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Training Camp-Vets arrive

#1

For years, our Jaguars, as much as we loved them, were a joke.  We were regularly among the worst teams in the league.  The rosters had plenty of holes, and it reflected on the field.

But with the hiring of David Caldwell, that began to change.  Perpetual holes at marquee positions of QB, CB, DE and LT were eventually filled with guys like Bortles, Ramsey, Bouye, Ngakoue, Campbell, and Robinson.  Furthermore, the team was able to add guys like Dareus, Jackson, Fournette, jack and Telvin Smith at the non marquee positions.  As a result, the Jaguars are deemed to have one of the two most talented rosters in football, and it finally reflected on the field with the team's first playoff appearance since 2007, and almost beat the Patriots in the AFC championship.  The on field success Jaguars fans so richly deserved finally arrived.

However, a consequence of this evolution of the roster is that it makes posts like these a lot more difficult.  Make no mistake, I'd much rather deal with this than what we've seen in years before.  I am NOT COMPLAINING AT ALL!  But the fact is, there aren't many starting spots really up for grabs on this team.  However, there are some things I want to watch.

  1. The WR spot opposite Marqise Lee-I think because he is the most experienced WR on the roster and that he has become really good on drive extending crossing routes on 3rd down, I believe his status as a starter is pretty secure.  However, I think the battle for the spot opposite him will be an interesting one.  Donte Moncrief is big, fast and experienced, but has never put it all together for a stellar season. Keelan Cole was a pleasant surprise as a UDFA and in the preseason, and later the second half of the season, showed he can get deep and produce big plays.  But there were times he heard footsteps across the middle (SF game) and needs to be a more complete WR.  Dede Westbrook was the 2nd round talent that fell to the 4th round due to off field concerns.  Thus far, he has avoided any further off field issues.  Once he got healthy and got on the field, he had some impact, but like Cole, he needs more consistency.  Finally, DJ Chark is this year's second round pick who has deep speed and size for days, but needs experience and better route running.  UDFA rookie Allen Lazard is a longshot who is hoping to be a red zone target.
  2. SAM-You could argue that this is a position that isn't on the field much and therefore isn't that important.  Nevertheless, with Jack moving from that position to Mike, at first glance, there may be a drop in performance here.  Blair Brown, last year's 5th round pick, had some decent moments last year, but needs more experience. For me, I want to see how he holds up at the point of attack.   Leon Jacobs, the muscular 6th round pick this year from Wisconsin, is his primary competition for the spot.  Though I have heard some whispers he could be a pass rusher, I admit I know very little about him.
  3. Nickelback-Not sure there's much of a competition here, but since last year's nickel-Arron Colvin-is now in Houston, there is a slight degree of uncertainty.  Given his contract and experience, the expected starter is free agent DJ Hayden.  Hayden has a ton of speed, but I question his ability to turn and change directions, and his ability to play a physical game.  But I think Myrick and Patmon might give him a run.  To me, Myrick is a younger, cheaper version of Hayden.  Patmon gave the team some good minutes last year.
  4. If I were to pick guys who were surprises to make the team, Quentin Meeks and Tony Adams would be my guys.
  5. Conversely, surprise cuts?  That would be tough, but depending on what Richardson shows, I could see Parnell or Cann being shown the door.
    Thoughts?

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





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#2

(07-25-2018, 09:22 AM)Bullseye Wrote: ...

  1. The WR spot opposite Marqise Lee-I think because he is the most experienced WR on the roster and that he has become really good on drive extending crossing routes on 3rd down, I believe his status as a starter is pretty secure.  However, I think the battle for the spot opposite him will be an interesting one.  Donte Moncrief is big, fast and experienced, but has never put it all together for a stellar season. Keelan Cole was a pleasant surprise as a UDFA and in the preseason, and later the second half of the season, showed he can get deep and produce big plays.  But there were times he heard footsteps across the middle (SF game) and needs to be a more complete WR.  Dede Westbrook was the 2nd round talent that fell to the 4th round due to off field concerns.  Thus far, he has avoided any further off field issues.  Once he got healthy and got on the field, he had some impact, but like Cole, he needs more consistency.  Finally, DJ Chark is this year's second round pick who has deep speed and size for days, but needs experience and better route running.  UDFA rookie Allen Lazard is a longshot who is hoping to be a red zone target.
  2. SAM-You could argue that this is a position that isn't on the field much and therefore isn't that important.  Nevertheless, with Jack moving from that position to Mike, at first glance, there may be a drop in performance here.  Blair Brown, last year's 5th round pick, had some decent moments last year, but needs more experience. For me, I want to see how he holds up at the point of attack.   Leon Jacobs, the muscular 6th round pick this year from Wisconsin, is his primary competition for the spot.  Though I have heard some whispers he could be a pass rusher, I admit I know very little about him.
  3. Nickelback-Not sure there's much of a competition here, but since last year's nickel-Arron Colvin-is now in Houston, there is a slight degree of uncertainty.  Given his contract and experience, the expected starter is free agent DJ Hayden.  Hayden has a ton of speed, but I question his ability to turn and change directions, and his ability to play a physical game.  But I think Myrick and Patmon might give him a run.  To me, Myrick is a younger, cheaper version of Hayden.  Patmon gave the team some good minutes last year.
  4. If I were to pick guys who were surprises to make the team, Quentin Meeks and Tony Adams would be my guys.
  5. Conversely, surprise cuts?  That would be tough, but depending on what Richardson shows, I could see Parnell or Cann being shown the door.
    Thoughts?


