Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

The Thread should have been titled "Disproving Intellect in 30 Seconds"

And yet no one has refuted him. I'll admit he doesn't prove anything. Everything he typed could be true and it still wouldn't prove white privilege doesn't exist. That doesn't mean his points are not worthy of discussion. Please show me why they are unworthy to be considered as a possible explanation for disparity in this system.

(06-03-2020, 01:06 PM)Gabe Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-03-2020, 12:30 PM)rfc17 Wrote: [ -> ]People havent been endorsing the looting and violence?  Probably should pay attention a little bit more.  For starters the chick that somehow won a pulitzer prize for the 1619 project was just on tv talking about how rioting, looting, and burning isnt violence.

But the absolute best twitter to follow is Chris Palmer twitter.  Writer covering the NBA who was on there screaming to burn down Minneapolis.  And that the Atlanta mayor was wrong to want peaceful protests as burning down a city is the only way to get attention.  But then in a great twist of fate, the rioters started approaching his neighborhood in LA, and all of a sudden he was calling the cops to come save his [BLEEP].

RCF, the argument/assumption is that anyone on here that's expressed any sympathy to protesters and/or their cause is endorsing/condoning anarchy. 

My stance is that I have yet to see anyone on here do that, despite multiple accusations

You don't think Bullseye's post condones rioting?

You don't think JagJohn's post that agrees with the author also condones rioting?

"Here's a guy who thinks rioting is justified. I agree with him. But I don't condone rioting." <-- How idiotic does someone have to be to spout that nonsense?

BTW, here's another example of "white privilege." Apparently it's considered a privilege for whites to have crimes against them buried by the MSM and covered up by the Leftist authorities.

Duncan Lemp

(06-03-2020, 02:15 PM)Last42min Wrote: [ -> ]And yet no one has refuted him. I'll admit he doesn't prove anything. Everything he typed could be true and it still wouldn't prove white privilege doesn't exist. That doesn't mean his points are not worthy of  discussion. Please show me why they are unworthy to be considered as a possible explanation for disparity in this system.

Exactly.  

I would redraw everyone's attention to the variation amid the black community itself.  Black Carribeans, Blacks of west Indian descent have completely different profiles for interactions with police, education, learning, home ownership etc.  If the difference is purely employer discrimination or invidious standards THOSE disparities shouldn't exist.  

The best example raised by the left would be redlining, but even that example is flawed.  Your truth and lending statements technical term is a HUD-1.  why? Because that stands for department of housing and urban development.  Since 1976 with the community reinvestment act we have been monitoring the dat a loan terms etc. and with advent of the government sponsored entities, the government itself has been the major player in buying and packaging home loans.  Adjustable rate, floating rate, subprime, nonconforming etc. All manner of products were created marketed approved by the state and in most cases bought and repackaged by the state with the stated goal of CLOSING THE HOME OWNERSHIP GAP.  what were the RESULTS.  Complete and utter disaster.  Home buyers were hit with the freight train of run away housiniflation, then the firm's holding the paper were hit by the freight train of deflation and over supplyThe GSEs completely and totally misjudged the risk associated with "affordable housing" goals.  Systemic risk created in washington DC ran through the system the financial system nearly collapsed.  And when employment cratered who were the people hardest hit?  The same low income blacks they claim they wanted to help!  

How many times does progressivism have to fail?

So I would kindly ask jag john, to stand up and tell the class, where is the compassion and empathy in making sure that people who are bad off, become worse off.  

Liars figure. Figures dont lie.  The leading indicator for success is family structure.  This transcends not only race, but disparity within pre-tested high IQ individuals of similar background.  And ironically the black legitimacy rate, just like black crime rates, are 100% in the control of black americans.

(06-03-2020, 03:41 PM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-03-2020, 02:15 PM)Last42min Wrote: [ -> ]And yet no one has refuted him. I'll admit he doesn't prove anything. Everything he typed could be true and it still wouldn't prove white privilege doesn't exist. That doesn't mean his points are not worthy of  discussion. Please show me why they are unworthy to be considered as a possible explanation for disparity in this system.

Exactly.  

