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We could most definitely land Phillips or Schwartz, not sure why you guys think we can’t. It’s not like they have their choice at any top contenders.

(01-01-2020, 10:34 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]I've heard the Dom Capers scenario bandied about as a replacement for Wash. That seems ideal.

Agreed. There's been some revisionism around here that he's really not a very good defensive coach but he's been largely successful most of career as a DC (not so much as a HC). Look at the rankings of teams before and after he took over. He did have the bad year in Green Bay but my bet is that the team would benefit from him taking over.

The impression I always got was Capers was a Tom hire and only there to help with some installs and be a pair of eyes for Tom. Doubt hes on staff going forward but dunno what contracts are like or what doug thinks

(01-08-2020, 11:15 AM)TJBender Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 10:31 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]I'd imagine Rebrovich is promoted to DC from Dline coach in that scenario. He's Dougs boy since Syracuse.

Considering that the DL is the only solid unit on the entire defense, I just don't see them moving Rebrovich out of that role. Maybe they would consider something where he's DL/run coordinator and Walton or Capers add pass coordinator to their title, but taking Rebrovich off of the DL at this point just seems like a goofy desperation move. 

So, yeah, that's exactly what will happen.

I know it seems odd that I keep bringing up Walton, but the Rams' D was actually pretty good during his year running it. He was only fired because Jeff Fisher's bromantic partner Gregg Williams was finally available.

Not like our pass rush is good because of who we have coaching it and the run defense is terrible so no real loss by moving him. 

I'm just putting myself in Doug's shoes with this new found power. If outside candidates aren't appealing I'd likely promote within and give a guy who's been with me forever a bump up. 

Didn't actually know Walton was DC before, did he call plays that year do you know?

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(01-08-2020, 12:53 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-01-2020, 10:34 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]I've heard the Dom Capers scenario bandied about as a replacement for Wash. That seems ideal.

Agreed. There's been some revisionism around here that he's really not a very good defensive coach but he's been largely successful most of career as a DC (not so much as a HC). Look at the rankings of teams before and after he took over. He did have the bad year in Green Bay but my bet is that the team would benefit from him taking over.

It was more than one bad year in Green Bay towards the end. More like 3 or so in his last 5 years, great DC in his prime though for sure. 

Theres a reason he isn't a DC anymore


Capers defense in points allowed
2017: #26 (24 points per game)
2016: #25 (25 points per game)
2015: #11 (21)
2014: #14 (22)
2013: #24 (26)

Jim Schwartz is under contract through 2020. It’s going to be hard to get him from Philly unless Philly is ready to give him up.

(01-08-2020, 02:37 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 11:15 AM)TJBender Wrote: [ -> ]Considering that the DL is the only solid unit on the entire defense, I just don't see them moving Rebrovich out of that role. Maybe they would consider something where he's DL/run coordinator and Walton or Capers add pass coordinator to their title, but taking Rebrovich off of the DL at this point just seems like a goofy desperation move. 

So, yeah, that's exactly what will happen.

I know it seems odd that I keep bringing up Walton, but the Rams' D was actually pretty good during his year running it. He was only fired because Jeff Fisher's bromantic partner Gregg Williams was finally available.

Not like our pass rush is good because of who we have coaching it and the run defense is terrible so no real loss by moving him. 

I'm just putting myself in Doug's shoes with this new found power. If outside candidates aren't appealing I'd likely promote within and give a guy who's been with me forever a bump up. 

Didn't actually know Walton was DC before, did he call plays that year do you know?

---

(01-08-2020, 12:53 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]Agreed. There's been some revisionism around here that he's really not a very good defensive coach but he's been largely successful most of career as a DC (not so much as a HC). Look at the rankings of teams before and after he took over. He did have the bad year in Green Bay but my bet is that the team would benefit from him taking over.

It was more than one bad year in Green Bay towards the end. More like 3 or so in his last 5 years, great DC in his prime though for sure. 

Theres a reason he isn't a DC anymore


Capers defense in points allowed
2017: #26 (24 points per game)
2016: #25 (25 points per game)  
2015: #11 (21)
2014: #14 (22)
2013: #24 (26)

I don't know if Walton called plays. He was coaching under Jeff Fisher, so who knows?

