(07-04-2020, 03:07 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote:

(07-04-2020, 11:41 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: The degree of curve was not inevitable.

It could have been mitigated much more effectively and could STILL be mitigated much more effectively. 

The administration's inaction and it's continued dissent of scientific evidence is largely to blame. 
History will undoubtedly reflect that this pandemic was mismanaged by this administration. 
Hell, this president's rallies and events are "spreader parties" full of unmasked and un-distanced science deniers. 

Now we are seeing new concentrated outbreaks in cities like Houston and Miami that could become nearly as ugly as NYC was several weeks ago. This administration's encouragement to those state governors to re-open and remove restrictions is part of the problem and will receive blame accordingly. 

Your insistence on viewing this as some right vs left or GOP vs Dem world is clouding your ability to look at significant issues.

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Regarding your gulag comment and others like it:

You need to understand that our great nation operates with carefully designed checks and balances that prevent extremism from going too far from any branch. 

The same powers that have resulted in Trump only building 3 miles of fencing instead of some grandiose wall at our southern border will also keep someone like Bernie Sanders from turning our nation into your socialist nightmares. 
There's only a small portion of "the left" that's radical or violent and their voices will be squelched by the more moderate. Just as those they elect will be checked and balanced once in office. 
These extreme worst case scenarios you toss around are fantasy and serve no one - certainly they don't lend credibility to your posts.

I get almost all of my information from apolitical doctors. I avoid those who seem to be repeating talking points pushed out by the media or politicians. I am hardly an extremist  on this issue. In fact, this is one of the few issues I have an opinion on that is free from political bias, because my opinions were formed before Trump ever started talking about it. I have followed it since January. I was watching what other nations were doing, like Taiwan and S.Korea, while most people here claimed it wouldn't be a big deal. Spare me your lecture on this topic. 

As to the latter part of your statement, I acknowledge my comment was hyperbolic. It was done so intentionally, in part because I think Mikesez is the biggest moron on this board, and also in part because I think there is truth to that statement. I am fully aware of how our government works. I am also fully aware that there is an awful lot of gaslighting going on these days. People are becoming increasingly convinced this nation is "systemically" flawed, and won't be changed until we change the system. That new idea is called socialism, and it's gaining support without most people even understanding what that means. You see the violence and frustration escalating. These things don't happen overnight. There is a buildup that eventually overflows into the streets. It's getting there.

Historically, most nations function pretty well right up until they don't. Many nations have fallen because "moderates" come to think comfort and civility are the status quo. It's not. People are not born wealthy. Wealth is created. People are not born civil. Civility is created. People are not born peaceful. Peace is created. People are not born with an innate law. Law is created. You start kicking out those pillars and it will collapse. 

You seem like a good dude, man, but look at the pillars that are getting kicked out in our society. You're being told we're kicking out the pillars of racism, but we're kicking out the pillars of law and order. You're being told we're kicking out the pillars of the patriarchy, but we're kicking out the pillars of the nuclear family. You're being told we're kicking out the pillars of equity, but we're kicking out the pillars of wealth and hard work. You're being told we're kicking out the pillars of offence, but we're kicking out the pillars of civility. You're being told we're kicking out the pillars of injustice, but we're kicking out the pillars of peace. 

I am as liberal as a conservative can get. I am open to looking at any one mechanism and making changes to try to improve upon what we're doing. I am not cool with burning everything to the ground and building it from scratch, using an ideology that has proven time and time again to be destructive, oppressive, immoral, and unjust. You think the moderates will come around, but you can't even see that there is a real threat coming from the left. If you do, you are dismissive of it. I was that way about 10 years ago, but it's bigger, better funded, and more organized than I realized until recently. 

I hope you are correct about moderates, but our elites have become SO corrupt. Did you see the proposal made by Bret Weinstein about the Darkhorse Duo? I think it is worth considering. Something has to be done to stop this division, and I don't think fixating on the right is the way to go.

Thanks for the thoughtful response. 

I maintain that the curve we've seen and the current spikes we are experiencing could have been managed MUCH better in a number of ways. Ways I spent pages on in the related thread, so I'll leave that stuff for that thread. 

Regarding the bolded. That's just a bunch of rhetoric saying absolutely nothing. It's pretty and colorful language, but it's neither accurate nor sensical in terms of correlation. 
Firstly - I'm not "being told" any of this that you suggest.  Secondly we aren't seeing any pillars kicked out.  We NEED to see a few pillars kicked out. All we've got so far is largely placating, symbolic baby-steps and lots of real work to do in the name of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. 

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On topic:

Can someone tell me what this moron is talking about???  

Who the hell is he accusing of slandering American WWII soldiers and Union Soldiers of the Civil War?

https://twitter.com/QuickTake/status/127...31712?s=20

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