(10-19-2017, 08:16 PM)atburg Wrote:

(10-18-2017, 01:55 PM)Kane Wrote: I specifically was referring to offense. Yeah he had Hines Ward and the Bus for awhile in the early years... but not until the last few seasons have they loaded up on that side of the ball.

I don't deny that he walked into a very good team, and Tomlin won a SB because of the defense that was built there in Pitt.
But as Big Ben made his way into his 3rd and 4th seasons (where Bortles is now) he elevated the play of others around him.

Bortles was a top 5 selection. And in his 4th year, we have to gameplan around him. We have to limit the amount of throws he makes. 
In his 4th year... he elevates the play of no one. If anything he brings down the play of others.

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Aaron Rodgers lost Jordy Nelson and still made the playoffs I think.

I believe teams lose guys all the time. QBs that are ACTUALLY good, tend to overcome these things.
Bortles can't overcome himself.... much less losing his #1 "jump ball" receiver.

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For what team?

He also had a stacked line, and a rookie stud tight end ( in 2005). But not looking to bicker, as I agree with most of your points.