The standard for all new coaches is to get a Chip Kelly/Jim Harbaugh type of output for the 1st season, with Bill Belichek consistency the following seasons.

 

Which is unreasonable.

 

Obviously it's not unreasonable since it repeatedly happens.

 

What's unreasonable is the idea that coaches should get 3 seasons just to show they're making progress. If you're not at least making the playoffs within 3 years then that coach will never be a difference making guy.

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Schiano will take over the Penn State job after O 'Brien bolts to the NFL

 

Wait until it is official to say things like that. Bill O'Brien is "expected" to be named Texans coach. Penn State is interested in Greg Schiano "if O'Brien bolts to the NFL." No announcement yet on who is going to be the next Texans coach.

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Obviously it's not unreasonable since it repeatedly happens.

 

What's unreasonable is the idea that coaches should get 3 seasons just to show they're making progress. If you're not at least making the playoffs within 3 years then that coach will never be a difference making guy.

 

Most new head coaches have losing seasons. Jim Harbaugh and Chip Kelly are exceptions. Even Tom Landry went 1-15 in his first season. So it is unreasonable to expect what Kelly is doing.

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The standard for all new coaches is to get a Chip Kelly/Jim Harbaugh type of output for the 1st season, with Bill Belichek consistency the following seasons.

 

Which is unreasonable.

 

 

Obviously it's not unreasonable since it repeatedly happens.

 

What's unreasonable is the idea that coaches should get 3 seasons just to show they're making progress. If you're not at least making the playoffs within 3 years then that coach will never be a difference making guy.

 

Was just about to post a response to the first quote with something like this. 

 

Spot on. 

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Most new head coaches have losing seasons. Jim Harbaugh and Chip Kelly are exceptions. Even Tom Landry went 1-15 in his first season. So it is unreasonable to expect what Kelly is doing.

 

How about Reid in KC? Arians in Arizona? Schiano last year?

 

Sure it's not as common as guys coming in and losing, but it's just plain more common for guys to be losing failures.

 

I have hopes for Bradley and company, but he's still not proven anything except that the team kept trying to win, but just trying to win doesn't mean he actually knows how to get the most out of his guys.

 

It's not like we actually won or even were competitive with any good teams this year.

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Obviously it's not unreasonable since it repeatedly happens.

 

What's unreasonable is the idea that coaches should get 3 seasons just to show they're making progress. If you're not at least making the playoffs within 3 years then that coach will never be a difference making guy.

 

I get your point.

 

Also worth taking into account is that most of these guys who got fired seemed to have locker room issues, except for maybe Frazier

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How about Reid in KC? Arians in Arizona? Schiano last year?

 

Sure it's not as common as guys coming in and losing, but it's just plain more common for guys to be losing failures.

 

I have hopes for Bradley and company, but he's still not proven anything except that the team kept trying to win, but just trying to win doesn't mean he actually knows how to get the most out of his guys.

 

It's not like we actually won or even were competitive with any good teams this year.

 

don't forget McCoy in San Diego - playoffs his first year too. 

 

and Harbaugh, and Harbaugh, and Mike Smith, and Kelly, and even Rex Ryan.... (of recent years)

 

 

The last line is a good point and something everyone is overlooking. 

 

Even Del stinking Rio beat a good Colts team his rookie year. 

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don't forget McCoy in San Diego - playoffs his first year too. 

 

and Harbaugh, and Harbaugh, and Mike Smith, and Kelly, and even Rex Ryan.... (of recent years)

 

 

The last line is a good point and something everyone is overlooking. 

 

Even Del stinking Rio beat a good Colts team his rookie year. 

 

Right. I was just trying to think of some recent examples, but it's not like it's uncommon for guys to come in and right a ship straight away.

 

I'll give Bradley a little slack since I think the Jaguars roster coming into this season was the worst NFL roster I've ever seen, but I also don't doubt that some of the true top tier guys would have had this team at least in some truly competitive games against winning teams this season.

 

It's also conceivable that a top tier coaching staff would have made Gabbert and Henne look better than they are, and that's what concerns me the most. It's clear Henne didn't grow or shine any brighter than the rest of his career (as would be expected) and Gabbert completely flamed out.

 

Harbaugh made Alex Smith look like an all star.

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Right. I was just trying to think of some recent examples, but it's not like it's uncommon for guys to come in and right a ship straight away.

 

I'll give Bradley a little slack since I think the Jaguars roster coming into this season was the worst NFL roster I've ever seen, but I also don't doubt that some of the true top tier guys would have had this team at least in some truly competitive games against winning teams this season.

