(03-07-2023, 03:29 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (03-07-2023, 01:50 PM)I am Yoda Wrote: [ -> ]Right?! I love their tandem of McKinnon and Pachecho. I absolutely love how Isaiah Pachecho runs!
I'm so glad we moved up to take Snoop Connor two rounds ahead of him.
Baalke master class or something.
I may have some incorrect info so I want to ask here.
Has Baalke ever had a really good draft in rounds four and lower?
Well, if Travon becomes dominant this year, then we are not going to care about the 5th round as much.
(03-21-2023, 08:02 AM)wg171 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 07:52 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Has anyone?
Brady was pretty good 
It's rare. We've had a few here though for sure. Funny enough. From Caldwell. I think he pulled players like Brandon Linder, Telvin Smith & Gardner Minshew out of the RD4 - RD6 range. It just depends on what you're looking for and what you need.
I think RD4 - RD7 next month for us will be all about adding big bodies with high ceilings to develop for a year or two. Plenty of those options available to get the offensive line and defensive line shored up. You also tend to find your special teams aces and gadget players in those rounds.
It'll be fun to watch regardless though. Deep TE class. Solid RB class. Solid interior offensive line class as well. I wouldn't be shocked if Baalke lands a future starter or two in those rounds next month for this football team. Vorhees, Kuntz, Coburn, Brooks, Mallory & Spears are names to watch.
(03-21-2023, 06:39 AM)wg171 Wrote: [ -> ]I may have some incorrect info so I want to ask here.
Has Baalke ever had a really good draft in rounds four and lower?
I'll say sure. Hit the googles and prove me wrong.
(03-21-2023, 08:13 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 06:39 AM)wg171 Wrote: [ -> ]I may have some incorrect info so I want to ask here.
Has Baalke ever had a really good draft in rounds four and lower?
I'll say sure. Hit the googles and prove me wrong.
When I have more time I do want to check out his drafts over the years. He may have hit on some in San Fran.
https://youtu.be/tbd2dmYn884
25:00 mark
(03-21-2023, 08:02 AM)wg171 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 07:52 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Has anyone?
Brady was pretty good
Did you know, the year the Pats drafted Brady in the 6th round, every other pick they made was a bust? It's true. They had a pathetically bad draft that year, but lucked out in round 6.
(03-21-2023, 08:35 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 08:02 AM)wg171 Wrote: [ -> ]Brady was pretty good
Did you know, the year the Pats drafted Brady in the 6th round, every other pick they made was a bust? It's true. They had a pathetically bad draft that year, but lucked out in round 6.
I’ve wondered if Brady would have been as successful had he been drafted by another team. I think the chemistry with Belichick had a lot to do with his development.
(03-21-2023, 08:47 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 08:35 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Did you know, the year the Pats drafted Brady in the 6th round, every other pick they made was a bust? It's true. They had a pathetically bad draft that year, but lucked out in round 6.
I’ve wondered if Brady would have been as successful had he been drafted by another team. I think the chemistry with Belichick had a lot to do with his development.
That and the fact that Belichick had some really damn good defensive squads during the earlier part of Brady's career. The AFC East was kind of weak as well for a good stretch. The Jets had a brief moment in the sun with Ryan and Sanchez but it's not like they were having to duke it out consistently for first place.
Doesn't discount the fact that they beat really good teams, especially defensive teams in the AFC play-offs though. Brady at least pulled another Superbowl win out of his [BLEEP] without Belichick. That's a testament to his skill as a QB. I wonder if Belichick will keep chasing that ghost until he gets another one without Brady.
(03-21-2023, 09:21 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 08:47 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]I’ve wondered if Brady would have been as successful had he been drafted by another team. I think the chemistry with Belichick had a lot to do with his development.
That and the fact that Belichick had some really damn good defensive squads during the earlier part of Brady's career. The AFC East was kind of weak as well for a good stretch. The Jets had a brief moment in the sun with Ryan and Sanchez but it's not like they were having to duke it out consistently for first place.
Doesn't discount the fact that they beat really good teams, especially defensive teams in the AFC play-offs though. Brady at least pulled another Superbowl win out of his [BLEEP] without Belichick. That's a testament to his skill as a QB. I wonder if Belichick will keep chasing that ghost until he gets another one without Brady.
I think Belichick retires before that happens.
Brady won without Belichick because he reached the rarefied air of a field general that few other quarterbacks achieve. The combination of skill and maturity which enabled him to put a team on his back and carry it. Peyton Manning, Terry Bradshaw, and Drew Brees, to an extent, achieved that level. I’m sure there are some others I’m overlooking but they come immediately to mind.
Mahomes looks to reach that level someday. Hopefully Trevor as well.
(03-21-2023, 09:41 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 09:21 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]That and the fact that Belichick had some really damn good defensive squads during the earlier part of Brady's career. The AFC East was kind of weak as well for a good stretch. The Jets had a brief moment in the sun with Ryan and Sanchez but it's not like they were having to duke it out consistently for first place.
Doesn't discount the fact that they beat really good teams, especially defensive teams in the AFC play-offs though. Brady at least pulled another Superbowl win out of his [BLEEP] without Belichick. That's a testament to his skill as a QB. I wonder if Belichick will keep chasing that ghost until he gets another one without Brady.
I think Belichick retires before that happens.
