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Random Musings on Training Camp Eve

#1

At least looking solely from the narrow window of football fans, our long national nightmare is over!  NFL Football is back!!!

Some of the things that have popped in my mind over the past few days:

1.  Where has everybody been?!?  I know we were in the dead zone of the offseason, but I would think as training camp approaches, the posting would pick up, especially considering the Jaguars are considered contenders heading into this preseason for the first time in ages.  Yet the board has been a virtual ghost town.  I can't believe you guys have the temerity...the unmitigated gall to have lives outside the message board!  If that's not a violation of the COC, it should be.   Laughing  Seriously, as always, I look forward to discussing and debating football with you guys this year.

2.  It is my deepest hope that the lawsuits surrounding Marcell Dareus are wholly baseless and are thrown out of court for any number of reasons.  From a human decency perspective, the idea of rape-whether through the actual bodily harm, the threat of bodily harm, or through the use of substances that inhibit the ability of one to voice consent or objection-is most unpleasant.  Any Jaguars fan interested in a positive team image may also be concerned about the effect such allegations might have on the team's image.  But from an on field perspective, an early season Dareus suspension could have disastrous consequences for a team with legitimate Super Bowl aspirations.

An examination of the first half of the schedule, listed below, is instructive on this point.

Week 1  at N.Y. Giants
Week 2  New England Patriots
Week 3  Tennessee tacks
Week 4  N.Y. Jets
Week 5  at Kansas City
Week 6  at Dallas

The Giants retooled this offseason, adding veteran OLs LT Nate Solder from the Pats and Patrick Omameh from us, in addition to prized rookie RB Saquon Barkley and second round road grading G Will Hernandez.  In a most optimistic speculation (one not likely to happen), early on the Giants would rely heavily on a running game while the team learns the offense and the offensive line gels.  But assuming no such apprehensions from the Giants coaching staff, it stands to reason an effective running game added to an impressive array of receiving threats in OBJ and Engram would make them difficult to defend.  New England lost LT Nate Solder and will have either a rookie with short limbs in Isaiah Wynn or a journeyman at LT, highly drafted RB in Sony Michel, and will have dependable Brady target Julian Edelman suspended the first four games.  Depending upon what happens in week 1 against the Texans, it may not be a stretch to see Belichick depend more heavily on the running game to protect Brady and mitigate the impact of an opposing pass rush.  While the tacks brought aboard Mike Vrabel in the hopes of revamping a moribund passing game, they still don't have much at WR.  Until proven otherwise, their bread and butter offensively will be the running game.  The Jets will come to town likely with rookie QB Sam Darnold behind C, a questionable offensive line, and memories of considerable success running the ball against the Jaguars last year.  Seeing them rely heavily upon the running game here would not be a shock.  While Andy Reid is known for being a WCO coach that jazzes up passing games, the truth is he has presided over strong running games over the years, featuring guys like Duce Staley, Brian Westbrook, LeSean McCoy, and second year stud Kareem Hunt.  Finally, Dallas will likely look to pound the ball, given they have a strong offensive line,a big bruising back in Ezekiel Elliott, and their passing game is missing two experienced stalwart receiving threats in WR Dez Bryant (released) and TE Jason Witten (retired). 

Taken together, if Dareus' run stopping ability is absent from the lineup due to suspension (or, for that matter injury) early in the season, winning in this early stretch of games will be more difficult.  A slow start resulting from a lessened ability to stop the run could mean the difference between gaining home field advantage and playing in the wild card round, or between making the playoffs or not.

3.  On a related note, while there is still a day before rookies report, and while the current CBA has all but eliminated rookie holdouts, there is one abiding question:  why hasn't Taven Byrant signed yet?  I'm not sounding the alarm yet, but even though the plan is to bring him along slowly and groom him, it doesn't mitigate the need for him to be here and not miss any time due to a holdout.

