I have been reading and posting on the o-line off and on for two years and saw another post that I think is worth reflecting on as we look at the poor play of the o-line.  Like most others, I am pretty unhappy with this year's crappy performance.  As bad as it has been I don't think that given:

 

-the youth of the players

 

-their lack of time to form a cohesive unit which is so crucial to o-line play

 

-their offensive line coach gone with cancer

 

-a rookie quarterback in a Dead Fish offense 

 

maybe we should hold back a little bit with the torches and pitchforks.

 

What got me going off on this again was a post in a similar topic that advocated going after Joe Barksdale for RT.  I think if you take a look at the performance for money comparisons below you might see that we may need to sharpen the pitchforks and oil the torches but not be too quick to light them for the O-line we already have until they get some more time to prove themselves, individual by individual.

 

 

Eugene Monroe  $37.5M for Five years

                             Rated 63rd of 84 tackles by PFF

 

 

Austin Pasztor    $1.5M for Three years

                             Rated 55th of 84 tackles by PFF

 

 

Joe Barksdale     $$$????

                              Rate 48th of 84 tackles by PFF          

 

 

How much do you want to pay to go from 55th best tackle to 48th best tackle, even assuming that Barksdale doesn't fall off like Monroe did.  Granted Monroe is a more valuable left tackle but you think Barksdale isn't going to want some big money?

 

Overpaying for mediocrity got us into this mess.  Please let's be a little more patient.  We have made the investment in the o-line.  Let's see how it turns out with some better offensive leadership and instead focus on some other areas like free safety where we are the worst in the league or our good but aging D-line in a year with a bonanza of d-line talent coming out.

 

 

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OVerpaying got us into what mess? we have cap space for days.

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Monroe is the 63rd rated tackle? Haha, some people are still upset about the trade. Hard to believe Pasztor is better than Monroe

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Where does Barksdale rank among the RT?

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This team has underspent for well over a decade.  We have sucked for close to that.

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Monroe is the 63rd rated tackle? Haha, some people are still upset about the trade. Hard to believe Pasztor is better than Monroe

 

You really believe Monroe is that low? there's only 64 starting tackles in the NFL, if anything it's a discredit to PFF rankings. But statistics are funny like that sometimes when you crunch a number the story it tells just isn't a reality. 

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I have been reading and posting on the o-line off and on for two years and saw another post that I think is worth reflecting on as we look at the poor play of the o-line.  Like most others, I am pretty unhappy with this year's crappy performance.  As bad as it has been I don't think that given:

 

-the youth of the players

 

-their lack of time to form a cohesive unit which is so crucial to o-line play

 

-their offensive line coach gone with cancer

 

-a rookie quarterback in a Dead Fish offense 

 

maybe we should hold back a little bit with the torches and pitchforks.

 

What got me going off on this again was a post in a similar topic that advocated going after Joe Barksdale for RT.  I think if you take a look at the performance for money comparisons below you might see that we may need to sharpen the pitchforks and oil the torches but not be too quick to light them for the O-line we already have until they get some more time to prove themselves, individual by individual.

 

 

Eugene Monroe  $37.5M for Five years

                             Rated 63rd of 84 tackles by PFF

 

 

Austin Pasztor    $1.5M for Three years

                             Rated 55th of 84 tackles by PFF

 

 

Joe Barksdale     $$$????

                              Rate 48th of 84 tackles by PFF          

 

 

How much do you want to pay to go from 55th best tackle to 48th best tackle, even assuming that Barksdale doesn't fall off like Monroe did.  Granted Monroe is a more valuable left tackle but you think Barksdale isn't going to want some big money?

 

Overpaying for mediocrity got us into this mess.  Please let's be a little more patient.  We have made the investment in the o-line.  Let's see how it turns out with some better offensive leadership and instead focus on some other areas like free safety where we are the worst in the league or our good but aging D-line in a year with a bonanza of d-line talent coming out.

 

No offense but your looking at it from the "analytic" stuff, this isn't money ball. The reality is we just put together one of the WORSE offensive lines in damn near a decade. They gave up 70+ sacks this season, you can't just sit back and hope they get better over the offseason. That's a bet no one should be willing to wager. 

 

Forget PFF rankings and grades, it's just someone creating data on a spread sheet, when you watch the game it's painfully obvious the problem we have. Also you can't say with a straight face Joeckel is better then Monroe this year, so him being rated 63rd should just be a red flag on the argument you're building. 

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You really believe Monroe is that low? there's only 64 starting tackles in the NFL, if anything it's a discredit to PFF rankings. But statistics are funny like that sometimes when you crunch a number the story it tells just isn't a reality.

But 83 have started this year so it's correct and it looks worse when he started all year and is that low. It takes in account the whole year where he was terrible in the 2nd half

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"Get Better Everyday"

No offense but your looking at it from the "analytic" stuff, this isn't money ball. The reality is we just put together one of the WORSE offensive lines in damn near a decade. They gave up 70+ sacks this season, you can't just sit back and hope they get better over the offseason. That's a bet no one should be willing to wager.


