Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:Watching the playoffs, I started to get a better understanding of how long it can take to build a team through the draft.   I was watching these teams, and I was curious about some of the players, how long they had been in the league, so I googled a few at random.   Like one play, the Steelers' Lawrence Timmons made a tackle, so I said, who is this guy, how long has he been in the league, and found out he was drafted in 2007. 

 

I am realizing that if you draft well, and get just 2 or 3 core players each draft, you can still be on an upward trend after 5, 6, 7 years.  If you're drafting players that you expect to be on the team 7, 8, 9 years, then the building process can go on for a very very long time. 

 

So for us to expect the Jags to become contenders in 3 years, with the plan they have in place, tearing everything up and starting over and building through the draft, was probably asking too much.  Way too much.   The way we are doing it, we shouldn't be even starting to reach a peak level of team talent for another 2 or 3 years from now.   By that time, some of these guys will be in their second contracts, and that's why we have to stay way under the salary cap for now and carry over as much money as possible.  

 

It takes incredible patience and a very long range view, and it's understandable the Jags would not try to sell the fans on waiting 4 or 5 years before we had a contender.   No one would buy tickets.   So the fans are a little bit in the dark about the plan, and that's the reason for the frustration.  

 

The Jags were 9-7 in their 2nd season, starting from scratch.


The Panthers were 12-4.


 

OK, the 1995 expansion teams had some advantages in extra picks and plenty of cap room. The 2013 Jags also had the cap room advantage. Note that the 7-9 Raiders also started from nothing in 2013, and they didn't have any cap room that year.


 

But also ...


 

The Cleveland Browns 2.0 were 7-9 in their 3rd season, as were the Texans. Not playoffs, but better than 5-11 and neither of those teams had the cupcake schedule the Jags faced this year. The problem is not the personnel, this year's Jags team is better. We have a true franchise QB, which is by far the most important position on a team. Realistically, the Jags should have won the division this year. Instead they fell two games short of the Browns. The Browns! The most abysmally run franchise in the NFL since they came into the league.

Quote:The Jags were 9-7 in their 2nd season, starting from scratch.

The Panthers were 12-4.


OK, the 1995 expansion teams had some advantages in extra picks and plenty of cap room. The 2013 Jags also had the cap room advantage. Note that the 7-9 Raiders also started from nothing in 2013, and they didn't have any cap room that year.


But also ...


The Cleveland Browns 2.0 were 7-9 in their 3rd season, as were the Texans. Not playoffs, but better than 5-11 and neither of those teams had the cupcake schedule the Jags faced this year. The problem is not the personnel, this year's Jags team is better. We have a true franchise QB, which is by far the most important position on a team. Realistically, the Jags should have won the division this year. Instead they fell two games short of the Browns. The Browns! The most abysmally run franchise in the NFL since they came into the league.

Cool story bro

Here is why the fan view of Gus diverges from the reality of his situation.

 

To fans, Gus Bradley has been a disappointment for three straight years. He's won just 12 games in that 3 year period. He's gone 4-12, 3-13, 5-11, and even a blind polecat with no understanding of the rules of football can see that's not good enough. By now we should be a playoff team - or if not, we should be contending for the playoffs a lot more seriously than we did this year.

 

And all of this is true.

 

But the reality of his situation is this: the expectations for those first two years were set very low. It seems like the plan for the rebuild was always that those years would be as bad as they were, as the roster was gutted and built up with young (perhaps overly young) players. The expectation within the building was that those seasons would be painful, and that expectation was met. So to Shad Kahn, Gus has been a disappointment for one year. And probably not as much of a disappointment as he was to fans in that last year, because the impression seems to be that expectations were lower than they were for lots of fans this year as well. Which is understandable, because a lot of fans had extremely unreasonable expectations.

 

Here's the thing, though. Going into next year, I think expectations inside and outside are going to be starting to align a lot more closely. Sure, fans will still be over the top with their expectations and demands (playoffs or fired), but not by much. I don't think we'll have to have this discussion a year from now, because either Dave and Shad will have been proved right, and the team will have delivered under Gus (maybe not everything the fans want, but most of it), or the team will have moved on.

Quote:I voted "Yes" due to the wording of the question.

 

Am I happy with what I see on the field?  No.  Not really. 

 

However, I also remember what the team looked like under Mularkey, and under Gus year 1 and year 2.  What we saw on the field this year was light years better.

 

It didn't result in as many wins as we ALL would have hoped, however, to say that the team hasn't drastically improved would simply be fooling ones self.

 

The team HAS improved under Gus and Dave.  Maybe not year 1, when they blew the whole thing up a mere year after Gene blew it up, leaving us with one of the youngest and most talent starved rosters EVER.  But this year the difference was OBVIOUS.

 

I don't know that this year was ENOUGH of an improvement to warrant keeping Gus.  I don't really know how much of the improvement can even be CREDITED to Gus (as opposed to Dave simply adding significantly better talent).

 

What I DO know, is that the arrow is pointing up.  I know that the team improved this year over last.  That's the right direction.

 

The question, is speed.  How SOON can we go from "improving" to "Good" or higher?

I totally agree, I believe we are headed in the right direction under Gus. But that isn't to say Gus is the reason for that, if we had changed coach we may have better progress and results thus far.

 

At the same time, not getting rid of Gus has allowed for more stability and constancy in the franchise. I am a fan of this and believe it may have some influence over the improvement of our players. 

Gus was the perfect coach to weather the storm through the rebuild when expectations were extremely low.  His positive demeanor was clearly valued.  The real question is if he is the one capable of turning the corner now that the cupboards aren't nearly as bare.  Has anyone seen enough to think he can?

 

I don't see it.

Quote:Gus was the perfect coach to weather the storm through the rebuild when expectations were extremely low.  His positive demeanor was clearly valued.  The real question is if he is the one capable of turning the corner now that the cupboards aren't nearly as bare.  Has anyone seen enough to think he can?

 

I don't see it.

 

If you did you'd need your eyes checked or your head examined! I agree with you exactly that coach Good Vibes was needed to get through this storm, now it's time for Good Vibes to be replaced by Good Coach.

Quote:Cool story bro

nothing to rebut, eh? Basically you just conceded that you have nothing to contribute and that Malabar just owned you on this debate.


So yes- it is a cool story, bro.

Quote:nothing to rebut, eh? Basically you just conceded that you have nothing to contribute and that Malabar just owned you on this debate.


So yes- it is a cool story, bro.

Another hot take from the middle manager that know business better than the billionaire who owns a football team.


Cool story bro

He is heading in the right direction. Maintaining bottom feeder status to preserve our inferior stance.