Alualu was decent for us. He also has been solid/good for the Steelers.
Monroe was better than a lot of OT we've had after he left, if not better than all of them.
Smith was still good
Lewis was decent

I am so tired of talking about Caldwell, the record says it all, that, his Bortles pick and his choice of Bradley.

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BTW, it is extremely funny how grades matter with players that are on the team right now, the moment they leave they don't matter at all xD

I haven't seen anyone saying he isnt playing good these last few years.  The question is what did he do for us?  62 is the highest pff grade he had when he played here if you want to tak about grades. Taven Bryan's was higher than that last year and his rookie year lol

I don't care about grades at all but I find it funny how you brought them up for the Henderson topic and now you say you don't care what they say, which one is it? or they only matter when they say good things about our current players?
And someone said Alualu was a backup so...

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I am a fan, not a cheerleader.

I haven't seen anyone saying he isnt playing good these last few years.  The question is what did he do for us?  62 is the highest pff grade he had when he played here if you want to tak about grades. Taven Bryan's was higher than that last year and his rookie year lol

I don't care about grades at all but I find it funny how you brought them up for the Henderson topic and now you say you don't care what they say, which one is it? or they only matter when they say good things about our current players?
And someone said Alualu was a backup so...

Well like I said, his highest grade when he was with us wasn't very good.  Taven Bryan was better the last 2 years than Alu ever was with us since he brings up Alu's grades lol

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iHaunting Raven

Well like I said, his highest grade when he was with us wasn't very good.  Taven Bryan was better the last 2 years than Alu ever was with us since he brings up Alu's grades lol

LOL... He was asking me for proof of his productivity so I gave him some.  For the record, I am in agreement.  PFF grades are based on a lot of assumptions of responsibilities on plays that only the coaching staff or front office can truly evaluate.  I'm just saying that the fact Alualu was signed to multiple contracts by both us and the Steelers (2 by each franchise) over an 11 year period clearly shows football coaches and scouts value his skill set and production.  Should he have been a 1st rounder?  Hell no... but if he were a 3rd rounder, he would have been considered good pick.  That's all I am saying.

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This is a results-oriented business.  There are no trophies or titles given for "moral victories" or for "winning the draft".  Our record with DC is 37-86.  6-10 is our 2nd best season in 8 years of Caldwell leadership.  These are the FACTS.

Yeah, we should be thankful to Coughlin for Minshew... And Chark and Allen.

We can also thank Caldwell for Bortles and Bradley.

We can't be sure if Minshew was Caldwell's idea or Coughlin's... but we know that Coughlin usually phoned in the late rounds of the draft during his first stint in Jacksonville.  In fact, a lot of those late round picks from 95 to 02 were actually scouted by Gene Smith.

I don't give a whole lot of credit to anyone for a 6th round pick.  Just like I don't give the Pats any credit for getting Tom Brady in the 6th round.  For a 6th round pick to become a starter is just pure luck.  If they really thought he was that good, they would have picked him sooner.  A 6th round pick is a special teamer, or a developmental guy who can maybe become a solid backup.  If he hits, it's a lottery shot.  Pure luck.

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We can't be sure if Minshew was Caldwell's idea or Coughlin's... but we know that Coughlin usually phoned in the late rounds of the draft during his first stint in Jacksonville.  In fact, a lot of those late round picks from 95 to 02 were actually scouted by Gene Smith.

I don't give a whole lot of credit to anyone for a 6th round pick.  Just like I don't give the Pats any credit for getting Tom Brady in the 6th round.  For a 6th round pick to become a starter is just pure luck.  If they really thought he was that good, they would have picked him sooner.  A 6th round pick is a special teamer, or a developmental guy who can maybe become a solid backup.  If he hits, it's a lottery shot.  Pure luck.

It's funny, if Minshew were picked in the 1st round the entire fanbase would have imploded - but if he had this level of production - we'd call Caldwell a genius. But since he's a 6th rounder we're like... let's wait n see.

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In a re-draft Minshew would easily be a 1st round pick. Maybe even top 10.

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He got rid of Smith, Monroe and Lewis too soon, that's for sure.

Scobee played a total of 4 games (and was horrible) for the Steelers and they cut him. Been out of the league since.

Meester was done and never played again.

Austen Lane played a total of 2 games after his time here.

Cox played 1 season with the Chargers and was out of the league.

