Quote:I already said it many times including right here on this page: If a receiver drops the ball, it is not Blake's fault the pass is incomplete. I am right about this until proven wrong.
Unless the ball is delivered poorly which would make it partially blakes fault.
Quote:Unless the ball is delivered poorly which would make it partially blakes fault.
And when it's delivered beautifully?
I have seen plenty of perfect clockwise, rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to to the ground that receivers drop.
Quote:And when it's delivered beautifully?
I have seen plenty of perfect clockwise, rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to to the ground that receivers drop.
If the pass is accurate and the receiver can reasonably catch it and he doesnt then the blame is on the receiver. It just so happens that isnt the case with blake.
Quote:And when it's delivered beautifully?
I have seen plenty of perfect clockwise, rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to to the ground that receivers drop.
This is true. But this same thing happened to Gabbert. Gabbert had an amazing amount of dropped passes. If you are a wide receiver and Gabbert is your quarterback, a perfectly delivered ball is a surprise. But that same perfectly delivered ball from a Tom Brady is exactly what the WR expected. I think this is a big difference to a wide receiver. It affects them.
If they are anticipating the ball being off target and it's on target, the on target ball may be harder to catch. If they are mostly anticipating the ball to not get there at all, then everything is harder to catch.
Quote:"Hitting him in the hands" isn't the definition for a drop. Neither of the two plays you are talking about were classified as drops. One he was having to make a sideline dive and the other he was fighting through an elite CB to try to catch the pass on the other side of the CBs body. Yes they both hit his hands and he has the capability of making great catches on both, but they aren't drops.
It's like the distinction between a passed ball and a wild pitch. Plenty of wild pitches are avoided because catchers make great digs out of the dirt, but if they don't make that dig it's a wild pitch credited to the pitcher not the catcher. A passed ball is when it is a routine throw that the catcher misses.
Hurns is the one that is making the routine attempt drops (credited with 6 drops, 2nd worst in the league), Arob is the one on the receiving end of the wild pitches (2 drops, 113th worst). You're trying to say yeah well that pitch was two feet short and three feet wide, but the catcher got a piece of glove on it as he was diving across the zone so it should have been caught.
Look man, I appreciate your post, and it's a good argument. I tend to look at football in a much simpler light, and I hate to be cliché but I really believe in the "if it hits your hands you should catch it" mantra.
I think he's still a great player, but he's very clearly in a slump because of the team's current situation, and it's plain obvious how much the dude cares.
I wholeheartedly believe he should've caught both those passes, and 2015 AR probably does catch both.
Quote:And when it's delivered beautifully?
I have seen plenty of perfect clockwise, rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to to the ground that receivers drop.
Can we all just take a moment during this holiday season and bask in the stench of this glorious nugget of hilarity:
"perfect clockwise rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to the ground."
You can't make this [BLEEP] up folks.
Quote:This is true. But this same thing happened to Gabbert. Gabbert had an amazing amount of dropped passes. If you are a wide receiver and Gabbert is your quarterback, a perfectly delivered ball is a surprise. But that same perfectly delivered ball from a Tom Brady is exactly what the WR expected. I think this is a big difference to a wide receiver. It affects them.
If they are anticipating the ball being off target and it's on target, the on target ball may be harder to catch. If they are mostly anticipating the ball to not get there at all, then everything is harder to catch.
This is where we often hear the phrase "develop chemistry" in post-practice meetings. That chemistry was there in 2015. The unsolved mystery is its disappearance in 2016 with the same coaches and players.
Quote:This is where we often hear the phrase "develop chemistry" in post-practice meetings. That chemistry was there in 2015. The unsolved mystery is its disappearance in 2016 with the same coaches and players.
Yea, that chemistry was so great it got us a 5-11 record, which is by far our best season in the Gus Era.
Quote:And when it's delivered beautifully?
I have seen plenty of perfect clockwise, rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to to the ground that receivers drop.
That's because you are a fan of the Broncos, Packers, and some other teams.
You haven't seen very many perfect clockwise, rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to the ground that receivers drop for the Jaguars.
Quote:I am right about this until proven wrong.
You ignore facts that prove you wrong all the time.
Only time I remember you ever admitting being wrong was about Malik Jackson being a NT. But I'm not sure you apologized for it, either.
Quote:Can we all just take a moment during this holiday season and bask in the stench of this glorious nugget of hilarity:
"perfect clockwise rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to the ground."
You can't make this [BAD WORD REMOVED] up folks.
As if it's impossible for counter-clockwise rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to the ground.
Mark Brunell nailed many a water cooler with them late in his years here.
Quote:That's because you are a fan of the Broncos, Packers, and some other teams.
You haven't seen very many perfect clockwise, rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to the ground that receivers drop for the Jaguars.
I have seen Blake Bortles throw that type of pass.
Quote:As if it's impossible for counter-clockwise rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to the ground.
Mark Brunell nailed many a water cooler with them late in his years here.
It should be pretty obvious what I meant by "clockwise" spirals: That is the direction balls spin when our current QB throws them.
FWIW no current NFL quarterbacks are left-handed.
Quote:And when it's delivered beautifully?
I have seen plenty of perfect clockwise, rapidly-spinning spirals parallel to to the ground that receivers drop.
There have been many more inaccurate, wobbling passes from Bortles this season than there have been "perfectly clockwise, rapidly spinning spirals" from him.
There have also been drops by all receivers this year, but they were making thise catches last season.
There is PLENTY of blame to go around. Bortles' share of the blame this year is pretty substantial, but he's not alone in it.
Quote:Uh... WRONG.
