Only a complete idiot can look at those athletes competing against one another ( I mean the dudes/intersex/what ever the hell they are against the girls) and not see the clear physical difference. To ignore it is simply being obtuse.

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Looking to troll? Don't bother, we supply our own.

 

 

Remember when you said this was about testosterone? Pepperidge Farm remembers.

The two athletes were tested for testosterone, and banned at one time due to that.
That test was about testosterone.
The larger issue is about any number of other measurable differences.

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He likes to move goalposts to suit his argument.

I'm responding to you regarding biology.  Biology is all living things, not just two intersex boxers.
These boxers don't have CAIS but there may be Olympic athletes who do that we will never know about. We haven't been in touch for a while, but I personally know a girl with the condition who played girls golf and girls soccer for her high school.  Her appearance and musculature is entirely feminine. Her chromosomes are XY.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Dude, early reports on this thing talked about how she was tested and failed an unspecified gender eligibility test. In no world is that tied to testosterone. She may have had high testosterone, but that has nothing to do with passing or failing a gender eligibility test. The OIC only required her passport as proof of gender. I feel bad for the lady, as she was born with female genitals and raised as such. Her testosterone is probably not off the charts, nor would her anatomy be vastly different. It's still an edge, but probably not nearly to the degree people think. Regardless, this should be a very small issue, but dishonest people with an agenda ruin everything, and only simpletons can't see the truth of it. Hi, Mikey.

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Dude, early reports on this thing talked about how she was tested and failed an unspecified gender eligibility test. In no world is that tied to testosterone. She may have had high testosterone, but that has nothing to do with passing or failing a gender eligibility test. The OIC only required her passport as proof of gender. I feel bad for the lady, as she was born with female genitals and raised as such. Her testosterone is probably not off the charts, nor would her anatomy be vastly different. It's still an edge, but probably not nearly to the degree people think. Regardless, this should be a very small issue, but dishonest people with an agenda ruin everything, and only simpletons can't see the truth of it. Hi, Mikey.

Who are the dishonest people in this story and how did they ruin everything?

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Dude, early reports on this thing talked about how she was tested and failed an unspecified gender eligibility test. In no world is that tied to testosterone. She may have had high testosterone, but that has nothing to do with passing or failing a gender eligibility test. The OIC only required her passport as proof of gender. I feel bad for the lady, as she was born with female genitals and raised as such. Her testosterone is probably not off the charts, nor would her anatomy be vastly different. It's still an edge, but probably not nearly to the degree people think. Regardless, this should be a very small issue, but dishonest people with an agenda ruin everything, and only simpletons can't see the truth of it. Hi, Mikey.

Who are the dishonest people in this story and how did they ruin everything?

The Olympic officials who allowed men to compete in a combat sport against women. They ruined those actual women's opportunity to win medals in their competitions, years of training lost to a lie that you insist on defending.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Who are the dishonest people in this story and how did they ruin everything?

The Olympic officials who allowed men to compete in a combat sport against women. They ruined those actual women's opportunity to win medals in their competitions, years of training lost to a lie that you insist on defending.

These boxers aren't men.  We covered that already.  They are intersex.  Whether they should be banned is a gray area. This isn't society or the IOC bending the definitions of sex and gender.  God did this one.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

The Olympic officials who allowed men to compete in a combat sport against women. They ruined those actual women's opportunity to win medals in their competitions, years of training lost to a lie that you insist on defending.

These boxers aren't men.  We covered that already.  They are intersex.  Whether they should be banned is a gray area. This isn't society or the IOC bending the definitions of sex and gender.  God did this one.

LOL you still at it? We covered this already with a bit of research.

 In summary we establish it has not been 100 years. Also, that it was not historically ok. Well, except for Hilter in the 30's and this Olympic committee that deflected the situation to the country issuing a passport. So unless the committee is God I do not feel he did anything as far as letting them play.

You know the women they fought are banned from raising their testosterone level or adding the extra muscle to that of those guys right?

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A new broom always sweeps clean.

These boxers aren't men.  We covered that already.  They are intersex.  Whether they should be banned is a gray area. This isn't society or the IOC bending the definitions of sex and gender.  God did this one.

LOL you still at it? We covered this already with a bit of research.

 In summary we establish it has not been 100 years. Also, that it was not historically ok. Well, except for Hilter in the 30's and this Olympic committee that deflected the situation to the country issuing a passport. So unless the committee is God I do not feel he did anything as far as letting them play.

You know the women they fought are banned from raising their testosterone level or adding the extra muscle to that of those guys right?

God made the boxers intersex.  Someone's status as intersex isn't always obvious. Man (in this case the IOC) gets to decide if they are qualified to compete as women.