Shorts played in 20 games over 2 seasons (with 2 different teams) after his time here and wasn't really that productive. 53 catches for 636 yards with 2 TD.

Landry and Lowery played 2 and 3 (for a different team in each of those 3 seasons) more years after their time here. Lowery was constantly hurt when he played for us (played in 11 games, 9 games and 3 games). Probably should have kept them for another season or 2, but Lowery always being hurt justified his cut and he had just drafted Cyprien to take Landry's spot. Landry was also 30 years old at the time.

Jennings pounded out a couple of average seasons (4) after his time here, but he's a dime a dozen player and he wasn't really that productive for us to begin with. 224 carries for 944 yards with 7 TD in 3 seasons here.

It's funny that you bring up Alualu honestly. This board did nothing but bash and trash on him during his entire career here. But he did play here for another 4 season after Caldwell got here...

Poz was here for 2 seasons before Caldwell got here and he played another 5 seasons since Caldwell has been here.

How about we play that game with Dave

-#1 2nd overall pick Luke Joeckle "The Joke"  Was off the team before he retired
-#1 3rd overall pick Blake Bortles  Just a disaster of a pick
#1 3rd overall pick Dante Fowler was traded for peanuts .
#1 5th overall pick Jalen Ramsey:  Just a disaster of a situation that made the team look very bad


I could do this with Forunette and lower round picks etc.   Lets also not forget the very poor free agents Caldwell has wasted money on as well.  This team should be a dynasty with the draft capital and salary cap room we have had.

Joeckle just straight up busted...He was projected to go top 1/2 in just about every mock/experts opinion.
- Should Jacksonville not have drafted Josh Allen?  He was seen as a top 3 possibility...sometimes guys just bust but it wasn't a pick out of left field.

Bortles is definitely one that stands out...It was a reach for a QB and a flop.
- Hindsight a lot of fans would have wanted Manzel/Bridgewater at the time but would they have been any better of a pick?

Fowler wasn't an angel while he was he either with off the field issue and with cap issues had to be dumped because a 3rd rounder was outplaying him.  Still got some kind of return.

I guess I'm not following how Ramsey makes Caldwell looks bad...2 1st/4th is really good return for what the issue became.

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Caldwell also brought in Campbell, Jackson, Bouye, Church, Gipson.

Jack Ramsey and Yan in 1 draft

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Caldwell Coughlin also brought in Campbell, Jackson, Bouye, Church, Gipson.

Caldwell also brought/drafted:

Cyprien
Gratz
Gerhart lol
Zane Beadles LOL
Davon House
Julius Thomas lol
Yeldon
Cann
Ivory
Amukamara
Henne
Quitter diva Ramsey

And since people insist in giving credit to Caldwell for Coughlin moves... then Caldwell also brought:

Drafted Fournette over Mahomes, Watson and CmC
Smoot
Taven Bryan over Lamar Jackson
Ronnie Harrison
Moncrief for 10 million lol
Extended Bortles
ASJ
Extended Lee
Foles
Made Norwell highest paid OG at that moment

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I am a fan, not a cheerleader.

Cyprian, House, Ivory, Amukamara and Henne were alright. I dunno you're just listing every player you can think of. Not everyone is gonna stick. This isn't Madden some players don't work out. What you need to focus on is the players that do. And considering the roller coaster ride these last two years have been, hot damn we're actually in a really good spot right now and that's largely in part due to Caldwell.

You also have to give credit to Caldwell for not hesitating to move on from players. Bottles extension was probably the biggest stain on his record but I'm not convinced that's all on him.

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Cyprian, House, Ivory, Amukamara and Henne were alright. I dunno you're just listing every player you can think of. Not everyone is gonna stick. This isn't Madden some players don't work out. What you need to focus on is the players that do. And considering the roller coaster ride these last two years have been, hot damn we're actually in a really good spot right now and that's largely in part due to Caldwell.

You also have to give credit to Caldwell for not hesitating to move on from players. Bottles extension was probably the biggest stain on his record but I'm not convinced that's all on him.

Are we in a really good spot right now?  I hope you're right, but I have my doubts.  We were 6-10 last season... what record at the end of this season will confirm we are in a "really good spot right now?"  If we don't have a better record than last season, its time to move on from this 8 year slow-motion car crash.

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This is a results-oriented business.  There are no trophies or titles given for "moral victories" or for "winning the draft".  Our record with DC is 37-86.  6-10 is our 2nd best season in 8 years of Caldwell leadership.  These are the FACTS.

