Aggression is not breed specific and pits have a bad reputation because of their owners who most of the time don’t know how raise them.

---

Whether someone has a liberal, or conservative viewpoint, a authoritative figure should not lock a thread for the sole purpose to get the last word in all the while prohibiting someone else from being able to respond.

Much like kids, it’s how well they are raised and handled.

I think it's safe to say a poorly raised and handled pit bull is more dangerous than a poorly raised and handled Chihuahua, but not half as annoying.

Agreed. Don't underestimate those little, beady-eyed rats though!

---

I have 2 dogs. Both are lab/hound mixes. They wouldn't hurt a fly, but I also know not to "poke the bear." No dog should ever be bothered during their meal times. That's just something every kid should be taught. Dogs base their entire lives around food and if they perceive someone might take that food away, you never know what can happen. Most dogs do nothing when you mess with their food, but others (it doesn't matter the breed,) might try and rip your arm off. I can do anything to my dog's food while they are eating and they do nothing, but if one dog looks at the other dog sideways, during mealtime, there's a fight brewing. They never actually bite one another, just growling, teeth gnashing and charges, but as soon as I start yelling for them to quit, they stop. You just have to be able to read a dog. Aggression is not breed specific. I saw an interview with Cesar Milan (The Dog Whisperer) and he said the worst bite he ever suffered from a dog was a yellow lab. My dad was bitten by a Saint Bernard as a kid and my sister was bitten by a Cocker Spaniel. There was even a lady last week who was mauled to death by a pack of Daschunds! Yes, you read that right,  weiner dogs! I still don't understand how that happened though. She should've been able to just kick them off.

But that's the thing. Dogs will defend their turf, and their food, but after one bite that succeeds in driving the "threat" away they will stop. No doubt in the case of your two dogs when there's a disagreement the winner is determined before even a single bite. People don't understand this, so sometimes it comes down to a bite, but not a second bite.

That's most dogs. Normal dogs will bite but they won't maul someone to death. Somehow I doubt that six year old remained to duke it out with a pit bull after the first bite. The dog in this case kept attacking long after the fight was won, and this is a problem with pit bulls, rarely with other breeds.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Pitbulls are banned here. Wish the same was true of rottweilers too. It only needs a young kid to go near one while they are eating and it could lead to disaster.

So apparently something like the pitbull breed has increased its population 10x in the last decade in the US (due to breeders and the dogs popularity for what I believe is all the wrong reasons- the bad image). The funny thing is every time a pitbull mauls someone 2 things will happen: A. The owner will claim that the dog never did anything in its life and the dog is the sweetest you ever saw prior to this plus it was trained, and B. other pitbull owners/defenders will claim that the dog wasn't 'well trained.' 

As someone who worked in a trauma unit and got to interact with Shiners hospital for children, let me be clear: Pitbulls are, by far, the most dangerous breed to have around kids (even "trained"). They may or may not bite humans more often than other breeds, but they definitely kill way more often than other breeds when they do attack. Also they definitely attack other dogs more than other breeds tho, as that is literally what they were breed for 'gameness'. There is literally no reason for this breed to exist as dog fighting is illegal. And yet people still try to breed them for 'gameness.' And yes you can tell what an American Staffordshire Terrier is, and the lay person can id a pit bull as proven in prior court cases.

Just highlighting a couple of many studies:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication...nstitution
"Pit bull bites were implicated in half of all surgeries performed and over 2.5 times as likely to bite in multiple anatomic locations as compared to other breeds."

Characteristics of 1616 Consecutive Dog Bite Injuries at a Single... (PDF Download Available). Available from: https://www.researchgate.net/publication...nstitution [accessed May 28 2018].