I would redraw everyone's attention to the variation amid the black community itself.  Black Carribeans, Blacks of west Indian descent have completely different profiles for interactions with police, education, learning, home ownership etc.  If the difference is purely employer discrimination or invidious standards THOSE disparities shouldn't exist.  

The best example raised by the left would be redlining, but even that example is flawed.  Your truth and lending statements technical term is a HUD-1.  why? Because that stands for department of housing and urban development.  Since 1976 with the community reinvestment act we have been monitoring the dat a loan terms etc. and with advent of the government sponsored entities, the government itself has been the major player in buying and packaging home loans.  Adjustable rate, floating rate, subprime, nonconforming etc. All manner of products were created marketed approved by the state and in most cases bought and repackaged by the state with the stated goal of CLOSING THE HOME OWNERSHIP GAP.  what were the RESULTS.  Complete and utter disaster.  Home buyers were hit with the freight train of run away housiniflation, then the firm's holding the paper were hit by the freight train of deflation and over supplyThe GSEs completely and totally misjudged the risk associated with "affordable housing" goals.  Systemic risk created in washington DC ran through the system the financial system nearly collapsed.  And when employment cratered who were the people hardest hit?  The same low income blacks they claim they wanted to help!  

How many times does progressivism have to fail?

So I would kindly ask jag john, to stand up and tell the class, where is the compassion and empathy in making sure that people who are bad off, become worse off.  

Liars figure. Figures dont lie.  The leading indicator for success is family structure.  This transcends not only race, but disparity within pre-tested high IQ individuals of similar background.  And ironically the black legitimacy rate, just like black crime rates, are 100% in the control of black americans.

Oh wise teacher, thank you for giving me the chance to contribute to this profound lesson you are teaching us all.

I'm in a [BLEEP] work zoom meeting right now that is thoroughly pissing me off, so please excuse me if I don't give a lengthy answer to your rambling nonsense.

To be absolutely honest, I find the argument that white privilege doesn't exist to be so entirely absurd that it is laughable. Again, most of the world sees this, it's only blowhards like you preaching to your choir of like-minded buffoons who actually bother to get into this again and again.

Did white privilege exist at some point in the past? If no, lol. If yes, when did it cease to exist exactly?

(06-03-2020, 12:53 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-03-2020, 12:14 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]WHAT?   Where do you live?  I've been to MX City, Puebla, Guadalajara, Chapala, and Puerto Vallarta on numerous occasions (usually visit MX once every 2 years).  Don't worry, I won't come scope you out, just curious as to what city you currently live and which soccer team you may support, if any?  I'm a fan of the Chivas (Guadalajara) and root for Pumas as my secondary team (MX City).

You are correct with regard to avacados.  In MX, it's just another vegetable in which they use in various dishes or simply eat in a tortilla (like my mexican-born wife does).

I live in Playa Del Carmen, big touristy place about an hour south of Cancun. Beautiful beaches, weather and people, for the most part. Been here for getting on 7 years now. No soccer team near here is the only massive drawback... I did get to see Toluca beat America (the club soccer team that is, in case anyone in this thread is about to bash me for being anti-american lol) last year which was an awesome experience.

If you do ever make it to this part of the country feel free to send me a message and we can go for a cerveza or ten.

Sounds great.  My wife has been speaking highly of Merida so we want to get down there an do a tour of the Yucatan Peninsula.  I haven't been to that part of Mexico but need to do so sometime in the very near future.  I'll treat ya to a Paloma too

(06-03-2020, 04:27 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-03-2020, 12:53 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]I live in Playa Del Carmen, big touristy place about an hour south of Cancun. Beautiful beaches, weather and people, for the most part. Been here for getting on 7 years now. No soccer team near here is the only massive drawback... I did get to see Toluca beat America (the club soccer team that is, in case anyone in this thread is about to bash me for being anti-american lol) last year which was an awesome experience.

If you do ever make it to this part of the country feel free to send me a message and we can go for a cerveza or ten.

Sounds great.  My wife has been speaking highly of Merida so we want to get down there an do a tour of the Yucatan Peninsula.  I haven't been to that part of Mexico but need to do so sometime in the very near future.  I'll treat ya to a Paloma too

Merida is a great city, full of culture and great food. I strongly suggest going in the winter though, in the summer that city makes Jax feel like the North Pole.

