Ask the tinhorns how having the coach act as czar worked out...

It can work.

It can fail. 

We won't know with Meyer till we actually try it.  Do you think Meyer is smarter than O'Brien?

Honestly, not really. I think they are about the same.

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Their history may also suggest that Baalke played no small role in bringing Meyer to the table.

That is the reason Baalke is here. Maybe this was planned, maybe it was just Baalke wanting to get a GM job again. Baalke knew he wasn't staying unless he could find a coach that would go to bat for him. He used his influence with Khan to then get a promotion by pushing Meyer. He gets paid like a GM and doesn't have the responsibility.

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What is your problem?

The last few coaches for the Jags have been from the NFL coaching cicrle.  They all failed.

This is a new move that could potentially be great.  I don't know if It will work out but we have a proven winner as head coach.  Del Rio, Malarkey, Marrone, all had previous NFL experience and look how that turned out.

Coughlin came from the Jags straight from Boston College.  He has assistant NFL experience before but nothing like previous NFL head coaching experience.  He was rough and tough but the results spoke for themselves.  The last time the Jags have steadily been relevant was the 90s. That was due to Coughlin's hard nose attitude and coaching. 2 AFC title games in a 4 year span to put icing on the cake.

The Jags had to hit the nuclear button and rebuild from the top to the bottom.  I love some of the comments I have heard from Meyer.  There wasn't like there was another bill bellicheck or any other proven head coach available.

I was willing to take a wait and see attitude with the Meyer hire, but so far the choices he has made have been abysmal. How are we supposed to be optimistic, when he is just holding onto hires from the old regime (Warhop and Baalke)?

Same here.

1 season, if we have the same results I'll probably quit. It seems like there is no hope as long as Khan in the owner.

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"Treyvon Wallet is elite run defender and better overall than Aidan Hutchinson" 11/11/23

It can work.

It can fail. 

We won't know with Meyer till we actually try it.  Do you think Meyer is smarter than O'Brien?

Honestly, not really. I think they are about the same.

O'brien was a decent coach, it's just that the coach should focus on coaching and someone whose expertise is evaluating prospects should be doing player selections.

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If Baalke gets all the "blame" for "ruining" the 49ers, then he also deserves credit for their early 2010's run. Which was a good run and one play away from a championship.

I am not incredibly thrilled about being in-house, but in his defense, he was only here a few months. So he was not here long enough to absorb the "stink".

Let's see how it plays out.

Why would he get any credit for the success they had with McCloughan's players? Baalke had terrible drafts.

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See, this is what I'm not getting.

How could he have singularly ruined the 49ers if he has those accolades-besides from maybe driving away Harbaugh?

The critics would argue that the early success was due to players mostly acquired prior to him being GM and the team just got worse the longer Baalke ran things.  Let's just take the record of 51-44-1.  It doesn't sound that bad.  Hypothetically, if it went as follows, I think most people would be pleased:

Season 1:  2-14
Season 2:  5-11
Season 3:  8-8
Season 4:  12-4
Season 5:  11-4-1
Season 6:  13-3

However, that's not what happened.  The reality is reversed.  His actual records went as follows:

Season 1:  13-3
Season 2:  11-4-1
Season 3:  12-4
Season 4:  8-8
Season 5:  5-11
Season 6:  2-14

That's the concern.

That makes a ton of sense and placed in that perspective, it's scary as hell, though the draft, salary cap and free agency are designed to produce those results...though not to that degree.

I wonder how much of that was due to his inability to get along with coaches and the instability it provided, how much of that was attributable to Kaepernick and Reid leaving, and how much of it is attributable to bad personnel/draft decisions outside of coaching attributable to him.


If it's a "coach centered" power structure as Khan asserts, then I wonder if Meyer will have the final say in draft decisions.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Honestly, not really. I think they are about the same.

O'brien was a decent coach, it's just that the coach should focus on coaching and someone whose expertise is evaluating prospects should be doing player selections.

Absolutely!

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I was willing to take a wait and see attitude with the Meyer hire, but so far the choices he has made have been abysmal. How are we supposed to be optimistic, when he is just holding onto hires from the old regime (Warhop and Baalke)?

Same here.

1 season, if we have the same results I'll probably quit. It seems like there is no hope as long as Khan in the owner.

If anyone but Khan isn't the owner, the Jags aren't in Jacksonville anymore. You should be thankful he is our owner.

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Same here.