4.  I will be the first to acknowledge the guys running the Jaguars know way more than message board hacks like me, but I find the decision to make Fournette drop more weight to be curious.  At the 228 or so pounds he played at last year, Fournette displayed breakaway ability, as evidenced in 90 and 75 yard TDs runs.  While the weight loss brings the promise of improved quickness and better conditioning, were those things issues last year?  From my perspective, Fournette was limited by a persistent ankle injury, an interior OL that sometimes did not run block effectively, and opposing 8 man fronts that did not respect the Jaguars passing game and loaded up to stop the run.  Furthermore, I am left to wonder if there would be any negative effect on him.  It seems to me power and physicality is a big part of Fournette's game.  If he has less mass to for an opponent to stop, will he generate less power? (I'm sure physics majors and others more scientifically inclined/competent are cringing at my wording here.)

5.  From a more league wide perspective, I think an underrated story from this offseason could potentially have long ranging ramifications.  Seven (7) experienced officials have retired from their officiating duties this past offseason, including Jeff Triplette (a good thing) and Ed Hochuli (not so good).  This is a development that could cut both ways.  This presents the opportunity to bring in officials with younger eyes and more spry legs to better keep up with the action, which could lead to better officiating.  On the other hand, the fiasco with the replacement refs a few years back shows the value of having experienced and competent (?) officials working the games.  I am compelled to believe the constant, reactionary, and oft ill conceived rules changes played a role in some of the departures.  I cringe when considering inexperienced officials trying to make sense of the new rules governing what a catch is (only recently clarified), and the new helmet rules (which have yet to be clarified).  In short, hold on folks.  This could be a bumpy ride for those of us who desire good officiating in our football games.

6.  While I admit I may not have my finger on the pulse on the feelings of Jaguars fans as a whole, I perceive something of an apprehension from Jaguars fans as it pertains to our receiving corps.  While many of the Jaguars fans had concerns about his off field issues, most seemed enthusiastic about the physical abilities of Westbrook.  I know many Jaguars fans were pleasantly surprised by the second half impact shown by Keelan Cole last year.  But given that receivers often make their biggest improvements between their first and second years, it seems Jaguars fans aren't particularly bullish on this part of the team.  While I do not view them to be as much of a team strength as the secondary or D-Line, I can definitely see improved play from this area of the team, especially factoring in the additions of Chark and Moncrief.  The passing game may be a pleasant surprise, and I think the experience, continuity and overall ability will be key.

7.  Speaking of fan sentiment, I don't know about you, but I want blood weeks two and three of this season.  Dating back to 1996, the Patriots have held dominion over the Jaguars.  With the exception of that home wild card playoff game after the 1998 season, we haven't beaten the Patriots.  They have knocked us out of the playoffs four (4) different times-1996, 2005, 2007 and last year.  Two of those times were in the AFC Championship game.  Since I was a little boy many many many years ago, I have always had an admiration for the Patriots, even though they were never my favorite team, and that has persisted to modern day.  But dammit, enough is enough!  To channel the late Al Davis, Brady must go down and he must go down hard!  The Jaguars owe them a major league [BLEEP] kicking, with interest compounded since 1996.  As for the tacks, they are our division rivals, ruined our 1999 season, and swept us last year.  They are a pain in our [BLEEP] and a loathsome and detestable organization.  It was sweet to see Malik Jackson call out Jurrell Casey and the tacks after the win in Pittsburgh.  Beating them in weeks two and three would be cathartic for Jaguars fans. 'Nuff said.
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





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#2

You should be a journalist. This is a better read than anything I have seen anywhere the last month.
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#3
(This post was last modified: 07-17-2018, 11:40 AM by Bullseye.)

(07-17-2018, 10:59 AM)brianmsbc Wrote: You should be a journalist. This is a better read than anything I have seen anywhere the last month.

Thank you sir.

Update:  I just read Taven Bryan has signed.  I will post a link once I get confirmation.

Update 2:  Apparently this is via Mike Kaye's twitter...

[Image: 37279858_2294268543922840_34562644992568...e=5BE9F81D]
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





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#4

SO READY FOR WEEK 2.