(06-03-2020, 04:11 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-03-2020, 03:41 PM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]Exactly.  

I would redraw everyone's attention to the variation amid the black community itself.  Black Carribeans, Blacks of west Indian descent have completely different profiles for interactions with police, education, learning, home ownership etc.  If the difference is purely employer discrimination or invidious standards THOSE disparities shouldn't exist.  

The best example raised by the left would be redlining, but even that example is flawed.  Your truth and lending statements technical term is a HUD-1.  why? Because that stands for department of housing and urban development.  Since 1976 with the community reinvestment act we have been monitoring the dat a loan terms etc. and with advent of the government sponsored entities, the government itself has been the major player in buying and packaging home loans.  Adjustable rate, floating rate, subprime, nonconforming etc. All manner of products were created marketed approved by the state and in most cases bought and repackaged by the state with the stated goal of CLOSING THE HOME OWNERSHIP GAP.  what were the RESULTS.  Complete and utter disaster.  Home buyers were hit with the freight train of run away housiniflation, then the firm's holding the paper were hit by the freight train of deflation and over supplyThe GSEs completely and totally misjudged the risk associated with "affordable housing" goals.  Systemic risk created in washington DC ran through the system the financial system nearly collapsed.  And when employment cratered who were the people hardest hit?  The same low income blacks they claim they wanted to help!  

How many times does progressivism have to fail?

So I would kindly ask jag john, to stand up and tell the class, where is the compassion and empathy in making sure that people who are bad off, become worse off.  

Liars figure. Figures dont lie.  The leading indicator for success is family structure.  This transcends not only race, but disparity within pre-tested high IQ individuals of similar background.  And ironically the black legitimacy rate, just like black crime rates, are 100% in the control of black americans.

Oh wise teacher, thank you for giving me the chance to contribute to this profound lesson you are teaching us all.

I'm in a [BLEEP] work zoom meeting right now that is thoroughly pissing me off, so please excuse me if I don't give a lengthy answer to your rambling nonsense.

To be absolutely honest, I find the argument that white privilege doesn't exist to be so entirely absurd that it is laughable. Again, most of the world sees this, it's only blowhards like you preaching to your choir of like-minded buffoons who actually bother to get into this again and again.

Did white privilege exist at some point in the past? If no, lol. If yes, when did it cease to exist exactly?

Can you explain what exactly "white privilege" is?  I mean other than a liberal fantasy.

Is/was it possible for a young black girl growing up in the era of the civil rights movement to succeed?

Is/was it possible for a poor young black man growing up in a ghetto in a single parent household to succeed?

Is/was it possible for a poor black man born in the 1940's and raised in the south to succeed?

What about a poor Hispanic (Mexican) male growing up through the 1920's and 1930's?  Could he not succeed without the so-called "white privilege"?  What about his off-spring?

Depending on what your definition of "white privilege" is, there is no way possible that any of these people ever had it.

(06-03-2020, 05:34 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-03-2020, 04:11 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]Oh wise teacher, thank you for giving me the chance to contribute to this profound lesson you are teaching us all.

I'm in a [BLEEP] work zoom meeting right now that is thoroughly pissing me off, so please excuse me if I don't give a lengthy answer to your rambling nonsense.

To be absolutely honest, I find the argument that white privilege doesn't exist to be so entirely absurd that it is laughable. Again, most of the world sees this, it's only blowhards like you preaching to your choir of like-minded buffoons who actually bother to get into this again and again.

Did white privilege exist at some point in the past? If no, lol. If yes, when did it cease to exist exactly?

Can you explain what exactly "white privilege" is?  I mean other than a liberal fantasy.

Is/was it possible for a young black girl growing up in the era of the civil rights movement to succeed?

Is/was it possible for a poor young black man growing up in a ghetto in a single parent household to succeed?

Is/was it possible for a poor black man born in the 1940's and raised in the south to succeed?

What about a poor Hispanic (Mexican) male growing up through the 1920's and 1930's?  Could he not succeed without the so-called "white privilege"?  What about his off-spring?

Depending on what your definition of "white privilege" is, there is no way possible that any of these people ever had it.

