(06-26-2017, 05:37 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 04:10 PM)TheAll22 Wrote: [ -> ]In term of this board absolutely - The Henne hate is solely based on his age/image and nothing to do with his ability as a pro athlete
Bortles has done very little to separate himself from Henne.
I get where you're coming from. I mean Chad Henne's career TDs in 65 games = 58. Blake Bortles TDs over the past two seasons = 58.
It's almost like they're exactly the same player.
Not really. Look at the big picture rather than the stat sheet. I'm specifically talking about how Chad Henne has performed with the team, not his prior experience with the Dolphins.
In 2012 Henne was signed as "competition" for Blaine Gabbert. He came into a game for an injured Blaine Gabbert in week 11 and went on to start the remaining games that season. Remember that this was also the same season that the team had a new head coach/coaching staff and a new owner. No real "supporting cast" around him.
In 2013 Henne was named the starter after Blaine Gabbert was benched three games into the season. Another thing to note is that is that this was yet under another new head coach/coaching staff. This was also the time-frame of the whole "Justin Blackmon mess". The team had no real "supporting cast" for Henne.
In 2014 the team as a whole started out poorly. Yes, Henne was a part of it, but the team was forced to start the just-drafted rookie QB (Blake Bortles) far sooner than anticipated (3 games into the season). This was also the year that a "total rebuild" was started with many young players (rookies) being forced into key roles.
That small snapshot is what many on this board go by when commenting on Chad Henne.
Henne is going to be so rusty if he ever has to come into the middle of a regular season game. It will be fine if all he has to do is hand the ball off, but the moment he starts to throw it, it's either going to get picked off or batted down. Going to be a classic Jaguars moment when that happens
(06-26-2017, 06:14 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 05:37 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]I get where you're coming from. I mean Chad Henne's career TDs in 65 games = 58. Blake Bortles TDs over the past two seasons = 58.
It's almost like they're exactly the same player.
Not really. Look at the big picture rather than the stat sheet. I'm specifically talking about how Chad Henne has performed with the team, not his prior experience with the Dolphins.
In 2012 Henne was signed as "competition" for Blaine Gabbert. He came into a game for an injured Blaine Gabbert in week 11 and went on to start the remaining games that season. Remember that this was also the same season that the team had a new head coach/coaching staff and a new owner. No real "supporting cast" around him.
In 2013 Henne was named the starter after Blaine Gabbert was benched three games into the season. Another thing to note is that is that this was yet under another new head coach/coaching staff. This was also the time-frame of the whole "Justin Blackmon mess". The team had no real "supporting cast" for Henne.
In 2014 the team as a whole started out poorly. Yes, Henne was a part of it, but the team was forced to start the just-drafted rookie QB (Blake Bortles) far sooner than anticipated (3 games into the season). This was also the year that a "total rebuild" was started with many young players (rookies) being forced into key roles.
That small snapshot is what many on this board go by when commenting on Chad Henne.
Sorry, I'm not following whatever point it is you're trying to make. Could you be more clear about it?
(06-26-2017, 07:45 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 04:54 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]Nobody is saying that he's a superstar by any means, but he is a veteran that can manage a game and not lose it for you.
I'm reminded of a Raiders game where Blaine Gabbert had the Raiders in check. There was no way we were losing that game until Blaine got hurt and Henne came in. Henne single-handedly managed to choke the lead and the game away in one of the most pathetic quarterback performances on NFL record. The situation was beyond ideal for Henne. He was handed an easy win, and still blew it.
Memories just keep getting shorter and shorter.
I've said it many many times, and it still bears repeating. The backup doesn't magically become better just because you don't like the starter.
From the 2011-2013 span, watching the gut wrenching performances come one after another between Gabbert and Henne was something I have no desire to ever see again. The only good thing about Henne still being on the team is that I still get to look forward to the day he's cut.
(06-26-2017, 06:51 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 06:14 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]Not really. Look at the big picture rather than the stat sheet. I'm specifically talking about how Chad Henne has performed with the team, not his prior experience with the Dolphins.