I hope they leave Brady in a whining lump on the field.
[Image: Jason-The-Good-Place-Jaguars.png?w=472]
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#5

(07-17-2018, 12:28 PM)Hard_Eight Wrote: SO READY FOR WEEK 2.

I hope they leave Brady in a whining lump on the field.

An apt description and deserving fate!
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





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#6

Four random 2018 NFL predictions:

Jags pass rush rotation will be suffocating

Tacks pass defense is gonna suck. Bad.

Pats lose in the divisional round if they even get that far.

Watson plays well for the tinhorns, but the better defenses force him to commit turnovers in bunches.
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#7

(07-17-2018, 01:47 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: Four random 2018 NFL predictions:

Jags pass rush rotation will be suffocating

Tacks pass defense is gonna suck. Bad.

Pats lose in the divisional round if they even get that far.

Watson plays well for the tinhorns, but the better defenses force him to commit turnovers in bunches.

I love these predictions.

I am curious as to why you think the tack pass defense will suck.

I am hoping Taylor Lewan's hold out is lengthy...lasting until week 4 or so of the regular season.
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





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#8

(07-17-2018, 12:28 PM)Hard_Eight Wrote: SO READY FOR WEEK 2.

I hope they leave Brady in a whining lump on the field.
I’m so ready for week 1!

Beckham vs Ramsey?! Our pass rush vs their retooled line? Gimme!
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#9

I think we will dominate the Giants in week 1. OBJ will get 80 yards and a TD in garbage time. Ramsey and Bouye will have an int each.

Week 2 I think we finally overcome Tom Brady by 1 point.

Week 3 in my opinion is a must win. We can't keep letting the Titans beat us. With that said I think we lose by 3 points.

That's my first quarter predictions.
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#10
(This post was last modified: 07-17-2018, 04:04 PM by jvillejagsn1.)

I think the board was a little dead (I admit, I didn't visit much) because of where we are as a team. There seemed to always be something negative to discuss or worry about in the recent past. However, with our team currently being solid all around and not many things happening to us or against us, we haven't had a whole lot to discuss; other than random speculation. This is a good thing lol The Dareus thing brought a little discussion back. But training camp will be the board back in full mode again. Me and a buddy are driving over the morning to watch it (as of now) on Friday. So looking forward to us taking another big step forward!!
Let's Get Em!!!! Go Jags!
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#11

(07-17-2018, 02:11 PM)Bullseye Wrote:
(07-17-2018, 01:47 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: Four random 2018 NFL predictions:

Jags pass rush rotation will be suffocating

Tacks pass defense is gonna suck. Bad.

Pats lose in the divisional round if they even get that far.

Watson plays well for the tinhorns, but the better defenses force him to commit turnovers in bunches.

I love these predictions.

I am curious as to why you think the tack pass defense will suck.

I am hoping Taylor Lewan's hold out is lengthy...lasting until week 4 or so of the regular season.

I don’t really expect them to be that bad, but I’m sort of playing a hunch card here. 
I like their FS. The Jackson kid is pretty good, but I wasn’t as impressed as the hype around him suggests. He may take a step forward this season but he’ll also be adapting to a new defensive scheme. I have doubts about the secondary gelling cohesively right away.
I think Butler is a declining player that just got overpaid and I have some doubt in Vrabel’s coaching As well.
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#12
(This post was last modified: 07-17-2018, 09:35 PM by SeldomRite.)

(07-17-2018, 08:12 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(07-17-2018, 02:11 PM)Bullseye Wrote: I love these predictions.

I am curious as to why you think the tack pass defense will suck.

I am hoping Taylor Lewan's hold out is lengthy...lasting until week 4 or so of the regular season.

I don’t really expect them to be that bad, but I’m sort of playing a hunch card here. 
I like their FS. The Jackson kid is pretty good, but I wasn’t as impressed as the hype around him suggests. He may take a step forward this season but he’ll also be adapting to a new defensive scheme. I have doubts about the secondary gelling cohesively right away.
I think Butler is a declining player that just got overpaid and I have some doubt in Vrabel’s coaching As well.

