Quote:Of course a bunch of white men whom grew up wearing Redskins attire don't find it offensive.
It isn't that they don't find it offensive, it's that we don't care if something is offensive. If you want to name your new team "The Whities", I couldn't care less. I don't care what name a private business wants to name themselves, and it isn't my business (or your's).
Quote:It isn't that they don't find it offensive, it's that we don't care if something is offensive. If you want to name your new team "The Whities", I couldn't care less. I don't care what name a private business wants to name themselves, and it isn't my business (or your's).
The NFL is not simply "a private business." It is a special case. Personally I don't care, but I can see the name being changed and I would totally be fine with that.
Quote:I hope the legal action forces the greedy ignorant bigot Daniel Snyder to change the franchise name. If it was called a different racial slur of another minority such as African-Americans would so many people come to the owner's defense of a hatred name? It is sad that in 2015 that even transgenders get more respect than Native Americans in our society.
Of course a bunch of white men whom grew up wearing Redskins attire don't find it offensive. How could they if they aren't even Native American, and the people that come out and say I'm part cherokee (first off don't say your Native American unless you are actually registered with a tribe, maybe taught and speak their language, or receive funds from the tribe). It's similar to a person making racist comments and saying its okay i have a black friend...
Dude (or Chick, gotta be PC about this) you have gone so overboard in your "outrage".
Please explain to us how Dan Snyder is "ignorant". (your words not mine)
Please explain to us how Dan Snyder is "greedy". (your words not mine)
Please explain to us how Dan Snyder is a "bigot". (your words not mine)
Finally, please explain how a team that has been named as such for so many years is all of the sudden "racist" or bigoted" because of their mascot?
Quote:Who are you to say what offends someone and what doesn't
And this is the very root of all the questions/controversies about all of the things in today's society that are considered NOT politically correct.
Quote:It's not like the entire Native American population just woke up one morning and decided that "redskin" was a racial slur. This is something that's been stewing for a long time now.
Sorry, not buying it. There has been documentation of teams on Native American reservations using the name.
I think people are forgetting what a fascist is..
A fascist is a person that wants everyone else to live by what he or she believes. Now in the old days the fascist would accomplish this with mass killings. Now? It's accomplished by calling anyone who doesn't fall in line with their "enlightened" beliefs a bigot or a racist.. and the masses just believe it because they don't want to be labeled as either of those things.
I don't care how anyone else wants to live, I don't care what anyone else wants to believe..
But when the vocal minority starts to override the majority... we will have problems.
Quote:I think people are forgetting what a fascist is..
A fascist is a person that wants everyone else to live by what he or she believes
. Now in the old days the fascist would accomplish this with mass killings. Now? It's accomplished by calling anyone who doesn't fall in line with their "enlightened" beliefs a bigot or a racist.. and the masses just believe it because they don't want to be labeled as either of those things.
I don't care how anyone else wants to live, I don't care what anyone else wants to believe..
But when the vocal minority starts to override the majority... we will have problems.
And that...is what American's are becoming...It seems that everyone wants everything to their own satisfaction no matter what the cause is...People are so wrapped in "me" that they don't give a rats [BLEEP] about anyone else as long as they are getting what they want
Quote:Sorry, not buying it. There has been documentation of teams on Native American reservations using the name.
And black people call each other [word] all the time, but I dare anyone to start a team called the New York/LA/Chicago [Words].
Quote:I think people are forgetting what a fascist is..
A fascist is a person that wants everyone else to live by what he or she believes. Now in the old days the fascist would accomplish this with mass killings. Now? It's accomplished by calling anyone who doesn't fall in line with their "enlightened" beliefs a bigot or a racist.. and the masses just believe it because they don't want to be labeled as either of those things.
I don't care how anyone else wants to live, I don't care what anyone else wants to believe..
But when the vocal minority starts to override the majority... we will have problems.
You have a very narrow and flawed view of what fascism actually is.
Quote:I hope the legal action forces the greedy ignorant bigot Daniel Snyder to change the franchise name. If it was called a different racial slur of another minority such as African-Americans would so many people come to the owner's defense of a hatred name? It is sad that in 2015 that even transgenders get more respect than Native Americans in our society.
Of course a bunch of white men whom grew up wearing Redskins attire don't find it offensive. How could they if they aren't even Native American, and the people that come out and say I'm part cherokee (first off don't say your Native American unless you are actually registered with a tribe, maybe taught and speak their language, or receive funds from the tribe). It's similar to a person making racist comments and saying its okay i have a black friend...
Quote:Dude (or Chick, gotta be PC about this) you have gone so overboard in your "outrage".
Please explain to us how Dan Snyder is "ignorant". (your words not mine)
Please explain to us how Dan Snyder is "greedy". (your words not mine)
Please explain to us how Dan Snyder is a "bigot". (your words not mine)
Finally, please explain how a team that has been named as such for so many years is all of the sudden "racist" or bigoted" because of their mascot?
By the way, you being a veteran and all. Is it "racist" or "hatred" to call a cruise missile a tomahawk?
Quote:By the way, you being a veteran and all. Is it "racist" or "hatred" to call a cruise missile a tomahawk?
Good question. Is it bigoted or hateful to spearhead a project? Heck, that could cover multiple minority groups in its offensiveness.
Quote:By the way, you being a veteran and all. Is it "racist" or "hatred" to call a cruise missile a tomahawk?
I don't see how naming a weapon after a weapon could be construed as racism. Maybe if we were to create a 150-megaton nuke and name it "The Final Solution", but naming a cruise missile after a tomahawk is, to me at least, honoring the tomahawk in a way.