Cyprian, House, Ivory, Amukamara and Henne were alright. I dunno you're just listing every player you can think of. Not everyone is gonna stick. This isn't Madden some players don't work out. What you need to focus on is the players that do. And considering the roller coaster ride these last two years have been, hot damn we're actually in a really good spot right now and that's largely in part due to Caldwell.

You also have to give credit to Caldwell for not hesitating to move on from players. Bottles extension was probably the biggest stain on his record but I'm not convinced that's all on him.

Who is Bottles?

His worst moves were Bradley and Bortles and this team was garbage for years because of that, thanks to Caldwell.

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I am a fan, not a cheerleader.

I guess the answer to the question is "yes, some of us still doubt Caldwell". Still, surprising start by the Jags. Had I listened to some of you, and the talking heads on ESPN or NFL Networks, I'd have figured on the Jags going 0-16. Good thing for me I'm too smart to do that.

Apparently, we have our TMD replacement, too. Inevitable.

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I guess the answer to the question is "yes, some of us still doubt Caldwell".  Still, surprising start by the Jags.  Had I listened to some of you, and the talking heads on ESPN or NFL Networks, I'd have figured on the Jags going 0-16.  Good thing for me I'm too smart to do that.

Apparently, we have our TMD replacement, too.  Inevitable.

You can go pull up my pre-season prediction... it was 6-10.  I thought we would see some good teasing of young talent (as in years past) but not enough results (again).  Minshew has been lights out for 2 games, but I will expect a regression as the season goes on... particularly on our 3rd down conversion percentage.  And we still only have one win right now.  In Jacksonville, I guess the bar is low enough to consider that to be optimistic.

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This is a results-oriented business.  There are no trophies or titles given for "moral victories" or for "winning the draft".  Our record with DC is 37-86.  6-10 is our 2nd best season in 8 years of Caldwell leadership.  These are the FACTS.

Cyprian, House, Ivory, Amukamara and Henne were alright. I dunno you're just listing every player you can think of. Not everyone is gonna stick. This isn't Madden some players don't work out. What you need to focus on is the players that do. And considering the roller coaster ride these last two years have been, hot damn we're actually in a really good spot right now and that's largely in part due to Caldwell.

You also have to give credit to Caldwell for not hesitating to move on from players. Bottles extension was probably the biggest stain on his record but I'm not convinced that's all on him.

Are we in a really good spot right now?  I hope you're right, but I have my doubts.  We were 6-10 last season... what record at the end of this season will confirm we are in a "really good spot right now?"  If we don't have a better record than last season, its time to move on from this 8 year slow-motion car crash.

Yeah, I think regardless of how we finish the season we are in a good spot. We have a franchise QB in minshew, and a young exciting offense to go with him. And some young pieces to build around on defense. Personally I expect this team to win at least 7 this year. But next year is where things get interesting. A good draft will have us on top of the AFC South.

Cyprian, House, Ivory, Amukamara and Henne were alright. I dunno you're just listing every player you can think of. Not everyone is gonna stick. This isn't Madden some players don't work out. What you need to focus on is the players that do. And considering the roller coaster ride these last two years have been, hot damn we're actually in a really good spot right now and that's largely in part due to Caldwell.

You also have to give credit to Caldwell for not hesitating to move on from players. Bottles extension was probably the biggest stain on his record but I'm not convinced that's all on him.

Who is Bottles?

His worst moves were Bradley and Bortles and this team was garbage for years because of that, thanks to Caldwell.

Never heard of Blake Bottles? Dude liked knocking up Bartenders more than throwing a spiral.

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Are we in a really good spot right now?  I hope you're right, but I have my doubts.  We were 6-10 last season... what record at the end of this season will confirm we are in a "really good spot right now?"  If we don't have a better record than last season, its time to move on from this 8 year slow-motion car crash.

Yeah, I think regardless of how we finish the season we are in a good spot. We have a franchise QB in minshew, and a young exciting offense to go with him. And some young pieces to build around on defense. Personally I expect this team to win at least 7 this year. But next year is where things get interesting. A good draft will have us on top of the AFC South.

If we win 7 or 8, I'm down with giving this GM / HC combo another season.  
But what happens if we end up 5-11 (or worse), Minshew finishes the season looking good but not great, and the defense is atrocious.  Are you on-board with cleaning house at that point?

