People open a business so they control everything. Don't like what's going on, hit the bricks. Sadly in the litigious world we live in people have made it more difficult to completely run their business, hire who they want, and fire when they want.

Why were unions formed? Didn't the free market pretty much do this to themselves?


Great example. Why does the lending world have such heavy regulation? Because they proved that they couldn't function without it. The forced government to get involved.

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I don't know the whole situation. And I don't know if I see it as a pride thing. They were doing something selfless and faced heavy consequences. And I certainly don't see it as black and white.

But if the company looks at it as black and white, you have to as well or you look for another job..

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I have no problem with saying they had guts and courage to do what they did to stand up. They did. ....just as long as they were willing to pay the potential consequences and at that point take responsibility for their own actions.


But thats a baaaad term to a lot of people with this entitlement complex in America today....Personal responsibility/ accountability.....Ooooooooohhhhhh, baaaad!!!! Always gotta be someone else's fault. Gotta have an excuse to be violent and aggressive!!!!

I don't think it was a violent protest.

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But if the company looks at it as black and white, you have to as well or you look for another job..

Well, life would be much simpler if we were robots and took the human element out of the equation. If people didn't stand up to Companies at all then the working force would probably be in a worse situation. Granted, this is a little different situation and speaking in general terms.


While it is not a right to work and that is earned, I don't think I view it so cold heartedly as I've seen from the posts in this thread. But anyways, getting further from the topic so just leave it at that.


I think there was potentially a better way to resolve this issue and that goes for both sides, UPS and the workers. I know they have the right to fire them, but take that out of the equation. Do you think they should have been fired for 90 minute protest? Or could they have found a better solution?

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So in summary... Winger is a selfish, weak kneed, loser that you wouldn't want to have a beer with. :blink:

Good summation. He has circular reasoning. I can assure you BB, that I've walked both lines, corporate and union. Have managed a union company and worked as a union employee. I didnt assume anything. What reality is, companies love guys like this, but dont respect them. If they dont care about their fellow employees, why should I, or can I trust them. And when you ask for help from others, like MD ..."Team please, I know a couple others on here"...I find it ironic and comical. 

But I digress, I blame myself when discussing a subject with those who have this circular reasoning, basically drawing conclusions from assumptions.

But I do not assume anything when it comes to your summation. You hit it on the head.

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Blakes Life Matters

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/ups-threatens...ng-workers


Looks like this thing is just getting started...

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I don't know the whole situation. And I don't know if I see it as a pride thing. They were doing something selfless and faced heavy consequences. And I certainly don't see it as black and white.

Exactly JT.Its not about pride, as it is sticking together as a brotherhood ( sister too ) to stand by their fellow employee who has fought for all of them; and quite possibly to prevent this bone of contention from happening again.. In this case, both, company and the workers are doing so, and not wanting to set a precedent.

Its far more than, " cool..job openings". But you get that.

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Blakes Life Matters

I don't think it was a violent protest.

 

was saying it in general, too - not only specific for just this one case. 

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was saying it in general, too - not only specific for just this one case.

So are most work protests violent? I really don't know, just asking.

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Good summation. He has circular reasoning. I can assure you BB, that I've walked both lines, corporate and union. Have managed a union company and worked as a union employee. I didnt assume anything. What reality is, companies love guys like this, but dont respect them. If they dont care about their fellow employees, why should I, or can I trust them. And when you ask for help from others, like MD ..."<span>Team please,
I know a couple others on here"...I find it ironic and comical. </span>
But I digress, I blame myself when discussing a subject with those who have this circular reasoning, basically drawing conclusions from assumptions.

But I do not assume anything when it comes to your summation. You hit it on the head.

That's where you and I differ.. Respect? I could care less for.. As long as I'm making my wage for my family, their respect is all the respect i need..

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http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/ups-threatens...ng-workers


Looks like this thing is just getting started...

 

So according to that article the guy that was initially fired that started this whole thing, was fired for clocking in on his time card earlier than he was supposed to. He was allegedly warned repeatedly not to do so and did it anyway....

 

Not sure why I'd stick up for someone like that. 

 

He claims he had permission to do so, but if so why haven't anyone on the boss side agreed with his claims??

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So are most work protests violent? I really don't know, just asking.

 

I know that we had a strike at one of our power stations a few years back. The workforce is populated mostly by rural folks who know their way around hunting rifles and such. There was never even a word stated to me as I drove in and out every day. Note however, that I was an Engineering employee therefore I could not be part of the Union so the strike really did not affect me and my going in to work did not affect those on strike.

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I'm trying to make myself more informed and less opinionated.

Stop saying whatever stupid thing you're talking about and pay attention to all the interesting things I have to say!

