Let me give advance notice that there will be some QB talk in this thread, but I will not just talk QBs.  If you are weary of the QB talk and are inclined to roll your eyes at the thought, you may wish to seek another thread...or at least go down beyond point 2.  Having dispensed with the topic warning, here are some of my thoughts on the midpoint of preseason.


1.  More than any time that I can recall, I have been spectacularly wrong about the QB position here.  I'm talking Wile-e-coyote ACME bomb face explosion disastrously wrong.  I post a thread talking about Ryan Mallet throwing 5 INTs in practice and talk about how fortunate we are that Bortles hasn't done that.  The next day-the first padded practice-boom-he throws five picks!  After the New England preseason game, I urge people to not overreact to Henne and Bortles...then BOOM-Bortles slips back into open competition with Henne seemingly having all of the momentum.  I feel as though somehow I have jinxed Bortles.  Right now, my urge is to talk about his Jaguars career in the past tense.  I'm far from a QB mechanics guy, but I don't think his mechanics exclusively did him in.  I am wondering if his failure here is psychological in nature.  He does not look like the same guy we saw the first two years.  The 2015 Bortles easily hits Allen Robinson.  Last year and camp this year, he looks like he is pressing instead of just playing.  His misses on Robinson vs the Bucs last week mirror many of the misses last year.  I'm not sure if he recovers in time to reclaim the starting job, and with his $19 million salary next year, I'm not sure how the Jaguars can keep that salary on the bench.  Perhaps a fresh start is in order for him.

2.    Bortles training camp fall creates quite the conundrum.  What does the team do to address the QB position, short and long term?  Barring a career year from Henne, if we keep the current three QBs on the roster, it seems we will waste a year of a roster that most observers think is talented.  I think we possibly get a similar result if we sign one of the free agent QBs currently on the market, because minimally, it will take 3 weeks or so for them to get comfortable with the offense, with no guarantee they will perform any better than the incumbents we have on the roster.  Some have urged we try to trade for a QB.  As tempting as that would be, I think patience and restraint would be in the best long term interests of this team.  I cringe typing this.  I am weary of urging patience in the midst of nine straight losing seasons and counting.  Like all of you, I want to win now.  But despite that, I urge patience because there will be a buyer's market for QBs next year-or at least as close to one as you can find in the NFL.  If the current speculative evaluations hold, there will be several QBs carrying first round grades next year:  Darnold, Rosen, Allen, Mayfield, the kid from Washington State, and maybe Jackson.  There seem to be some other decent prospects too.  On top of that, there are several situations where teams will have to fish or cut bait at the position where they have quality depth and impending free agents.  Let's start in Kansas City, where the Chiefs traded next year's first round pick to Buffalo for Mahomes, and they currently have Alex Smith under contract.  Smith is n his thirties, so it doesn't make much sense to trade for him, especially when they are going to want Mahomes to play.  Detroit has managed to get to the point where Matthew Stafford is playing in a contract year.  Will they franchise him?  Probably.  But he will be thirty by next year.    Buffalo presents another opportunity.  Tyrod Taylor is the current starter, but they drafted Nathan Peterman this year and I've heard they've been pleased with him.  However, given all of the picks they have accumulated (two picks in each of the first three rounds), you have to think they are positioning themselves to be able to take one of the QBs in next year's draft.  Taylor or Peterman or possibly both may be available next offseason. In Cincinnati, you've got starter Andy Dalton, who will be 30 this October and backup A.J. McCarron, who is slated to be a free agent in 2018.  Dalton has not won a playoff game through his entire tenure there, and is coming off his first losing season with the Bengals.  Given the state of their O-Line, turning it around may not be in the cards for them this year.  Perhaps Marvin Lewis leaves in that scenario, and perhaps a new coach brings in his own QB.  On the other hand, the Jaguars reportedly offered a 2nd round pick to Cincinnati for McCarron and was turned down.  There is no way the Bengals pay for both of those QBs beyond this year if there is, indeed, interest in McCarron.  One or the other will be let go or dealt.  Finally, Cousins is still in Washington without a long term deal.  If the Skins' season goes south, might they let him go and go for a rookie?   I think if we wait it out, we will have more options at QB and will be less likely to overpay via trade.  The only problem is getting through this season.  Ugh!

3.  Lost in the QB talk-and the talk of his misdemeanor charges-is Dante Fowler.  Last year, the padded practices against the Bucs effectively took the air out of his balloon.  This year against the same team, he actually got pressure on their QB and forced a fumble.  It wasn't on a stunt, either.  He beat his man around the edge and hit the QB.  FWIW, Lageman and Boselli have said Fowler has had a good camp.  Does that mean he becomes the most unblockable pass rushing force the league has seen since LT in his prime?  No, but progress from him would be welcome.

