I can see Kirk being released for sure. Would hate to see Engram released personally. I think with a better coaching staff they would find a way to utilize his skill set more. Not a really deep TE class to find a mismatch guy like that in 2025 and I don't know what the free agency class looks like.

Agreed, Brenton would have to do some really special stuff for me to justify walking away from Engram. Kirk is all but gone, but I see a lot more in the connection betw Engram and TLaw and Engram is just an effort dude. He'd work in dang near any system regardless of who we bring in. I have a feeling he's a leader in the locker room, which is significant, especially during a transition.

Sometimes saving money isn't worth the rest of what you lose.

---

It's actually mindblowing, knowing the culture this franchise has... people actually think letting Engram (and his leadership) walk out the door is a GOOD thing lmao.

dollars and (non)sense

15 million can go a long way and just look at what Strange did yesterday when he was given the starting role. He is a very good young player.

Engram is not worth the money when you have a younger and cheaper option. This is Cam Robinson all over again (even though I think Engram is much better at his position). 

I like Engram but I like my QB more. Use the 31 million you save by cutting Kirk and Engram, upgrade the RG spot and add some beef to the IDL. Draft Graham, Hunter or Will Johnson in round 1.

---

Agreed, Brenton would have to do some really special stuff for me to justify walking away from Engram. Kirk is all but gone, but I see a lot more in the connection betw Engram and TLaw and Engram is just an effort dude. He'd work in dang near any system regardless of who we bring in. I have a feeling he's a leader in the locker room, which is significant, especially during a transition.

Sometimes saving money isn't worth the rest of what you lose.

---

dollars and (non)sense

15 million can go a long way and just look at what Strange did yesterday when he was given the starting role. He is a very good young player.

Engram is not worth the money when you have a younger and cheaper option. This is Cam Robinson all over again (even though I think Engram is much better at his position). 

I like Engram but I like my QB more. Use the 31 million you save by cutting Kirk and Engram, upgrade the RG spot and add some beef to the IDL. Draft Graham, Hunter or Will Johnson in round 1.

Engram will cost 13.5 mil in dead money.  If you do a post a Post June 1st cut you are just pushing most of that dead money to the following year.  That's a lot of dead money

---

I don't see how saving the money this year but then it hitting you next year is a good thing

---

Agreed, Brenton would have to do some really special stuff for me to justify walking away from Engram. Kirk is all but gone, but I see a lot more in the connection betw Engram and TLaw and Engram is just an effort dude. He'd work in dang near any system regardless of who we bring in. I have a feeling he's a leader in the locker room, which is significant, especially during a transition.

Sometimes saving money isn't worth the rest of what you lose.

---

dollars and (non)sense

15 million can go a long way and just look at what Strange did yesterday when he was given the starting role. He is a very good young player.

Engram is not worth the money when you have a younger and cheaper option. This is Cam Robinson all over again (even though I think Engram is much better at his position). 

I like Engram but I like my QB more. Use the 31 million you save by cutting Kirk and Engram, upgrade the RG spot and add some beef to the IDL. Draft Graham, Hunter or Will Johnson in round 1.

My dude,
You know we are allowed to put both Engram and Strange on the field at the same time, right?

---

My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

15 million can go a long way and just look at what Strange did yesterday when he was given the starting role. He is a very good young player.

Engram is not worth the money when you have a younger and cheaper option. This is Cam Robinson all over again (even though I think Engram is much better at his position). 

I like Engram but I like my QB more. Use the 31 million you save by cutting Kirk and Engram, upgrade the RG spot and add some beef to the IDL. Draft Graham, Hunter or Will Johnson in round 1.

My dude,
You know we are allowed to put both Engram and Strange on the field at the same time, right?

I know that but the coaching staff didn't. Strange was rarely ever used when Engram was in the game.

The new GM might keep him. Who knows.

I'm just saying there's a chance that Enram and Kirk are not back due to the money they save by cutting them.

---

We need a new offensive scheme to take advantage of the talent we have .

---

My dude,
You know we are allowed to put both Engram and Strange on the field at the same time, right?

I know that but the coaching staff didn't. Strange was rarely ever used when Engram was in the game.

The new GM might keep him. Who knows.

I'm just saying there's a chance that Enram and Kirk are not back due to the money they save by cutting them.