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This is a results-oriented business.  There are no trophies or titles given for "moral victories" or for "winning the draft".  Our record with DC is 37-86.  6-10 is our 2nd best season in 8 years of Caldwell leadership.  These are the FACTS.

Yeah, I think regardless of how we finish the season we are in a good spot. We have a franchise QB in minshew, and a young exciting offense to go with him. And some young pieces to build around on defense. Personally I expect this team to win at least 7 this year. But next year is where things get interesting. A good draft will have us on top of the AFC South.

If we win 7 or 8, I'm down with giving this GM / HC combo another season.  
But what happens if we end up 5-11 (or worse), Minshew finishes the season looking good but not great, and the defense is atrocious.  Are you on-board with cleaning house at that point?

No I wouldn't be. I think Dave Caldwell has a nose for talent and that "fact" has gotten lost a bit with all the other woes that plague this franchise. If after next year we don't make a huge step towards competing then I'd be fine with cleaning house. But I'd honestly rather we stick with Caldwell because as we all know, it could get much much worse. And generally it's agreed across the leagues, that we draft pretty well and Khan seemed eager to give Caldwell another chance, so I'm not the only one seeing this.

The only personnel change I really want to see is at DC. We desperately need to change up our defensive scheme.

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Yeah, I think regardless of how we finish the season we are in a good spot. We have a franchise QB in minshew, and a young exciting offense to go with him. And some young pieces to build around on defense. Personally I expect this team to win at least 7 this year. But next year is where things get interesting. A good draft will have us on top of the AFC South.

If we win 7 or 8, I'm down with giving this GM / HC combo another season.  
But what happens if we end up 5-11 (or worse), Minshew finishes the season looking good but not great, and the defense is atrocious.  Are you on-board with cleaning house at that point?

I think Caldwell and Doug are given another season by Khan barring a complete meltdown (something like 3 wins). Think it was the plan they sold Khan on during off season and think he bought in giving them a year to correct the cap and stay competitive and then by 2021 must be really good. If we only win 4 or 5 games but the offense is scoring a lot in losses, like 33-30 or 40-35, I think Khan believes the plan is working, the offense is good and defense just needs to be rebuilt.

7-8 wins after a purge on the defense should give fans confidence... should give Caldwell some ground to stand on.
But some fans have dug their heels in and would never back down from it. Caldwell is a bad GM, no matter what, and always will be.

A new GM and HC will want their guy and the Minshew era will be over essentially. So I think the W/L column matters only somewhat in the final decision of things.

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If we win 7 or 8, I'm down with giving this GM / HC combo another season.  
But what happens if we end up 5-11 (or worse), Minshew finishes the season looking good but not great, and the defense is atrocious.  Are you on-board with cleaning house at that point?

No I wouldn't be. I think Dave Caldwell has a nose for talent and that "fact" has gotten lost a bit with all the other woes that plague this franchise. If after next year we don't make a huge step towards competing then I'd be fine with cleaning house. But I'd honestly rather we stick with Caldwell because as we all know, it could get much much worse. And generally it's agreed across the leagues, that we draft pretty well and Khan seemed eager to give Caldwell another chance, so I'm not the only one seeing this.

The only personnel change I really want to see is at DC. We desperately need to change up our defensive scheme.

The definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over and expecting a different result.  If we draft so great, why are we 36-76?  Put the Teal Kool-Aid down brother.

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This is a results-oriented business.  There are no trophies or titles given for "moral victories" or for "winning the draft".  Our record with DC is 37-86.  6-10 is our 2nd best season in 8 years of Caldwell leadership.  These are the FACTS.

No I wouldn't be. I think Dave Caldwell has a nose for talent and that "fact" has gotten lost a bit with all the other woes that plague this franchise. If after next year we don't make a huge step towards competing then I'd be fine with cleaning house. But I'd honestly rather we stick with Caldwell because as we all know, it could get much much worse. And generally it's agreed across the leagues, that we draft pretty well and Khan seemed eager to give Caldwell another chance, so I'm not the only one seeing this.

The only personnel change I really want to see is at DC. We desperately need to change up our defensive scheme.

The definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over and expecting a different result.  If we draft so great, why are we 36-76?  Put the Teal Kool-Aid down brother.

Lol you're being obtuse on purpose. We owe most of that record to Gus "Icecream" Bradley.

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