100 years ago there was no testosterone test.  It wasn't possible.  They did physical examination only.  A woman configured like one of these boxers 100 years ago would have been allowed to compete as a woman.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

LOL you still at it? We covered this already with a bit of research.

 In summary we establish it has not been 100 years. Also, that it was not historically ok. Well, except for Hilter in the 30's and this Olympic committee that deflected the situation to the country issuing a passport. So unless the committee is God I do not feel he did anything as far as letting them play.

You know the women they fought are banned from raising their testosterone level or adding the extra muscle to that of those guys right?

God made the boxers intersex.  Someone's status as intersex isn't always obvious. Man (in this case the IOC) gets to decide if they are qualified to compete as women.

100 years ago there was no testosterone test.  It wasn't possible.  They did physical examination only.  A woman configured like one of these boxers 100 years ago would have been allowed to compete as a woman.

You provided the link the summary came from. Look back.  Also, it was you that made the 100 year statement.

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A new broom always sweeps clean.

Look guys,
Consider a person who was born with female genitalia, and suddenly decides they identify as a man. You say that's crazy.
Fine.
But a consider a different person, also born with female genitalia, but has higher testosterone and fights well, you start calling her a man even though she wants to be called a woman? Now you're just as crazy as the first person! And you're an [BLEEP] too!

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

God made the boxers intersex.  Someone's status as intersex isn't always obvious. Man (in this case the IOC) gets to decide if they are qualified to compete as women.

100 years ago there was no testosterone test.  It wasn't possible.  They did physical examination only.  A woman configured like one of these boxers 100 years ago would have been allowed to compete as a woman.

You provided the link the summary came from. Look back.  Also, it was you that made the 100 year statement.

Your reading comprehension skills are bad.
I'm pointing a forest out to you and you're arguing over the first tree you come to.
The main point is, intersex people have always existed.  Whether 10 years ago or 100 years ago or 1000 years ago.  Women's sports haven't always existed.  But as soon as women's sports came into existence, intersex people were participating as women.  Later, testing for intersex conditions became available.  Before that testing existed, the only way to check was physical examination.  Many intersex conditions manifest with normal looking genitals.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

You provided the link the summary came from. Look back.  Also, it was you that made the 100 year statement.

Your reading comprehension skills are bad.
I'm pointing a forest out to you and you're arguing over the first tree you come to.
The main point is, intersex people have always existed.  Whether 10 years ago or 100 years ago or 1000 years ago.  Women's sports haven't always existed.  But as soon as women's sports came into existence, intersex people were participating as women.  Later, testing for intersex conditions became available.  Before that testing existed, the only way to check was physical examination.  Many intersex conditions manifest with normal looking genitals.

I comprehend just fine. Dude say what you want, believe what you want. What happen was not fair today, or historically. Quit trying to justify what happened because that dog just doesn't hunt.  It is just as fair to have you try to block Travon Walker as have those women fight those guys.

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A new broom always sweeps clean.

Your reading comprehension skills are bad.
I'm pointing a forest out to you and you're arguing over the first tree you come to.
The main point is, intersex people have always existed.  Whether 10 years ago or 100 years ago or 1000 years ago.  Women's sports haven't always existed.  But as soon as women's sports came into existence, intersex people were participating as women.  Later, testing for intersex conditions became available.  Before that testing existed, the only way to check was physical examination.  Many intersex conditions manifest with normal looking genitals.

I comprehend just fine. Dude say what you want, believe what you want. What happen was not fair today, or historically. Quit trying to justify what happened because that dog just doesn't hunt.  It is just as fair to have you try to block Travon Walker as have those women fight those guys.

You're still not getting it.
 
I'm not arguing they should or should not compete. I don't care about that.  If you think they should not compete, fine.  You think they should, fine.  I have no opinion on that.

Instead, I'm arguing my opinion that, as far as we know, they did nothing wrong.  

And I'm telling you, as a fact, that women like them have competed and likely won before, and was not a big deal.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

I comprehend just fine. Dude say what you want, believe what you want. What happen was not fair today, or historically. Quit trying to justify what happened because that dog just doesn't hunt.  It is just as fair to have you try to block Travon Walker as have those women fight those guys.

You're still not getting it.
 
I'm not arguing they should or should not compete. I don't care about that.  If think they should not compete, fine.  You think they should, fine.  I have no opinion on that.

Instead, I'm arguing my opinion that, as far as we know, they did nothing wrong.  

And I'm telling you, as a fact, that women like them have competed and likely won before, and was not a big deal.

Actually it was a big deal, every time they were uncovered the accomplishments were stripped.

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A new broom always sweeps clean.

Imagine being married to man who is cool with 2 dudes competing against each other in women's boxing, lol.