"Our Trauma and Emergency Surgery Services treated 228 patients with dog bite injuries; for 82 of those patients, the breed of dog involved was recorded (29 were injured by pit bulls). Compared with attacks by other breeds of dogs, attacks by pit bulls were associated with a higher median Injury Severity Scale score (4 vs. 1; P = 0.002), a higher risk of an admission Glasgow Coma Scale score of 8 or lower (17.2% vs. 0%; P = 0.006), higher median hospital charges ($10,500 vs. $7200; P = 0.003), and a higher risk of death (10.3% vs. 0%; P = 0.041). Attacks by pit bulls are associated with higher morbidity rates, higher hospital charges, and a higher risk of death than are attacks by other breeds of dogs. Strict regulation of pit bulls may substantially reduce the US mortality rates related to dog bites."

Mortality, Mauling, and Maiming by Vicious Dogs. Available from: https://www.researchgate.net/publication...cious_Dogs [accessed May 28 2018].
https://www.researchgate.net/publication...cious_Dogs
https://www.jpedsurg.org/article/S0022-3...3/abstract 
"Pit bulls were most frequently responsible, accounting for 39% (83/213) of incidents in which dog breed was documented. Fifty-three percent (150/282) of dogs belonged to the patient's immediate or extended family."


I don't hate pit bulls, any more than I hate bears, sharks or any other dangerous animals. But people don't usually try to have alligators/sharks/tigers as pets. They do with pitbulls. Denying that the breed is more dangerous than others doesn't make a pitbull less dangerous. They are a terrible dog to have around children and I feel personally obligated to make sure that anyone who reads this understands that even if its unpopular. 

For additional studies: https://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-statis...tudies.php

---

Yes, it's improvement, but it's Blaine Gabbert 2012 level improvement. - Pirkster

http://youtu.be/ouGM3NWpjxk The Home Hypnotist!

http://youtu.be/XQRFkn0Ly3A Media on the Brain Link!
 

Peyton must store oxygen in that forehead of his. No way I'd still be alive after all that choking.

 

Pitbulls are banned here. Wish the same was true of rottweilers too. It only needs a young kid to go near one while they are eating and it could lead to disaster.

So apparently something like the pitbull breed has increased its population 10x in the last decade in the US (due to breeders and the dogs popularity for what I believe is all the wrong reasons- the bad image). The funny thing is every time a pitbull mauls someone 2 things will happen: A. The owner will claim that the dog never did anything in its life and the dog is the sweetest you ever saw prior to this plus it was trained, and B. other pitbull owners/defenders will claim that the dog wasn't 'well trained.' 

As someone who worked in a trauma unit and got to interact with Shiners hospital for children, let me be clear: Pitbulls are, by far, the most dangerous breed to have around kids (even "trained"). They may or may not bite humans more often than other breeds, but they definitely kill way more often than other breeds when they do attack. Also they definitely attack other dogs more than other breeds tho, as that is literally what they were breed for 'gameness'. There is literally no reason for this breed to exist as dog fighting is illegal. And yet people still try to breed them for 'gameness.' And yes you can tell what an American Staffordshire Terrier is, and the lay person can id a pit bull as proven in prior court cases.

But if dog fighting is illegal it surely isn't the reason why we have this problem. I mean, we have a LAW! Maybe we need some common sense dog purchasing reform like stringent background checks at pet stores, jaw locks, and to ban assault terriers (cut ears, more than 10 spots, and black in color).

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

So apparently something like the pitbull breed has increased its population 10x in the last decade in the US (due to breeders and the dogs popularity for what I believe is all the wrong reasons- the bad image). The funny thing is every time a pitbull mauls someone 2 things will happen: A. The owner will claim that the dog never did anything in its life and the dog is the sweetest you ever saw prior to this plus it was trained, and B. other pitbull owners/defenders will claim that the dog wasn't 'well trained.' 

As someone who worked in a trauma unit and got to interact with Shiners hospital for children, let me be clear: Pitbulls are, by far, the most dangerous breed to have around kids (even "trained"). They may or may not bite humans more often than other breeds, but they definitely kill way more often than other breeds when they do attack. Also they definitely attack other dogs more than other breeds tho, as that is literally what they were breed for 'gameness'. There is literally no reason for this breed to exist as dog fighting is illegal. And yet people still try to breed them for 'gameness.' And yes you can tell what an American Staffordshire Terrier is, and the lay person can id a pit bull as proven in prior court cases.

