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(04-09-2022, 02:55 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-09-2022, 01:49 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]I think it was just coach speak by Pederson that he wanted Chark back.  By free agency standards, Chark signed for a very modest, low risk contract with Detroit.  The way the Jaguars were throwing around money, they could have easily offered a more favorable contract than what he got.  The Jaguars gave $14 million in guaranteed money to Zay Jones.

I also don't see much support for the theory that Chark didn't want to be here.  If it was Urban Meyer, he's no longer the coach.  If he just wanted to play for a winner, why go to Detroit?

I think Pederson/Baalke had low interest in Chark.  That's too bad because I think Chark is under-rated.  His stats are low in part because of injury and also because he mostly had awful quarterbacks throwing to him.  I could easily see him bouncing back to his pro-bowl alternate level or even exceeding it.  It wouldn't surprise me if down the road that Chark is added to the list of former players where Jaguars fans say "Why in the world did we let him go?!?".

Pederson brought it up in three separate meetings with members of the press. 

I don't think he does that if he's just paying lip service.
 I think he wanted to get it done, and being vocal about it may have been his way of pressing Baalke to make it happen.

It could be that they offered him something that had similar guaranteed money but was a longer contract (2 or 3 seasons) and Chark is betting on himself to have a good season and get a better contract next year. We'll probably never know, but Chark doesn't seems particularly disgruntled with the team.
(04-09-2022, 02:59 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-09-2022, 02:55 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Pederson brought it up in three separate meetings with members of the press. 

I don't think he does that if he's just paying lip service.
 I think he wanted to get it done, and being vocal about it may have been his way of pressing Baalke to make it happen.

It could be that they offered him something that had similar guaranteed money but was a longer contract (2 or 3 seasons) and Chark is betting on himself to have a good season and get a better contract next year. We'll probably never know, but Chark doesn't seems particularly disgruntled with the team.

This sounds plausible and probably closer to the truth...
(04-09-2022, 02:55 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-09-2022, 01:49 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]I think it was just coach speak by Pederson that he wanted Chark back.  By free agency standards, Chark signed for a very modest, low risk contract with Detroit.  The way the Jaguars were throwing around money, they could have easily offered a more favorable contract than what he got.  The Jaguars gave $14 million in guaranteed money to Zay Jones.

I also don't see much support for the theory that Chark didn't want to be here.  If it was Urban Meyer, he's no longer the coach.  If he just wanted to play for a winner, why go to Detroit?

I think Pederson/Baalke had low interest in Chark.  That's too bad because I think Chark is under-rated.  His stats are low in part because of injury and also because he mostly had awful quarterbacks throwing to him.  I could easily see him bouncing back to his pro-bowl alternate level or even exceeding it.  It wouldn't surprise me if down the road that Chark is added to the list of former players where Jaguars fans say "Why in the world did we let him go?!?".

Pederson brought it up in three separate meetings with members of the press. 

I don't think he does that if he's just paying lip service.
 I think he wanted to get it done, and being vocal about it may have been his way of pressing Baalke to make it happen.

If the Jaguars had high interest in Chark, why isn't he on the team?  Actions speak louder than words.  The Jaguars had a ton of salary cap space and were clearly very willing to spend it and even over pay for players they wanted.  Chark's contract was very reasonable.  I think it was one of the better values in free agency this year.  If the Jaguars didn't outbid that offer, I would consider by definition that the Jaguars didn't have high interest in him.

The other hypothetical scenario is that the Jaguars did outbid Detroit, but Chark turned it down because he didn't want to stay in Jacksonville.  However, I have not seen a single report of this.  An agent would likely brag about a higher offer if it existed as agents earn their livelihood on their perceived ability to get their clients the best contracts.  I'm also having a hard time finding a motive, not mention evidience to support that motive.  Urban Meyer?  He's no longer the coach.  To play for a contender?  He signed with a team that was 3-13-1 last year.  He just prefers living in Detroit over Florida?  Really?  Particularly from a player who has always lived in the South and chose to go to college in the South?  I won't say it is impossible that he has some secret motive, but I think the most likely scenario is simply the Jaguars didn't outbid Detroit.
(04-09-2022, 07:17 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-09-2022, 02:55 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Pederson brought it up in three separate meetings with members of the press. 