It's worth remembering that during Capers' last couple of years in GB, McCarthy was starting to lose the team, and the overall talent level was coming down some.

(01-08-2020, 02:37 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 12:53 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]Agreed. There's been some revisionism around here that he's really not a very good defensive coach but he's been largely successful most of career as a DC (not so much as a HC). Look at the rankings of teams before and after he took over. He did have the bad year in Green Bay but my bet is that the team would benefit from him taking over.

It was more than one bad year in Green Bay towards the end. More like 3 or so in his last 5 years, great DC in his prime though for sure. 

Theres a reason he isn't a DC anymore


Capers defense in points allowed
2017: #26 (24 points per game)
2016: #25 (25 points per game)  
2015: #11 (21)
2014: #14 (22)
2013: #24 (26)

By DVOA his defenses finished top 10 in the league 4 of his 9 seasons in Green Bay, the most recent was 2015 (9th). In 2013 they had some injury issues and really sank in the rankings. In 2017, the season he was canned, they had some issues with the pass but still finished 8th against the run. That was just a bad team though as the following year, the defense sank to 30th.

He's not the *best possible* DC candidate no doubt, but he's pretty good and likely the best we could hire for 2020 given the circumstances.

(01-08-2020, 03:37 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 02:37 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]It was more than one bad year in Green Bay towards the end. More like 3 or so in his last 5 years, great DC in his prime though for sure. 

Theres a reason he isn't a DC anymore


Capers defense in points allowed
2017: #26 (24 points per game)
2016: #25 (25 points per game)  
2015: #11 (21)
2014: #14 (22)
2013: #24 (26)

By DVOA his defenses finished top 10 in the league 4 of his 9 seasons in Green Bay, the most recent was 2015 (9th). In 2013 they had some injury issues and really sank in the rankings. In 2017, the season he was canned, they had some issues with the pass but still finished 8th against the run. That was just a bad team though as the following year, the defense sank to 30th.

He's not the *best possible* DC candidate no doubt, but he's pretty good and likely the best we could hire for 2020 given the circumstances.

Yeah nobody is doubting he used to be good. Just that he got very outdated, Packers fans wanted him fired for ages.  

I'd rather go after new blood to see what ideas they have for the modern NFL than a dinosaur like Capers who'll never get a DC job again anywhere else.

(01-08-2020, 04:09 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 03:37 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]By DVOA his defenses finished top 10 in the league 4 of his 9 seasons in Green Bay, the most recent was 2015 (9th). In 2013 they had some injury issues and really sank in the rankings. In 2017, the season he was canned, they had some issues with the pass but still finished 8th against the run. That was just a bad team though as the following year, the defense sank to 30th.

He's not the *best possible* DC candidate no doubt, but he's pretty good and likely the best we could hire for 2020 given the circumstances.

Yeah nobody is doubting he used to be good. Just that he got very outdated, Packers fans wanted him fired for ages.  

I'd rather go after new blood to see what ideas they have for the modern NFL than a dinosaur like Capers who'll never get a DC job again anywhere else.

Well he had a top 10 defense as recently as 2015. I guess you could say 4 seasons ago is outdated but I wouldn't. Green Bay fans seemed split on dropping him after 2017. They probably regretted it though because they fell even further in 2018.

(01-08-2020, 04:12 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 04:09 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah nobody is doubting he used to be good. Just that he got very outdated, Packers fans wanted him fired for ages.  

I'd rather go after new blood to see what ideas they have for the modern NFL than a dinosaur like Capers who'll never get a DC job again anywhere else.

Well he had a top 10 defense as recently as 2015. I guess you could say 4 seasons ago is outdated but I wouldn't. Green Bay fans seemed split on dropping him after 2017. They probably regretted it though because they fell even further in 2018.

Tom Coughlin was still an NFL head coach 4 years ago. He's outdated because of tactics he's used forever, super complex defense, inability to adjust, very obvious blitz calls on 3rd and long , bad personnel usage etc etc.