But if dog fighting is illegal it surely isn't the reason why we have this problem. I mean, we have a LAW! Maybe we need some common sense dog purchasing reform like stringent background checks at pet stores, jaw locks, and to ban assault terriers (cut ears, more than 10 spots, and black in color).

Actually, this would be good. Many pet stores are supplied by puppy mills, where the dogs are living in filthy conditions, being bred over and over, often to their siblings or parent. Dogs who are inbred are more prone to birth defects, diseases and mental issues, the same as humans.

---

But if dog fighting is illegal it surely isn't the reason why we have this problem. I mean, we have a LAW! Maybe we need some common sense dog purchasing reform like stringent background checks at pet stores, jaw locks, and to ban assault terriers (cut ears, more than 10 spots, and black in color).

Actually, this would be good. Many pet stores are supplied by puppy mills, where the dogs are living in filthy conditions, being bred over and over, often to their siblings or parent. Dogs who are inbred are more prone to birth defects, diseases and mental issues, the same as humans.

I would expect the store to provide a quality product, aren't there already legal means to address such a problem?

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

But if dog fighting is illegal it surely isn't the reason why we have this problem. I mean, we have a LAW! Maybe we need some common sense dog purchasing reform like stringent background checks at pet stores, jaw locks, and to ban assault terriers (cut ears, more than 10 spots, and black in color).

Actually, this would be good. Many pet stores are supplied by puppy mills, where the dogs are living in filthy conditions, being bred over and over, often to their siblings or parent. Dogs who are inbred are more prone to birth defects, diseases and mental issues, the same as humans.

Oddly enough, most pure breeds are highly inbred.

---

Actually, this would be good. Many pet stores are supplied by puppy mills, where the dogs are living in filthy conditions, being bred over and over, often to their siblings or parent. Dogs who are inbred are more prone to birth defects, diseases and mental issues, the same as humans.

I would expect the store to provide a quality product, aren't there already legal means to address such a problem?

I have no idea. I go to shelters to get my dogs.

---

Actually, this would be good. Many pet stores are supplied by puppy mills, where the dogs are living in filthy conditions, being bred over and over, often to their siblings or parent. Dogs who are inbred are more prone to birth defects, diseases and mental issues, the same as humans.

I would expect the store to provide a quality product, aren't there already legal means to address such a problem?

Don't buy a dog from a puppy mill. I happen to be good friends with a pet shop manager, and he does not get any of his dogs from mills. In fact, to have 'papers' there are very strict standards on how the dogs are breed (i.e. how closely related they can be, how many pups a female is allowed to have and how often, also have to have a placement plan for the dog after they are done breeding). But I still see puppy mills all over the place in the country, and of course, craigslist. Interacting with him actually changed my perspective on purebreed dogs, I used to volunteer at the ASPCA and I thought that purebreeds shouldn't exist thanks to 'puppy mills' who would just dump the 'left overs' on us. 

Now that I understand American Kennel Club standards, I realize that those puppy mills have nothing to do with the actual papered purebreed dogs. They look like them, but how they are raised and treated are totally different.

---

Yes, it's improvement, but it's Blaine Gabbert 2012 level improvement. - Pirkster

http://youtu.be/ouGM3NWpjxk The Home Hypnotist!

http://youtu.be/XQRFkn0Ly3A Media on the Brain Link!
 

Peyton must store oxygen in that forehead of his. No way I'd still be alive after all that choking.

 

So apparently something like the pitbull breed has increased its population 10x in the last decade in the US (due to breeders and the dogs popularity for what I believe is all the wrong reasons- the bad image). The funny thing is every time a pitbull mauls someone 2 things will happen: A. The owner will claim that the dog never did anything in its life and the dog is the sweetest you ever saw prior to this plus it was trained, and B. other pitbull owners/defenders will claim that the dog wasn't 'well trained.' 