If you owe the bank 100k and they say you can pay 30k this year and 70k next year you think that is saving 70k when you are still paying the money.

---

We need a new offensive scheme to take advantage of the talent we have .

Agreed, if you cut Engram it means you don't think he is worth 6.25 mil

---

I know that but the coaching staff didn't. Strange was rarely ever used when Engram was in the game.

The new GM might keep him. Who knows.

I'm just saying there's a chance that Enram and Kirk are not back due to the money they save by cutting them.

If you owe the bank 100k and they say you can pay 30k this year and 70k next year you think that is saving 70k when you are still paying the money.

---

We need a new offensive scheme to take advantage of the talent we have .

Agreed, if you cut Engram it means you don't think he is worth 6.25 mil

Engram is definitely worth it. No way he is cut. Potentially traded if deal is right, but most likely he stays imo.

---

I know that but the coaching staff didn't. Strange was rarely ever used when Engram was in the game.

The new GM might keep him. Who knows.

I'm just saying there's a chance that Enram and Kirk are not back due to the money they save by cutting them.

If you owe the bank 100k and they say you can pay 30k this year and 70k next year you think that is saving 70k when you are still paying the money.

---

We need a new offensive scheme to take advantage of the talent we have .

Agreed, if you cut Engram it means you don't think he is worth 6.25 mil

Watching this crazy talk about saving pennies to cost us dollars and degrade a position of strength in the process.   We have 1 exceptional TE on contract through the 2025 season. (26-29 are void years) We also have one rising young TE on his rookie deal through 2026. This is what a good team does. We are suppose to do by position group. I wish they had this on the o-line...

Yes, I would like to see the 2 TE sets incorporated into the offense. The fact they have not done this is a question the management needs to answer to Shad about.

---

A new broom always sweeps clean.

I don't see how saving the money this year but then it hitting you next year is a good thing

The concept is that next paying the money next year becomes a smaller chunk of the salary cap due to the ever expanding cap.  Essentially that 2026 money is cheaper (cap wise) than 2025 money.  There's also the pressure for a GM/HC to 'win now,'  but if you look at some mismanaged teams that can get teams in hot water in the future.  There's nothing worse than being 5-12 but having already spent your cap in the upcoming year(s).

---

NYC4jags Wrote:
Can we leave the personal insults behind for a while and get back to some semblance of topic, gents?
Please, and thank you.

If you owe the bank 100k and they say you can pay 30k this year and 70k next year you think that is saving 70k when you are still paying the money.

---

Agreed, if you cut Engram it means you don't think he is worth 6.25 mil

Watching this crazy talk about saving pennies to cost us dollars and degrade a position of strength in the process.   We have 1 exceptional TE on contract through the 2025 season. (26-29 are void years) We also have one rising young TE on his rookie deal through 2026. This is what a good team does. We are suppose to do by position group. I wish they had this on the o-line...

Yes, I would like to see the 2 TE sets incorporated into the offense. The fact they have not done this is a question the management needs to answer to Shad about.

People have complained about are talent level and the TE position for years and like you say, its a strength on the team now and on a 3-11 team they want to get rid of one of our better players.  Yeah, it doesn't make much sense.

---

I'll never understand why fans think fixing a team means getting rid of its best players.
Engram is a valuable asset, people.

Hell - most of us thought Pederson would work wonders with two viable TEs, remember??
Why are we talking about cutting one of the two for the next coach, exactly??

---

I'll never understand why fans think fixing a team means getting rid of its best players.
Engram is a valuable asset, people.

Hell - most of us thought Pederson would work wonders with two viable TEs, remember??
Why are we talking about cutting one of the two for the next coach, exactly??

How else are you going to afford the dominant team changing free agents like Arik Armstead, Ronald Darby, Gabe Davis, and Darnell Savage?  [God help the Jags if they don't get rid of Baalke.]

---

NYC4jags Wrote:
Can we leave the personal insults behind for a while and get back to some semblance of topic, gents?
Please, and thank you.

I'll never understand why fans think fixing a team means getting rid of its best players.
Engram is a valuable asset, people.

Hell - most of us thought Pederson would work wonders with two viable TEs, remember??
Why are we talking about cutting one of the two for the next coach, exactly??

How else are you going to afford the dominant team changing free agents like Arik Armstead, Ronald Darby, Gabe Davis, and Darnell Savage?  [God help the Jags if they don't get rid of Baalke.]