1 season, if we have the same results I'll probably quit. It seems like there is no hope as long as Khan in the owner.

If anyone but Khan isn't the owner, the Jags aren't in Jacksonville anymore. You should be thankful he is our owner.

What's better, to have a franchise that is humiliated year after year with no hope in sight or have no franchise at all? To me, there's not much difference. It's a no win situation.

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Same here.

1 season, if we have the same results I'll probably quit. It seems like there is no hope as long as Khan in the owner.

If anyone but Khan isn't the owner, the Jags aren't in Jacksonville anymore. You should be thankful he is our owner.

You be thankful, I don't care, I am not in Jacksonville. I also won't be thankful because this team has been hot garbage since he became the owner.

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"Treyvon Wallet is elite run defender and better overall than Aidan Hutchinson" 11/11/23

O'brien was a decent coach, it's just that the coach should focus on coaching and someone whose expertise is evaluating prospects should be doing player selections.

Absolutely!

Unless you're Belichick or Andy Reid.

The Pete Carroll and Schneider situation seems like it might be similar to what Khan is cooking up here and that is working well too.  Carroll reportedly has big influence of personnel decisions there. 

We just don't know if Meyer is going to use his influence wisely or not.

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Absolutely!

Unless you're Belichick or Andy Reid.

The Pete Carroll and Schneider situation seems like it might be similar to what Khan is cooking up here and that is working well too.  Carroll reportedly has big influence of personnel decisions there. 

We just don't know if Meyer is going to use his influence wisely or not.

Belichik is a terrible, terrible drafter. He constantly whiffs. That team is built on free agents. I look for him to be fired in the next couple of years. Without Brady, he's nothing.

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Unless you're Belichick or Andy Reid.

The Pete Carroll and Schneider situation seems like it might be similar to what Khan is cooking up here and that is working well too.  Carroll reportedly has big influence of personnel decisions there. 

We just don't know if Meyer is going to use his influence wisely or not.

Belichik is a terrible, terrible drafter. He constantly whiffs. That team is built on free agents. I look for him to be fired in the next couple of years. Without Brady, he's nothing.

Belichick's terrible drafting + Tom Brady yielded 17 division championships, 13 appearances in the AFC championship and 9 trips to the SB. 

What is Meyer's (you really don't know how he'll draft or how much he'll decide the picks) + Trevor Lawrence going to yield.  

We just don't know.  We don't know what a Baalke/Meyer braintrust is going to do in FA and the draft. Assuming it's going to be bad because the HC is involved seems like a bit of a stretch to me.

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Belichik is a terrible, terrible drafter. He constantly whiffs. That team is built on free agents. I look for him to be fired in the next couple of years. Without Brady, he's nothing.

Belichick's terrible drafting + Tom Brady yielded 17 division championships, 13 appearances in the AFC championship and 9 trips to the SB. 

What is Meyer's (you really don't know how he'll draft or how much he'll decide the picks) + Trevor Lawrence going to yield.  

We just don't know.  We don't know what a Baalke/Meyer braintrust is going to do in FA and the draft. Assuming it's going to be bad because the HC is involved seems like a bit of a stretch to me.

No. I'm going off the inexperience of Meyer and the way Baalke ruined the Niners. I don't think it's a stretch to say this is a long shot for success.

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Belichick's terrible drafting + Tom Brady yielded 17 division championships, 13 appearances in the AFC championship and 9 trips to the SB. 

What is Meyer's (you really don't know how he'll draft or how much he'll decide the picks) + Trevor Lawrence going to yield.  

We just don't know.  We don't know what a Baalke/Meyer braintrust is going to do in FA and the draft. Assuming it's going to be bad because the HC is involved seems like a bit of a stretch to me.

No. I'm going off the inexperience of Meyer and the way Baalke ruined the Niners. I don't think it's a stretch to say this is a long shot for success.

Meyer might be inexperienced but that doesn't mean he doesn't know how to recruit and build a team in his vision. Why do you think he wants to improve the facilities? The more things he can use to entice players, the better.

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If anyone but Khan isn't the owner, the Jags aren't in Jacksonville anymore. You should be thankful he is our owner.

You be thankful, I don't care, I am not in Jacksonville. I also won't be thankful because this team has been hot garbage since he became the owner.

See, I care if the team stays in Jacksonville. It is my home town team. If they leave Jacksonville, I am done as a fan. I am probably done with the NFL for a while to be honest.