As someone who worked in a trauma unit and got to interact with Shiners hospital for children, let me be clear: Pitbulls are, by far, the most dangerous breed to have around kids (even "trained"). They may or may not bite humans more often than other breeds, but they definitely kill way more often than other breeds when they do attack. Also they definitely attack other dogs more than other breeds tho, as that is literally what they were breed for 'gameness'. There is literally no reason for this breed to exist as dog fighting is illegal. And yet people still try to breed them for 'gameness.' And yes you can tell what an American Staffordshire Terrier is, and the lay person can id a pit bull as proven in prior court cases.

But if dog fighting is illegal it surely isn't the reason why we have this problem. I mean, we have a LAW! Maybe we need some common sense dog purchasing reform like stringent background checks at pet stores, jaw locks, and to ban assault terriers (cut ears, more than 10 spots, and black in color).

Could you please reach a little further? There's a can of salt on the top shelf that I just can't reach.

On a more serious note, I wouldn't complain at all if the business of selling dogs and cats was taken away from pet stores. Shelters and rescue groups should be the first stop, not the "only poor people get dogs there" location.

---

I am on the fence when it comes to this breed. I've never had any bad experiences or encounters with one. And I've been around quite a few. With that said. Pound for pound. It can be a lethal animal as we've all seen over the years. And even though there's far more aggressive breeds out there, both, smaller and larger than it can be. Those attacks were minimal or far less reported. I don't believe this breed deserves to be outlawed or put down though.

And I agree with the Alpha mentality. Certain breeds need certain direction and discipline. I don't mean rule with an iron fist though. But a commanding presence that understands and has a knack with dogs in general. That's not a breed you should ever take lightly. My grandfather and father used to actually breed and raise up Doberman's and Rottweiler's for guard jobs. And my father will tell you and most people that even with a sharp instructor or teacher that sometimes [BLEEP] happens. My aunt, when she was a little girl, she accidentally slammed a door on the biggest dog's paw that they had for years and after that he was "done" with her.

He wanted nothing to do with her. He would snarl and growl at her and he never liked being around her after that. He would actually leave the room or slink behind my father or grandfather anytime she was around. Kids will be kids. While it's terrible and sad to see a six year old die in such a brutal manner. The fact is. I don't know what happened between that dog and that kid. But the parents should have known better or been better prepared. I love my dog. I've had him for six years. He's mild mannered and usually happy go lucky and full of life around other people and kids. But I'll tell you right now. If he was ever attacking someone for no apparent reason other than just to attack. He's dead. I'll put him down myself.

Because at that point I've failed him as an owner and I've failed myself as an owner.

---

"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Much like kids, it’s how well they are raised and handled.

That might be true if it were true of other breeds too. While you can occasionally read about an attack by some other breed, one particular breed, pit bulls, account for more than half of the attacks on humans. I'm pretty sure pit bulls don't make up half of the total dog population.

Or are you saying it's only pit bulls that are poorly raised and handled?

By nature, Pit Bulls (which technically isn't even a real breed) are actually less aggressive than Dalmations and about 7 other breeds https://pethelpful.com/dogs/10-Most-Aggr...nformation
And yeah Pit Bulls are notoriously raised to be fighting dogs... so they are probably treated more poorly and raised incorrectly (and also inbred the most) than any other  breed

---

That might be true if it were true of other breeds too. While you can occasionally read about an attack by some other breed, one particular breed, pit bulls, account for more than half of the attacks on humans. I'm pretty sure pit bulls don't make up half of the total dog population.

Or are you saying it's only pit bulls that are poorly raised and handled?

By nature, Pit Bulls (which technically isn't even a real breed) are actually less aggressive than Dalmations and about 7 other breeds https://pethelpful.com/dogs/10-Most-Aggr...nformation
And yeah Pit Bulls are notoriously raised to be fighting dogs... so they are probably treated more poorly and raised incorrectly (and also inbred the most) than any other  breed

In your link, a mauling from a pit bull is recorded as one incident, the same as a chihuahua barking at a stranger. 

Dog aggression is defined as dangerous behavior directed at another individual, including other animals. This behavior includes barking, biting, lunging, snarling, etc. 

