But it is not really $55 million a year. If we are going to have this conversation let's do it honestly.

Also EVERY QB require players of certain level to perform to a good standard. Basically every MVP, All-Pro, Super Bowl winning QB has another offensive player who is HoF or All -Pro caliber. And the few that don't are no doubt HoF's.

Every contending Super Bowl winning QB typically has a HoF coach. McVeigh is definitely trending that way. Gary Kubiak, Brian Billick, John Gruden, Mike Holgrem, Bruce Arians, and early career Mike McCarthy are just a notch or few below that level and most with HoF level Qb's.That leaves Doug Pederson and it's pretty clear the 2017 Eagles are the flukiest champion of the past 30 years. who won't but he is much better than any coach the Jags have had in 2 decades. Doug Pedersen is basically the only e

Now if you were expected a future HoF, I don't know what to tell you.

But he can still be damn good, and can still win a SB in the right situation. My point being that ever QB has to be in the right situation to succeed.

Plus if you are looking to but bait, it is more likely the Jags are waiting another 10-15 years to find a QB with this level of potential again.

I'm not harping on the $55 million/yr as a primary point of emphasis, which is crazy to say, but it's more of an addendum in the scope of entirety.

I'm not going to keep reiterating the same points over and over that I have made earlier in both threads but Trevor hasn't gone out there and WON us a game enough - and it's been a long time since he actually has. A couple of games every few seasons just simply won't cut it in the NFL.

Was that INT tonight on the coaches? Trevor has been responsible for 62 total turnovers since 2021, which leads the entire league in that span sadly. Some of them should not fall on him, but there's A LOT that actually do - and is not a good sign.

I'm tired of seeing stat lines like 21/38 178 yards 1 TD and 1 INT so many times... Can we just have a string of games where he grabs the game by the freaking horns and exerts his "greatness" so we don't ever have to be subjected to conversations like these with our starting QB?

... Please?

Dude, Trevor Lawrence willed this team to so many wins in 2022 when Pederson allowed him to be who he is.

Lawrence isn't a pocket passer.  Doug realized that in 2022, he let him roll out of pockets.  He let him go deep.  He let him trust his players.  

What's different now is that Trevor has to run the plays called in the 1st half.  He's not given the freedom or mobility to do what he did when he was at Clemson.

They are pigeon holding Lawrence, trying to make him a Peyton Manning type QB.  But he's not that right now.  But they bunch up the middle and make the field easy for defenses to key on the simple schemes we do.

This isn't a Trevor Lawrence issue.

---

21/38 178 yards 1 TD (lets be real, garbage time umbrella defense) and 1 INT is indeed awful. And we get these statlines more times than not.

Scoring only 10 points on offense and not being able to maintain a drive IS a major part of what cost us the game.

We all knew this defense was dog crap - what we didn't know, at least for some of us, is that Trevor might actually not be the guy we all thought we were getting. And we've had 4 seasons of this now.

I've been a lot more vocal, starting tonight because I've given him an incredibly long leash with numerous excuses over the years - but I don't see it anymore with him. Even if we somehow win a game in the next few weeks, I am starting to feel like it would be fluke-y.

I'm just sad its devolved down to this point because I've always been a vehement supporter of TLaw from the outset. But he seems more like a game manager type player at best.

Drops continue to put Lawrence and this Offense behind. There were 4 drops in the 1st half alone tonight.

I completely agree with you.

Drops have been the bane of this offense for the last few years, especially with Ridley... That's why I never piled on TLaw last year because I understood what was happening which wasn't a fair assessment of TLaw in certain situations.

I wish we still had Keenan here honestly.

---

---

NYC4jags Wrote:
Can we leave the personal insults behind for a while and get back to some semblance of topic, gents?
Please, and thank you.

I'm not harping on the $55 million/yr as a primary point of emphasis, which is crazy to say, but it's more of an addendum in the scope of entirety.

I'm not going to keep reiterating the same points over and over that I have made earlier in both threads but Trevor hasn't gone out there and WON us a game enough - and it's been a long time since he actually has. A couple of games every few seasons just simply won't cut it in the NFL.

Was that INT tonight on the coaches? Trevor has been responsible for 62 total turnovers since 2021, which leads the entire league in that span sadly. Some of them should not fall on him, but there's A LOT that actually do - and is not a good sign.

I'm tired of seeing stat lines like 21/38 178 yards 1 TD and 1 INT so many times... Can we just have a string of games where he grabs the game by the freaking horns and exerts his "greatness" so we don't ever have to be subjected to conversations like these with our starting QB?

... Please?

Dude, Trevor Lawrence willed this team to so many wins in 2022 when Pederson allowed him to be who he is.

Lawrence isn't a pocket passer.  Doug realized that in 2022, he let him roll out of pockets.  He let him go deep.  He let him trust his players.  

