Lol, what a straw man argument, Lions?! Lol.


A Lion is a wild animal. Dogs, yes even pit bulls are domesticated animals. I'm not even going to entertain that argument.

And no, you don't "have to train a pit bull not to kill". You simply have to be a responsible owner that understands the needs of the breed.

A straw man argument? How about the actions of one single pit bull out of four million as a strawman argument? My point wasn't to compare lions to pit bulls, it was to show that one incident does not prove anything.

Pit bulls are "domesticated. " They have also been bred for over a hundred years for dogfighting. If merely 1% of the existing pit bulls are capable of killing that's still 40,000 dogs that could kill a child. And unlike wild animals, dogs have no fear of humans.

According to this article 51% of dog bites are from pit bulls. More than half. Do pit bulls make up anywhere close to half the dogs in the USA?

Are pit bulls dangerous?

And 71% of fatalities. They kill, not just bite:

From 2005 to 2017, pit bulls killed 284 Americans, about one citizen every 17 days.

This article has the active link

As far as "the needs of the breed" what does that mean? The need to train them not to kill? If they require significantly different training than other breeds, that points to a problem in the breed itself.

I've seen several pit bulls in my time at the dog park or owned by friends. The dogs were all very nice and friendly to me. But that doesn't change the statistics.

I'm not suggesting that they be exterminated. Sadly, a million pit pulls a year are euthanized, and I'm sure being dumped at the pound when the owner loses control has a lot to do with that. What I would suggest is that people be required to pass a strict test in order to be able to breed them, and that the designated breeders emphasize docility to get the breed in line with other breeds in that regard.

YAY for half told stats.... They're meaningless in the big picture, like most stats, they're always spun. We've already been over this...

Big dogs do more damage when they bite, which is why their attacks are reported and why it's always big dog breeds label as the most aggressive (every dog on the list of your first link is a large breed of dog and hmm I wonder why)..... Because when they do attack, they typically require a hospital visit for stitches etc. Again, aka reported.

Small dogs bite people far more often, but do very little damage, which doesn't require hospital visits because all it does is break the skin. Aka not reported.

Things like this heavily skew your stats and puts a bad rep on big dog breeds.

I've come across at least 5x the amount of mean little aggressive, biting Chihuahuas in my life, than I have any kind of big dog breed. This includes countless Pits and Rotts.

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A straw man argument? How about the actions of one single pit bull out of four million as a strawman argument? My point wasn't to compare lions to pit bulls, it was to show that one incident does not prove anything.

Pit bulls are "domesticated. " They have also been bred for over a hundred years for dogfighting. If merely 1% of the existing pit bulls are capable of killing that's still 40,000 dogs that could kill a child. And unlike wild animals, dogs have no fear of humans.

According to this article 51% of dog bites are from pit bulls. More than half. Do pit bulls make up anywhere close to half the dogs in the USA?

Are pit bulls dangerous?

And 71% of fatalities. They kill, not just bite:


This article has the active link

As far as "the needs of the breed" what does that mean? The need to train them not to kill? If they require significantly different training than other breeds, that points to a problem in the breed itself.

I've seen several pit bulls in my time at the dog park or owned by friends. The dogs were all very nice and friendly to me. But that doesn't change the statistics.

I'm not suggesting that they be exterminated. Sadly, a million pit pulls a year are euthanized, and I'm sure being dumped at the pound when the owner loses control has a lot to do with that. What I would suggest is that people be required to pass a strict test in order to be able to breed them, and that the designated breeders emphasize docility to get the breed in line with other breeds in that regard.

YAY for half told stats.... They're meaningless in the big picture, like most stats, they're always spun. We've already been over this...

Big dogs do more damage when they bite, which is why their attacks are reported and why it's always big dog breeds label as the most aggressive (every dog on the list of your first link is a large breed of dog and hmm I wonder why)..... Because when they do attack, they typically require a hospital visit for stitches etc. Again, aka reported.

Small dogs bite people far more often, but do very little damage, which doesn't require hospital visits because all it does is break the skin. Aka not reported.

Things like this heavily skew your stats and puts a bad rep on big dog breeds.

