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Tony Wiggins again with good points. What if press is not the problem

#41
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2024, 09:14 AM by PV=nRT.)

(01-22-2024, 07:46 PM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote:
(01-16-2024, 07:01 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
It's a lot more tolerable if you bother to complain about something that's actually worth changing.
Not sure if you discern the difference.

Trevor having butter fingers with the ball, making horrible decisions passing (when there is time to throw) and sailing passing many feet above his WRs catch radius is worth changing. He needs to get A LOT better to be anywhere near as good as you think he is.

And that twitter link above is absurd, You really think Geno Smith played better than Lamarr Jackson this season? Come on use your brain if it still works.

(01-16-2024, 07:51 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: LOL

His issues are minuscule compared to the problems worth making roster and scheme changes over. 

You've conceded you won't change the starter at QB

Would you change the LG?
Center?
RG?
XWR?
Run scheme?

Everybody wants Trevor to cut out the mistakes. Most are just wise enough to see where those mistakes fall in order of negative impact on this offense.

The O line has absolutely no bearing on a lot of his poor passes/dropped fumbles..
Would you consider LJackson "butterfingers", or does he get a pass?
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#42

His podcast today he mentioned he's heard the same thing that Baalke picked the DC
No Fun
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#43

(01-23-2024, 05:32 PM)nhiverson Wrote: His podcast today he mentioned he's heard the same thing that Baalke picked the DC

Well, yeah. He heard the same [BLEEP] we heard. 

Doesn't make it any more true. 

I'd be shocked if it went down that way.
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#44

(01-23-2024, 05:44 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(01-23-2024, 05:32 PM)nhiverson Wrote: His podcast today he mentioned he's heard the same thing that Baalke picked the DC

Well, yeah. He heard the same [BLEEP] we heard. 

Doesn't make it any more true. 

I'd be shocked if it went down that way.

I’m no football guru (no [BLEEP], homebiscuit??), ahem, but I would be shocked, dumbfounded, flabbergasted if a GM forced a coordinator hire on a HC. Is it possible? I guess. Is it plausible? Almost certainly not.
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#45

(01-23-2024, 05:32 PM)nhiverson Wrote: His podcast today he mentioned he's heard the same thing that Baalke picked the DC


He mentioned E Dilla right before he said he don't know if Baalke could get rid of Press or pick the DC if he wanted.  They follow each other on Twitter and post each other's tweets at times.  HE "heard" the same thing we did.
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#46

IDK I'm just mentioning what I see. I also heard Prisco say it on the radio. All I am saying is the GM having any input on coaching staff is bad. Like it's Philly for Doug all over again and San Fran for Baalke.
No Fun
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#47

(01-23-2024, 07:20 PM)nhiverson Wrote: IDK I'm just mentioning what I see. I also heard Prisco say it on the radio. All I am saying is the GM having any input on coaching staff is bad. Like it's Philly for Doug all over again and San Fran for Baalke.

I think the most likely scenario is that the source who "heard" Doug preferred one guy and TB preferred another just doesn't know the whole story of the interview and eval process - and the braintrust agreed on Nielsen with Doug in the driver's seat on the call. 

But since the fanbase is so close to tar and feathers after 5 losses to squander the season late - everyone is jumping to conclusions seeking scapegoats.
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#48

(01-23-2024, 11:23 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(01-23-2024, 07:20 PM)nhiverson Wrote: IDK I'm just mentioning what I see. I also heard Prisco say it on the radio. All I am saying is the GM having any input on coaching staff is bad. Like it's Philly for Doug all over again and San Fran for Baalke.

I think the most likely scenario is that the source who "heard" Doug preferred one guy and TB preferred another just doesn't know the whole story of the interview and eval process - and the braintrust agreed on Nielsen with Doug in the driver's seat on the call. 

But since the fanbase is so close to tar and feathers after 5 losses to squander the season late - everyone is jumping to conclusions seeking scapegoats.
This I can believe.  I would imagine there will be A LOT of spirited discussions this year as they plot the off season plan out.  As a fan I want that. I want all involved to have passion to improve this team. I just do not want it to get out of control.  I believe that is Kahn's job...
A new broom always sweeps clean.
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#49

(01-22-2024, 09:46 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(01-22-2024, 09:35 PM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: Yes because scrambling is the reason he has poor ball security.. come on dude.

The O line absolutely made it difficult for him to move the ball but to reach that hard to blame them for every mistake he made is insanity.


LOL

I'm gonna help you connect a couple of dots here.

This is going to sound really crazy to you at first - but you may get somewhere with it if you let it marinate. 

If he wasn't running for his life from pressure on a designed pass play, he wouldn't fumble the ball running downfield on that play. Therefore - he would have fumbled fewer times in 2023 with better protection.

