People don't want to take it because it's an unknown. Yes, it reduces severity, but you still can't tell me how much by demographics. That's because they don't release that data. You still can't show me how the FDA is following the science, because they aren't even getting studies or reading them, by their own admission. You still can't show me why people with natural immunity should take it. Just using the flu shot as an example, you don't tell someone who had the flu for the year to go get their flu vaccine. You don't force kids to get the flu vaccine, even though it's a much greater threat to them than Covid. Nothing about this makes sense. Profit is the best thing I can think of that paints these policies in a neutral light. Any other theory is rooted in malice or incompetency.

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The mandate will hit TSA hard. This holiday travel season will be interesting.

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Colin Powell was fully vaccinated has died from Covid. 

I was firm about not taking the vaccine. But If this becomes available for the kids under 12 my daughters are not taking it. 

Of course the media will downplay the hell out of this. F- the pro vaccine crowd who wanna force this mandate down everyone’s throat.

He had multiple myeloma also, which is a cancer of the plasma cells that messes with your immune system.

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What in the Wide Wide World of Sports is agoin' on here???

I just don't understand this position. People who wear seatbelts dies in car crashes everyday but no one says they don't work. Every year people who get a flu shot end up getting the flu but people still get the shot because it works. Cops who wear vests get shot and die anyway, but not one of them says that he won't wear one as a result. Only with this vaccine are people saying that they will eschew the protection it offers because it doesn't protect everyone an ironclad 100% of the time. It's just not rational what you're saying here.

It's the whole forcing to put something into your body in order to continue to have the ability to feed your family thing that bothers most people.

On a side note, with the existing data, for the life of me, I can't figure out why someone would let their child get jabbed

Nothing in JFC's position relates to any mandate until the end. He's saying he won't do it, period.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Why should he? He's already had Covid.

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Why should he? He's already had Covid.

Reinfection in unvaccinated Covid survivors can occur as soon as 3 months after contracting the virus.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

So what. Isn't it the reduction in death and hospitalization that matters? That's the standard for the vaccine, right?

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Can we have any equitable measurements anymore? Geez.

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And, since we are using your standard, natural immunity is 7X stronger than the vaccine. So if it's popping up in convalescent patients, what's that say about the vaccinated? So you didn't answer the question. Why should people who have had Covid take the vaccine?

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So what. Isn't it the reduction in death and hospitalization that matters? That's the standard for the vaccine, right?

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Can we have any equitable measurements anymore? Geez.

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And, since we are using your standard, natural immunity is 7X stronger than the vaccine. So if it's popping up in convalescent patients, what's that say about the vaccinated? So you didn't answer the question. Why should people who have had Covid take the vaccine?

A study showed that vaccination post-infection conferred higher levels of immunity against current Covid strains and 20 mutations of concern. These levels exceeded both vaccination only and natural immunity only samples. As I also said, we know that natural immunity only can result in reinfection in as little as 3 months and since lifetime immunity for most coronaviruses is not attainable we have evidence to justify vaccination along with natural immunity. For both breadth and length of this pandemic the shot along with natural immunity provides the best protection against current and future strains, and people should absolutely not trust acquiring natural immunity as their defense against this virus because of the great risk of serious illness and death.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

You can't trust the vaccine, either. I've read the study that vaccinated convalescent patients can end up with better protection than both vaccinated and natural immunity alone, but that still doesn't justify mandatory vaccinations from the government or employers. Why require a subset of the population to require a higher standard of immunity. If your cool with vaccinated individuals to interact freely in society, you should be fine with those with natural immunity, whose resistance is even stronger, to share those same privileges. Anything else is nonsensical.

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My thoughts regarding this...

1)  Vaccine mandates should be illegal.  No person should be forced to have a drug injected into their body against their will.

2)  If getting the vaccine is so important and people do it, there should be no "mask mandates".  The purpose of the vaccine is to protect the self rather than people around you.  The mask does nothing.

3)  There should be no kind of "vaccine passport" at all.  Being vaccinated or not is personal medical information.  That information should only be between a person and their doctor.  Someone at a store or a restaurant has no reason to know a person's personal health information.

With that being said, my personal "un-medically trained opinion" is that people that can get the vaccine should.  I have seen people that I know succumb to the disease and if getting vaccinated will prevent possible death, it's probably the right thing to do.

Another "that being said" thing is that if somebody has had it and gotten over it, they will probably be fine not getting vaccinated.  The choice should be theirs.

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

Why should he? He's already had Covid.

Reinfection in unvaccinated Covid survivors can occur as soon as 3 months after contracting the virus.