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Corn is what I feel... yes

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I feel bad for the browns…

(Emphasis added)

The interview this afternoon on 1010XL supports this viewpoint.  It seems the biggest question is whether he can actually have a functional working relationship with Meyer, considering he flamed out with FOUR (4) different 49ers head coaches.

Somehow I feel like that "Nobody will outwork this guy!" is a case of damned by faint praise.  It's one of those things that might technically be true, but isn't really praise.  "He's a great talent evaluator!" is good praise for a general manager.  "He knows how to get the best value for his picks."  "He's an amazing negotiator."  Those are actual skills that are worthy of praise.  "This guy works hard!" is almost like saying he has no other notable skills but they want to say something nice about him because it's polite.  I seem to recall people saying the same thing about a certain other GM who shall remain unnamed.  

But the very best GMs have their misses.

Jimmy Johnson  spent the first pick of the 2nd round in 1990 on Alexander Wright.

Bill Walsh drafted Larry Roberts.

Belichick missed on any number of WRs.

It concerns me that he takes a lot of chances on guys with torn ACLs.  THAT is more concerning that the mere presence of misses.

That happens with every GM from time to time.

My issue isn't that he has misses.  It's that he often has reaches, which include taking chances on guys with torn ACL's.  Sure, if they work out nobody will be complaining.  But Baalke seems like a guy who'd take Myles Jack in the first round.  (Though that wouldn't have even really been a reach.  Jack was often touted as a Top 10 player even with his torn ACL.  But we were pretty fortunate to have a GM who was patient enough to wait to pick Jack at a better time, when there was less risk).  

For all of Caldwell's faults, one of them wasn't that he didn't know how to get good value out of a draft pick.  Heck, he got a 6th rounder out of Gabbert!  Can't believe some sucker traded a 6th round pick for Blaine Gabbert.

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I was willing to take a wait and see attitude with the Meyer hire, but so far the choices he has made have been abysmal. How are we supposed to be optimistic, when he is just holding onto hires from the old regime (Warhop and Baalke)?

Same here.

1 season, if we have the same results I'll probably quit. It seems like there is no hope as long as Khan in the owner.

It's interesting to be on the other side of the Doom and Gloom club.  I have been saying for years how inept our front office is and calling Khan out for conning us.

Meyer is the Real GM here. Balke will handle the contracts but Meyer is going to pick his players.  I am going to wait and see before I hit the old "same old jags" slogan.  I am willing to give Meyer a shot.

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For the slow people on the board...


Balke's draft record means squat. Meyer will be the one pulling the strings.

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(Emphasis added)

The interview this afternoon on 1010XL supports this viewpoint.  It seems the biggest question is whether he can actually have a functional working relationship with Meyer, considering he flamed out with FOUR (4) different 49ers head coaches.

Somehow I feel like that "Nobody will outwork this guy!" is a case of damned by faint praise.  It's one of those things that might technically be true, but isn't really praise.  "He's a great talent evaluator!" is good praise for a general manager.  "He knows how to get the best value for his picks."  "He's an amazing negotiator."  Those are actual skills that are worthy of praise.  "This guy works hard!" is almost like saying he has no other notable skills but they want to say something nice about him because it's polite.  I seem to recall people saying the same thing about a certain other GM who shall remain unnamed.  

But the very best GMs have their misses.

Jimmy Johnson  spent the first pick of the 2nd round in 1990 on Alexander Wright.

Bill Walsh drafted Larry Roberts.

Belichick missed on any number of WRs.

It concerns me that he takes a lot of chances on guys with torn ACLs.  THAT is more concerning that the mere presence of misses.

That happens with every GM from time to time.

My issue isn't that he has misses.  It's that he often has reaches, which include taking chances on guys with torn ACL's.  Sure, if they work out nobody will be complaining.  But Baalke seems like a guy who'd take Myles Jack in the first round.  (Though that wouldn't have even really been a reach.  Jack was often touted as a Top 10 player even with his torn ACL.  But we were pretty fortunate to have a GM who was patient enough to wait to pick Jack at a better time, when there was less risk).  

For all of Caldwell's faults, one of them wasn't that he didn't know how to get good value out of a draft pick.  Heck, he got a 6th rounder out of Gabbert!  Can't believe some sucker traded a 6th round pick for Blaine Gabbert.

And you know who that sucker was? None other than our very own Trent Baalke... Yup that's right, he was the GM of the 49ers in 2014 when he/they traded that 6th rounder for Gabbert. 

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