I don't think he does that if he's just paying lip service.
 I think he wanted to get it done, and being vocal about it may have been his way of pressing Baalke to make it happen.

If the Jaguars had high interest in Chark, why isn't he on the team?  Actions speak louder than words.  The Jaguars had a ton of salary cap space and were clearly very willing to spend it and even over pay for players they wanted.  Chark's contract was very reasonable.  I think it was one of the better values in free agency this year.  If the Jaguars didn't outbid that offer, I would consider by definition that the Jaguars didn't have high interest in him.

The other hypothetical scenario is that the Jaguars did outbid Detroit, but Chark turned it down because he didn't want to stay in Jacksonville.  However, I have not seen a single report of this.  An agent would likely brag about a higher offer if it existed as agents earn their livelihood on their perceived ability to get their clients the best contracts.  I'm also having a hard time finding a motive, not mention evidience to support that motive.  Urban Meyer?  He's no longer the coach.  To play for a contender?  He signed with a team that was 3-13-1 last year.  He just prefers living in Detroit over Florida?  Really?  Particularly from a player who has always lived in the South and chose to go to college in the South?  I won't say it is impossible that he has some secret motive, but I think the most likely scenario is simply the Jaguars didn't outbid Detroit.

Lots of reasons he may have chosen to not take the Jags offer.

I have my gut feeling about it and you have yours.

(04-09-2022, 06:35 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-09-2022, 02:59 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]It could be that they offered him something that had similar guaranteed money but was a longer contract (2 or 3 seasons) and Chark is betting on himself to have a good season and get a better contract next year. We'll probably never know, but Chark doesn't seems particularly disgruntled with the team.

This sounds plausible and probably closer to the truth...

I agree - that is a sound theory.
(04-09-2022, 09:34 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-09-2022, 07:17 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]If the Jaguars had high interest in Chark, why isn't he on the team?  Actions speak louder than words.  The Jaguars had a ton of salary cap space and were clearly very willing to spend it and even over pay for players they wanted.  Chark's contract was very reasonable.  I think it was one of the better values in free agency this year.  If the Jaguars didn't outbid that offer, I would consider by definition that the Jaguars didn't have high interest in him.

The other hypothetical scenario is that the Jaguars did outbid Detroit, but Chark turned it down because he didn't want to stay in Jacksonville.  However, I have not seen a single report of this.  An agent would likely brag about a higher offer if it existed as agents earn their livelihood on their perceived ability to get their clients the best contracts.  I'm also having a hard time finding a motive, not mention evidience to support that motive.  Urban Meyer?  He's no longer the coach.  To play for a contender?  He signed with a team that was 3-13-1 last year.  He just prefers living in Detroit over Florida?  Really?  Particularly from a player who has always lived in the South and chose to go to college in the South?  I won't say it is impossible that he has some secret motive, but I think the most likely scenario is simply the Jaguars didn't outbid Detroit.

Lots of reasons he may have chosen to not take the Jags offer.

I have my gut feeling about it and you have yours.

(04-09-2022, 06:35 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]This sounds plausible and probably closer to the truth...

I agree - that is a sound theory.

I'm fairly convinced Chark just didn't want to be here.
Chark was in Jax working out with Trevor days before FA opened. I think he would have been perfectly happy staying here if we offered the most or probably even the same money, but the Lions offered ~30% more.
(04-10-2022, 10:56 AM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-09-2022, 09:34 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Lots of reasons he may have chosen to not take the Jags offer.

I have my gut feeling about it and you have yours.


I agree - that is a sound theory.

I'm fairly convinced Chark just didn't want to be here.

What's his reason for not wanting to be here and what evidence do you have to support it?  As someone else said, he was working out with Trevor just before free agency.  I see no reason to believe anything other than Detroit just outbid Jacksonville.
Lots of folks very happy to adopt unsubstantiated reports as gospel and dismiss anyone who doesn't make the same leap of faith.

I wish Chark were a Jag, but I'm not going act like my assumptions are the only possibility, and i'm definitely not going to pretend anyone here actually knows what the Jags offered.

Maybe Baalke gave us one more reason to hate him.
Maybe Chark had good reason to make a change besides money.
There are so many possibilities.
(04-10-2022, 02:33 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-10-2022, 10:56 AM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]I'm fairly convinced Chark just didn't want to be here.