 

It's also conceivable that a top tier coaching staff would have made Gabbert and Henne look better than they are, and that's what concerns me the most. It's clear Henne didn't grow or shine any brighter than the rest of his career (as would be expected) and Gabbert completely flamed out.

 

Harbaugh made Alex Smith look like an all star.

 

Go back to your last line up there too. You might not realize what a great point you made. 

 

What games vs good teams were we really even competitive in this year? Usually if a coach is good, there will at least be ONE upset in a given season vs a good team on the schedule. Gus had zero. As mentioned, even Jack who wasn't all that good of a coach beat the Indy Colts his first year, and that was with a rookie in Leftwich. 

 

The jury is still very much out on Gus. 

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Go back to your last line up there too. You might not realize what a great point you made. 

 

What games vs good teams were we really even competitive in this year? Usually if a coach is good, there will at least be ONE upset in a given season vs a good team on the schedule. Gus had zero. As mentioned, even Jack who wasn't all that good of a coach beat the Indy Colts his first year, and that was with a rookie in Leftwich. 

 

The jury is still very much out on Gus. 

 

Oh believe me, I understand my point was salient, I churn them out constantly. Most people miss the finer points of what's going on in the wash of the whole season, but this has been a concerning year in spite of the doubled win total.

 

If the texans hadn't fallen apart and just played like a middle of the road NFL team the Jaguars would have once again won a total of 2 games this season.

 

Like I said, this may be the worst roster I've ever seen, but Bradley so far hasn't done anything to convince me he and the staff couldn't easily be upgraded.

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How about Reid in KC? Arians in Arizona? Schiano last year?

 

Sure it's not as common as guys coming in and losing, but it's just plain more common for guys to be losing failures.

 

I have hopes for Bradley and company, but he's still not proven anything except that the team kept trying to win, but just trying to win doesn't mean he actually knows how to get the most out of his guys.

 

It's not like we actually won or even were competitive with any good teams this year.

 

Andy Reid had been a head coach for years. He was just coaching a different team. Bruce Arians was not exactly a rookie either because he was the interim HC in Indy. I was referring to coaches who never had that job in the NFL before.

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As long as Jerry continues down that path, the Cowboys will never win anything of consequence. 

 

You say that like it's a bad thing...

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Most new head coaches have losing seasons. Jim Harbaugh and Chip Kelly are exceptions. Even Tom Landry went 1-15 in his first season. So it is unreasonable to expect what Kelly is doing.

 

They played 16 game seasons in 1960? Who knew?

 

(I think you meant Jimmy Johnson. The coach, not the race car driver guy.)

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

You say that like it's a bad thing...

 

It is. The Cowboys have been irrelevant for too long. The NFL is better when the Cowboys are a legit SB contender, something they have not been since the mid 1990s. 

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It is. The Cowboys have been irrelevant for too long. The NFL is better when the Cowboys are a legit SB contender, something they have not been since the mid 1990s. 

 

Gotta disagree with you. The NFL needs an enema. The steelers, 49ers, packers, and cowboys having a few decades of losing while teams that have traditionally not been excellent succeed is needed.

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They played 16 game seasons in 1960? Who knew?

 

(I think you meant Jimmy Johnson. The coach, not the race car driver guy.)

 

Yeah, that's who I meant. Good catch.

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Gotta disagree with you. The NFL needs an enema. The steelers, 49ers, packers, and cowboys having a few decades of losing while teams that have traditionally not been excellent succeed is needed.

 

The Cowboys have not been excellent in 2 decades. 

 

Perhaps agreed for your other examples. 

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The Cowboys have not been excellent in 2 decades. 

 

Perhaps agreed for your other examples. 

 

The Cowboys haven't been excellent, but they also haven't experienced what they need, which is 10-20 years of sub .500 seasons with most of them being of the sort that really tests their fanship, much like the Jaguars have been experiencing for most of the last 13 years.

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The Cowboys haven't been excellent, but they also haven't experienced what they need, which is 10-20 years of sub .500 seasons with most of them being of the sort that really tests their fanship, much like the Jaguars have been experiencing for most of the last 13 years.

 

What they need is a new owner who will hire a president and general manager and let the coach make all football decisions.

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The news of Falcons Defensive Line Coach Ray ' Sugar Bear'  Hamilton being fired likely got lost in the shuffle with so much happening on Black Monday,   In fairness to the former Jaguars D-Line coach under JDR,  did he really have enough to work with in Atlanta?    I have my doubts.

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/201...s-of-ball/

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