An interesting part of this all is whether Caldwell wanted to fire Bradley after last year but Shad wouldn't let him.


If true it shows that Shad Khan is not the hands off owner he said he would be and that Caldwell at least wanted to make amends for his mistake earlier than now.

---

I remember those Mike Lombardi quotes about a month ago saying that our front office wasn't having an honest evaluation with themselves about the talent that have brought in.

 

I also remember Gus saying just a few weeks ago that he and Dave looked at all of Blake's throws again and their decision was that a lot of other QBs in the league were missing throws too.

 

Obviously that is just a taste of information, but I think there is at least some evidence that Caldwell isn't self evaluating honestly. 

 

1 - You are misquoting Bradley/ putting words in Dave's mouth and,

 2- you are merely parroting Lombardi's opinion on that topic. 

 

Get back to me with this "evidence" you speak of when you actually have some. 

 

I may be wrong about Caldwell, and I get why you and others are already done with him. I do.

 I don't blame you for feeling that way or think less of you because of it. I simply have a bit of faith in his ability to get it right.  It's fine that you don't. 

---

It's disingenuous to call either Bortles or Fowler a miss at his point in time, IMO.  Fowler tore an ACL, which is a huge deal for a defensive lineman, especially one who is heavily reliant on speed.  It's also his first 14 games in the NFL.  There's also the issue of our defensive scheme, which seems to put almost nobody in a position to be successful.  Our coaching has certainly had an impact.

 

Bortles has been awful this year, but when asked, said that nobody on staff had even mentioned his mechanics to him.  He looked great last year (despite the garbage time arguments) and many had pegged both he and Carr as the next great QBs.  Carr improved, he regressed.  It's possible he's not fixable, but he does have talent.  30 other teams missed on Carr, as well.

 

Our receivers have clearly given up--especially A-Rob.  We scheme nobody open.  We just line them up across from the corners and expect them to beat the coverage.  This entire team has an attitude that screams they've given up--and that reflects leadership.

 

Joeckel is clearly a bust, but it was the right pick.  That entire draft was awful.  The fact that Cyprien is even average is a victory in my book.

 

Players have come to this team, looked good, and become worse as time went on.  It's coaching.  The talent gleaned in the later rounds speaks for itself.  It's possible that Caldwell remains unsuccessful, but you can't pin all the problems on him.

 

we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

I think it's both.  coaching and lack of talent overall. 

---

<FONT face="Comic Sans MS" size=3><B><FONT face=Verdana color=#ff6600 size=4></FONT></B></FONT>

And Mike Lombardi is doing what?  Providing commentary on FS1 because he no longer has a job in the league....

 

Grain of salt, man.  Grain of salt.

He's also one of the most anti-Jaguar writer/media/commentator out there

---

It could be argued that it was Khans call, but the GM choose to keep Gus around for 4 years coaching the talent he was drafting, so lets please not act like Caldwell was some innocent bystander here. He is part of the problem.

Time for you to start firedavecaldwell.com

---

Formerly known as The Real Joker

1 - You are misquoting Bradley/ putting words in Dave's mouth and,

 2- you are merely parroting Lombardi's opinion on that topic. 

 

Get back to me with this "evidence" you speak of when you actually have some. 

 

I may be wrong about Caldwell, and I get why you and others are already done with him. I do.

 I don't blame you for feeling that way or think less of you because of it. I simply have a bit of faith in his ability to get it right.  It's fine that you don't. 

“We went back, Dave (Caldwell) and I were just watching in his office on some throws that were made around the league,” Bradley told reporters on Monday when asked about Bortles struggles. “Let’s just look at the misses and see what’s taking place and you see it. A lot of quarterbacks are doing it across the league. You go back, and it’s a head scratcher, because you do see some great throws and some great decision-making. Other ones, just got away from him.”

 

That's where I got it from. 

---

we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

I think it's both.  coaching and lack of talent overall. 

 

We do not lack talent overall. It is missing at some positions, but "overall" is an exaggeration. Sometimes we appear to be less talented when players don't execute. Many forum members can't tell the difference.

---

We do not lack talent overall. It is missing at some positions, but "overall" is an exaggeration. Sometimes we appear to be less talented when players don't execute. Many forum members can't tell the difference.

 

if only there was a way to objectively measure the combination of talent and coaching against other teams.  

 

maybe they could meet on Sundays and play football.  

---

<FONT face="Comic Sans MS" size=3><B><FONT face=Verdana color=#ff6600 size=4></FONT></B></FONT>

if only there was a way to objectively measure the combination of talent and coaching against other teams.


maybe they could meet on Sundays and play football.

Now that Gus is gone and we're likely upgrading coaches, Id say theres a decent chance you get your wish.

---

if only there was a way to objectively measure the combination of talent and coaching against other teams.  

 

maybe they could meet on Sundays and play football.  

 

Dave Caldwell's job was to make our team much better than it was. The fact he did cannot be denied.

---

“We went back, Dave (Caldwell) and I were just watching in his office on some throws that were made around the league,” Bradley told reporters on Monday when asked about Bortles struggles. “Let’s just look at the misses and see what’s taking place and you see it. A lot of quarterbacks are doing it across the league. You go back, and it’s a head scratcher, because you do see some great throws and some great decision-making. Other ones, just got away from him.”