Obviously all of those people were capable of succeeding in life. Everyone is capable of succeeding. But some people have fewer obstacles that they need to overcome, and some people have more. 

I assume we can agree on at least one form of privilege. A child born to very wealthy parents has a far greater chance of what we typically call "success" than a child born to parents in poverty. That is privilege of wealth. We can agree on that basic point right?

The idea of white privilege can be expressed as this: if you were to take two children, raised them identically in the same conditions, but one had black skin and one had white skin, the black child would have more obstacles to overcome than the white child would to achieve 'success'. Obviously, in this case, that obstacle is racism.

To be clear, white privilege does not mean this person will succeed, or that person will not succeed. There are obviously many more things that factor in, and many of them are massively more significant than skin colour.

I know you will not agree with me, because you deny that racism is still a problem in American society. If you don't recognize that racism exists, you obviously will not recognize that white privilege exists.

(06-03-2020, 06:26 AM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]Black Americans make up roughly 13% of the population, yet they make up 75% of NFL players.  Is this over sampling because GM's and Coaches hate white people?  The fundamental premise of "White privilige" is that anything that has a disparate impact is inherently and institutionally racist/unconsciously bias etc.  We just proved that you can have a completely OBJECTIVE sorting criteria that produces good faith results that are completely asymmetrical to the population @ large.

now do the HCs and GMs in the sport, especially at college level

How many black owners in the NFL you know the guys with the power?

Such a stupid argument.

(06-03-2020, 07:06 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-03-2020, 05:34 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]Can you explain what exactly "white privilege" is?  I mean other than a liberal fantasy.

Is/was it possible for a young black girl growing up in the era of the civil rights movement to succeed?

Is/was it possible for a poor young black man growing up in a ghetto in a single parent household to succeed?

Is/was it possible for a poor black man born in the 1940's and raised in the south to succeed?

What about a poor Hispanic (Mexican) male growing up through the 1920's and 1930's?  Could he not succeed without the so-called "white privilege"?  What about his off-spring?

Depending on what your definition of "white privilege" is, there is no way possible that any of these people ever had it.

Obviously all of those people were capable of succeeding in life. Everyone is capable of succeeding. But some people have fewer obstacles that they need to overcome, and some people have more. 

I assume we can agree on at least one form of privilege. A child born to very wealthy parents has a far greater chance of what we typically call "success" than a child born to parents in poverty. That is privilege of wealth. We can agree on that basic point right?

The idea of white privilege can be expressed as this: if you were to take two children, raised them identically in the same conditions, but one had black skin and one had white skin, the black child would have more obstacles to overcome than the white child would to achieve 'success'. Obviously, in this case, that obstacle is racism.

To be clear, white privilege does not mean this person will succeed, or that person will not succeed. There are obviously many more things that factor in, and many of them are massively more significant than skin colour.

I know you will not agree with me, because you deny that racism is still a problem in American society. If you don't recognize that racism exists, you obviously will not recognize that white privilege exists.

Bwwwaaahahaha, Tony Khan agrees!

(06-03-2020, 07:26 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-03-2020, 07:06 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]Obviously all of those people were capable of succeeding in life. Everyone is capable of succeeding. But some people have fewer obstacles that they need to overcome, and some people have more. 

I assume we can agree on at least one form of privilege. A child born to very wealthy parents has a far greater chance of what we typically call "success" than a child born to parents in poverty. That is privilege of wealth. We can agree on that basic point right?

The idea of white privilege can be expressed as this: if you were to take two children, raised them identically in the same conditions, but one had black skin and one had white skin, the black child would have more obstacles to overcome than the white child would to achieve 'success'. Obviously, in this case, that obstacle is racism.

To be clear, white privilege does not mean this person will succeed, or that person will not succeed. There are obviously many more things that factor in, and many of them are massively more significant than skin colour.

I know you will not agree with me, because you deny that racism is still a problem in American society. If you don't recognize that racism exists, you obviously will not recognize that white privilege exists.

Bwwwaaahahaha, Tony Khan agrees!

Thanks, a perfect example of the privilege of wealth.

