It's being reported that the Jags are exploring a trade for Hayden Hurst.

Depending on the compensation, I wouldn't hate this. Jags need to upgrade the TE room immediately and rookies rarely make an impact. They need a vet.

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4th this year and a 5th next?

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Jesus. So what the hell is our secondary going to look like this year? I already don't like this. Do they keep Bouye as well in this scenario?

That means you're looking at Okudah, Diggs or Henderson now in the draft. Which just sucks. You're just back filling your mistakes now instead of getting ahead and building around the offense.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Jesus. So what the hell is our secondary going to look like this year? I already don't like this. Do they keep Bouye as well in this scenario?

That means you're looking at Okudah, Diggs or Henderson now in the draft. Which just sucks. You're just back filling your mistakes now instead of getting ahead and building around the offense.

The good news is that our run defense sucks so bad that opponents won't need to throw the ball against us.

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Jesus. So what the hell is our secondary going to look like this year? I already don't like this. Do they keep Bouye as well in this scenario?

That means you're looking at Okudah, Diggs or Henderson now in the draft. Which just sucks. You're just back filling your mistakes now instead of getting ahead and building around the offense.

The good news is that our run defense sucks so bad that opponents won't need to throw the ball against us.

The bad news is. My reading comprehension skills suck. I was thinking of our CB Hayden. LOL. FAIL!!!!

I still don't like this. He'll be 27 already by the time the regular season starts. And he hasn't shown much.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

As long as it’s a day three pick, a player were going to cut anyway, or maybe a swap from 20 to 28 in the first round I’d be okay with it.

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As long as it’s a day three pick, a player were going to cut anyway, or maybe a swap from 20 to 28 in the first round I’d be okay with it.

I disagree. You invested in Josh Oliver with the 69th overall selection in last year's draft. You signed James O'Shaughnessy to a two year deal last year. Giving up any draft capital for a guy that hasn't shown he can create enough separation at this level is too risky. Especially with a class of TE's that actually fit that need that we're looking for. 

We don't need another "in-line" player at the TE position. Hurst is built like that. He's not a mover. I would rather save any pick at this point and go after one of these "move" type TE's. Between Harrison Bryant, Adam Trautman & Hunter Bryant you would more than likely get more value. Especially in Gruden's offense.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

For no more than a 7th rounder sure.

Lamar would thrive in 2 TE sets, so it's really not a good sign they are willing to trade him.

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For no more than a 7th rounder sure.

Lamar would thrive in 2 TE sets, so it's really not a good sign they are willing to trade him.

They'll flip him to us or some other dumb [BLEEP] team and they'll turn that pick right back around into another Mark Andrews type TE for their offense. They'll probably target a guy like Adam Trautman or Harrison Bryant. Wouldn't surprise me one bit.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

I don’t mind this, as long as the cost isn’t silly. I think he was unlucky at Baltimore.

If he’d not picked up an injury at the start of his rookie season, he would probably have been their number one TE, instead of Mark Andrews. Instead, Andrews took his chance and Hurst was never able to overtake him in the depth chart.

And if it means that’s one position we don’t have to fill in the draft, then it should help us focus on other areas.

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Mark Andrews was a lot more polished and ready to go for the NFL over Hayden Hurst. I don't know how that was overlooked. I guess the age difference or the QB play from each team played a role. He was a much more viable red zone target coming out of college though. Hurst was nowhere near as good in the receiving game. Maybe it was that whole SEC bias Vs. Big 12 conference.

Thankful we didn't draft him though. And if they trade for him it'll just be a waste of a pick. They need a move TE. Not another blocky [BLEEP] that can't get open and make plays downfield. Harrison Bryant, Hunter Bryant & Adam Trautman need to be targeted by this team. IMHO, if they trade for Hurst you're just getting another James O'Shaughnessy. And what does that say about your 69th overall investment you just made last year in Josh Oliver?

Did they mail it in with him already? Or does this team play on running a bunch of twin and trio TE sets? Makes no sense at this time. . .

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Mark Andrews was a lot more polished and ready to go for the NFL over Hayden Hurst. I don't know how that was overlooked. I guess the age difference or the QB play from each team played a role. He was a much more viable red zone target coming out of college though. Hurst was nowhere near as good in the receiving game. Maybe it was that whole SEC bias Vs. Big 12 conference.