Quote:I don't see how naming a weapon after a weapon could be construed as racism. Maybe if we were to create a 150-megaton nuke and name it "The Final Solution", but naming a cruise missile after a tomahawk is, to me at least, honoring the tomahawk in a way.
The tomahawk example It's a classic example of a red herring. Weapons aren't people.
Nothing bestows honor on a group of people like referring to them by the color of their skin, right?
The term redskin began to be considered a derogatory term when it was used when issuing bounties on Native Americans. But, hey, if that's what the owner of that incompetent football football operation in Washington want as his symbol, what can we do?
Quote:I don't see how naming a weapon after a weapon could be construed as racism. Maybe if we were to create a 150-megaton nuke and name it "The Final Solution", but naming a cruise missile after a tomahawk is, to me at least, honoring the tomahawk in a way.
However, not all Native Americans used tomahawks, so that might be offensive to some them because the term "tomahawk" could mean a stereotype.
My point is that PC has gotten so out of control that it's starting to dictate and take over society. The Washington Redskins have been around longer than probably 99% of the participants on this message board. It's never "offended" anyone until recently, and I would wager that those that are "offended" probably don't have a drop of Native American blood in them.
Quote:However, not all Native Americans used tomahawks, so that might be offensive to some them because the term "tomahawk" could mean a stereotype.
My point is that PC has gotten so out of control that it's starting to dictate and take over society. The Washington Redskins have been around longer than probably 99% of the participants on this message board. It's never "offended" anyone until recently, and I would wager that those that are "offended" probably don't have a drop of Native American blood in them.
As to point one, you're typically one of the most well-spoken, thoughtful debaters on here, even if we disagree more often than we agree. That said, "tomahawk" being a stereotype because not all Native American tribes used them is kind of ridiculous. It's the type of thing I'd expect from another poster who frequents the same topics you and I do, but not from you.
As to point two, I'm not personally offended by the word "Redskin". I'm not personally offended by any other symbols that have been prevalent on here lately either, but if a word or symbol is hurtful or derogatory to a large group of people, then it's right to consider changing it.
The "Redskins" situation will end predictably: one or more NFL broadcast partners will issue a decree saying that the word is not to be used on their network, and the others will follow suit. The team will start fishing for public money to replace FedEx Field, and no one will be willing to give it to them as long as the team is called the "Redskins". I believe DC has already hinted that they won't allow the team to build a new stadium within city limits as long as the name remains. Congress will probably get involved, because it's something they so dearly love to do with minor things so that bigger things go unnoticed, and there will be extreme public pressure on both the club and the NFL to change the name. Finally, we'll hit critical mass, and the team will give in and partner with advocacy groups to choose a new name.
Do I think there are far more important things we should be talking about? Hell yes, but I'm not going to completely discount a group of people who claim that the word "Redskin" is no better than dropping an n-bomb.
Quote:However, not all Native Americans used tomahawks, so that might be offensive to some them because the term "tomahawk" could mean a stereotype.
My point is that PC has gotten so out of control that it's starting to dictate and take over society. The Washington Redskins have been around longer than probably 99% of the participants on this message board. It's never "offended" anyone until recently, and I would wager that those that are "offended" probably don't have a drop of Native American blood in them.
And the n-word has been around longer than any of us also, and for a very long time it didn't seem to "offend" many, and I would wager that many of those who were offended probably didn't have a drop of black blood in them.
Or are you still using it? If not, is that an example of PC getting out of control?
Everything that changes is not political correctness. Everything doesn't have to remain as it was in 1955.
Quote:As to point one, you're typically one of the most well-spoken, thoughtful debaters on here, even if we disagree more often than we agree. That said, "tomahawk" being a stereotype because not all Native American tribes used them is kind of ridiculous. It's the type of thing I'd expect from another poster who frequents the same topics you and I do, but not from you.
As to point two, I'm not personally offended by the word "Redskin". I'm not personally offended by any other symbols that have been prevalent on here lately either, but if a word or symbol is hurtful or derogatory to a large group of people, then it's right to consider changing it.
The "Redskins" situation will end predictably: one or more NFL broadcast partners will issue a decree saying that the word is not to be used on their network, and the others will follow suit. The team will start fishing for public money to replace FedEx Field, and no one will be willing to give it to them as long as the team is called the "Redskins". I believe DC has already hinted that they won't allow the team to build a new stadium within city limits as long as the name remains. Congress will probably get involved, because it's something they so dearly love to do with minor things so that bigger things go unnoticed, and there will be extreme public pressure on both the club and the NFL to change the name. Finally, we'll hit critical mass, and the team will give in and partner with advocacy groups to choose a new name.
Do I think there are far more important things we should be talking about? Hell yes, but I'm not going to completely discount a group of people who claim that the word "Redskin" is no better than dropping an n-bomb.
First of all, thank you for the kind words. I really mean that.
Second, regarding the above in bold. I said what I said exactly for the reason that you stated. It's ludicrous to think that the word "tomahawk" could be "offensive" to anyone, and I was attempting to illustrate how "political correctness" is out of control. When does it end? A flag is deemed "offensive" to some (a minority of the population by the way) so it has to be brought down. A monument (The Ten Commandments) bought with private funding and maintained with private funding must be brought down because it's "offensive" to some people (a minority). Should someone hypothetically from an Indian Tribe be offended by the use of the term "tomahawk" be "offended" does that mean that we need to change the name of that particular missile? Who exactly is so "offended" by the name of an NFL team that has been in existence for over 80 years?
Liberals will show one or two Native Americans that are so "offended" by the name, and will continue to push the agenda of it being "offensive". Much like a flag or a monument, the name of an NFL franchise hurts no one, but they will be
forced to change it and comply.
That doesn't sound much like freedom to me. It's actually pretty chilling when you think about it, but that's where we are.
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