4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

5.  It will be nice to see Ramsey play tomorrow night, but I don't want to see too much of him. Save him for opening day and Hopkins.

6.  Rookie Watch

• Leonard Fournette-doing fine thus far  
  
• Cam Robinson-had his moments thus far.  Will wait and see
  
• Dawaune Smoot-I think most would characterize him as a disappointment
  
• Dede Westbrook-WOW!  It is evident why TC and Co. took a chance on him in the 4th round.
  
• Blair Brown-decent thus far
  
• Marquez Williams-has played well after starting camp on PUP.  Nice block on the Grant run v. New England.  I'm betting he is the starting FB opening day
  
• Jalen Myrick-looking like a practice squad guy.
  
• Keelan Cole-Wow!  Can't see how he doesn't make the team.
  

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

There are a lot of kicker competitions being played out right now in the NFL. Even though we didn't bring another kicker in, doesn't mean our opening day kicker is on our team right now.  I think right now we're scouting from afar.

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4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

There are a lot of kicker competitions being played out right now in the NFL. Even though we didn't bring another kicker in, doesn't mean our opening day kicker is on our team right now.  I think right now we're scouting from afar.

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I've no doubt we will scour the waiver wire in the next couple of weeks to get a kicker.  But I am disappointed in the guy we have now.  His first year was a disaster.  Last year he showed improvement.  He has regressed.  Ugh.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

There are a lot of kicker competitions being played out right now in the NFL. Even though we didn't bring another kicker in, doesn't mean our opening day kicker is on our team right now.  I think right now we're scouting from afar.

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The great Dave Caldwell is always on top of his roster , always preparing and thinking ahead - never waiting until it's too late

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4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

There are a lot of kicker competitions being played out right now in the NFL. Even though we didn't bring another kicker in, doesn't mean our opening day kicker is on our team right now.  I think right now we're scouting from afar.

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Bucs didn't waste time and I applaud them for that.

Aguayo sucked and they cut him. Jags need to do the same.

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There are a lot of kicker competitions being played out right now in the NFL. Even though we didn't bring another kicker in, doesn't mean our opening day kicker is on our team right now.  I think right now we're scouting from afar.

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I've no doubt we will scour the waiver wire in the next couple of weeks to get a kicker.  But I am disappointed in the guy we have now.  His first year was a disaster.  Last year he showed improvement.  He has regressed.  Ugh.

Maybe he's using the same sports psychologist as Blake?

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Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

There are a lot of kicker competitions being played out right now in the NFL. Even though we didn't bring another kicker in, doesn't mean our opening day kicker is on our team right now.  I think right now we're scouting from afar.

.

The great Dave Caldwell is always on top of his roster , always preparing and thinking ahead - never waiting until it's too late

It's a good thing he's not the guy making the personnel decisions any more.

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Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

I think it is safe to say, we are the BEST team in the league.

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The big takeaway so far from this offseason is that the front office is still making questionable decisions at critical spots even with Tom here. Granted he deserves some time to settle in but this team is still realistically a good deal away from competing in any serious level.

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3.  Lost in the QB talk-and the talk of his misdemeanor charges-is Dante Fowler.  Last year, the padded practices against the Bucs effectively took the air out of his balloon.  This year against the same team, he actually got pressure on their QB and forced a fumble.  It wasn't on a stunt, either.  He beat his man around the edge and hit the QB.  FWIW, Lageman and Boselli have said Fowler has had a good camp.  Does that mean he becomes the most unblockable pass rushing force the league has seen since LT in his prime?  No, but progress from him would be welcome.

4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

5.  It will be nice to see Ramsey play tomorrow night, but I don't want to see too much of him. Save him for opening day and Hopkins.

6.  Rookie Watch

• Leonard Fournette-doing fine thus far  
  
• Cam Robinson-had his moments thus far.  Will wait and see
  
• Dawaune Smoot-I think most would characterize him as a disappointment
  
• Dede Westbrook-WOW!  It is evident why TC and Co. took a chance on him in the 4th round.
  
• Blair Brown-decent thus far
  
• Marquez Williams-has played well after starting camp on PUP.  Nice block on the Grant run v. New England.  I'm betting he is the starting FB opening day
  
• Jalen Myrick-looking like a practice squad guy.
  
• Keelan Cole-Wow!  Can't see how he doesn't make the team.
  

The Fowler situation is a frustrating one, but with a little bit of hope.  He has had a good camp.  Demar Dotson owned him last year in training camp.  His comments after the two went head-to-head this year confirmed what Boselli and Lageman have been saying.  He's much improved.  Let's hope the misdemeanor charges don't derail him from finally starting to show us something.