Thankful we didn't draft him though. And if they trade for him it'll just be a waste of a pick. They need a move TE. Not another blocky [BLEEP] that can't get open and make plays downfield. Harrison Bryant, Hunter Bryant & Adam Trautman need to be targeted by this team. IMHO, if they trade for Hurst you're just getting another James O'Shaughnessy. And what does that say about your 69th overall investment you just made last year in Josh Oliver?

Did they mail it in with him already? Or does this team play on running a bunch of twin and trio TE sets? Makes no sense at this time. . .

Adding talent to the position group makes sense regardless of how the f.o. and staff view Oliver. 

The Jags are coming off a year that saw multiple tight ends on IR and multiple guys signed off that street playing high snap counts. I can see why they aren't sitting on their hands about the TE room.  They simply want to prevent a repeat of 2019's  TE scenario.  

Gruden uses the TE differently than DeFilippo attempted to, so we don't really know what "type" he and the F.O. are after right now -  and they likely see Oliver as their primary "move" TE. As they should, IMO. 
One thing he does like to do sometimes that Defilippo also did is to utilize a TE as a lead blocker instead of a FB.
Here's an article that one may interpret to predict two TE sets becoming a common thing in the Jags' 2020 offense.
https://247sports.com/nfl/washington-red...-74986208/

Find encouragement in the fact that they are at least looking to make moves  - and that in 4 of Gruden's 5 years in DC, his top two tight ends combined for 900+ yards.  Two of those seasons also saw at least 8 TDs from the redskins TE group.

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If he can be had for a 5th round pick or later, sign me up. I had no interest in him as a high draft pick, but I think he can provide some good depth we really need at TE. Happy to sign a FA as well and/ or spend a mid round pick. We need lots of improvement at TE.

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4th this year and a 5th next?

I would be highly in favor of this trade. Although Hurst has not produced as expected when he was drafted, I believe he has the potential to be a good tight end. A change of scenery (especially in his hometown) may be just what the doctor ordered. Even if Oliver develops, it would be nice to have 2 tight ends who could be utilized in Gruden's system. The Jaguars have too many needs to be addressed in April's draft and parting with a 4th rounder this year would be well worth it.

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Are there still people on here who think David Caldwell is a competent General Manager?

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It's being reported that the Jags are exploring a trade for Hayden Hurst.

Depending on the compensation, I wouldn't hate this. Jags need to upgrade the TE room immediately and rookies rarely make an impact. They need a vet.

Trade them Nick Foles, straight up. Maybe send a few players who weren't going to make it out of minicamp with him. I'm not in favor of giving up draft compensation for a way over-aged former first round pick that promptly fell to third on the depth chart behind a guy drafted after him in the same year.

a swap from 20 to 28 in the first round I’d be okay with it.

What the damn hell no.

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I'd give a day 3 pick, that's about it. Good idea to trade for a guy at a very deep position, even if I don't rate him as much more than a good 2.

Beggers can't be choosers

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Mark Andrews was a lot more polished and ready to go for the NFL over Hayden Hurst. I don't know how that was overlooked. I guess the age difference or the QB play from each team played a role. He was a much more viable red zone target coming out of college though. Hurst was nowhere near as good in the receiving game. Maybe it was that whole SEC bias Vs. Big 12 conference.

Thankful we didn't draft him though. And if they trade for him it'll just be a waste of a pick. They need a move TE. Not another blocky [BLEEP] that can't get open and make plays downfield. Harrison Bryant, Hunter Bryant & Adam Trautman need to be targeted by this team. IMHO, if they trade for Hurst you're just getting another James O'Shaughnessy. And what does that say about your 69th overall investment you just made last year in Josh Oliver?

Did they mail it in with him already? Or does this team play on running a bunch of twin and trio TE sets? Makes no sense at this time. . .

Adding talent to the position group makes sense regardless of how the f.o. and staff view Oliver. 

The Jags are coming off a year that saw multiple tight ends on IR and multiple guys signed off that street playing high snap counts. I can see why they aren't sitting on their hands about the TE room.  They simply want to prevent a repeat of 2019's  TE scenario.  