So you be my guest and walk off the job and get fired.. I'll take your job or someone else will, with a huge smile

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Well, life would be much simpler if we were robots and took the human element out of the equation. If people didn't stand up to Companies at all then the working force would probably be in a worse situation. Granted, this is a little different situation and speaking in general terms.


While it is not a right to work and that is earned, I don't think I view it so cold heartedly as I've seen from the posts in this thread. But anyways, getting further from the topic so just leave it at that.


I think there was potentially a better way to resolve this issue and that goes for both sides, UPS and the workers. I know they have the right to fire them, but take that out of the equation. Do you think they should have been fired for 90 minute protest? Or could they have found a better solution?

Good points, except in this case, they dont necessarily have the right to fire them. There is a process. Now, in a  right to work State thats not unionized, the company can fire at will...providing they dont violate the cardinal rules of due to age, sex, color,religion, etc. They're smarter than that...in most cases. There are renegade union employees as there are managers, particularly middle management, who have just earned a little power.

I this case, JT, I know for a fact that UPS and the Teamsters have had a long relationship, and for most of the time work well together.So this is interesting. Local 804 was the home of past president of the Teamsters, Ron Carey, who sometimes had a contentious relationship with the company. But was years ago, and most has smoothed over. Sometimes a union rep gets overzealous in his actions and sometimes the company does in theirs.Its why they have a grievance procedure. Was proper protocol followed? Arbitrarily walking off the job sounds dumb, but common in sense ( to most ) would at least wonder why 250 drivers would do this and risk their jobs? Yet again, some respect that, others get excited over a job opening at someones expense. 

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Blakes Life Matters

Exactly JT.Its not about pride, as it is sticking together as a brotherhood ( sister too ) to stand by their fellow employee who has fought for all of them; and quite possibly to prevent this bone of contention from happening again.. In this case, both, company and the workers are doing so, and not wanting to set a precedent.

Its far more than, " cool..job openings". But you get that.

 

 

Funny, in a post recently in this thread you make a point of chastising BB4 for reading too much into one small line that you had said, but apparently its justified when you do it, as you seem to be making quite a mountain from a molehill with my little quip remark of "cool job openings'. You've made mention of it what now 5 what? - separate times?? Grow a pair. It wasn't meant as literal as you took it, anyway. 

 

You're a hypocrite. Plain and simple. 

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So you be my guest and walk off the job and get fired.. I'll take your job or someone else will, with a huge smile

 

No you/ they won't because Ringo and his goon squad will beat you up if you dare try, lol

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So according to that article the guy that was initially fired that started this whole thing, was fired for clocking in on his time card earlier than he was supposed to. He was allegedly warned repeatedly not to do so and did it anyway....

 

Not sure why I'd stick up for someone like that. 

 

He claims he had permission to do so, but if so why haven't anyone on the boss side agreed with his claims??

Really?? They may have been on a witch hunt for the guy. Maybe he was a thorn in their side.That I dont know, but guessing he probably was. You think when they fired him, any management would come to his defense? That manger would be out with the 250 others. I've seen where a company sets it up quite nicely where they can find reason for discharge. So there more to this.

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Blakes Life Matters

So according to that article the guy that was initially fired that started this whole thing, was fired for clocking in on his time card earlier than he was supposed to. He was allegedly warned repeatedly not to do so and did it anyway....


Not sure why I'd stick up for someone like that.


He claims he had permission to do so, but if so why haven't anyone on the boss side agreed with his claims??

TMD, that's according to UPS. You think they are going to say he was the best employee and fire him? No. Now I'm not saying it is accurate or inaccurate, but don't you think you are being a little naive?

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TMD, that's according to UPS. You think they are going to say he was the best employee and fire him? No. Now I'm not saying it is accurate or inaccurate, but don't you think you are being a little naive?

 

All we know for sure is he was apparently clocking in early which was against policy. Not sure I'd ever go against policy that could eventually give management a reason to fire me. As a worker you have to be smart, yourself. 

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Funny, in a post recently in this thread you make a point of chastising BB4 for reading too much into one small line that you had said, but apparently its justified when you do it, as you seem to be making quite a mountain from a molehill with my little quip remark of "cool job openings'. You've made mention of it what now 5 what? - separate times?? Grow a pair. It wasn't meant as literal as you took it, anyway. 

 

You're a hypocrite. Plain and simple. 

 

Thats great. And you call out hypocrisy. You own it. You were on this very message board looking for work, or find "better" work. Then you claim." cool...job openings"...now you're trying to crawfish? 

Again...there might be some openings if the firings stick. Have you applied yet? Its good pay and bennies. Its what you were asking a while ago in your better job request.

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Blakes Life Matters