What's his reason for not wanting to be here and what evidence do you have to support it?  As someone else said, he was working out with Trevor just before free agency.  I see no reason to believe anything other than Detroit just outbid Jacksonville.

He was working out with Trevor because he lives here, probably built quite a relationship with him, maybe even they are friends? I dunno 
I don't have any evidence. No one on this board has evidence of any of their opinions usually.
Based solely on the deal he got, the location he went to... I find it hard to believe we wouldn't have offered him what he took in Detroit.
But I also have pondered how he didn't get any offers from any of the WR needy teams better than the Detroit deal. Perhaps he didn't have many offers at all but I think some teams will regret not taking a chance.
Detroit is an awful city. It just is and it has been for 60 years, since the fall of the American automobile.
(04-11-2022, 03:24 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]Detroit is an awful city. It just is and it has been for 60 years, since the fall of the American automobile.

It's not like he has to live in the ghetto or anything like that.  I'm sure there are some pretty nice neighborhoods up there.
(04-11-2022, 03:45 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-11-2022, 03:24 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]Detroit is an awful city. It just is and it has been for 60 years, since the fall of the American automobile.

It's not like he has to live in the ghetto or anything like that.  I'm sure there are some pretty nice neighborhoods up there.


Yea..... but no. It looks awful. Empty Warehouses, decrepit factories... it's just... a wasteland.

(04-11-2022, 03:45 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-11-2022, 03:24 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]Detroit is an awful city. It just is and it has been for 60 years, since the fall of the American automobile.

It's not like he has to live in the ghetto or anything like that.  I'm sure there are some pretty nice neighborhoods up there.


Yea..... but no. It looks awful. Empty Warehouses, decrepit factories... it's just... a wasteland.
(04-11-2022, 04:18 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-11-2022, 03:45 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]It's not like he has to live in the ghetto or anything like that.  I'm sure there are some pretty nice neighborhoods up there.


Yea..... but no. It looks awful. Empty Warehouses, decrepit factories... it's just... a wasteland.


How many days and nights have you spent in Detroit in the past 10 years?
(04-11-2022, 04:18 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-11-2022, 03:45 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]It's not like he has to live in the ghetto or anything like that.  I'm sure there are some pretty nice neighborhoods up there.


Yea..... but no. It looks awful. Empty Warehouses, decrepit factories... it's just... a wasteland.

(04-11-2022, 03:45 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]It's not like he has to live in the ghetto or anything like that.  I'm sure there are some pretty nice neighborhoods up there.


Yea..... but no. It looks awful. Empty Warehouses, decrepit factories... it's just... a wasteland.
Go find the clouds. They need someone to yell at them.
(04-11-2022, 03:24 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]Detroit is an awful city. It just is and it has been for 60 years, since the fall of the American automobile.

@Welp, that convinced me.@
Chark definitely made a mistake not taking less to live here instead.

Is that the desired response?
(04-02-2022, 04:54 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]For the purposes of these questions, assume the following conditions:

A.  A top slot WR and top nickel/slot CBs are considered starters, given the prevalence of 11 personnel and nickel defenses.

B.  There will be no trades up or down in any round, nor will there be any trades for or away of players existing on rosters, so there will be no trading away Shenault or trading for DK Metcalf.  What you now see as far as draft picks is what we will utilize in this draft.

With the above conditions in place:

1.  How many new starters do you expect to come out of our free agency haul?  Who are they?

2.  How many immediate starters do you expect to come out of this draft?

3.  Are there any guys drafted last year that did not start for whatever reason last year to be starters this year?  Name them and if applicable, name their positions.

4.  Given the number of new starters combined from the questions listed above, would you say that is a good or bad total?  Why?  Do you think the number of new starters is a reflection of a job well done in terms of player acquisition, a function of how bad the roster was in the first place, the need for newer players to fit the new schemes, or some combination? Will the players be clear upgrades or scheme fillers?

5.  Do your expectations rise or fall depending upon who has the most sway in the draft room between Baalke or Pederson?

6.  Would your expectations be any higher if Baalke had been fired or an EVP beeh placed above him as promised by Khan?

7.  Of all of the positions deemed to be needs on this team, what's the one position you somehow think will not be addressed by round 3?

I will give my answers a little later.  I want to hear your thoughts.
Thought it would be a good time to revisit this topic now that we've had the draft and seen the schedule.