Your argument makes about as much sense as if I said "well you see, if the O line crumbled quicker and he got sacked, he wouldn't have overthrown a pass and got intercepted so you see, the OL blocking properly ackshually caused the interception."
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#50

They talked on 1010 this morning about how there’s rumor amongst the sports reporting world that there is conflict in the Front Office between Doug and Trent. According to Prisco, there was certainly discussion about firing Baalke.
Partly fueled by the fact there has been no statement made by Baalke since the season ended.

Whether true or not, we don’t need a soap opera adding to our struggles.
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#51

(01-24-2024, 01:04 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote:
(01-22-2024, 09:46 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: LOL

I'm gonna help you connect a couple of dots here.

This is going to sound really crazy to you at first - but you may get somewhere with it if you let it marinate. 

If he wasn't running for his life from pressure on a designed pass play, he wouldn't fumble the ball running downfield on that play. Therefore - he would have fumbled fewer times in 2023 with better protection.

Your argument makes about as much sense as if I said "well you see, if the O line crumbled quicker and he got sacked, he wouldn't have overthrown a pass and got intercepted so you see, the OL blocking properly ackshually caused the interception."

Every time I think you can't be any dumber you exceed my expectation.
“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

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#52

(01-23-2024, 07:20 PM)nhiverson Wrote: IDK I'm just mentioning what I see. I also heard Prisco say it on the radio. All I am saying is the GM having any input on coaching staff is bad. Like it's Philly for Doug all over again and San Fran for Baalke.

...this blabber is precisely why social media journalism stinks out loud. Back in the day, confirm by two separate sources before reporting, at that point it's fact not speculation.

Everyone is reporting "I've read that [blurpity durpity]" and then everyone says on Joe's show Joe said blurpity durpity and now everyone takes it as gospel.

Give me Baalke standing in front of a microphone saying "Yeah, I done that, what of it?" and I'll consider it reliable info.
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#53

(01-24-2024, 09:01 AM)Mikey Wrote:
(01-23-2024, 07:20 PM)nhiverson Wrote: IDK I'm just mentioning what I see. I also heard Prisco say it on the radio. All I am saying is the GM having any input on coaching staff is bad. Like it's Philly for Doug all over again and San Fran for Baalke.

...this blabber is precisely why social media journalism stinks out loud. Back in the day, confirm by two separate sources before reporting, at that point it's fact not speculation.

Everyone is reporting "I've read that [blurpity durpity]" and then everyone says on Joe's show Joe said blurpity durpity and now everyone takes it as gospel.

Give me Baalke standing in front of a microphone saying "Yeah, I done that, what of it?" and I'll consider it reliable info.

Social media is the water cooler with a microphone.
“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

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#54

(01-23-2024, 09:13 AM)PV=nRT Wrote:
(01-22-2024, 07:46 PM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: Trevor having butter fingers with the ball, making horrible decisions passing (when there is time to throw) and sailing passing many feet above his WRs catch radius is worth changing. He needs to get A LOT better to be anywhere near as good as you think he is.

And that twitter link above is absurd, You really think Geno Smith played better than Lamarr Jackson this season? Come on use your brain if it still works.


The O line has absolutely no bearing on a lot of his poor passes/dropped fumbles..
Would you consider LJackson "butterfingers", or does he get a pass?

(01-24-2024, 08:40 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote:
(01-24-2024, 01:04 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: Your argument makes about as much sense as if I said "well you see, if the O line crumbled quicker and he got sacked, he wouldn't have overthrown a pass and got intercepted so you see, the OL blocking properly ackshually caused the interception."

Every time I think you can't be any dumber you exceed my expectation.

Must be aimed at NYC since he thinks the play where Trevor Fumbles without being touched was because of pressure. LOL.
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#55

(01-24-2024, 10:51 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote:
(01-23-2024, 09:13 AM)PV=nRT Wrote: Would you consider LJackson "butterfingers", or does he get a pass?

(01-24-2024, 08:40 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote:
Every time I think you can't be any dumber you exceed my expectation.

Must be aimed at NYC since he thinks the play where Trevor Fumbles without being touched was because of pressure. LOL.

Most of his fumbles are squarely on him - but it is hilarious that you can't comprehend how he shouldn't be running for his life on designed pass plays (and fumbling as a result)
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#56

(01-24-2024, 10:58 AM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(01-24-2024, 10:51 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: Must be aimed at NYC since he thinks the play where Trevor Fumbles without being touched was because of pressure. LOL.

Most of his fumbles are squarely on him - but it is hilarious that you can't comprehend how he shouldn't be running for his like on designed pass plays (and fumbling as a result)

I can comprehend it, Do you think my hope for the offseason is to find 4 brand new starters on the O line because they are good?