My expectation for the titans is they have a regression, end up with something like 4 or 5 wins. They had negative net points last year, and played the Jaguars at the best times they could, right after losing arob and right after clinching playoff position. I think mularky actually did a masterful job making chicken salad out of chicken [BLEEP] with them, and their playoff win could only come against a team as excellent at losing in the playoffs as the chiefs.
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#13

My focus is on the Patriots game. I'm still sore about last season. I believe this is the year we start hearing calls for Brady to retire and our game will plant that seed.
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#14

(07-17-2018, 09:35 AM)Bullseye Wrote: At least looking solely from the narrow window of football fans, our long national nightmare is over!  NFL Football is back!!!

Some of the things that have popped in my mind over the past few days:

1.  Where has everybody been?!?  I know we were in the dead zone of the offseason, but I would think as training camp approaches, the posting would pick up, especially considering the Jaguars are considered contenders heading into this preseason for the first time in ages.  Yet the board has been a virtual ghost town.  I can't believe you guys have the temerity...the unmitigated gall to have lives outside the message board!  If that's not a violation of the COC, it should be.   Laughing  Seriously, as always, I look forward to discussing and debating football with you guys this year.

2.  It is my deepest hope that the lawsuits surrounding Marcell Dareus are wholly baseless and are thrown out of court for any number of reasons.  From a human decency perspective, the idea of rape-whether through the actual bodily harm, the threat of bodily harm, or through the use of substances that inhibit the ability of one to voice consent or objection-is most unpleasant.  Any Jaguars fan interested in a positive team image may also be concerned about the effect such allegations might have on the team's image.  But from an on field perspective, an early season Dareus suspension could have disastrous consequences for a team with legitimate Super Bowl aspirations.

An examination of the first half of the schedule, listed below, is instructive on this point.

Week 1  at N.Y. Giants
Week 2  New England Patriots
Week 3  Tennessee tacks
Week 4  N.Y. Jets
Week 5  at Kansas City
Week 6  at Dallas

The Giants retooled this offseason, adding veteran OLs LT Nate Solder from the Pats and Patrick Omameh from us, in addition to prized rookie RB Saquon Barkley and second round road grading G Will Hernandez.  In a most optimistic speculation (one not likely to happen), early on the Giants would rely heavily on a running game while the team learns the offense and the offensive line gels.  But assuming no such apprehensions from the Giants coaching staff, it stands to reason an effective running game added to an impressive array of receiving threats in OBJ and Engram would make them difficult to defend.  New England lost LT Nate Solder and will have either a rookie with short limbs in Isaiah Wynn or a journeyman at LT, highly drafted RB in Sony Michel, and will have dependable Brady target Julian Edelman suspended the first four games.  Depending upon what happens in week 1 against the Texans, it may not be a stretch to see Belichick depend more heavily on the running game to protect Brady and mitigate the impact of an opposing pass rush.  While the tacks brought aboard Mike Vrabel in the hopes of revamping a moribund passing game, they still don't have much at WR.  Until proven otherwise, their bread and butter offensively will be the running game.  The Jets will come to town likely with rookie QB Sam Darnold behind C, a questionable offensive line, and memories of considerable success running the ball against the Jaguars last year.  Seeing them rely heavily upon the running game here would not be a shock.  While Andy Reid is known for being a WCO coach that jazzes up passing games, the truth is he has presided over strong running games over the years, featuring guys like Duce Staley, Brian Westbrook, LeSean McCoy, and second year stud Kareem Hunt.  Finally, Dallas will likely look to pound the ball, given they have a strong offensive line,a big bruising back in Ezekiel Elliott, and their passing game is missing two experienced stalwart receiving threats in WR Dez Bryant (released) and TE Jason Witten (retired). 