And yet for what over a year there were no reports of anyone getting it 2 times. Some paid off lab "study" versus facts, or are the real world facts being hidden now?


For the cases, NY actually won their case, they did not get the TRO. So they were fired and then won the case. Now each of them can sue for more money. The case in Indiana was a wrong decision but that will be fixed. For the Liberty Counsel class action lawsuit, that was filed in FL and check who oversees FL. The newer cases are winning because religious exemptions are being denied and legally they cannot do that.

Then wait until the class action lawsuit shows that there is no FDA approved vaccine and they are all still under EUA laws. You cannot force an EUA approved vaccine no matter what anyone has told you.

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The studies didn't catch it because they were asymptomatic. It wasn't until economies started opening up and places started doing mandatory testing that they were able to collect that data. Studies in March (iirc) of this year started showing that both the vaccinated and convalescent patients were carrying the virus but just didn't realize it. It's hard to find that type of information if people aren't showing symptoms. It's not all conspiracy. Looking at that data is what clued me into the idea that antibodies were not the best measure for these disease.

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The studies didn't catch it because they were asymptomatic. It wasn't until economies started opening up and places started doing mandatory testing that they were able to collect that data. Studies in March (iirc) of this year started showing that both the vaccinated and convalescent patients were carrying the virus but just didn't realize it. It's hard to find that type of information if people aren't showing symptoms. It's not all conspiracy. Looking at that data is what clued me into the idea that antibodies were not the best measure for these disease.

I know people have supposedly gotten it twice now some maybe even 3 times. The issue was they said you can't get it twice and continued with that for a long time. Then there is the issue with the PCR tests not being accurate at all. Really there is no clue what happened other than vaccinated people having immune issues and getting sick for covid or colds.

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Are you suggesting that the vaccine gave the virus the capability to reinfect people? Do you have any evidence for that other than correlation?

They were saying early on that you couldn't catch it again, but it was never definitive. You have to ask yourself how they were arriving at that conclusion. It's not like they took a group of people, gave them a test to take once a week, then measured the data over the course of the next year. They were just asking people to report if they got sick again, and that *shockingly* wasn't sufficient for determining reinfection rate. It wasn't until they started doing mass testing as travel opened back up that they started catching people who were "sick." Their immune system was responding quickly enough to mitigate the symptoms entirely. Then the "science" adjusted.

No science should be set in stone. It should be constantly evolving. Failing to evolve with it is a recipe for disaster, matched only by allowing the science to be politicized. Rigor, scrutiny, and integrity are the bedrocks of good science, and we are getting almost none of that in this era. We're chasing the almighty dollar, and it's resulting in bad science, bad policy, and massive mistrust in the institutions that are supposed to protect us.

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Are you suggesting that the vaccine gave the virus the capability to reinfect people? Do you have any evidence for that other than correlation?

Yes and no. It kills your immune system, so you will naturally get infected more ... covid or not covid but that is really hard to say which it is because of the difference in testing policies.


For 2020 and into 2021, you supposedly weren't supposed to be able to get it again. Even with all the constant testing there weren't any reinfections.

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Are you suggesting that the vaccine gave the virus the capability to reinfect people? Do you have any evidence for that other than correlation?

Yes and no. It kills your immune system, so you will naturally get infected more ... covid or not covid but that is really hard to say which it is because of the difference in testing policies.


For 2020 and into 2021, you supposedly weren't supposed to be able to get it again. Even with all the constant testing there weren't any reinfections.

So no, you don't have any evidence for your statements.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Yes and no. It kills your immune system, so you will naturally get infected more ... covid or not covid but that is really hard to say which it is because of the difference in testing policies.


For 2020 and into 2021, you supposedly weren't supposed to be able to get it again. Even with all the constant testing there weren't any reinfections.

So no, you don't have any evidence for your statements.

I have evidence from all the vaccinated people that keep missing work because they are sick. We have evidence from all the vaccinated people getting covid or a "covid like illness" and going in and out of the hospital.

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So no, you don't have any evidence for your statements.

I have evidence from all the vaccinated people that keep missing work because they are sick. We have evidence from all the vaccinated people getting covid or a "covid like illness" and going in and out of the hospital.

Sounds more like your evidence is the Alt Rightnews aggregators like Liberty Daily, which makes sense since you are pimping hate groups like Liberty Council.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

I'm not giving any credit to that theory, but I would be interested to see if anyone was getting sick at a higher rate based on their exposure to the virus or vaccine (or lack thereof). Wonder if anyone has done a study on that yet. I'm still waiting for the study that shows what happens when vaccinated people get covid. Does their body then produce antibodies and t-cells for the virus? Find a study on that yet?

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