The team has been bringing in kickers this week, and I would imagine that will continue until they can find a guy who can be a lot more consistent than Meyers.  I know our kicker has a huge leg, but something has happened this off season with him.  Like Bortles, it looks like the kid has a bad case of the yips.  Maybe knowing they're actively looking for his replacement will light a fire underneath him to get his mental game under control.  We all know he can kick for distance.  We'd like to think he could do so on target.

Agree on Ramsey.  Let him get enough reps to get his legs and to get the cobwebs shaken off, and then put the bubble wrap on him until opening day.

I'd like to see Cole take a couple of reps with the first team to see what he can do against a first team defense.  The kid is fun to watch.  Same thing with Westbrook.  Let them have some reps with the guys they'd be lining up against on Sunday to see what we have here.

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Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

The big takeaway so far from this offseason is that the front office is still making questionable decisions at critical spots even with Tom here. Granted he deserves some time to settle in but this team is still realistically a good deal away from competing in any serious level.

I somewhat disagree.  I think this team is a decent QB away from being a competitive roster.  The defense is going to be good.  I suspect the offensive line will get better.  We should have a stout running game and a good group of receivers, so it all comes down to the same thing we've been saying for years now.  The arm of the QB will determine what this team does this season.

If the QB struggles continue, Tom will have a top 5 draft pick to find a solution.  Hopefully this turmoil at the QB position wakes one of the guys competing for the starting gig up and we can get even marginal play from one of them.  I think that should be enough to allow this team to make significant strides.  Unfortunately, I'm not sure that's going to happen.

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Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Can someone summarize the OP?

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If you think I offended you, don't worry, I meant to. #facts 
  
#iamlegend

The big takeaway so far from this offseason is that the front office is still making questionable decisions at critical spots even with Tom here. Granted he deserves some time to settle in but this team is still realistically a good deal away from competing in any serious level.

I somewhat disagree.  I think this team is a decent QB away from being a competitive roster.  The defense is going to be good.  I suspect the offensive line will get better.  We should have a stout running game and a good group of receivers, so it all comes down to the same thing we've been saying for years now.  The arm of the QB will determine what this team does this season.

If the QB struggles continue, Tom will have a top 5 draft pick to find a solution.  Hopefully this turmoil at the QB position wakes one of the guys competing for the starting gig up and we can get even marginal play from one of them.  I think that should be enough to allow this team to make significant strides.  Unfortunately, I'm not sure that's going to happen.

Yep the QB (and Oline) is what's keeping us from competing right now. 

This season isn't going to be a season we seriously complete for anything with Bortles, Henne or Allen at the helm. In 2018 I'd imagine we draft a QB pretty high, then we either play him his rookie year and go through the growing pains or have a journey man type QB to start instead while he learns the ropes, that's 2018 likely not competing. Then finally in 2019 we should finally be competing for something with a decent QB. 

8 years after Caldwell began his rebuild. (Although he'll be gone this offseason)

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There are a lot of kicker competitions being played out right now in the NFL. Even though we didn't bring another kicker in, doesn't mean our opening day kicker is on our team right now.  I think right now we're scouting from afar.

.

Bucs didn't waste time and I applaud them for that.

Aguayo sucked and they cut him. Jags need to do the same.

What makes it bad is that our guy has a strong leg, and he had a decent year last year.  On some level, he's capable of being good.  But somehow he is spectacularly inconsistent.

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The big takeaway so far from this offseason is that the front office is still making questionable decisions at critical spots even with Tom here. Granted he deserves some time to settle in but this team is still realistically a good deal away from competing in any serious level.

I'm not sure I'd go quite that far.

Right now, if we got above average QB play, we'd easily be a .500 team with our roster as it stands.

Our defense is pretty good on every level.  I'd say very good in the secondary.

Offensively, we have good skill positions and are insanely deep at WR.

It remains to be seen whether Cam Robinson has solidified LT, but LG in particular seems problematic, and right now I anticipate Watt lining up on our LG often in week one.

But uncertainty at QB is hindering this team.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Finally, Cousins is still in Washington without a long term deal.  If the Skins' season goes south, might they let him go and go for a rookie?  ...

4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

Somehow landing Cousins would be ideal.

I have to think they'll bring in competition as kickers gets waived during the cut-downs. There are some intense kicking competitions going on right now throughout the league.

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'02

3.  Lost in the QB talk-and the talk of his misdemeanor charges-is Dante Fowler.  Last year, the padded practices against the Bucs effectively took the air out of his balloon.  This year against the same team, he actually got pressure on their QB and forced a fumble.  It wasn't on a stunt, either.  He beat his man around the edge and hit the QB.  FWIW, Lageman and Boselli have said Fowler has had a good camp.  Does that mean he becomes the most unblockable pass rushing force the league has seen since LT in his prime?  No, but progress from him would be welcome.

4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

5.  It will be nice to see Ramsey play tomorrow night, but I don't want to see too much of him. Save him for opening day and Hopkins.