While barking, lunging, and snarling are disturbing traits in dogs, they don't send people to the hospital, and one bite is not the same as a mauling. From HandsomeRob86's links, Pit Bulls (and we know what they are even if they aren't considered a real breed by the AKC) were responsible for 100% of the deaths in the study. Death is a lot worse than being barked at.

BTW, have you been to a dog shelter lately? The last time I went almost every dog there was a pit bull. Maybe that's because they're overbred, or because people don't want to adopt them. But it also could be because they are the breed most likely to threaten their former owners. Probably it's a combination of all three.


 

---

                                                                          

"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

By nature, Pit Bulls (which technically isn't even a real breed) are actually less aggressive than Dalmations and about 7 other breeds https://pethelpful.com/dogs/10-Most-Aggr...nformation
And yeah Pit Bulls are notoriously raised to be fighting dogs... so they are probably treated more poorly and raised incorrectly (and also inbred the most) than any other  breed

In your link, a mauling from a pit bull is recorded as one incident, the same as a chihuahua barking at a stranger. 

Dog aggression is defined as dangerous behavior directed at another individual, including other animals. This behavior includes barking, biting, lunging, snarling, etc. 

While barking, lunging, and snarling are disturbing traits in dogs, they don't send people to the hospital, and one bite is not the same as a mauling. From HandsomeRob86's links, Pit Bulls (and we know what they are even if they aren't considered a real breed by the AKC) were responsible for 100% of the deaths in the study. Death is a lot worse than being barked at.

BTW, have you been to a dog shelter lately? The last time I went almost every dog there was a pit bull. Maybe that's because they're overbred, or because people don't want to adopt them. But it also could be because they are the breed most likely to threaten their former owners. Probably it's a combination of all three.


 

A mixture of factors like over breeding, bans, lifestyle changes (kids) in combination with a bad reputation. It takes a very strong alpha in the household. They certainly aren't a breed for the lazy. Sucks to see humans ruining the breed.

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PIT BULL GRABS BABY BY DIAPER, SAVES HER FROM FIRE

STOCKTON, California - Man's best friend is being hailed as a hero by one family in Stockton, California.

Sasha, the family's pit bull, started barking and alerted the family to the fire spreading from their neighbor's home.

As soon as Latana Chai opened the door, Sasha sprang into action to make sure the smallest member of the family was safe.

"I ran into the room and I see Sasha, she has my baby like by the diaper, just dragging her off the bed trying to get her to safety," said Chai.

https://www.google.com/amp/abc7chicago.c...e/3589872/

Raised properly they're good dogs.

---

PIT BULL GRABS BABY BY DIAPER, SAVES HER FROM FIRE

STOCKTON, California - Man's best friend is being hailed as a hero by one family in Stockton, California.

Sasha, the family's pit bull, started barking and alerted the family to the fire spreading from their neighbor's home.

As soon as Latana Chai opened the door, Sasha sprang into action to make sure the smallest member of the family was safe.

"I ran into the room and I see Sasha, she has my baby like by the diaper, just dragging her off the bed trying to get her to safety," said Chai.

https://www.google.com/amp/abc7chicago.c...e/3589872/

Raised properly they're good dogs.

This will likely be ignored by a lot of people simply because they refuse to believe anything other than their opinion that Pit Bulls are nothing but blood thirsty killers. 

Pits are incredibly smart dogs. There's some Cops in Washington that use them as their K9 dogs. Drug and explosive detecting K9s.

Bad dogs are created by bad owners.

---

https://www.google.com/amp/abc7chicago.c...e/3589872/

Raised properly they're good dogs.

This will likely be ignored by a lot of people simply because they refuse to believe anything other than their opinion that Pit Bulls are nothing but blood thirsty killers. 

Pits are incredibly smart dogs. There's some Cops in Washington that use them as their K9 dogs. Drug and explosive detecting K9s.

Bad dogs are created by bad owners.

I was going to ignore it, but since you brought it up, there's a big difference between how a dog treats a family member vs. how they treat a stranger. 