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You're still not getting it.
 
I'm not arguing they should or should not compete. I don't care about that.  If think they should not compete, fine.  You think they should, fine.  I have no opinion on that.

Instead, I'm arguing my opinion that, as far as we know, they did nothing wrong.  

And I'm telling you, as a fact, that women like them have competed and likely won before, and was not a big deal.

Actually it was a big deal, every time they were uncovered the accomplishments were stripped.

But until about 20 years ago, it was only "uncovered" if it included unusual or male like genitalia. And it doesn't always include that.

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Imagine being married to man who is cool with 2 dudes competing against each other in women's boxing,  lol.

Imagine being the daughter of a man who might decide one day to call you "a dude" if you develop a hormone disorder.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Actually it was a big deal, every time they were uncovered the accomplishments were stripped.

But until about 20 years ago, it was only "uncovered" if it included unusual or male like genitalia. And it doesn't always include that.

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Imagine being married to man who is cool with 2 dudes competing against each other in women's boxing,  lol.

Imagine being the daughter of a man who might decide one day to call you "a dude" if you develop a hormone disorder.

There's no developing a disorder. If your daughter was born with XX, guess what, she is a woman.

You are purposely trying to complicate things by bringing all these other mutations to say DNA doesn't matter. You can have any number of mutations that affect your hormone levels or physical appearance. None of that matters. If you are XY, you don't compete against women.

You can argue hormone, testosterone, whatever but that it doesn't matter. Women can have elevated testosterone levels and larger upper body, well they won the lottery for swimming. Men who are small lost the genetic lottery but it doesn't mean they should get to compete against women. History also doesn't matter. Just because they had to use what parts you had in the past, means nothing now. There is a quick and easy test that settles the matter in minutes.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

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But until about 20 years ago, it was only "uncovered" if it included unusual or male like genitalia. And it doesn't always include that.

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Imagine being the daughter of a man who might decide one day to call you "a dude" if you develop a hormone disorder.

There's no developing a disorder. If your daughter was born with XX, guess what, she is a woman.

You are purposely trying to complicate things by bringing all these other mutations to say DNA doesn't matter. You can have any number of mutations that affect your hormone levels or physical appearance. None of that matters. If you are XY, you don't compete against women.

You can argue hormone, testosterone, whatever but that it doesn't matter. Women can have elevated testosterone levels and larger upper body, well they won the lottery for swimming. Men who are small lost the genetic lottery but it doesn't mean they should get to compete against women. History also doesn't matter. Just because they had to use what parts you had in the past, means nothing now. There is a quick and easy test that settles the matter in minutes.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

Did you look up complete androgen insensitivity on Wikipedia?
A person can be XY and be born and go their entire life looking like a woman.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

There's no developing a disorder. If your daughter was born with XX, guess what, she is a woman.

You are purposely trying to complicate things by bringing all these other mutations to say DNA doesn't matter. You can have any number of mutations that affect your hormone levels or physical appearance. None of that matters. If you are XY, you don't compete against women.

You can argue hormone, testosterone, whatever but that it doesn't matter. Women can have elevated testosterone levels and larger upper body, well they won the lottery for swimming. Men who are small lost the genetic lottery but it doesn't mean they should get to compete against women. History also doesn't matter. Just because they had to use what parts you had in the past, means nothing now. There is a quick and easy test that settles the matter in minutes.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

Did you look up complete androgen insensitivity on Wikipedia?
A person can be XY and be born and go their entire life looking like a woman.

Again, who cares. They lost the genetic lottery.

Let's say a short person wants to play in the NBA and dunk. Are you going to lower the nets for them? Give them stairs on the court that only they can use?

You are trying to compare a weaker male and saying he should be able to compete against women. Unless you are creating new open competitions based on testosterone levels, it just doesn't matter.

Life isn't fair and some things you can't control. If you can't compete against men without any mutations, may you can qualify for the special Olympics.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

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Did you look up complete androgen insensitivity on Wikipedia?
A person can be XY and be born and go their entire life looking like a woman.

Again, who cares. They lost the genetic lottery.

Let's say a short person wants to play in the NBA and dunk. Are you going to lower the nets for them? Give them stairs on the court that only they can use?

You are trying to compare a weaker male and saying he should be able to compete against women. Unless you are creating new open competitions based on testosterone levels, it just doesn't matter.

Life isn't fair and some things you can't control. If you can't compete against men without any mutations, may you can qualify for the special Olympics.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

I am only trying to tell you that your focus on chromosomes indicates you don't understand biology very well.  People with complete androgen insensitivity are women with XY chromosomes.  None of them are men. I don't care if or where they compete in sports.  But they are women.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.