Having reviewed the free agency haul and  the draft class I can see up to 12-14 new starters this year.

I see the new starters this way:

RB-Travis Etienne-I've heard lots of favorable reports about his health and prognosis for recovery.  Since JRob is still recovering, Etienne will be the starter.

WR-Christian Kirk (Slot) I think both Kirk and Jones are new starters almost by default.  
WR-Zay Jones I do NOT see him as an upgrade.  Had there not been such a dramatic run at WR in the first round, I think the Jaguars might have addressed that position and Jones would not be a starter. 

TE-Evan Engram-This is almost self explanatory

LG-???-Bartch was a starter last year, but at RG.  I'm not sold on him at LG, either.  I've heard some speculation that Taylor might be tried at LG.  Not sold on him, either, but he can't be any worse at LG than he is at RT, can he?

C-Fortner or Shatley-Not prepared to name the starter between these two.  If you put a gun to my head, I'd choose Shatley to start opening day, but who knows.

RG-Scherff-'Nuff said

RT-Walker Little-He had last year to knock the rust off.  I think this year he gets quality coaching and upgrades RT.

NT-Fatukasi-Given the investment and his apparent familiarity (?) with Caldwell, I think he starts.

DE-Hamilton-With Fatukasi in at NT, Hamilton slides to a DE spot

LOLB-Walker-as the top overall pick, I think he gets as much opportunity to start as possible.  I have my doubts as to how much impact he can actually have, especially as an edge rusher.  But I wonder how long he will hold onto that starting spot.

ILB-Devin Lloyd-I think he becomes the next star on the defense

ILB-Olukun or Muma-I think both guys would be upgrades over the athletically limited Wilson/Schobert and the seemingly non instinctual Myles Jack.

S-Andre Cisco-Wingard can't win the starting S spot this year, can he?

Nickel-Darious Williams

Among the UDFA's, if there were long shots to start, I'd say the WR out of Notre Dame and the DB from Texas are the longshots to start from that group.  Been looking at a lot of Austin clips lately.  While he seems to have all of the tools you'd want in a WR with good size and sub 4.4 sped, it didn't seem to translate into a lot of separation at the college level.  It'll be interesting to see what the Jaguars coaching can get out of him.

That's fifteen (15) new starters in 2022-not counting kicker. Possibly seven from free agency, three more from last year's draft ascend to starters this year, and  2, maybe 3 starters from the rookie class.  That's even more dramatic than I thought when I first posted these questions, and I'm not even sold on the Walker pick or the Zay Jones signing.  That seems almost an excessive number of new starters, even though this has been the worst team in the league the past two years running.

I feel like I am missing something in the analysis...kind of like that sudden panic you get where you feel the need to pat yourself down to ensure you have your keys, but I can't put my finger on what it is.

What are your thoughts?
Not quoting for the sake of space, but again, great details and analysis on your part, Bullseye.

Only contribution I suggest would be the interior line - I'd kinda like to see Shatley start at C, Fortner get some time at LG. He'll have vets on each side to help with learning curves, and he'll get up-close experience to what Shatley is doing pre-snap to set the line and identify defensive alignments. Of course, this assumes he beats out Bartch, which could be one of the key battles to watch through the preseason.

I push Taylor inside, but I keep him on the right side. He can back up Scherff, maybe the old guy can teach him some techniques or tricks to improve his footwork and blocking.

The high level of churn across our roster is one of the bigger reasons why I think we'll start slow but gradually strengthen as the season drags on.
I won't quote Bulleye's message in the interest of space.  I mostly agree, but have the following comments:

You say that you don't consider Zay Jones to be an upgrade, but who are you comparing him to?  Chark?  Chark only played 3 full games.  In terms of snaps, he was sixth among our wide receivers.  Our top three wide receivers last year in terms of offensive snaps were:


1. Marvin Jones
2. Laviska Shenault
3. Laquon Treadwell

All three return, although I expect Kirk to upgrade Shenault and Zay Jones to upgrade Treadwell.  I question whether Treadwell even makes the 53 man roster.  I think the Jaguars may cut him in favor of Kevin Austin.  As for Zay Jones, while I don't expect miracles, he does have a low drop rate.  How many times last year were we saying "All I want is a wide receiver who won't drop the ball....."? 