Brady won without Belichick because he reached the rarefied air of a field general that few other quarterbacks achieve. The combination of skill and maturity which enabled him to put a team on his back and carry it. Peyton Manning, Terry Bradshaw, and Drew Brees, to an extent, achieved that level. I’m sure there are some others I’m overlooking but they come immediately to mind.
Mahomes looks to reach that level someday. Hopefully Trevor as well.
I agree with this opinion. During his many Superbowl runs the Pats had many documented advantages that made Bill appear to be a wizard. A few have now been forever closed by new rules, others the rest of the NFL is on to. The last advantage was an elite QB and other players that would take a lot less pay. Today's players just will not do that. Imagine going to someone like Mahomes and saying no 40 million a year is too much. All we are going to pay you 20 million a year for the good of the team.
Brady is an anomaly. There is no recreating the time and place for his work in the league. You have to find your own way. That is what is happening in KC right now. I think we can do it here. I hope the team is smart and can maximize what is here to be successfully. Let it be a Doug+TL+Duval way of life or something. The NFL is fun when you have teams that have to get through other teams to ascend. Thinking fondly of all the Dallas v SF matchups that produced great games.
(03-21-2023, 11:27 AM)MoJagFan Wrote: [ -> ]Brady is an anomaly. There is no recreating the time and place for his work in the league. You have to find your own way. That is what is happening in KC right now. I think we can do it here. I hope the team is smart and can maximize what is here to be successfully. Let it be a Doug+TL+Duval way of life or something. The NFL is fun when you have teams that have to get through other teams to ascend. Thinking fondly of all the Dallas v SF matchups that produced great games.
The odds of someone taking a QB in the 6th and discovering two years later that he's the next Tom Brady would have to be something on par with winning the Powerball, mega million, state lottery, + getting struck by lightning while being bitten by a shark simultaneously all in the same day.
Anytime someone starts any assertion with "Tom Brady wasn't drafted until the 6th round..." I just tune out.
It's a moot comparison due to insane improbability.
Nonetheless - there will be inevitable coach and QB combos on par with the Belichick/Brady pairing. There is no guarantee they will last as long due to the cap maneuvering though.
Most QBs won't last that long physically, and whether Brady got paid under the table or really gave up salary to keep the dynasty intact - that is going to be a challenge for any team that finds a QB/HC combo worthy of competing similarly.
(03-21-2023, 07:52 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 06:39 AM)wg171 Wrote: [ -> ]I may have some incorrect info so I want to ask here.
Has Baalke ever had a really good draft in rounds four and lower?
Has anyone?
I'll argue the Jags had decent 2nd and 3rd days in 2009 and 2014. Honorable mention for 2004 when we picked up Bobby McCray in the 7th round.
As for Baalke, he did trade a 6th rounder for Blaine Gabbert in 2014. Not sure what that says about his day 2 performance.
(03-21-2023, 07:52 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2023, 06:39 AM)wg171 Wrote: [ -> ]I may have some incorrect info so I want to ask here.
Has Baalke ever had a really good draft in rounds four and lower?
Has anyone?
The Jaguars have had incompetent front offices for most of their history, but even if we use them, some of the players taken in rounds 4 and later include:
- Telvin Smith (Although career was cut short, he had over 100 tackles in each of his 5 seasons).
- Rob Johnson (Traded for #9 overall draft pick which became Fred Taylor)
- John Wade (11 Years in NFL, 10 as a starter including the Jaguars 14-2 season)
- Danny Clark (11 Years in NFL with the majority as a starter)
- Seth Payne (10 Years in NFL)
- Marlon McCree (9 Years as starter in NFL)
- David Garrard (9 Years in NFL, 4 as starter. Ranked #23 on the Jaguars All-Time Players in 2019)
- Rob Meier (9 Years in NFL)
- Daimon Shelton (9 years in NFL)
- Gerald Sensabaugh (8 years in NFL, 5 as a starter)
- Bobby McCray (7 years in NFL, 10 sacks in one season)
- Rashad Jennings (7 years in NFL while starting the majority of games)
- Brandon Marshall (6 Years in NFL, 4 as a starter)
- Zach Miller (6 Years in NFL, 3 as starter)
- Aaron Colvin (6 years in NFL as nickel corner including 30 starts)
- Josh Scobee (Ranked #21 on Jaguars All-Time Players in 2019. Jaguars all-time leading scorer with 1,022 points)
- Logan Cooke (3rd in NFL in punting average last year. 1st all time in Jaguars career punting average with the exception of a guy with only 3 punts)
Granted, Baalke has only been here 2 years, but so far, his most productive player in round 4 and later is Luke Farrell. He was our 4th string tight end and has 96 career receiving yards.
(03-22-2023, 07:19 AM)wg171 Wrote: [ -> ]Baalke’s draft picks with San Fran 2011-2016
https://www.ninersnation.com/platform/am...icks-49ers
Yet, they had a nice little run out West with similar results to exactly what Lynch and Shanahan are doing now and since his departure. Close, but no cigar. Championship appearances with losses.
That article was written in 2018 to be fair. I wonder what that writer thinks of the Trey Lance trade and the fact that they now have him and Purdy to fix the QB situation.
I think Baalke has fared better here. Especially with the earlier rounds. Urban Miller was Khan's choice. Not Baalke's. Etienne landed on IR as a rookie. Cisco and Walker were not used at all that much.
Caldwell also left this team in far worse shape than Baalke did the 49ers. Last year's free agency haul for him was also one of the better hauls this franchise has seen in years.
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