Do you support the plan to extend the 1/2 cent sales tax from the Better Jacksonville Plan to help cover the shortage in the city's pension debt?
If you do not support the plan, what suggestions do you have for raising the money to fund the city's pension?
No I don't. Employers should not be responsible for people's retirement, that should be up to the people. City employees should fund their own retirement plan (pension) through 401k's or other avenues.
Go find the big money that was pilfered from the plan. Please go after the shady nepotism-funneled deals and whatever "waterfront" renovation project fiasco stole from citizens. I still can't hear the word "Shipyards" without cringing. And why was Citibank handed bailout money despite record revenue growth??
I could go on but WTH is the point anymore?
Quote:No I don't. Employers should not be responsible for people's retirement, that should be up to the people. City employees should fund their own retirement plan (pension) through 401k's or other avenues.
The problem is, the people who this funds were promised this money when they worked for the city and weren't given the option of 401Ks etc.
We have to pay it one way or another (it's a legal debt) the only question is how we raise the money.
The last few years they have borrowed from the city budget to pay it, taking money out of the budgets of the city's park division (which cuts down on cutting the grass, replacing lights and other park necessities) amongst other city services.
Quote:Go find the big money that was pilfered from the plan. Please go after the shady nepotism-funneled deals and whatever "waterfront" renovation project fiasco stole from citizens. I still can't hear the word "Shipyards" without cringing. And why was Citibank handed bailout money despite record revenue growth??
I could go on but WTH is the point anymore?
???
You're losing it. The question was asked if a sales tax increase should remain to fund a project that includes pension for city employees. I'm of the belief that people are responsible for their own retirement, not their employer even if it's city government. I personally don't want my tax dollars to fund a city employee's retirement plan.
Quote:???
You're losing it. The question was asked if a sales tax increase should remain to fund a project that includes pension for city employees. I'm of the belief that people are responsible for their own retirement, not their employer even if it's city government. I personally don't want my tax dollars to fund a city employee's retirement plan.
Better Jacksonville Plan. Do your own homework.
Quote:The problem is, the people who this funds were promised this money when they worked for the city and weren't given the option of 401Ks etc.
We have to pay it one way or another (it's a legal debt) the only question is how we raise the money.
The last few years they have borrowed from the city budget to pay it, taking money out of the budgets of the city's park division (which cuts down on cutting the grass, replacing lights and other park necessities) amongst other city services.
Well my first question is, is raising taxes and/or keeping tax rates up the right way to go? Are there not cuts in the mix that can cover the cost?
Quote:Well my first question is, is raising taxes and/or keeping tax rates up the right way to go? Are there not cuts in the mix that can cover the cost?
From my point of view, our taxes in Jax are very very low. Of course, at the same time our services, compared to other places my wife and I have lived, are also very slim. So maybe cutting from other areas could help a little, but we aren't talking $250,000 here or there, the shortfall is $1.5 billion.
Yes for Jacksonville, no for the beach cities.
Eliminate public pensions. Putting hundreds of millions of dollars in politician's hands is a recipe for disaster. Convert all pension plans to personal 401k plans. The plans are underfunded because the politicians made promised they couldn't keep.
If that means a retired cop gets only half of what was promised, that's still better than stealing more from the public. Besides, a lot of guys put in their 20 and then work for another 3 decades while collecting the full pension. Too many double and triple dippers.
Also, the rules make it easy to defraud the public and the pension fund. If a guy's pension is going to be 90% of his final year's pay a lot of them will spend that last year getting as much overtime as possible. So a guy who makes $55k can pull in $75k the final year and get a pension of $67,500 for life instead of $49,500. He's not only ripping off the public but all others in the pension.
If innocent employees were compromised by the actions of their executives, then yes, do whatever it takes to make certain they get what is rightfully due to them (which got lost through no fault of their own). It sucks that the general public must pay to offset the debt but the employees should not get totally screwed.
Just for the record, some of you know that I am a teacher, but I have an investment plan and do not have a pension.
Quote:Eliminate public pensions. Putting hundreds of millions of dollars in politician's hands is a recipe for disaster. Convert all pension plans to personal 401k plans. The plans are underfunded because the politicians made promised they couldn't keep.
If that means a retired cop gets only half of what was promised, that's still better than stealing more from the public. Besides, a lot of guys put in their 20 and then work for another 3 decades while collecting the full pension. Too many double and triple dippers.
Also, the rules make it easy to defraud the public and the pension fund. If a guy's pension is going to be 90% of his final year's pay a lot of them will spend that last year getting as much overtime as possible. So a guy who makes $55k can pull in $75k the final year and get a pension of $67,500 for life instead of $49,500. He's not only ripping off the public but all others in the pension.
City employees don't get overtime like that.
Quote:City employees don't get overtime like that.
Are cops and firemen city employees? I know a fire chief who did just that. His pension is 10k+ more than he ever made if you take away that last year.
Vicbow - I commend your effort. Local issues - how would have thought?
However - clearly jagibelieve, Rashean and Byron don't have a clue (lol at least regarding this subject.)
These are legal obligations, people. Regardless of what we think about pensions, 401Ks, etc., a way has to be found to pay these legal obligations.
By the way I voted for the tax, although I think Curry has done a poor job of explaining how a tax down the road helps today. We really should be raising the millage rate and the sales tax - but Curry is a Republican and will apparently be taken out back and shot if he dares say "tax increase".
Quote:Eliminate public pensions. Putting hundreds of millions of dollars in politician's hands is a recipe for disaster. Convert all pension plans to personal 401k plans. The plans are underfunded because the politicians made promised they couldn't keep.
If that means a retired cop gets only half of what was promised, that's still better than stealing more from the public. Besides, a lot of guys put in their 20 and then work for another 3 decades while collecting the full pension. Too many double and triple dippers.
Also, the rules make it easy to defraud the public and the pension fund. If a guy's pension is going to be 90% of his final year's pay a lot of them will spend that last year getting as much overtime as possible. So a guy who makes $55k can pull in $75k the final year and get a pension of $67,500 for life instead of $49,500. He's not only ripping off the public but all others in the pension.
Really? Really? How compassionate of you. If Hillary had said something like that ...
Extend the tax to relieve the current burden then change the pension laws for incoming and recently hired to self-paid plans.
I worked at JEA for a decade before leaving for the real world. Anyone who can stick it out 30+ years in civil service deserves every penny of that pension!
I'm all for doing something, but this plan is awful. Doesn't provide any real immediate assistance and kicks the can down the road. Have to vote no. Expected more from Accountant Lenny on this.
A better plan would be to approve slot machines at the Best Bet and have taxes on that go directly to the pension.