I see three starters from this draft which is better than my original guess of two.  Maybe he doesn't live up to the #1 overall status, but I have no doubt Walker will start.  I also have no doubt that Devin Lloyd will start.  While less certain, I think Fortner will start at center as well.  However, barring injury, I see little chance of Muma getting more defensive snaps than Oluokun or Lloyd this year.

Bartch will very likely be our left guard.  If there was doubt, Pederson basically said it today.  Although Bartch changes from right to left, I don't consider him a new starter.  He played over three times as many snaps last year as Cann and outplayed him.

I do think Cisco beats out Wingard and Little beats our Taylor.

I will say in terms of predictions, I did say that I didn't think we wouldn't acquire our left guard of the future or a safety in the draft.  That was a correct call.

The bottom line is that I see 13 new starters -- 7 free agents (Kirk, Z. Jones, Engram, Scherff, Fatukasi, Oluokun, Williams), 3 returning rookies from last year moving into starting roles this year (Etienne, Little, Cisco) and 3 draft picks from this year (Walker, Lloyd, Fortner).  We also got better depth, some additional role players and better coaching.  I'm hoping for a big step forward this year.
(05-13-2022, 09:09 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]Not quoting for the sake of space, but again, great details and analysis on your part, Bullseye.

Only contribution I suggest would be the interior line - I'd kinda like to see Shatley start at C, Fortner get some time at LG. He'll have vets on each side to help with learning curves, and he'll get up-close experience to what Shatley is doing pre-snap to set the line and identify defensive alignments. Of course, this assumes he beats out Bartch, which could be one of the key battles to watch through the preseason.

I push Taylor inside, but I keep him on the right side. He can back up Scherff, maybe the old guy can teach him some techniques or tricks to improve his footwork and blocking.

The high level of churn across our roster is one of the bigger reasons why I think we'll start slow but gradually strengthen as the season drags on.

Thanks.

I'm  certainly not averse to starting Shatley at C, at least to start the season.  Aside from not having seen much of Fortner, Shatley, while not to be mistaken for the great centers in NFL history, has played well for us when he's played.  To me he never seemed to stick out in a bad way.  His experience could easily be a key to the offensive line transitioning from the old schemes to the new one more smoothly. On the other hand, from what I've read about Fortner, it's clear he's no dummy.  I expect him to be a quick study.  I think no matter where you would put Fortner, he would have experienced guys around him, though obviously Bartch is less experienced than Scherff.

A this point, I look at Taylor and see a guy who has problems with speed and in space.  He seems to have a build and enough ability to move inside to guard and, with the additional protection the enclosed space would provide, he has a chance to possibly thrive (comparatively speaking) inside.  I still doubt he could handle an Aaron Donald or the guy from Tennessee, but despite his reluctance to do so, I think he might benefit from a move inside.  I think he has the power to do well, but stunts, slants, and switches to pick up blitzers would be my concern for him.

I agree the turnover in the starting lineup does not lend itself to a strong start.  Granted we've been the worst team in the league over the past two years.  I think we need an infusion of talent.  But they all need to adjust to the schemes, each other, and coalesce to maximize productivity.  This is an argument against a fast start the schedule seems to make possible at first glance.
(05-13-2022, 10:00 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]I won't quote Bulleye's message in the interest of space.  I mostly agree, but have the following comments:

You say that you don't consider Zay Jones to be an upgrade, but who are you comparing him to?  Chark?  Chark only played 3 full games.  In terms of snaps, he was sixth among our wide receivers.  Our top three wide receivers last year in terms of offensive snaps were:


1. Marvin Jones
2. Laviska Shenault
3. Laquon Treadwell

All three return, although I expect Kirk to upgrade Shenault and Zay Jones to upgrade Treadwell.  I question whether Treadwell even makes the 53 man roster.  I think the Jaguars may cut him in favor of Kevin Austin.  As for Zay Jones, while I don't expect miracles, he does have a low drop rate.  How many times last year were we saying "All I want is a wide receiver who won't drop the ball....."? 

I see three starters from this draft which is better than my original guess of two.  Maybe he doesn't live up to the #1 overall status, but I have no doubt Walker will start.  I also have no doubt that Devin Lloyd will start.  While less certain, I think Fortner will start at center as well.  However, barring injury, I see little chance of Muma getting more defensive snaps than Oluokun or Lloyd this year.