Taken together, if Dareus' run stopping ability is absent from the lineup due to suspension (or, for that matter injury) early in the season, winning in this early stretch of games will be more difficult.  A slow start resulting from a lessened ability to stop the run could mean the difference between gaining home field advantage and playing in the wild card round, or between making the playoffs or not.

3.  On a related note, while there is still a day before rookies report, and while the current CBA has all but eliminated rookie holdouts, there is one abiding question:  why hasn't Taven Byrant signed yet?  I'm not sounding the alarm yet, but even though the plan is to bring him along slowly and groom him, it doesn't mitigate the need for him to be here and not miss any time due to a holdout.

4.  I will be the first to acknowledge the guys running the Jaguars know way more than message board hacks like me, but I find the decision to make Fournette drop more weight to be curious.  At the 228 or so pounds he played at last year, Fournette displayed breakaway ability, as evidenced in 90 and 75 yard TDs runs.  While the weight loss brings the promise of improved quickness and better conditioning, were those things issues last year?  From my perspective, Fournette was limited by a persistent ankle injury, an interior OL that sometimes did not run block effectively, and opposing 8 man fronts that did not respect the Jaguars passing game and loaded up to stop the run.  Furthermore, I am left to wonder if there would be any negative effect on him.  It seems to me power and physicality is a big part of Fournette's game.  If he has less mass to for an opponent to stop, will he generate less power? (I'm sure physics majors and others more scientifically inclined/competent are cringing at my wording here.)

5.  From a more league wide perspective, I think an underrated story from this offseason could potentially have long ranging ramifications.  Seven (7) experienced officials have retired from their officiating duties this past offseason, including Jeff Triplette (a good thing) and Ed Hochuli (not so good).  This is a development that could cut both ways.  This presents the opportunity to bring in officials with younger eyes and more spry legs to better keep up with the action, which could lead to better officiating.  On the other hand, the fiasco with the replacement refs a few years back shows the value of having experienced and competent (?) officials working the games.  I am compelled to believe the constant, reactionary, and oft ill conceived rules changes played a role in some of the departures.  I cringe when considering inexperienced officials trying to make sense of the new rules governing what a catch is (only recently clarified), and the new helmet rules (which have yet to be clarified).  In short, hold on folks.  This could be a bumpy ride for those of us who desire good officiating in our football games.

6.  While I admit I may not have my finger on the pulse on the feelings of Jaguars fans as a whole, I perceive something of an apprehension from Jaguars fans as it pertains to our receiving corps.  While many of the Jaguars fans had concerns about his off field issues, most seemed enthusiastic about the physical abilities of Westbrook.  I know many Jaguars fans were pleasantly surprised by the second half impact shown by Keelan Cole last year.  But given that receivers often make their biggest improvements between their first and second years, it seems Jaguars fans aren't particularly bullish on this part of the team.  While I do not view them to be as much of a team strength as the secondary or D-Line, I can definitely see improved play from this area of the team, especially factoring in the additions of Chark and Moncrief.  The passing game may be a pleasant surprise, and I think the experience, continuity and overall ability will be key.

7.  Speaking of fan sentiment, I don't know about you, but I want blood weeks two and three of this season.  Dating back to 1996, the Patriots have held dominion over the Jaguars.  With the exception of that home wild card playoff game after the 1998 season, we haven't beaten the Patriots.  They have knocked us out of the playoffs four (4) different times-1996, 2005, 2007 and last year.  Two of those times were in the AFC Championship game.  Since I was a little boy many many many years ago, I have always had an admiration for the Patriots, even though they were never my favorite team, and that has persisted to modern day.  But dammit, enough is enough!  To channel the late Al Davis, Brady must go down and he must go down hard!  The Jaguars owe them a major league [BLEEP] kicking, with interest compounded since 1996.  As for the tacks, they are our division rivals, ruined our 1999 season, and swept us last year.  They are a pain in our [BLEEP] and a loathsome and detestable organization.  It was sweet to see Malik Jackson call out Jurrell Casey and the tacks after the win in Pittsburgh.  Beating them in weeks two and three would be cathartic for Jaguars fans. 'Nuff said.
I am in agreement with you about the wide receiving corps. While there is clearly not a true number 1 receiver, the depth is a real strength. A case could be made for Moncrief, Westbrook or Cole to emerge this season as legitimate number 1's. Lee should remain a consistent, if not spectacular, receiver who is excellent after the catch. The presence of ASJ at tight end should also help the wide receivers to take the next step this season. As far as Chark's prospects this season, I don't expect him to make a big difference this season as receivers usually struggle in year 1.
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#15