 

That's where I got it from. 

 

Exactly. You put Bradley's words in Dave's mouth.  That's Bradley talking.  Not Dave. The quote only states that Caldwell was present in the room. 

 

He didn't say "...we watched the film and Dave thought this or thought that." 

---

“We went back, Dave (Caldwell) and I were just watching in his office on some throws that were made around the league,” Bradley told reporters on Monday when asked about Bortles struggles. “Let’s just look at the misses and see what’s taking place and you see it. A lot of quarterbacks are doing it across the league. You go back, and it’s a head scratcher, because you do see some great throws and some great decision-making. Other ones, just got away from him.”

 

That's where I got it from. 

 

 

This is also the man who has said, after multiple games this year, "I don't know why we can't win.  Practice sure goes great, but it doesn't translate!"  Grain of salt.

---

I am not for making a change just for the sake of change.

 

If the Jags can get a better guy, then do it. If there is any question, then don't.

 

Caldwell has had some gaffes along the way, but is in his first GM stint. I expect he has learned a great deal from his mistakes. It would be just the Jag's luck to axe the guy, and get someone worse, while he moves on and has great success elsewhere.

---

What lies behind us, and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.







 

Exactly. You put Bradley's words in Dave's mouth.  That's Bradley talking.  Not Dave. The quote only states that Caldwell was present in the room. 

 

He didn't say "...we watched the film and Dave thought this or thought that." 

I guess we'll find out if Dave agreed by how he treats the QB competition acquisition this offseason. If it's the token veteran Hoyer/Glennon/etc type that I am expecting then I think it will be proven true.

 

If by some miracle we do get Garoppolo or Romo or if we spend our 1st or 2nd rounder on a QB then I will very happily be proven wrong. 

---

Bortles has none of the problems Freeman did between his ears. It is 100% bad coaching for him. If you don't believe that you are in denial.

Yes because players that throw temper tantrums after ever 3 and out.


As for your denial comment hi pot Im kettle. Denial and you go together like two cannibal midgets in a fat guys rib cage.

---

I guess we'll find out if Dave agreed by how he treats the QB competition acquisition this offseason. If it's the token veteran Hoyer/Glennon/etc type that I am expecting then I think it will be proven true.

 

If by some miracle we do get Garoppolo or Romo or if we spend our 1st or 2nd rounder on a QB then I will very happily be proven wrong. 

 

I agree... we'll see how serious Dave is about protecting his pick, or how dedicated he is to solving the problem at QB.

 

Because without bringing in a viable option, he's showing that he's too stubborn to admit there's a problem with "his guy."

 

Dave Caldwell's job was to make our team much better than it was. The fact he did cannot be denied.

 

Our team certainly is NOT much better than it was.  It's why the HC was fired... good grief!!!

---

"You do your own thing in your own time. You should be proud."

I agree... we'll see how serious Dave is about protecting his pick, or how dedicated he is to solving the problem at QB.

 

 

 

 

This is the most important question of the upcoming offseason, IMO.  It determines the scope of the HC search. 

 

Clearly, I think that DC is wise enough to draft or acquire a viable second option/upgrade to Bortles for his next HC. And while I haven't set a "2nd round or sooner" limitation like our fellow poster just did I would be severely disappointed if Caldwell doesn't provide real competition at the position. 

---

Unless I'm forgetting someone, I don't remember a qb ever coming back from a season as bad as Bortles this season and having success. This was his third season, and he struggled to even make the most routine NFL throws. Decision making is just as bad now as it was in his rookie season. And now, he has loser body language. I think it is just too much to expect, and I have been a Jaguars fan too long to expect that type of miracle. Bortles is unfixable now, in my opinion. He is who he is: turnover machine that struggles with accuracy and making the routine throws.


I was a huge Bortles believer... until the Oakland game in which we watched Carr look great and Bortles still look like a rookie. That was so depressing. And I can count on one hand how many decent games he had this season.

 

 

Eli Manning, a few times- his 2nd 3rd and 4th years.

Drew Brees 3rd year....

Ben Roethlisburder........3rd year

 

 

That is off the top of my head.

 

I think people subconsciously forget things like this, and how bad the above guys were, and how riled up their own fan bases were at the time, because they want to believe a savior is going to materialize.

 

Seriously, look at these guys and their 3rd seasons, and compare and contrast.

 

 

I know...I know....let's just throw him out and forget the notion of developing a player.  

 

 

If you want, for kicks, take a look at St. Mark's 3rd year in the league as well.  

---

“We went back, Dave (Caldwell) and I were just watching in his office on some throws that were made around the league,” Bradley told reporters on Monday when asked about Bortles struggles. “Let’s just look at the misses and see what’s taking place and you see it. A lot of quarterbacks are doing it across the league.
You go back, and it’s a head scratcher, because you do see some great throws and some great decision-making. Other ones, just got away from him.
”


That's where I got it from.

Is that PR talk or is that what him and Dave genuinely think?

---

Caldwell just said he still believe in Bortles but the new HC will have a lot of input about the QB situation. 

---