Wut? 
The Jags have 46 mil in cap space before cuts for 2025. 

Why would they cut an actual contributor when they could cut players who aren't contributing? 

They could cut Darby, Duvernay and Wingard and save the same cap space. 
Duvernay is a solid returner - but we have Washington and that RB coming off IR. 

The other two are cannon fodder at this point. Especially with a new defensive staff incoming.

---

Watching this crazy talk about saving pennies to cost us dollars and degrade a position of strength in the process.   We have 1 exceptional TE on contract through the 2025 season. (26-29 are void years) We also have one rising young TE on his rookie deal through 2026. This is what a good team does. We are suppose to do by position group. I wish they had this on the o-line...

Yes, I would like to see the 2 TE sets incorporated into the offense. The fact they have not done this is a question the management needs to answer to Shad about.

People have complained about are talent level and the TE position for years and like you say, its a strength on the team now and on a 3-11 team they want to get rid of one of our better players.  Yeah, it doesn't make much sense.

I know Ingram is on IR now.  But the fact that we rarely used both TEs this year...  It's a travesty.  Just such bad game planning, terrible scheming.  Just bad coaching.  Strange and Ingram together would be a monster.  But this coaching staff has no idea how to use our best players.  It's just so frustrating to watch simple things get looked over.

---

We need a new offensive scheme to take advantage of the talent we have .

It's a very strange dynamic we have here.  Baalke is almost universally hated and blamed, but we do have some pieces and he was responsible for a lot of them.  There have been obvious bad misses in free agency this year and roster construction philosophy has either been bad or we've been hindered by lack of opportunity to land quality guys at specific positions or both.  If I had time, I'd do a side by side of his free agency and draft decisions during his tenure here versus the rest of the division and a few of the perennial top tier teams just to get a sense of how bad it's been by comparison, but I ain't got that kinda time. By the time I'd get around to it, he'll be gone already anyway.

---

We need a new offensive scheme to take advantage of the talent we have .

It's a very strange dynamic we have here.  Baalke is almost universally hated and blamed, but we do have some pieces and he was responsible for a lot of them.  There have been obvious bad misses in free agency this year and roster construction philosophy has either been bad or we've been hindered by lack of opportunity to land quality guys at specific positions or both.  If I had time, I'd do a side by side of his free agency and draft decisions during his tenure here versus the rest of the division and a few of the perennial top tier teams just to get a sense of how bad it's been by comparison, but I ain't got that kinda time.

You just can't keep him anymore.  Lefty was reported to not want to work with him.  Heck, even this year, the whole Mason Smith issue came up where Pederson basically was giving the middle finger to Baalke.  

You gotta clean the entire management.  The GM and the HC (along with his trash staff) have to go.  We're not gonna turn anything around if it's just gonna be the same management group.

---

How else are you going to afford the dominant team changing free agents like Arik Armstead, Ronald Darby, Gabe Davis, and Darnell Savage?  [God help the Jags if they don't get rid of Baalke.]

Wut? 
The Jags have 46 mil in cap space before cuts for 2025. 

Why would they cut an actual contributor when they could cut players who aren't contributing? 

They could cut Darby, Duvernay and Wingard and save the same cap space. 
Duvernay is a solid returner - but we have Washington and that RB coming off IR. 

The other two are cannon fodder at this point. Especially with a new defensive staff incoming.

It was just a joke at Baalke's expense (indicating he doesn't know how to spend the 'extra money' he'd get by cutting Engram), of course I had to explain it so clearly it wasn't funny.

---

NYC4jags Wrote:
Can we leave the personal insults behind for a while and get back to some semblance of topic, gents?
Please, and thank you.

Darby had zero snaps vs the Jets.

---

I want a new Coach
One that won't make me sick
One that won't make me crash the boards
Or make me feel three feet thick

I want a new GM
One that won't hurt my head
One that won't make my mouth too dry
Or make my eyes too red
One that won't make me nervous
Wondering what to do
One that makes me feel like I did in 96
Oh back in 96

I want a new Offense
One that does what it should
One that won't make me feel too bad
One that can make me feel real good

---

Birth of the Franchise - November 30, 1993
Death of the Franchise - November 29, 2011

Fans deserve better. Thanks for all the good times too many are in the past.