(10-13-2021, 09:29 AM)Bullseye Wrote:

(10-13-2021, 08:38 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: I sometimes wonder if it’s the prevailing culture, or perhaps player preconceptions about coming into Jacksonville, which renders some of them as less than ideal effort-wise.

The new team facilities being planned will go a ways towards presenting Jacksonville as a good destination. A winning record always helps too.

Yes, I think there is something to that.

I believe in terms of drafted players, they see the few productive drafted players not retained by the team, the team not accumulating talent, and not winning.  Whatever external motivators of winning or financial reward for excellent are largely non existent here, and that could lead to lesser effort.

In terms of free agents, i think that dynamic serves as a deterrent, keeping potential contributors away from the team.  What remains is often the "mercenary" who is just out for the buck, who doesn't really care if they win or not, or the guys who care about winning but are less talented.

I disagree with this.  While it doesn't hurt to have new team facilities, that is not the problem.  Neither is players not wanting to come and for the most part, stay, in Jacksonville.  Some Meyer apologists want to create this narrative that quality free agents didn't come to Jacksonville this off-season because the Jaguars were undesirable.  This is false.  Free agents overwelmingly go to the team that pays them the most.  It's an auction.  An exception might be for aging players who have already made their money and know that they only have a year or two left and want to play for contender.  However, players coming off their rookie contracts, which is what the Jaguars should be targeting, will follow the money with only the occasional exception and even then, usually the money is close.  Even Urban Meyer himself in his post free agency press conference stated that he had no problems with players wanting to come to Jacksonville in free agency.  If they didn't get a top free agent, it was because either they didn't go after him or they were outbid by another team.  

As for players not wanting to stay with Jacksonville, yes, you have Jalen Ramsey.  His complaints were with the defensive scheme.  I doubt training facilities or culture would have mattered much to him.  Even if I'm wrong on that, the Jaguars could still have minimized the impact of this one if they had capitalized on the two first rounders, the fourth rounder, and the salary cap savings that we got in return.  Who else?  Perhaps C.J. Henderson, but even that is speculative.  I'm unclear if his issues had anything to do with the Jaguars specifically or was it just mental issues in general.  Either way, his performance wasn't living up to his draft status which severely limited the compensation we got as a result.  Ngakoue was a money issue.  He was willing to sign with the Jaguars initially, but wanted more money than the Jaguars were willing to pay.  He just got awful advice from his agent who didn't understand football.  He thought Ngakoue should get paid comparable to other players just because of his sacks, but those players were better run stuffers while Nquakoue was viewed as a pass rushing specialist, not only by the Jaguars, but other teams.  Ngakoue was insulted by the Jaguars offer, but the Jaguars offer in hindsight turned out to be completely fair, if not overly generous.  It should also be noted that the impact of Nquakoue could also have largely been mitigated if we capitalized on the second and fifth rounders that we got for him.  Who else?  Calais Campbell?  The Jaguars traded him because of age, salary and declining production and didn't seem like a good fit for a team that would be in rebuilding mode for a couple of years.  Disagree with it if you want, but the trade was the Jaguars' choice, not Campbell's.  Fournette?  The Jaguars cut him.  Again, I'm not aware of him wanting out.  I would also note that he cleared waivers after being cut.  This means that all 31 other teams in the NFL didn't think he was worth his existing salary either.  Fowler?  Again, he was traded which was the Jaguar's choice, not his.  I'm not aware of him wanting out.  I felt the third rounder for him was low, but he had off the field issues with the law and his on-field production was inconsistent.  In the half season after trading him, he only had 2 sacks.  He then had a wonderful year in 2019 with 11.5 sacks.  He then went back to only 3 sacks last year.  Inconsistency is his middle name.  Getting back to the main point, I'm not aware of him wanting out.  He was playing at the time of his trade, so it's not like he was holding out.  If the Jaguars didn't want to trade him, they could have just not traded him.  Call it a bad trade if you want, but new training facilities or the Jaguars culture had nothing to do with it.  

While I'm sure you can find multiple reasons for the Jaguars struggles over recent years, I would put poor drafting at top of their list.  Players not wanting to be here would be way down on that list.  Look at their first round picks:

2011:  Blaine Gabbert (#10 overall) - Terrible pick.  Nothing to do with him not wanting to be here.

2012:  Justin Blackmon (#5 overall) - Terrible pick.  Quickly got suspended for drugs.  Nothing to do with him not wanting to be here.

2013:  Luke Joeckel (#2 overall) - Terrible pick.  Nothing to do with him not wanting to be here.

2014:  Blake Bortles (#3 overall) - Terrible pick.  Nothing to do with him not wanting to be here.

2015:  Dante Fowler (#3 overall) - Discussed earlier.  Inconsistent pick.  Seems to alternate between great years and mediocre years.  I felt we gave up on him fast and for too little value.  I think off the field issues with the law were a major factor.  That being said, I'm not aware of him not wanting to be here.

2016:  Jalen Ramsey (#5 overall) - Discussed earlier.  The one exception who wanted out, but even the damage from this exception would have been mitigated if we could have capitalized on the two first rounders, the fourth rounder and the salary cap savings that we got in exchange.

2017:  Leonard Fournette (#4 overall) - Discussed earlier.  Was cut and no team picked him off waivers.  I'm not aware of him wanting out.

2018:  Tavern Bryan (#29 overall) - Terrible pick, but still with team.  

2019:  Josh Allen (#7 overall) - An exception in that I do think he was a good pick.  He is also still with the team.

2020:  C.J. Henderson (#9 overall) - Discussed earlier.  It's unclear if he wanted out, but even if so, his play was not living up anywhere near his draft position and severely limited the compensation we got in return.  Personally, I think the Jaguars were too quick to give up on him.

2020:  K'Lavon Chaisson (#20 overall) - He's clearly struggled so far and appears to be a bad pick, but he's still young and was considered a project when drafted.  There's no denying that he has contributed little to this point.  However, he's still with the team.

2021:  Trevor Lawrence (#1 overall) - An exception in that I love this pick even though it was a no-brainer.  He's a rookie at a difficult position, so he's making a number of mistakes right now, but that isn't unexpected.  He's shown a lot of potential for the future.  He's also still with the team.

2021:  Travis Etienne (#25 overall) - Although I personally didn't like this pick, he's injured for the year, so we don't really know if it was a good pick or not.  He's still with the team.

That's a lot of very high picks with very little success.  You can point to many things this team has done wrong, but it starts with drafting.  If we had hit on these picks, we would have a great team.

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