I've come across at least 5x the amount of mean little aggressive, biting Chihuahuas in my life, than I have any kind of big dog breed. This includes countless Pits and Rotts.

This is all true, but death is death, and it's not the same as barking or even biting. Chihuahua attacks aren't a problem because they aren't a problem.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

YAY for half told stats.... They're meaningless in the big picture, like most stats, they're always spun. We've already been over this...

Big dogs do more damage when they bite, which is why their attacks are reported and why it's always big dog breeds label as the most aggressive (every dog on the list of your first link is a large breed of dog and hmm I wonder why)..... Because when they do attack, they typically require a hospital visit for stitches etc. Again, aka reported.

Small dogs bite people far more often, but do very little damage, which doesn't require hospital visits because all it does is break the skin. Aka not reported.

Things like this heavily skew your stats and puts a bad rep on big dog breeds.

I've come across at least 5x the amount of mean little aggressive, biting Chihuahuas in my life, than I have any kind of big dog breed. This includes countless Pits and Rotts.

This is all true, but death is death, and it's not the same as barking or even biting. Chihuahua attacks aren't a problem because they aren't a problem.

I get that pit owners love thier dogs, and it isnt fair that many dogs get a bad rep for the action of what is admittedly only a few hundred out of probably hundreds of thousands. But other dogs just can't do the same kind of damage as easily as a pitbull. Pitbulls owners need to be the most cautious and best trained owners but some people are just not. They want the dog for its image/looks (some are beautiful), but arent asking themselves if they can be the kind of owner a pitbulls needs.

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Yes, it's improvement, but it's Blaine Gabbert 2012 level improvement. - Pirkster

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http://youtu.be/XQRFkn0Ly3A Media on the Brain Link!
 

Peyton must store oxygen in that forehead of his. No way I'd still be alive after all that choking.

 

By nature, Pit Bulls (which technically isn't even a real breed) are actually less aggressive than Dalmations and about 7 other breeds https://pethelpful.com/dogs/10-Most-Aggr...nformation
And yeah Pit Bulls are notoriously raised to be fighting dogs... so they are probably treated more poorly and raised incorrectly (and also inbred the most) than any other  breed

In your link, a mauling from a pit bull is recorded as one incident, the same as a chihuahua barking at a stranger. 

Dog aggression is defined as dangerous behavior directed at another individual, including other animals. This behavior includes barking, biting, lunging, snarling, etc. 

While barking, lunging, and snarling are disturbing traits in dogs, they don't send people to the hospital, and one bite is not the same as a mauling. From HandsomeRob86's links, Pit Bulls (and we know what they are even if they aren't considered a real breed by the AKC) were responsible for 100% of the deaths in the study. Death is a lot worse than being barked at.

BTW, have you been to a dog shelter lately? The last time I went almost every dog there was a pit bull. Maybe that's because they're overbred, or because people don't want to adopt them. But it also could be because they are the breed most likely to threaten their former owners. Probably it's a combination of all three.


 

I get it.. you hate pit bulls for no good reason.

Dog aggression is what stems violence.
But how you raise the animal matters more.
I could raise 100 pit bulls that would never bite or attack anyone, much less cause death.
But another person could raise a Dalmation in the same manner and it would actually be more likely to attack.

The main problem with "pit bulls" is breeding which you allude to. Overbreeding and inbreeding.

My main point is... the problem is with people, not the dog/breed.

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In your link, a mauling from a pit bull is recorded as one incident, the same as a chihuahua barking at a stranger. 


While barking, lunging, and snarling are disturbing traits in dogs, they don't send people to the hospital, and one bite is not the same as a mauling. From HandsomeRob86's links, Pit Bulls (and we know what they are even if they aren't considered a real breed by the AKC) were responsible for 100% of the deaths in the study. Death is a lot worse than being barked at.

BTW, have you been to a dog shelter lately? The last time I went almost every dog there was a pit bull. Maybe that's because they're overbred, or because people don't want to adopt them. But it also could be because they are the breed most likely to threaten their former owners. Probably it's a combination of all three.


 

I get it.. you hate pit bulls for no good reason.