What's different now is that Trevor has to run the plays called in the 1st half.  He's not given the freedom or mobility to do what he did when he was at Clemson.

They are pigeon holding Lawrence, trying to make him a Peyton Manning type QB.  But he's not that right now.  But they bunch up the middle and make the field easy for defenses to key on the simple schemes we do.

This isn't a Trevor Lawrence issue.

The only way anyone can know the whole "Pederson allowed him to be who he is" is if they are inside the organization itself. And sadly, you and I are on the outside looking in.

But for [BLEEP] and giggles, why would Pederson change what was working then? He's still here as the HC, isn't he?

Coaching IS a problem but so is the player at hand - and that's my stance on this specific issue.

This entire organization is dysfunctional from Shad Khan to the water boy - and everything in between.

---

NEED!!!

---

I'm not harping on the $55 million/yr as a primary point of emphasis, which is crazy to say, but it's more of an addendum in the scope of entirety.

I'm not going to keep reiterating the same points over and over that I have made earlier in both threads but Trevor hasn't gone out there and WON us a game enough - and it's been a long time since he actually has. A couple of games every few seasons just simply won't cut it in the NFL.

Was that INT tonight on the coaches? Trevor has been responsible for 62 total turnovers since 2021, which leads the entire league in that span sadly. Some of them should not fall on him, but there's A LOT that actually do - and is not a good sign.

I'm tired of seeing stat lines like 21/38 178 yards 1 TD and 1 INT so many times... Can we just have a string of games where he grabs the game by the freaking horns and exerts his "greatness" so we don't ever have to be subjected to conversations like these with our starting QB?

... Please?

Dude, Trevor Lawrence willed this team to so many wins in 2022 when Pederson allowed him to be who he is.

Lawrence isn't a pocket passer.  Doug realized that in 2022, he let him roll out of pockets.  He let him go deep.  He let him trust his players.  

What's different now is that Trevor has to run the plays called in the 1st half.  He's not given the freedom or mobility to do what he did when he was at Clemson.

They are pigeon holding Lawrence, trying to make him a Peyton Manning type QB.  But he's not that right now.  But they bunch up the middle and make the field easy for defenses to key on the simple schemes we do.

This isn't a Trevor Lawrence issue.

I agree. There are lots of issues but the game plan is just terrible. Trying to stand in the pocket and hold the ball for deep routes is not working. Move the pocket, look for the quick routes to open up the deep passes.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

---

Trevor looks like he's about done with Doug's bull [BLEEP] lol.
https://twitter.com/JagKenKnowledge/stat...5736806462

---

Trevor looks like he's about done with Doug's bull [BLEEP] lol.
https://twitter.com/JagKenKnowledge/stat...5736806462

Him and 91% of the fan base.

---

I get it. You've had enough and your giving up on Trevor. That's absolutely fine if that's what you want to do and I completely understand where your coming from. 

I'm just saying I'm not writing him off. He's shown more than enough times the talent he has. This team is in a horrible run right now and everything is off right now. The Bills scored on 8 of 9 drives tonight. Tough to win when the opponents can do that. I sadly don't see a quick fix for all of our ills right now and things will get worse in the short term as they look like they have zero confidence right now.

People want to vent tonight, I get it. It's been a rough start to what looked a promising season.

I completely understand your point as well, as I was there for a long time. But my tune would have been a lot different if we had lost 35-40 where Trevor was 21/38 320 yards 4 TDs and 1 INT.

It's not about the stat line, so I hope you don't dwindle it down to that, I'm just trying to say that if he was responsible for leading multiple touchdown drives the rhetoric would be vastly different - at least coming from me.

We are just ANEMIC - and I think that is the perfect word to summarize this entire team with all players included in this characterization.

I hope things change around and stay positive consistently because that would be the true measure of what a team and its players truly are. Instead, we've had plenty of anemic performances more times than not.

Your a great poster on here and I completely respect your opinion. Your certainly not wrong about the way the O is playing. Its been a problem for a long time now and there are issues like drops or pass protection that have hurt us but we've not shown were overcoming those issues or putting everything together and showing what they can be. Everyone draws their own line on who or what is the 'reason' why that is when it's probably a mix of everything.

As soon as they fell behind by a few scores you could see what little fight we had was gone and that's the lack of confidence. Feels like we're back to the fall behind and that's game attitude again.

If we're going to turn this season around it's guys like Trevor that have to be the catalyst. Putting a drive together looks tough right now, we find a way to blow a drive so many times and in so many ways but this is where we need the leaders to step up. That's the challenge for Trevor and the expectation.

---

Dude, Trevor Lawrence willed this team to so many wins in 2022 when Pederson allowed him to be who he is.