I wasn't even a fan of the Jaguars back when Jimmy Smith played, but anyone that knows football can see that Stonehands does not have the same type of game as Jimmy Smith had. Jimmy Smith, if I remember him correctly, was more of a fly route WR. AR15 cannot blow the top of a defense the way Jimmy Smith did. AR15 appears like he's gonna wind up being more of a possession type WR.
The problem with AR15, besides the fact that he cannot catch balls anymore, is that his route running isn't crisp enough to get separation... He's having a disappointing season this year because he has not gotten better. Just like BB6. Both these players took the offseason to get fat, metaphorically speaking. They clearly were not working on thier game.
Stop feeding the troll bro. The person you're responding to is 2 or 3 brain cells away from being a baked potatoe.
That said, you're right imo in your assumptions of recognizable differences between J smooth and AR15. There really is no comparison to be had imo. Robinson can't separate this year
Quote:There have been many more inaccurate, wobbling passes from Bortles this season than there have been "perfectly clockwise, rapidly spinning spirals" from him.
There have also been drops by all receivers this year, but they were making thise catches last season.
There is PLENTY of blame to go around. Bortles' share of the blame this year is pretty substantial, but he's not alone in it.
I agree - and it starts with the coaching staff. It's their responsibility to train these players up when they come into the league and it's also their responsibility to help them maintain a high level of play. Bradley has failed on all counts and now Bortles has become highly inconsistent because of his incompetence. Bradley is on his 3rd OC in 4 years - that alone is going to cause major issues for ANY offense. What's worse is that the two OCs weren't fired because their styles didn't match the type of players we had, they were fired because they weren't fit to actually be OCs - position coach is as high as they should've gone. Bradley himself makes a good DC, but he just isn't cut out to be HC because he doesn't manage his staff well.
The people who think that getting another QB is the solution aren't seeing the big picture. It doesn't matter who the Jags draft or sign at QB - if the coaching staff doesn't do their job, the QB is going to look average at absolute best (if it were someone like Tom Brady or Russell Wilson) or terrible at worst (if it's just about everyone else). Gabbert was an exception to this rule because he had issues that simply can't be fixed (bad pocket presence) - even great coaching MAYBE would've only resulted in a decent QB in Gabbert - that team would require someone else to be the centerpiece of their offense. At least with Bortles, nearly all of his issues are fixable with a good coaching staff in place (although he may still average about 13-16 INTs a season, but that's the price that comes with gunslinger QBs).
In year three, I can't say Bortles' issues are any more "fixable" than Gabbert's were.
While it's true Gabbert had many more, I'm not sure the issues Bortles has are any more easily "fixed."
It's year three. How long are we going to sit waiting and wishing.
Again...
Trying to talk ourselves into being satisfied and ignoring the position (as we did with Garrard) lead us to Gabbert. We sat around on Gabbert for a while, too. Will we repeat the same mistake with Bortles and not bring in serious competition?
Insanity would say we're good. Stay the course with Bortles and not bring in starter competition. Insanity would say the patience we use on Bortles will end up differently than the patience we've used with other QBs.
I agree that there's a bigger picture, but I don't think you realize how big it truly is.
Waiting around and wishing for Bortles to be "fixed" is not big picture thinking. It's repeating historical failures. Again.
Quote:In year three, I can't say Bortles' issues are any more "fixable" than Gabbert's were.
While it's true Gabbert had many more, I'm not sure the issues Bortles has are any more easily "fixed."
It's year three. How long are we going to sit waiting and wishing.
Again...
Trying to talk ourselves into being satisfied and ignoring the position (as we did with Garrard) lead us to Gabbert. We sat around on Gabbert for a while, too. Will we repeat the same mistake with Bortles and not bring in serious competition?
Insanity would say we're good. Stay the course with Bortles and not bring in starter competition. Insanity would say the patience we use on Bortles will end up differently than the patience we've used with other QBs.
I agree that there's a bigger picture, but I don't think you realize how big it truly is.
Waiting around and wishing for Bortles to be "fixed" is not big picture thinking. It's repeating historical failures. Again.
I have to disagree with several things you said here.
First off, comparing Bortles to Gabbert is just plain ignorant. Several experts, including Jaws, thought Gabbert wasn't anywhere near as good as his draft status was - and it turned out to be true. If the Jags hadn't taken Gabbert, he would've slipped out of the 1st round. Gabbert NEVER flashed ANY potential to be a good starter during his time in Jax. That said, Gabbert got the right amount of time any young QB should get: 3 seasons (although in year 3, he got benched about a 3rd through the season).
Bortles, on the other hand, was considered to have lots of upside with his mechanics being his issue (something that actually CAN be fixed in most cases - an opinion most football experts share). Unlike Gabbert, he actually showed flashes of potential his first year and had a very good sophomore year in the league. His 3rd year has been a mess because of a combo of things, his mechanics regressing being a big one. That said, a fanbase who wants to throw away a QB after ONE bad year is a fanbase I am glad isn't running the team. There's a reason teams like Browns haven't found a QB since they first came back in 1999 and the reason the Redskins (up until now) took even longer to find a QB.
You claim that insanity is to let Bortles continue to start. In order for that argument to work, Bortles would need to have two straight bad seasons with no improvement at all. Seeing the bigger picture doesn't mean getting rid of a player after one bad season. That's the complete opposite - that's called a 'knee-jerk' reaction, something that this fanbase is doing now.
If anyone's been here too long without signs of improvement, it's this coaching staff. Expecting something good after 4 straight years of losing with very little improvement as well as causing the regression of our offensive players is insanity.
Cool story, bro. That's a lot of words to say "shut up! I'm right, you're wrong!" Nice try, but not very convincing to me. Dismissive and completely unpersuasive.
I'd surely let Bortles compete from the job, it's that he has to earn it. That's the issue. He's got not competition and must start by default.
If we had a QB of competence at backup, he should have been benched already (if not even for just a single game.)