You just can't seem to seperate one from the other, Like I said the other day he's obviously hindered from succeeding by this terrible unit. It's still very easy to seperate what is squarely on him, and what's not. You can blame the O line on a fumble/int when the defender is under hsi nose or in the process of sacking him.. you cannot blame them for him running away and dropping the ball without contact or sailing a pass above the WRs head when he had time to throw.
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#57

(01-24-2024, 11:26 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote:
(01-24-2024, 10:58 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: Most of his fumbles are squarely on him - but it is hilarious that you can't comprehend how he shouldn't be running for his like on designed pass plays (and fumbling as a result)

I can comprehend it, Do you think my hope for the offseason is to find 4 brand new starters on the O line because they are good?

You just can't seem to seperate one from the other, Like I said the other day he's obviously hindered from succeeding by this terrible unit. It's still very easy to seperate what is squarely on him, and what's not. You can blame the O line on a fumble/int when the defender is under hsi nose or in the process of sacking him.. you cannot blame them for him running away and dropping the ball without contact or sailing a pass above the WRs head when he had time to throw.

Yes - William Trevor Lawrence makes a conscious decision inside Fortner's brain to not even try to block the 3 tech - and he wills the rookie TE to totally whiff picking up the safety blitz, specifically so that he can run backwards, then sideways, then downfield, where he makes a boneheaded, almost inconceivable fumble.

All of that is squarely on him.

He made a terrible mistake after being put in a situation he never should have been in. 

You can ignorantly ignore the dynamics of this. I prefer to have contextual perspective. 

I'm not giving him a pass. Just context.
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#58
(This post was last modified: 01-24-2024, 11:48 AM by Jaguarmeister. Edited 5 times in total.)

(01-23-2024, 11:23 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(01-23-2024, 07:20 PM)nhiverson Wrote: IDK I'm just mentioning what I see. I also heard Prisco say it on the radio. All I am saying is the GM having any input on coaching staff is bad. Like it's Philly for Doug all over again and San Fran for Baalke.

I think the most likely scenario is that the source who "heard" Doug preferred one guy and TB preferred another just doesn't know the whole story of the interview and eval process - and the braintrust agreed on Nielsen with Doug in the driver's seat on the call. 

But since the fanbase is so close to tar and feathers after 5 losses to squander the season late - everyone is jumping to conclusions seeking scapegoats.

Nah man, the people have spoken and they want the soap opera to be true, so that's what we're running with.  

The Jags should really consider filming "back stage" interactions WWE style.  People would lap it up. I want to see draft war room chairs fly and tables get flipped and angry stares coming from Doug and Trent at each other with heavy mouth breathing.
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#59

(01-24-2024, 11:35 AM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(01-24-2024, 11:26 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: I can comprehend it, Do you think my hope for the offseason is to find 4 brand new starters on the O line because they are good?

You just can't seem to seperate one from the other, Like I said the other day he's obviously hindered from succeeding by this terrible unit. It's still very easy to seperate what is squarely on him, and what's not. You can blame the O line on a fumble/int when the defender is under hsi nose or in the process of sacking him.. you cannot blame them for him running away and dropping the ball without contact or sailing a pass above the WRs head when he had time to throw.

Yes - William Trevor Lawrence makes a conscious decision inside Fortner's brain to not even try to block the 3 tech - and he wills the rookie TE to totally whiff picking up the safety blitz, specifically so that he can run backwards, then sideways, then downfield, where he makes a boneheaded, almost inconceivable fumble.

All of that is squarely on him.

He made a terrible mistake after being put in a situation he never should have been in. 

You can ignorantly ignore the dynamics of this. I prefer to have contextual perspective. 

I'm not giving him a pass. Just context.

And like I said, while you can blame the O line on him running away, you cannot blame them for him dropping the ball for no reason under no contact. 

This is why we can still say ETN is a good RB despite having bad YPC numbers this season, while also saying Tank Bigsby was a dissapointment. ETN may not have been an effecient runner this season due to the O line, but he also wasn't fumbling/dropping passes consistently like Bigsby. 

Self inflicted mistakes are the issue, not that he wasn't overly effecient behind a poor line.
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#60

(01-24-2024, 11:42 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote:
(01-23-2024, 11:23 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: I think the most likely scenario is that the source who "heard" Doug preferred one guy and TB preferred another just doesn't know the whole story of the interview and eval process - and the braintrust agreed on Nielsen with Doug in the driver's seat on the call. 

But since the fanbase is so close to tar and feathers after 5 losses to squander the season late - everyone is jumping to conclusions seeking scapegoats.

Nah man, the people have spoken and they want the soap opera to be true, so that's what we're running with.  

The Jags should really consider filming "back stage" interactions WWE style.  People would lap it up.  I want to see draft war room chairs fly and tables get flipped and angry stares coming from Doug and Trent at each other with heavy mouth breathing.

Jags twitter is less than a step away from this ^ sadly

It's like the old comments section under the O-Zone posts circa 2014
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