Lawrence isn't a pocket passer.  Doug realized that in 2022, he let him roll out of pockets.  He let him go deep.  He let him trust his players.  

What's different now is that Trevor has to run the plays called in the 1st half.  He's not given the freedom or mobility to do what he did when he was at Clemson.

They are pigeon holding Lawrence, trying to make him a Peyton Manning type QB.  But he's not that right now.  But they bunch up the middle and make the field easy for defenses to key on the simple schemes we do.

This isn't a Trevor Lawrence issue.

The only way anyone can know the whole "Pederson allowed him to be who he is" is if they are inside the organization itself. And sadly, you and I are on the outside looking in.

But for [BLEEP] and giggles, why would Pederson change what was working then? He's still here as the HC, isn't he?

Coaching IS a problem but so is the player at hand - and that's my stance on this specific issue.

This entire organization is dysfunctional from Shad Khan to the water boy - and everything in between.

There is 1 reason, 1 coach left from that offense. That unfortunately left Trevor with Press.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

---

I'm not harping on the $55 million/yr as a primary point of emphasis, which is crazy to say, but it's more of an addendum in the scope of entirety.

I'm not going to keep reiterating the same points over and over that I have made earlier in both threads but Trevor hasn't gone out there and WON us a game enough - and it's been a long time since he actually has. A couple of games every few seasons just simply won't cut it in the NFL.

Was that INT tonight on the coaches? Trevor has been responsible for 62 total turnovers since 2021, which leads the entire league in that span sadly. Some of them should not fall on him, but there's A LOT that actually do - and is not a good sign.

I'm tired of seeing stat lines like 21/38 178 yards 1 TD and 1 INT so many times... Can we just have a string of games where he grabs the game by the freaking horns and exerts his "greatness" so we don't ever have to be subjected to conversations like these with our starting QB?

... Please?

Dude, Trevor Lawrence willed this team to so many wins in 2022 when Pederson allowed him to be who he is.

Lawrence isn't a pocket passer.  Doug realized that in 2022, he let him roll out of pockets.  He let him go deep.  He let him trust his players.  

What's different now is that Trevor has to run the plays called in the 1st half.  He's not given the freedom or mobility to do what he did when he was at Clemson.

They are pigeon holding Lawrence, trying to make him a Peyton Manning type QB.  But he's not that right now.  But they bunch up the middle and make the field easy for defenses to key on the simple schemes we do.

This isn't a Trevor Lawrence issue.

So by your logic, Pederson is doing the complete opposite from what worked, because of what?

---

I completely understand your point as well, as I was there for a long time. But my tune would have been a lot different if we had lost 35-40 where Trevor was 21/38 320 yards 4 TDs and 1 INT.

It's not about the stat line, so I hope you don't dwindle it down to that, I'm just trying to say that if he was responsible for leading multiple touchdown drives the rhetoric would be vastly different - at least coming from me.

We are just ANEMIC - and I think that is the perfect word to summarize this entire team with all players included in this characterization.

I hope things change around and stay positive consistently because that would be the true measure of what a team and its players truly are. Instead, we've had plenty of anemic performances more times than not.

Your a great poster on here and I completely respect your opinion. Your certainly not wrong about the way the O is playing. Its been a problem for a long time now and there are issues like drops or pass protection that have hurt us but we've not shown were overcoming those issues or putting everything together and showing what they can be. Everyone draws their own line on who or what is the 'reason' why that is when it's probably a mix of everything.

As soon as they fell behind by a few scores you could see what little fight we had was gone and that's the lack of confidence. Feels like we're back to the fall behind and that's game attitude again.

If we're going to turn this season around it's guys like Trevor that have to be the catalyst. Putting a drive together looks tough right now, we find a way to blow a drive so many times and in so many ways but this is where we need the leaders to step up. That's the challenge for Trevor and the expectation.

Likewise man, I genuinely appreciate your perspective on topics and posts - our board is better with you part of it.

Yeah, I think this was the game that set it over the edge for me. I had been waiting patiently for a while but I might be seeing things a little differently than others now - whether who is "right" or "wrong" remains to be seen, but I sincerely hope I'm wrong. Again, our organization certainly has done Trevor NO favors (outside of WR acquisitions), but I'm slowly starting to believe that Trevor might play a larger role in this along with the rest of the team.

But I'm starting to call the issues out now after giving him some arbitrary amount of time that I feel is the right amount (lol). You can go back to page 1 of this thread and see I have always been on his side, but I'm starting to sway towards providing some criticism on Trevor - as I have not done so up until tonight. So I hope others don't think I'm just piling on just to pile on, or part of the people who came out to slander TLaw right away - because that's the exact opposite approach I have always taken when trying to assess a player and his talents.

---

Dude, Trevor Lawrence willed this team to so many wins in 2022 when Pederson allowed him to be who he is.