Forget PFF rankings and grades, it's just someone creating data on a spread sheet, when you watch the game it's painfully obvious the problem we have. Also you can't say with a straight face Joeckel is better then Monroe this year, so him being rated 63rd should just be a red flag on the argument you're building.

Except PFF watches the games you truly know nothing lol do some research before spazing

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"Get Better Everyday"

Gene Smith did a lot of things wrong. Managing cap space was not one of them.

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Kind of unrelated, but do you have a link of those PFF rankings?

 

I'd love to see where all our starters rank.

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The problem is this roster is so void of talent it's going to take almost 10 years to depend on just the draft alone.  This team needs veteran leadership and actual talent.

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Kind of unrelated, but do you have a link of those PFF rankings?

 

I'd love to see where all our starters rank.

 

Here is the website:

 

www.profootballfocus.com

 

Some of it is free but the individual stats are $26.99 for a year.  It is a bargain to get some objective information.  I got started on it from reading too many MB warriors that were all heat and no light.  It is really quite surprising in many ways.  A great example is the defensive backfield where most of our cornerbacks have positive ratings and the safeties are probably the worst in the league yet we constantly hear Cyprien being touted as some sort of building block star. To his late arriving credit though, he has had a couple good games toward the end of the season but Joeckle is a better tackle than Cyrien is a safety.  I have the same hopes for both and think we need patience with both.   Another surprising tidbit that might generate howls of disbelief is Clemmons being 58th out of 59 4-3 defensive ends.

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Here is the website:

 

www.profootballfocus.com

 

Some of it is free but the individual stats are $26.99 for a year.  It is a bargain to get some objective information.  I got started on it from reading too many MB warriors that were all heat and no light.  It is really quite surprising in many ways.  A great example is the defensive backfield where most of our cornerbacks have positive ratings and the safeties are probably the worst in the league yet we constantly hear Cyprien being touted as some sort of building block star. To his late arriving credit though, he has had a couple good games toward the end of the season but Joeckle is a better tackle than Cyrien is a safety.  I have the same hopes for both and think we need patience with both.   Another surprising tidbit that might generate howls of disbelief is Clemmons being 58th out of 59 4-3 defensive ends.

Where does it say Poz is as a MLB lol?

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Gene Smith did a lot of things wrong. Managing cap space was not one of them.

Managing cap space was one of Genes worst as a GM.  We were over the cap when Dave became GM.  Every one of Gene's contract were back loaded which is to each year went by we got closer and closer to the cap,  Not to mention all the horrible contracts he gave out to one season wonders at non premium positions.  Outside of not being able to find talent in the draft is next wost asset was probably not being able to manage the cap space.

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Managing cap space was one of Genes worst as a GM.  We were over the cap when Dave became GM.  Every one of Gene's contract were back loaded which is to each year went by we got closer and closer to the cap,  Not to mention all the horrible contracts he gave out to one season wonders at non premium positions.  Outside of not being able to find talent in the draft is next wost asset was probably not being able to manage the cap space.

 

This is so wrong. The Jags have been way under the cap since before Gene Smith became GM. He made some questionable decisions handing out grossly inflated contracts to a few players (Marcedes, Mike Thomas, Poz) but never spent close to the cap, much less over it.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

This is so wrong. The Jags have been way under the cap since before Gene Smith became GM. He made some questionable decisions handing out grossly inflated contracts to a few players (Marcedes, Mike Thomas, Poz) but never spent close to the cap, much less over it.

Maybe im wrong but he still sucked and the contracts you mentioned along with a few more, Mincey is one.  Maybe not over it but I remember a few years ago when Dave took over we were close to the cap,  One of the reason Dave cut so many players.

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I think it was the dead money that put us close to the cap a few years back, either way Gene was still in over his head.

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Managing cap space was one of Genes worst as a GM.  We were over the cap when Dave became GM.  Every one of Gene's contract were back loaded which is to each year went by we got closer and closer to the cap,  Not to mention all the horrible contracts he gave out to one season wonders at non premium positions.  Outside of not being able to find talent in the draft is next wost asset was probably not being able to manage the cap space.

lolwut?

 

http://www.bigcatcountry.com/2013/1/9/38...-cap-space

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Managing cap space was one of Genes worst as a GM. We were over the cap when Dave became GM. Every one of Gene's contract were back loaded which is to each year went by we got closer and closer to the cap, Not to mention all the horrible contracts he gave out to one season wonders at non premium positions. Outside of not being able to find talent in the draft is next wost asset was probably not being able to manage the cap space.

Gene had a lot of fault's, managing cap space sure wasn't one of them.

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"Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes. That way, if he gets angry, he's a mile away and barefoot."