I so agree with the need for a 3-0 start this season.

The Giants will be much improved but it will be their rookie RB's first start, and he'll probably need a few games to figure things out. With Ramsey on OBJ, that should be a win but it makes me a little nervoius that it's in New York.

Week two we have to take advantage of the Pats starting a rookie, projected to be a G, at their LT spot against Ngakoue.

Week three we seriously need to shut up the tack fans by stopping their streak. They've done a great job of holding off our pass rush so we may have to get more creative to get any real pressure on Mariota. 
'02
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#16
(This post was last modified: 07-18-2018, 04:09 AM by JaguarJosh05.)

Its been a good off-season thus far. We know we have a good team. The bitter loss against the Patriots doesn't sting so much anymore. The media likes us and we know we should win a lot of games this year. People still doubt Blake Bortles but we know he balled out for the most part last season. He isn't clutch but he was an asset to the team still. Blake had an awful Pre-season last year and that's where most of his haters in the media came from and then it was just the national narrative that we have no QB. It has been a fast and eager offseason for me. I am ready to see these guys come out and work and prove that last year's camp is every bit as tough as this years. The team has a proven formula and has seen results. Lets get back to work and get a ring. It starts with Marrone's "win the quarter" philosophy and going 3-1 in each quarter would have us at 12-4. We need that first round bye.
No pain, no gain.
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#17

Listening to 1010 this morning discuss Dan Patrick's comments about the Jags splitting their home games with London. I have fatigue over the non-stop talk about the Jaguars leaving Jacksonville. I hope today Shad comes out and puts this to bed once and for all.
Original Season Ticket Holder - Retired  1995 - 2020


At some point you just have to let go of what you thought should happen and live in what is happening.
 

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#18

I’m super nervous about a possible 0-3 start. Yeah, you heard me. That’s a killer intro.
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#19
(This post was last modified: 07-18-2018, 07:18 AM by The_Franchise_QB.)

The Dareus effect is huge. This team needs him so bad against the run. Without, team going to get run up and down with those two linebackers in the back (telvin and myles). Don't get me wrong super athetlic guys made for defending the pass... no doubt about it this team has the BEST pass D in the game.. run D though? Without dareus if I'm an enemy team I'm running all game long... where's the big boys?

That being said worst case is Dareus gets a suspendo. Worst case imo, maybe 3-4 games. I don't anticipate that... at all but that's worst case. But we can't truly know until more details come out. Hopefully it passes and Dareus becomes a major dog in the defense all year long. If not, who the heck going to step up?
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#20

(07-18-2018, 07:13 AM)The_Franchise_QB Wrote: The Dareus effect is huge. This team needs him so bad against the run. Without, team going to get run up and down with those two linebackers in the back (telvin and myles). Don't get me wrong super athetlic guys made for defending the pass... no doubt about it this team has the BEST pass D in the game.. run D though? Without dareus if I'm an enemy team I'm running all game long... where's the big boys?

That being said worst case is Dareus gets a suspendo. Worst case imo, maybe 3-4 games. I don't anticipate that... at all but that's worst case.  But we can't truly know until more details come out. Hopefully it passes and Dareus becomes a major dog in the defense all year long. If not, who the heck going to step up?


To help put his importance into perspective, the Jaguars were one the worst teams vs the run when he signed, but they ended up finishing the season 3rd overall.
'02
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