In 2012 Henne was signed as "competition" for Blaine Gabbert. He came into a game for an injured Blaine Gabbert in week 11 and went on to start the remaining games that season. Remember that this was also the same season that the team had a new head coach/coaching staff and a new owner. No real "supporting cast" around him.
In 2013 Henne was named the starter after Blaine Gabbert was benched three games into the season. Another thing to note is that is that this was yet under another new head coach/coaching staff. This was also the time-frame of the whole "Justin Blackmon mess". The team had no real "supporting cast" for Henne.
In 2014 the team as a whole started out poorly. Yes, Henne was a part of it, but the team was forced to start the just-drafted rookie QB (Blake Bortles) far sooner than anticipated (3 games into the season). This was also the year that a "total rebuild" was started with many young players (rookies) being forced into key roles.
That small snapshot is what many on this board go by when commenting on Chad Henne.
Sorry, I'm not following whatever point it is you're trying to make. Could you be more clear about it?
All I'm saying is, the roster was pretty "broken" on both sides of the ball during that time frame. Did Henne make mistakes and/or some poor plays during that time? Certainly, but it's not as if he was the sole cause of the poor seasons.
(06-26-2017, 07:45 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 04:54 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]Nobody is saying that he's a superstar by any means, but he is a veteran that can manage a game and not lose it for you.
I'm reminded of a Raiders game where Blaine Gabbert had the Raiders in check. There was no way we were losing that game until Blaine got hurt and Henne came in. Henne single-handedly managed to choke the lead and the game away in one of the most pathetic quarterback performances on NFL record. The situation was beyond ideal for Henne. He was handed an easy win, and still blew it.
I remember that game. Some thoughts come to mind regarding that game.
Maurice Jones Drew (our only real offensive weapon) was injured early in the game and did not return.
Blaine Gabbert didn't exactly have the Raiders "in check". Yes he did throw a deep TD but the only other TD the Jaguars had in that game came from a run as a result of a muffed return when the Jags punted and recovered the fumble deep (in the red zone) in Raider's territory. Offensive production while Blaine was in the game wasn't exactly dominant. I don't really call that as Blaine Gabbert having the Raiders "in check".
With no run game, poor play calling and lack of play-makers it's not surprising that the Jaguars didn't win that game, especially with a backup QB (no reps with the starters). There is no way that somebody can say that Henne "single-handedly managed to choke the lead and the game away". After all, when he came into the game in the second quarter the score was 3-14 Jaguars.
We can go back and watch the game and comment about it if you would like. It wasn't really an "easy win" game (no NFL game is).
(06-27-2017, 03:22 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 06:51 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]Sorry, I'm not following whatever point it is you're trying to make. Could you be more clear about it?
All I'm saying is, the roster was pretty "broken" on both sides of the ball during that time frame. Did Henne make mistakes and/or some poor plays during that time? Certainly, but it's not as if he was the sole cause of the poor seasons.
(06-26-2017, 07:45 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ]
I'm reminded of a Raiders game where Blaine Gabbert had the Raiders in check. There was no way we were losing that game until Blaine got hurt and Henne came in. Henne single-handedly managed to choke the lead and the game away in one of the most pathetic quarterback performances on NFL record. The situation was beyond ideal for Henne. He was handed an easy win, and still blew it.
I remember that game. Some thoughts come to mind regarding that game.
Maurice Jones Drew (our only real offensive weapon) was injured early in the game and did not return.
Blaine Gabbert didn't exactly have the Raiders "in check". Yes he did throw a deep TD but the only other TD the Jaguars had in that game came from a run as a result of a muffed return when the Jags punted and recovered the fumble deep (in the red zone) in Raider's territory. Offensive production while Blaine was in the game wasn't exactly dominant. I don't really call that as Blaine Gabbert having the Raiders "in check".
With no run game, poor play calling and lack of play-makers it's not surprising that the Jaguars didn't win that game, especially with a backup QB (no reps with the starters). There is no way that somebody can say that Henne "single-handedly managed to choke the lead and the game away". After all, when he came into the game in the second quarter the score was 3-14 Jaguars.