He's just not a good DC anymore, and the rest of the league is aware of it so we should be too.

Also check out pretty much every packers site when he got fired. It was long overdue and the vast majority loved it happening

(01-08-2020, 04:12 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 04:09 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah nobody is doubting he used to be good. Just that he got very outdated, Packers fans wanted him fired for ages.  

I'd rather go after new blood to see what ideas they have for the modern NFL than a dinosaur like Capers who'll never get a DC job again anywhere else.

Well he had a top 10 defense as recently as 2015. I guess you could say 4 seasons ago is outdated but I wouldn't. Green Bay fans seemed split on dropping him after 2017. They probably regretted it though because they fell even further in 2018.

Things these days change so quickly that 4 seasons ago sometimes feels like an eternity. I mean we made the AFCCG in 2017 and that feels like 10 years ago.

All I know is I follow a few Packers fans that I would consider among the best evaluators around, and they haaaated Capers. Still make fun of him to this day.

(01-08-2020, 04:45 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 04:12 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]Well he had a top 10 defense as recently as 2015. I guess you could say 4 seasons ago is outdated but I wouldn't. Green Bay fans seemed split on dropping him after 2017. They probably regretted it though because they fell even further in 2018.

Things these days change so quickly that 4 seasons ago sometimes feels like an eternity. I mean we made the AFCCG in 2017 and that feels like 10 years ago.

He was also 8th against the run in 2017 with not a great deal of talent. Things can change fast in terms of roster turnover but good coaches don't suddenly go bad. Would you rather keep Wash? He's young(er).

(01-08-2020, 04:59 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]good coaches don't suddenly go bad. 

If that's true then why is everyone trying to run Wash off? He was the DC of our studly 2017 defense after all.

(01-08-2020, 04:59 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 04:45 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Things these days change so quickly that 4 seasons ago sometimes feels like an eternity. I mean we made the AFCCG in 2017 and that feels like 10 years ago.

He was also 8th against the run in 2017 with not a great deal of talent. Things can change fast in terms of roster turnover but good coaches don't suddenly go bad. Would you rather keep Wash? He's young(er).

They had very good run stopping talent in 2O17 though. 

Why don't we hire Mike Smith as DC instead? He was a good defensive coach before

(01-08-2020, 05:55 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 04:59 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]good coaches don't suddenly go bad. 

If that's true then why is everyone trying to run Wash off? He was the DC of our studly 2017 defense after all.

Did Wash ever have more than a single year with a top 10 defense? Also, that defense had so much talent it certainly should have been good.

(01-08-2020, 05:59 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 04:59 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]He was also 8th against the run in 2017 with not a great deal of talent. Things can change fast in terms of roster turnover but good coaches don't suddenly go bad. Would you rather keep Wash? He's young(er).

They had very good run stopping talent in 2O17 though. 

Why don't we hire Mike Smith as DC instead? He was a good defensive coach before

Because Capers would be a better choice.

(01-08-2020, 06:39 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 05:55 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]If that's true then why is everyone trying to run Wash off? He was the DC of our studly 2017 defense after all.

Did Wash ever have more than a single year with a top 10 defense? Also, that defense had so much talent it certainly should have been good.

(01-08-2020, 05:59 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]They had very good run stopping talent in 2O17 though. 

Why don't we hire Mike Smith as DC instead? He was a good defensive coach before

Because Capers would be a better choice.

The point is Mike Smith isn't a good defensive coach prospect anymore, even though he was in the past and nobody will hire him..the same is true of Capers

(01-08-2020, 04:59 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-08-2020, 04:45 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Things these days change so quickly that 4 seasons ago sometimes feels like an eternity. I mean we made the AFCCG in 2017 and that feels like 10 years ago.

He was also 8th against the run in 2017 with not a great deal of talent. Things can change fast in terms of roster turnover but good coaches don't suddenly go bad. Would you rather keep Wash? He's young(er).

I don’t want to keep Wash because I don’t think he plays to strengths of his players.

New WR coach incoming:

https://twitter.com/ochocinco/status/121...2321225728

^^
What could that possibly be for?