Dog aggression is what stems violence.
But how you raise the animal matters more.
I could raise 100 pit bulls that would never bite or attack anyone, much less cause death.
But another person could raise a Dalmation in the same manner and it would actually be more likely to attack.

The main problem with "pit bulls" is breeding which you allude to. Overbreeding and inbreeding.

My main point is... the problem is with people, not the dog/breed.

Yeah. Only 71% of people killed by dogs are killed by pit bulls. No good reason there. And I don't hate pit bulls. I just think the breed needs to be heavily regulated.

If you could raise 100 pit bulls that would never bite or attack anyone, then you are not the problem. If you raised 100% of the pit bulls in the USA we wouldn't be having this argument. But, except for a few places in the US, anyone can own a pit bull, not just you.

I once believed the same as you, that the problem was 100% with the owners. But the actual statistics and years of seeing no improvement convinced me otherwise. On average the people who raise other breeds are no more capable of correctly raising a dog than the average pit bull owner is. But somehow pit bulls end up responsible for 71% of killings? Just a coincidence? If pit bulls need special training (as you imply) it is not a fact in the breed's favor.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

I get it.. you hate pit bulls for no good reason.

Dog aggression is what stems violence.
But how you raise the animal matters more.
I could raise 100 pit bulls that would never bite or attack anyone, much less cause death.
But another person could raise a Dalmation in the same manner and it would actually be more likely to attack.

The main problem with "pit bulls" is breeding which you allude to. Overbreeding and inbreeding.

My main point is... the problem is with people, not the dog/breed.

Yeah. Only 71% of people killed by dogs are killed by pit bulls. No good reason there. And I don't hate pit bulls. I just think the breed needs to be heavily regulated.

If you could raise 100 pit bulls that would never bite or attack anyone, then you are not the problem. If you raised 100% of the pit bulls in the USA we wouldn't be having this argument. But, except for a few places in the US, anyone can own a pit bull, not just you.

I once believed the same as you, that the problem was 100% with the owners. But the actual statistics and years of seeing no improvement convinced me otherwise. On average the people who raise other breeds are no more capable of correctly raising a dog than the average pit bull owner is. But somehow pit bulls end up responsible for 71% of killings? Just a coincidence? If pit bulls need special training (as you imply) it is not a fact in the breed's favor.

Dude... you've said it yourself.. Over the years it hasn't improved. Dog breeds are supposed to magically get better even when inbred?
The problem is always humans. We screw up everything. I get that "pit bulls" are a large number of dog killings. I'm not disputing those numbers. I'm just saying the breed isn't the issue. Its the breeding and raising.
Look... here in Pensacola I see pits in every neighborhood I drive through. MANY of them are chained up in small yards. Many more or bred with their brothers and sisters because there is a racket in selling pit bull pups.
But I also personally know a few people that have had pit bulls and they were the nicest, kindest, most well behaved dogs ever. More so than many of these Chihuahua I see with these old ladies. Sure... a chihuahua is never going to kill someone from biting them... and I'm not arguing against the dangers of pit bulls and other large dog breeds (Rots and dobermans probably make up the other 30% of dog killings) but the fact remains that if you get a pure breed pit and raise it correctly, it is less likely to attack than other breeds of dog. 
Those are facts....
Why is the number of dog attack deaths so much higher for pit bulls? Because that "breed" in particular is one of the most inbred (which causes mental issues with dogs) and most mistreated (used for fighting I guess because of the lock jaw thing...)

FTR... I'm actually not a big "domestication of animals" guy. Chihuahuas, pits, cats... I think it's kind of a selfish thing us humans do for entertainment and companionship.
I refuse to blame animals for stupid humans.
It's like blaming cars for pollution. (It isn't the cars fault we built them that way)

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I hate dogs only because the dogs I'm around now are complete useless pieces of crap because of the way they were raised by their owners, who think they're doing an AMAZING job at it.

So yea, it's all because of the owners. But I never want a dog now.

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I’ve owned a handful of pits in my life. All good dogs that never hurt or were aggressive towards anyone.
My mother has a Jack Russell who bit my 1 year old son who wasn’t even messing with him. Was just there. Lets ban Jack Russells too.

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