(09-09-2018, 08:18 AM)jj82284 Wrote:

(09-08-2018, 08:02 PM)mikesez Wrote: look, if you're going to make wild, life and career changing claims without evidence, that's called religion and it has no place on this forum.

It's okay.  It's a lot to take in.  

Not all intelligence operations are strictly for information gathering.  Some intelligence operations are for information implanting to create or foster a narrative or disinformation.  In the case of the Trump Campaign, it has already been acknowledged in the public square that there were American sanctioned intelligence assets in contact with Satellites of the Trump campaign for the purpose of soliciting or planting information relating to the alleged Russian interference in our elections.  The most glaring case is that of Papadopoulos.  There was Stephen Halper, an American intelligence asset that invited him over to London, one of his associates Professor Miffsoud, another person affiliated with both American and Russian intelligence, was the source (Along with the public statements of Julianne Assange) of the idea that the Russians had "dirt" on Hillary Clinton.  Stephen Halpers involvement as an active American asset has been acknowledged in the public square.  This is also a gentlemen who was involved in falsely accusing Michael Flynn of Misconduct back in 2014 because of personal animus.  

Under John Brennan, The United States developed an expanded policy of outsourcing elements of foreign intelligence work to assets from allied countries in their native theaters of operation.  Christopher Steele was an American/British asset under this program.  He was paid roughly 11 times by the United States government in the run up to the 2016 presidential campaign.  He was also paid (illegally) by Hillary Clinton's campaign through the DNC and the Law Firm Perkins Quoi to the company FUSION GPS.  It was his work (the Dossier) that comprised the foundation of the Intelligence communities argument for probable cause against the Trump Campaign after it was believed that there were exculpatory developments in the case against George Papadopoulos.  In addition to Steele, Nellie Ohre the wife of the #4 at DOJ was also employed to provide Opposition Research against the Trump Campaign (Bruce Ohr illegally concealed this information) and her husband worked extensively to lend credibility to the Disinformation that Steele was peddling when it had never and has never been verified (in court documents Steele has expressed his own disbelief in his own work.)  These are all facts that are part of the public square that are easily searchable.

In addition, there are a number of other alleged interference, grooming, and solicitations from American Assets against other members of the Trump Campaign.  We know that Natalia Vesselnetskya (The Russia Connected Lawyer from the Trump Tower Meeting) was also a client of Fusion GPS.  We know that Peter Strzok expressed a need for an "insurance policy".  We know that James Comey, Sally Yates, Andrew McCabe and the current deputy AG whose in charge of the entire Russian Collusion sham all signed off on a FISA Application to spy on an American citizen based on the fiction of Mr. Steele.  We also know that requests to unmask American Citizens captured through incidental collections more than doubled during Campaign season (the paper trail of those requests has been thrown into question with the denials of Samantha Powers.)  We know that someone leaked the unmasked transcript of  Michael Flynn to the press as a news hook for his prosecution.  We know that an intelligence official leaked the initial disclosure of the Dossier to the President by Jim Comey in an intelligence brief.  The list goes on.  


Even if you want to limit the scope of "spying" to mean the pure theft of information then you still have the illegal Fisa and the unconstitutional unmasking that have both been acknowledged as fact in the public square and open source reporting.  And even that ignores the massive counter intel operation research operation that was initiated against the Trump Campaign, I believe, as a potential October Surprise before there was knowledge of the Billy bush Tape.

I sense you put a lot of effort into that response.  I'm sorry but it doesn't answer my question.
My question was, did Hillary's campaign or any of her PACs, or any of Obama's PACs, obtain this sensitive information before the public did?
So far, there is no evidence that they did, and not even Trump is alleging that they did. Remember how the DNC emails from this time period all got hacked? There's nothing in those emails pointing to them knowing stuff about Trump that the public didnt already know.
So how could it be politically motivated spying or unmasking if the politicians that might have wanted that information didnt get any early access to it?

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