So, I think most people could agree to a form of wealth privilege. There are definitely class issues that impact opportunities. There is also intelligence privilege and beauty privilege. There is also a majority privilege. If we started analyzing every difference by trait, I am sure we could list out a ton of disparities between groups. There are benefits derived from each of these.

As to majority privilege, I get that it would kind of be odd to be raised in a society that tailors certain elements to skin tone (like dolls, action figures, movies, bandaids, etc.). I could see how this could make some people feel alienated or create a sense of longing. This is also true for every other difference between groups. Do short people long to be tall? Ugly people pretty? Etc? Some of life is luck, and it's unfortunate when people are put in those situations, but it's not something that can't be overcome. I am also sympathetic to creating some kind of atmosphere that helps reduce those disparities. That said, it's going to be difficult to adequately mitigate all differences.

I also accept some form of wealth privilege, comparatively, between whites and blacks. I am all about changing this, but, in my opinion, the way to solve this is by addressing the problems that create wealth disparities. No data suggests this is intrinsic to RACE. Strong family units (don't have kids until you're married and raise them in a joint home), Education (graduate highschool), Hard work (get and maintain a full time job). 75% of poor children who follow these rules make it into middle class (making more than 55k a year). To this end, I feel like whites are in a better position to move into middle class, because these are values that are emphasized in middle class families. I blame welfare for contributing to the degradation of poor families. I will even concede that whites had the privilege of not needing to go on welfare and were therefore insulated from this kind of deterioration to a degree (though it is growing in white communities).

I have said it before, and I will say it again, that I think the single greatest benefit of white privilege is the freedom to shed poverty without judgement. Blacks do not get this luxury. They get some form of discrimination both from ingroup ("Uncle Tom"ism) and outgroup (You're not like those other ones). Whites may get some of the former, but none of the latter. Imo, the single greatest obstacle to culture change is the threat of losing black identity. The 90's were a battle ground among blacks for the future of black identity, and progressives won. Now, the Biden's of the world get to use the "You ain't black" line as a way to encourage proper group think. I'm glad to see blacks are wising up to this with the standard Joe's, but, unfortunately, they are being heavily influenced and recruited the socialist wing of the democratic party. We will never be able to solve race issues if they believe it's fundamentally necessary to overthrow capitalism for these problems to disappear.

All that said, whiteness is not inherently a privilege. I think whites by and large to benefit from many values passed on by middle class families (this is true for higher class families, also).

White Liberal Privilege: "Shad Khan, you ain't minority enough (for me)."

https://deadspin.com/the-two-faces-of-sh...1843894295

The closing tag: "But come November, what will he be a bigger fan of? The Trump economy or social justice?"

Socialism is the goal. If you're not on board, you're the enemy.

(06-04-2020, 05:37 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]White Liberal Privilege: "Shad Khan, you ain't minority enough (for me)."

https://deadspin.com/the-two-faces-of-sh...1843894295

Another white liberal excoriating a minority for wandering off the plantation. (Joe Biden wink)

I think it always helps to define our terms.  What exactly do we mean by "white privilege?"  I was thinking that "white privilege" was a broad term that meant that white people are treated better than non-white people.   In general, I agree with that statement.  I do think that white people in a very general sense are treated better than non-white people.  Of course, one might say, skinny people are treated better than fat people, tall people are treated better than short people, and beautiful people are treated better than ugly people.  But I digress.  

What exactly is "white privilege?"  So I went to wikipedia for a definition, and here it is.  It's an interesting concept.  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_privilege

I think I would agree that white privilege exists, but where we go from there would be a real puzzle, because most of the solutions I've seen proposed are counterproductive.

And the above sentence is a perfect example of the difference between liberals, moderates, and conservatives.  

Liberals: here's the problem, here's the solution.
Conservatives: those problems are not real, and the proposed solutions are terrible.
Moderates: the problems are real, but the proposed solutions are terrible.  

In the case of race and racism, I see the problem, but I don't see any proposed solutions that don't make the problem worse than it already is.

(06-03-2020, 07:26 PM)lastonealive Wrote: [ -> ]How many black owners in the NFL you know the guys with the power?

Such a stupid argument.

The new members of the Australian Parliament of 2019.  Where are all the black people?  Such a racist country!