Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Sauerkraut lasagna?! That’s a big fat NOPE.

(06-12-2020, 09:25 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Sauerkraut lasagna?! That’s a big fat NOPE.

Yep. Accidentally ordered it at a restaurant in Germany. That first bite was quite shocking.

Is that the same Rex Chapman who was a nasty white dunker?

(06-26-2020, 02:06 PM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]Is that the same Rex Chapman who was a nasty white dunker?

Same guy.

(06-09-2020, 04:29 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-09-2020, 03:57 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]Robert E. Lee was a hero in the Mexican/American war.  He was reluctant to join the confederacy and only did so because that was what his home state chose to do.  In fact, he was very much against secession.


Did Crazy Horse or Sitting Bull give up their "right" to be called American when they took up arms against the U.S. military?  Was their fight honorable or treasonous?  Should we remove monuments to them since they took up arms against the U.S.?


I disagree.  It wasn't until perhaps 10 years or so ago that the monuments, school names, etc. were deemed "offensive" or "repressive".  We are told by those on the left that there should be an "open and honest" dialog about black history.  What better way to start a conversation than to have someone ask the question as to why a piece of art 100+ years old is displayed where it is?

Much like the definition of "hate speech" the definition of a "proper monument" is purely subjective.

Just because YOU learned that it was offensive 10 years ago doesn't mean it hasn't been that for MUCH longer.
You were just late to arrive there and you unfortunately had to be notified of your ignorance to the pain of others. 

That conversation you think "needs starting" has been being played out in the streets since 1954, man. 

The conversation has been had. It's over. 

I don't find it proper to erect monuments that serve to divide the populace where they stand. This one did  - as evidenced by the opinions being expressed by African American Jacksonvillians today. 

You should think past this "well it doesn't offend ME" stance.  Many people have lived a very different experience than you and see those monuments very differently than you do.

Absolutely!

(06-10-2020, 06:36 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-09-2020, 06:58 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]It's not my heritage.  I wasn't born around here and my home state (New Mexico) had very little impact during The Civil War.

I do have many friends that are multi-generation Floridians that are very proud of their heritage.  Their ancestors fought for what they (back then) believed in and fought honorably.  The Civil War was a very dark time in our nation's history, but it is what it is.  Many fought because their idea and belief is that it was "right".  Many died and shed blood during that conflict.  Whether or not if they were right or wrong, they deserve some dignity and respect.  That's what the statue that was (cowardly) taken down in the middle of the night was commemorating.  It had nothing to do with "oppression" or slavery.

Put yourself in the shoes of a white man living in Florida in 1850 or so and imagine what you think is "right or wrong".  Society's way of thinking back then is nowhere near what it is today.  Fast forward to the 1890's (when the statue was built and erected) and think about what people were remembering.  It was NOT about slavery.  It was about loved ones that fell during that horrific time in our nation's history.

That statue stood there over a hundred years before some "woke" people decided that it was "offensive".  There is a reason why so many landmarks, roads and schools around this city are named what they are named.  It's all about the history.

In my opinion people that find monuments, landmarks, names of schools, etc. "offensive" or "repressive" today are living in the past.  The whole "white privilege" thing is a big myth.

When we start tearing down monuments and treasures from the past, where will it end?  In my opinion doing so is really no different than what the Taliban did.  I think we as a country are better than that.

People have a right to be proud of their heritage, but they need to be a little more selective about what part of their heritage they're proud of.  Confederate soldiers were fighting for a government that seceded from the United States because they thought slavery was under threat from abolitionists in the North.   The proof of this is in the Articles of Secession where the Southern states stated their reasons for seceding.  Articles of Secession are declarations of independence.  Five of the most important states that made up the confederacy passed and published Articles of Secession.  

You can read them here: 

https://www.battlefields.org/learn/prima...ing-states

Mississippi: "Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery-- the greatest material interest of the world. Its labor supplies the product which constitutes by far the largest and most important portions of commerce of the earth. These products are peculiar to the climate verging on the tropical regions, and by an imperious law of nature, none but the black race can bear exposure to the tropical sun. These products have become necessities of the world, and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization. That blow has been long aimed at the institution, and was at the point of reaching its consummation. There was no choice left us but submission to the mandates of abolition, or a dissolution of the Union, whose principles had been subverted to work out our ruin. That we do not overstate the dangers to our institution, a reference to a few facts will sufficiently prove."

And here is Alexander Stevens' speech about secession:  

https://teachingamericanhistory.org/libr...ne-speech/

"Our new government is founded upon exactly the opposite idea; its foundations are laid, its corner-stone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery subordination to the superior race is his natural and normal condition."

I'm a southerner, and I'm descended from southerners, some of whom fought in the Confederate armies.  But that part of my heritage, the part that includes slavery and fighting to preserve slavery, is not something I would be proud of, and I certainly don't think we should have monuments to the army that fought to preserve slavery.  

"...that cause was, I believe, one of the worst for which a people ever fought, and one for which there was the least excuse." Ulysses S Grant

Agreed completely.  Well done!