We can go back and watch the game and comment about it if you would like. It wasn't really an "easy win" game (no NFL game is).
Yeah, the roster was pretty rough, but Henne wasn't making it any better.
In 2014 a raw rookie came in and showed that even being a raw rookie with little preparation was better than having Henne in the game.
Remember that last half he played against the colts before he got benched?
(06-27-2017, 03:51 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ] (06-27-2017, 03:22 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]All I'm saying is, the roster was pretty "broken" on both sides of the ball during that time frame. Did Henne make mistakes and/or some poor plays during that time? Certainly, but it's not as if he was the sole cause of the poor seasons.
I remember that game. Some thoughts come to mind regarding that game.
Maurice Jones Drew (our only real offensive weapon) was injured early in the game and did not return.
Blaine Gabbert didn't exactly have the Raiders "in check". Yes he did throw a deep TD but the only other TD the Jaguars had in that game came from a run as a result of a muffed return when the Jags punted and recovered the fumble deep (in the red zone) in Raider's territory. Offensive production while Blaine was in the game wasn't exactly dominant. I don't really call that as Blaine Gabbert having the Raiders "in check".
With no run game, poor play calling and lack of play-makers it's not surprising that the Jaguars didn't win that game, especially with a backup QB (no reps with the starters). There is no way that somebody can say that Henne "single-handedly managed to choke the lead and the game away". After all, when he came into the game in the second quarter the score was 3-14 Jaguars.
We can go back and watch the game and comment about it if you would like. It wasn't really an "easy win" game (no NFL game is).
Yeah, the roster was pretty rough, but Henne wasn't making it any better.
In 2014 a raw rookie came in and showed that even being a raw rookie with little preparation was better than having Henne in the game.
Remember that last half he played against the colts before he got benched?
Sure. At the time Henne was the starter and ended up getting benched. Nobody ever said that he should be the starting QB to begin with.
Given what we know now regarding the 2014 season and beyond, especially with the "plan" that they had when they drafted Bortles, do you think that was the right decision at the time? Do you think that it helped or hurt Bortles in his development? Would the season have ended up much different?
(06-27-2017, 04:00 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ] (06-27-2017, 03:51 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, the roster was pretty rough, but Henne wasn't making it any better.
In 2014 a raw rookie came in and showed that even being a raw rookie with little preparation was better than having Henne in the game.
Remember that last half he played against the colts before he got benched?
Sure. At the time Henne was the starter and ended up getting benched. Nobody ever said that he should be the starting QB to begin with.
Given what we know now regarding the 2014 season and beyond, especially with the "plan" that they had when they drafted Bortles, do you think that was the right decision at the time? Do you think that it helped or hurt Bortles in his development? Would the season have ended up much different?
I doubt it would have had any positive effect on Bortles overall to have say the entire season.
As for what would have been different, we might have become the second ever 0-16 team and been able to make a team give up a ransom for Mariota or Jameis, so possibly a huge upgrade for the long term.
Either way it would have been a sickening season to sit through had Henne started sixteen games.
(06-27-2017, 04:22 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ] (06-27-2017, 04:00 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]Sure. At the time Henne was the starter and ended up getting benched. Nobody ever said that he should be the starting QB to begin with.
Given what we know now regarding the 2014 season and beyond, especially with the "plan" that they had when they drafted Bortles, do you think that was the right decision at the time? Do you think that it helped or hurt Bortles in his development? Would the season have ended up much different?
I doubt it would have had any positive effect on Bortles overall to have say the entire season.
As for what would have been different, we might have become the second ever 0-16 team and been able to make a team give up a ransom for Mariota or Jameis, so possibly a huge upgrade for the long term.
Either way it would have been a sickening season to sit through had Henne started sixteen games.
So what you're saying is that it was the correct decision to throw Bortles out there before he was ready? In my opinion he should have stayed on the sidelines and stayed in a "learning phase". He was nowhere ready to play the game at this level.
You're also saying that you think we wouldn't have won at least 3 games with Chad Henne?