There was also a case where a lion saved a person.  Does that mean that people should be allowed to keep lions as pets and breed lions in their poorly fenced backyards? 

The point being that one example does not prove that EVERY pit bull is not a killer. Likewise, one example (or in the case of pit bulls, many) does not mean that EVERY pit bull is a killer. But pit bulls make up an overwhelming percentage of the dogs that kill people, and an even greater percentage of dogs that kill people without being given specific training to do so.

You have to train a german shepherd to kill, while you have to train some (not all) pit bulls not to kill. See the difference?

---

                                                                          

"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

This will likely be ignored by a lot of people simply because they refuse to believe anything other than their opinion that Pit Bulls are nothing but blood thirsty killers. 

Pits are incredibly smart dogs. There's some Cops in Washington that use them as their K9 dogs. Drug and explosive detecting K9s.

Bad dogs are created by bad owners.

I was going to ignore it, but since you brought it up, there's a big difference between how a dog treats a family member vs. how they treat a stranger. 

There was also a case where a lion saved a person.  Does that mean that people should be allowed to keep lions as pets and breed lions in their poorly fenced backyards? 

The point being that one example does not prove that EVERY pit bull is not a killer. Likewise, one example (or in the case of pit bulls, many) does not mean that EVERY pit bull is a killer. But pit bulls make up an overwhelming percentage of the dogs that kill people, and an even greater percentage of dogs that kill people without being given specific training to do so.

You have to train a german shepherd to kill, while you have to train some (not all) pit bulls not to kill. See the difference?

Lol, what a straw man argument, Lions?! Lol.


A Lion is a wild animal. Dogs, yes even pit bulls are domesticated animals. I'm not even going to entertain that argument.

And no, you don't "have to train a pit bull not to kill". You simply have to be a responsible owner that understands the needs of the breed.

---

I was going to ignore it, but since you brought it up, there's a big difference between how a dog treats a family member vs. how they treat a stranger. 

There was also a case where a lion saved a person.  Does that mean that people should be allowed to keep lions as pets and breed lions in their poorly fenced backyards? 

The point being that one example does not prove that EVERY pit bull is not a killer. Likewise, one example (or in the case of pit bulls, many) does not mean that EVERY pit bull is a killer. But pit bulls make up an overwhelming percentage of the dogs that kill people, and an even greater percentage of dogs that kill people without being given specific training to do so.

You have to train a german shepherd to kill, while you have to train some (not all) pit bulls not to kill. See the difference?

Lol, what a straw man argument, Lions?! Lol.


A Lion is a wild animal. Dogs, yes even pit bulls are domesticated animals. I'm not even going to entertain that argument.

And no, you don't "have to train a pit bull not to kill". You simply have to be a responsible owner that understands the needs of the breed.

A straw man argument? How about the actions of one single pit bull out of four million as a strawman argument? My point wasn't to compare lions to pit bulls, it was to show that one incident does not prove anything.

Pit bulls are "domesticated. " They have also been bred for over a hundred years for dogfighting. If merely 1% of the existing pit bulls are capable of killing that's still 40,000 dogs that could kill a child. And unlike wild animals, dogs have no fear of humans.

According to this article 51% of dog bites are from pit bulls. More than half. Do pit bulls make up anywhere close to half the dogs in the USA?

Are pit bulls dangerous?

And 71% of fatalities. They kill, not just bite:

From 2005 to 2017, pit bulls killed 284 Americans, about one citizen every 17 days.

This article has the active link

As far as "the needs of the breed" what does that mean? The need to train them not to kill? If they require significantly different training than other breeds, that points to a problem in the breed itself.

I've seen several pit bulls in my time at the dog park or owned by friends. The dogs were all very nice and friendly to me. But that doesn't change the statistics.

I'm not suggesting that they be exterminated. Sadly, a million pit pulls a year are euthanized, and I'm sure being dumped at the pound when the owner loses control has a lot to do with that. What I would suggest is that people be required to pass a strict test in order to be able to breed them, and that the designated breeders emphasize docility to get the breed in line with other breeds in that regard.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"