Lawrence isn't a pocket passer.  Doug realized that in 2022, he let him roll out of pockets.  He let him go deep.  He let him trust his players.  

What's different now is that Trevor has to run the plays called in the 1st half.  He's not given the freedom or mobility to do what he did when he was at Clemson.

They are pigeon holding Lawrence, trying to make him a Peyton Manning type QB.  But he's not that right now.  But they bunch up the middle and make the field easy for defenses to key on the simple schemes we do.

This isn't a Trevor Lawrence issue.

So by your logic, Pederson is doing the complete opposite from what worked, because of what?

No one knows why. The offense is definitely different though and they tried to force it with Ridley last year when he isn't a traditional X WR.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

---

So by your logic, Pederson is doing the complete opposite from what worked, because of what?

No one knows why. The offense is definitely different though and they tried to force it with Ridley last year when he isn't a traditional X WR.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

I feel like a broken record but I think Doug is too prideful to admit he made a mistake in handing it over to Taylor. He couldn’t admit having Taylor on staff was a problem in Philly, why would he do it here? He doesn’t like accountability

---

No one knows why. The offense is definitely different though and they tried to force it with Ridley last year when he isn't a traditional X WR.

Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

I feel like a broken record but I think Doug is too prideful to admit he made a mistake in handing it over to Taylor. He couldn’t admit having Taylor on staff was a problem in Philly, why would he do it here? He doesn’t like accountability

This business is dirty. If he thought Press was an issue he would've fired him already. There's no shame in admitting a mistake. 

Don't think he would put his job in jeopardy because of Press freaking Taylor.

---

I feel like a broken record but I think Doug is too prideful to admit he made a mistake in handing it over to Taylor. He couldn’t admit having Taylor on staff was a problem in Philly, why would he do it here? He doesn’t like accountability

This business is dirty. If he thought Press was an issue he would've fired him already. There's no shame in admitting a mistake. 

Don't think he would put his job in jeopardy because of Press freaking Taylor.

From the outside that was what happened in Philly. It's obviously not that simple though because it's not possible this wasn't discussed at length before Pederson was appointed with us. 

It's just some made up fan fiction just like our drops, o-line or play calling.

---

This business is dirty. If he thought Press was an issue he would've fired him already. There's no shame in admitting a mistake. 

Don't think he would put his job in jeopardy because of Press freaking Taylor.

From the outside that was what happened in Philly. It's obviously not that simple though because it's not possible this wasn't discussed at length before Pederson was appointed with us. 

It's just some made up fan fiction just like our drops, o-line or play calling.

They literally showed a graphic during the game about the drops LOL. We have had the most drops of any team in the league since 2021. 21 more drops than the next highest team.

Fan fiction though right? LOLOLOLOL.

---

From the outside that was what happened in Philly. It's obviously not that simple though because it's not possible this wasn't discussed at length before Pederson was appointed with us. 

It's just some made up fan fiction just like our drops, o-line or play calling.

They literally showed a graphic during the game about the drops LOL. We have had the most drops of any team in the league since 2021. 21 more drops than the next highest team.

Fan fiction though right? LOLOLOLOL.

Who is around since 2021? Yes, that's your quarterback. Isn't it funny that receivers don't drop as much with other quarterbacks. Yeah, it must be our receivers are bad. Of course that's why. 

It's good that you admit neither o-line nor play calling is the real problem though. Maybe you'll figure out the rest soon enough.

---

They literally showed a graphic during the game about the drops LOL. We have had the most drops of any team in the league since 2021. 21 more drops than the next highest team.

Fan fiction though right? LOLOLOLOL.

Who is around since 2021? Yes, that's your quarterback. Isn't it funny that receivers don't drop as much with other quarterbacks. Yeah, it must be our receivers are bad. Of course that's why. 

It's good that you admit neither o-line nor play calling is the real problem though. Maybe you'll figure out the rest soon enough.

OL and play calling is a huge issue just like the drops.

Maybe one day you'll actually understand ball and what you're watching. If you actually even watch the game at all which is highly doubtful considering your dumb [BLEEP] takes.

---

Who is around since 2021? Yes, that's your quarterback. Isn't it funny that receivers don't drop as much with other quarterbacks. Yeah, it must be our receivers are bad. Of course that's why. 

It's good that you admit neither o-line nor play calling is the real problem though. Maybe you'll figure out the rest soon enough.

OL and play calling is a huge issue just like the drops.

Maybe one day you'll actually understand ball and what you're watching. If you actually even watch the game at all which is highly doubtful considering your dumb [BLEEP] takes.

Speaking of dumb takes. I'm not the one who thinks Trevor is good.  

https://stathead.com/football/vs/daniel-...r-lawrence

---