Was the season not "sickening" watching Bortles only win 3 games that season?
I'll give you a bit of a hint here. The 2014 record had very little to do with the QB.
You can't rewrite history, only look at it.
(06-26-2017, 06:01 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Am I the only one that remembers Henne being woefully unable to complete a very basic 10-15 yard out route during the 2016 preseason?
The ball was getting there so late I was certain he'd be picked each time it left his hands.
In pre- week three he went 7 for 18 for 75 yards. The o-line was really bad, but he looked like he was in "wing and a prayer mode" every time he released the ball.
He wouldnt be in the league if it werent for us.
This Henne > Kaep thing is [BLEEP] hilarious. The guys on this board are as good at evaluating QBs as our front office.
(06-26-2017, 04:54 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 02:28 PM)TheAll22 Wrote: [ -> ]Henne can at least read a defense somewhat. Henne is a very underrated back-up
I agree. Many people on this board hate on him so much because of his short stint as the starting QB, but fail to realize the "supporting" cast around him during that time-frame wasn't exactly ideal.
Nobody is saying that he's a superstar by any means, but he is a veteran that can manage a game and not lose it for you.
I think Henne is one of the better back ups in the league as well, but lets face it, he's a back up because he isn't any good. Just like every other back up in the NFL.
There's a reason why hes never thrown for more TDs, than INTs in a season. You can talk about his stint here, but he wasn't any better while he was with the Dolphins.
(06-27-2017, 05:42 PM)GlockBortles Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 06:01 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Am I the only one that remembers Henne being woefully unable to complete a very basic 10-15 yard out route during the 2016 preseason?
The ball was getting there so late I was certain he'd be picked each time it left his hands.
In pre- week three he went 7 for 18 for 75 yards. The o-line was really bad, but he looked like he was in "wing and a prayer mode" every time he released the ball.
He wouldnt be in the league if it werent for us.
This Henne > Kaep thing is [BLEEP] hilarious. The guys on this board are as good at evaluating QBs as our front office.
jesus christ the irony...
(06-27-2017, 10:59 PM)Eric1 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-26-2017, 04:54 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]I agree. Many people on this board hate on him so much because of his short stint as the starting QB, but fail to realize the "supporting" cast around him during that time-frame wasn't exactly ideal.
Nobody is saying that he's a superstar by any means, but he is a veteran that can manage a game and not lose it for you.
I think Henne is one of the better back ups in the league as well, but lets face it, he's a back up because he isn't any good. Just like every other back up in the NFL.
There's a reason why hes never thrown for more TDs, than INTs in a season. You can talk about his stint here, but he wasn't any better while he was with the Dolphins.
(06-27-2017, 05:42 PM)GlockBortles Wrote: [ -> ]He wouldnt be in the league if it werent for us.
This Henne > Kaep thing is [BLEEP] hilarious. The guys on this board are as good at evaluating QBs as our front office.
jesus christ the irony...
Kaep isnt in the league because of the protest. Henne is still in the league because were an inept franchise.
(06-27-2017, 04:56 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ] (06-27-2017, 04:22 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]I doubt it would have had any positive effect on Bortles overall to have say the entire season.
As for what would have been different, we might have become the second ever 0-16 team and been able to make a team give up a ransom for Mariota or Jameis, so possibly a huge upgrade for the long term.
Either way it would have been a sickening season to sit through had Henne started sixteen games.
So what you're saying is that it was the correct decision to throw Bortles out there before he was ready? In my opinion he should have stayed on the sidelines and stayed in a "learning phase". He was nowhere ready to play the game at this level.
You're also saying that you think we wouldn't have won at least 3 games with Chad Henne?
Was the season not "sickening" watching Bortles only win 3 games that season?
I'll give you a bit of a hint here. The 2014 record had very little to do with the QB.
You can't rewrite history, only look at it.
What I'm saying is that with the benefit of hindsight I can see why someone might think holding Bortles out would be better for the team's long term interest, but I also could imagine it would have been an absolutely horrific season to endure.
I think it's quite questionable that the team wins three games with Henne in the games. Maybe one or two.