Bartch will very likely be our left guard.  If there was doubt, Pederson basically said it today.  Although Bartch changes from right to left, I don't consider him a new starter.  He played over three times as many snaps last year as Cann and outplayed him.

I do think Cisco beats out Wingard and Little beats our Taylor.

I will say in terms of predictions, I did say that I didn't think we wouldn't acquire our left guard of the future or a safety in the draft.  That was a correct call.

The bottom line is that I see 13 new starters -- 7 free agents (Kirk, Z. Jones, Engram, Scherff, Fatukasi, Oluokun, Williams), 3 returning rookies from last year moving into starting roles this year (Etienne, Little, Cisco) and 3 draft picks from this year (Walker, Lloyd, Fortner).  We also got better depth, some additional role players and better coaching.  I'm hoping for a big step forward this year.

From a "the best ability is availability perspective," yes, Jones would be an upgrade over Chark based on last year's playing time.  But for the most part, Jones didn't do much with the time he was in the game for the Raiders.  In fairness, he had lots of talent around him with Ruggs, Waller, and Renfrow, but outside of one game, I don't see where his production/ability merits giving him the benefit of the doubt as an upgrade to anyone.  That hotel incident doesn't help him in my mind, either.  But the sad part about your snaps analysis is that Treadwell ranked 2rd in snaps among the WRs.  Wasn't he a mid season acquisition?  The fact he could come in so late and still warrant that many snaps speaks to how bad our receivers were last year.  Based on the things I've read about him, I'm rooting for his career to have a positive rebound, but under ideal circumstances, Treadwell should not have had that many snaps for us last year. To say that Jones will be an upgrade to Treadwell isn't saying much at all.   I hope like hell I'm wrong about Jones.  I would gladly eat crow if he made the Pro Bowl here.  But as of now, I still see WR as a HUGE need going into 2023.

I'm also hoping like hell Bartch pleasantly surprises me and takes a step up in his development and play this year.  He has had some good playing time and the reps should help him, but I have my doubts about him.  A guy like him is hurt by this team's seeming perpetual inability to develop players.  Hopefully Pederson, Rauscher, et al can get the most out of him. (speaking of Rauscher, I absolutely LOVED his draft quote about his job in life being to protect Trevor Lawrence!  Classic!  Hopefully he can instill and reinforce that mindset into the players and make them the most capable of doing so successfully.)

Though I;m not happy with the depth on the O, I think defensively, I agree we are a much deeper team than we've been in a long time.  We've added FIVE (5) LBs this offseason, and the guys we've added give us a ton of versatility.  Walker is a bit of a project, and I'd like him to stay at edge so he can quickly develop an array of pass rushing pmoves.  But I can see situations he could line up at 5 tech or 3 tech in addition to LOLB.  Devin Lloys has very good length and athletic ability,  As he was able to do at Utah, I could see him playing inside, rushing the passer from the edge, dropping into coverage and stopping the run.  Though I don't see Muma as quite the edge rusher Lloyd could be, I am very high on his selection in the 3rd round.  I think Olakun gives us a lot of coverage ability,  Arden Key gives us another viable edge rusher.

By my count , we have four to five guys who can give us quality snaps as an edge rusher:

Allen
Smoot
Key
Lloyd
and the if in this scenario is Walker, who seems to have the raw athletic ability to be one.

I'm not sure when we've ever had that before.  In the early TC era, we had Lageman, Smeenge, Simmons and Brackens.  We never had much luck at Edge rushers with JDR.  The DPR concept missed with Cordova.  We tried Kampman, Reggie Hayward and McCray there, with Kampman and Hayward failing due to injury, and McCray washing out for reasons that mystify me to this day.

In 2017 under Marrone, we had Campbell (who I'm not sure truly qualifies and an edge rusher), Ngakoue and Fowler but not much else.  Smoot was a rookie at that point and wasn't the pass rusher he is now.

But this group of guys, from 1-5, could prove to be a very strong group of edge rushers.

We have three guys who could give us quality snaps at NT with Fatukasi, Hamilton and Brown.

The numbers invested in versatile players in our front seven defensively gives us good depth on that side of the ball to the point I am pretty excited.  I long had reservations about switching to a 3-4, but they seem to have done a pretty good job stocking the defense this year.
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