6.  Rookie Watch

• Leonard Fournette-doing fine thus far  
  
• Cam Robinson-had his moments thus far.  Will wait and see
  
• Dawaune Smoot-I think most would characterize him as a disappointment
  
• Dede Westbrook-WOW!  It is evident why TC and Co. took a chance on him in the 4th round.
  
• Blair Brown-decent thus far
  
• Marquez Williams-has played well after starting camp on PUP.  Nice block on the Grant run v. New England.  I'm betting he is the starting FB opening day
  
• Jalen Myrick-looking like a practice squad guy.
  
• Keelan Cole-Wow!  Can't see how he doesn't make the team.
  

The Fowler situation is a frustrating one, but with a little bit of hope.  He has had a good camp.  Demar Dotson owned him last year in training camp.  His comments after the two went head-to-head this year confirmed what Boselli and Lageman have been saying.  He's much improved.  Let's hope the misdemeanor charges don't derail him from finally starting to show us something.

The team has been bringing in kickers this week, and I would imagine that will continue until they can find a guy who can be a lot more consistent than Meyers.  I know our kicker has a huge leg, but something has happened this off season with him.  Like Bortles, it looks like the kid has a bad case of the yips.  Maybe knowing they're actively looking for his replacement will light a fire underneath him to get his mental game under control.  We all know he can kick for distance.  We'd like to think he could do so on target.

Agree on Ramsey.  Let him get enough reps to get his legs and to get the cobwebs shaken off, and then put the bubble wrap on him until opening day.

I'd like to see Cole take a couple of reps with the first team to see what he can do against a first team defense.  The kid is fun to watch.  Same thing with Westbrook.  Let them have some reps with the guys they'd be lining up against on Sunday to see what we have here.

On Fowler, if he could get us 8 sacks this year, I would feel confident about his long term future-assuming he can stay out of trouble.  But whether the improvement that allowed him to get a forced fumble and hit against Tampa this year is indicative of an array of pass rush moves that can get him 8 sacks is the issue.

His strong leg makes his inconsistency all the more frustrating.  I'm still ticked we didn't sweep the Colts a couple of years back because of his misses.

As fore Westbrook and Cole, I have no doubt they have the burst and explosiveness to succeed against first team defenses.  To me, I wonder can they get off the jam at the LOS and how's their route running (more Cole than Westbrook).  But I have faith in Keenan to be able to develop those guys.

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Finally, Cousins is still in Washington without a long term deal.  If the Skins' season goes south, might they let him go and go for a rookie?  ...

4.  Why in the wide world of sports can we not find a kicker?  That is the one blemish in an otherwise nice improvement in special teams play.

Somehow landing Cousins would be ideal.

I have to think they'll bring in competition as kickers gets waived during the cut-downs. There are some intense kicking competitions going on right now throughout the league.

I'm shocked the Skins haven't locked this guy up long term.  If he hits the market, I sign him and don't look back.  He's experienced, productive, and still in his prime.

I have little doubt they will bring guys in.  I am surprised that they didn't bring in any competition knowing how inconsistent he was his first year.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

My main thought two weeks into the preseason is "how in the world did we end up in position for a coach to start thinking Henne is an actual option to start again?"

I wasn't as outraged at Bortles' week two performance as some here, but he looks like he's lost something along the way during his time in the NFL. Ideally he would be at least functional as he was at the end of least season. If Henne is starting games for this team I foresee a lot of fans heading for the exit at half-time this season.

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Bucs didn't waste time and I applaud them for that.

Aguayo sucked and they cut him. Jags need to do the same.

What makes it bad is that our guy has a strong leg, and he had a decent year last year.  On some level, he's capable of being good.  But somehow he is spectacularly inconsistent.

---

The big takeaway so far from this offseason is that the front office is still making questionable decisions at critical spots even with Tom here. Granted he deserves some time to settle in but this team is still realistically a good deal away from competing in any serious level.

I'm not sure I'd go quite that far.

Right now, if we got above average QB play, we'd easily be a .500 team with our roster as it stands.

Our defense is pretty good on every level.  I'd say very good in the secondary.

Offensively, we have good skill positions and are insanely deep at WR.

It remains to be seen whether Cam Robinson has solidified LT, but LG in particular seems problematic, and right now I anticipate Watt lining up on our LG often in week one.

But uncertainty at QB is hindering this team.

Right and at the moment we are a long way away from having above average QB play. Even if we draft a guy early in 2018 we can't depend on a rookie to lead us to the playoffs from the get go.  

Letting the QB spot get to this message is an odd way to win now and could have been avoiding with proper planning.

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If we could sign Cousins next year and draft a rookie I think that would be an ideal scenario.

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I keep thinking that once Brandon Allen finally does get his start, he's going to keep it and never look back. 

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'02