Gruden uses the TE differently than DeFilippo attempted to, so we don't really know what "type" he and the F.O. are after right now -  and they likely see Oliver as their primary "move" TE. As they should, IMO. 
One thing he does like to do sometimes that Defilippo also did is to utilize a TE as a lead blocker instead of a FB.
Here's an article that one may interpret to predict two TE sets becoming a common thing in the Jags' 2020 offense.
https://247sports.com/nfl/washington-red...-74986208/

Find encouragement in the fact that they are at least looking to make moves  - and that in 4 of Gruden's 5 years in DC, his top two tight ends combined for 900+ yards.  Two of those seasons also saw at least 8 TDs from the redskins TE group.

While I fully understand where you're coming from based on all of the above at that position in 2019. You're not hesitant even at the slightest that the Ravens are already willing to move on from him after two years? 

That's not good. He'll be 27 or 28 already by the time the regular season starts. Just doesn't seem like a good idea. And here's the thing. As StroudCrowd hinted at earlier. People still have faith in Caldwell as a competent General Manager around here?

I don't. But what I do know is that he tends to have better success picking on day two and day three of most of his drafts so far. Would rather see him keep whatever draft pick it is that he's thinking about forking over to Baltimore and aim for a younger, slower development type player at the position like Harrison or Hunter Bryant or maybe Adam Trautman.

I think you're essentially gaining James O'Shaughnessy again by trading for Hayden Hurst.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

I think you're essentially gaining James O'Shaughnessy again by trading for Hayden Hurst.

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Two O’Shags would be great. He was a nice target for Minshew before he got hurt.

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"I am only an average man, but by George, I work harder at it than the average man." - Teddy Roosevelt

Adding talent to the position group makes sense regardless of how the f.o. and staff view Oliver. 

The Jags are coming off a year that saw multiple tight ends on IR and multiple guys signed off that street playing high snap counts. I can see why they aren't sitting on their hands about the TE room.  They simply want to prevent a repeat of 2019's  TE scenario.  

Gruden uses the TE differently than DeFilippo attempted to, so we don't really know what "type" he and the F.O. are after right now -  and they likely see Oliver as their primary "move" TE. As they should, IMO. 
One thing he does like to do sometimes that Defilippo also did is to utilize a TE as a lead blocker instead of a FB.
Here's an article that one may interpret to predict two TE sets becoming a common thing in the Jags' 2020 offense.
https://247sports.com/nfl/washington-red...-74986208/

Find encouragement in the fact that they are at least looking to make moves  - and that in 4 of Gruden's 5 years in DC, his top two tight ends combined for 900+ yards.  Two of those seasons also saw at least 8 TDs from the redskins TE group.

While I fully understand where you're coming from based on all of the above at that position in 2019. You're not hesitant even at the slightest that the Ravens are already willing to move on from him after two years? 

That's not good. He'll be 27 or 28 already by the time the regular season starts. Just doesn't seem like a good idea. And here's the thing. As StroudCrowd hinted at earlier. People still have faith in Caldwell as a competent General Manager around here?

I don't. But what I do know is that he tends to have better success picking on day two and day three of most of his drafts so far. Would rather see him keep whatever draft pick it is that he's thinking about forking over to Baltimore and aim for a younger, slower development type player at the position like Harrison or Hunter Bryant or maybe Adam Trautman.

I think you're essentially gaining James O'Shaughnessy again by trading for Hayden Hurst.

I'm not sweating it for a 5th or 6th round pick.  The ravens are deep at TE. Not shocked they are willing to part with one. I'm sure they are surprised that the one they are willing to part with is the guy they drafted ahead of Lamar Jackson, but that's how it ended up. 

If the director of pro personnel is telling Dave that Hurst for a fifth round pick is better than any TE he'll get in the fifth round of the 2020 draft, then it's not an unreasonable way of adding talent to the position group.

Hurst had a mere 39 targets in 2019 (30 receptions).  I'm not going to pretend I've watched all of them and have a report put together on his receiving abilities. Maybe he's worth a 5th, maybe he's not.  

But I do understand why the Jags are exploring all avenues to bolster the TE room. And if they see Hurst as a viable option, so be it.

 There's a reason he went 25th overall initially and he's subsequently had a rookie season spoiled by injury, and a second year where he ended up behind a very good TE in Andrews, and essentially split the #2 snaps with Nick Boyle who also played well. I'm not so sure that there's nothing to salvage from Hurst. 

Personally, I had my eyes on a couple of free agents that I'd still prioritize, but I get it. 

There were a ton of people here lamenting the loss of O'Shaughnessy as a reason for the offense's sputtering mid season. If you believe that - and many do - Is that player not worth a fifth round pick?

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