1. In my opinion, it will be Cole but I think that it will be a bigger impact than just being "the guy across from Lee". It would not surprise me to see Cole overtake Lee in terms of production and being the favored target. 

2. I think that SAM is more important than some might guess. I'm still of the belief that most coaches prefer to run the ball and if they see success with it they will keep after it. From what I understand about the SAM in this defense is that he is there to slow things up enough so that the MIKE and WIL can come to the ball. If he doesn't hold up his spot, then the Defense is going to get a steady dose of RB making for a long day. My thought here is that Brown may start, but I see Jacobs taking over the spot by end of season.

3. Nickelback: bad band, important position. I am hoping that the versatility of Ramsey, Bouye and Hayden will make this spot be a true third CB and not just a player who has to cover the slot. My money is on Hayden holding this position down and Myrick and Patmon simply being bodies that can fill in and play 'Teams.

4. As for surprises, I always like LBs from Va Tech and Motuapuaka is one. Check out his career at VT sometime. The man can fill up a stat sheet.

5. I would be surprised if the team cut Starters from the O line, but then again I'm surprised at my bar tab most every night. Honestly, I don't have a feel for who may be susceptible.
I'm trying to make myself more informed and less opinionated.

Stop saying whatever stupid thing you're talking about and pay attention to all the interesting things I have to say!
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#3
(This post was last modified: 07-25-2018, 11:36 AM by copycat. Edit Reason: Brain fart )

(07-25-2018, 09:22 AM)Bullseye Wrote: For years, our Jaguars, as much as we loved them, were a joke.  We were regularly among the worst teams in the league.  The rosters had plenty of holes, and it reflected on the field.

But with the hiring of David Caldwell, that began to change.  Perpetual holes at marquee positions of QB, CB, DE and LT were eventually filled with guys like Bortles, Ramsey, Bouye, Ngakoue, Campbell, and Robinson.  Furthermore, the team was able to add guys like Dareus, Jackson, Fournette, Jack wasn't Down, and Telvin Smith at the non marquee positions.  As a result, the Jaguars are deemed to have one of the two most talented rosters in football, and it finally reflected on the field with the team's first playoff appearance since 2007, and almost beat the Patriots in the AFC championship.  The on field success Jaguars fans so richly deserved finally arrived.

However, a consequence of this evolution of the roster is that it makes posts like these a lot more difficult.  Make no mistake, I'd much rather deal with this than what we've seen in years before.  I am NOT COMPLAINING AT ALL!  But the fact is, there aren't many starting spots really up for grabs on this team.  However, there are some things I want to watch.

  1. The WR spot opposite Marqise Lee-I think because he is the most experienced WR on the roster and that he has become really good on drive extending crossing routes on 3rd down, I believe his status as a starter is pretty secure.  However, I think the battle for the spot opposite him will be an interesting one.  Donte Moncrief is big, fast and experienced, but has never put it all together for a stellar season. Keelan Cole was a pleasant surprise as a UDFA and in the preseason, and later the second half of the season, showed he can get deep and produce big plays.  But there were times he heard footsteps across the middle (SF game) and needs to be a more complete WR.  Dede Westbrook was the 2nd round talent that fell to the 4th round due to off field concerns.  Thus far, he has avoided any further off field issues.  Once he got healthy and got on the field, he had some impact, but like Cole, he needs more consistency.  Finally, DJ Chark is this year's second round pick who has deep speed and size for days, but needs experience and better route running.  UDFA rookie Allen Lazard is a longshot who is hoping to be a red zone target.
  2. SAM-You could argue that this is a position that isn't on the field much and therefore isn't that important.  Nevertheless, with Jack moving from that position to Mike, at first glance, there may be a drop in performance here.  Blair Brown, last year's 5th round pick, had some decent moments last year, but needs more experience. For me, I want to see how he holds up at the point of attack.   Leon Jacobs, the muscular 6th round pick this year from Wisconsin, is his primary competition for the spot.  Though I have heard some whispers he could be a pass rusher, I admit I know very little about him.
  3. Nickelback-Not sure there's much of a competition here, but since last year's nickel-Arron Colvin-is now in Houston, there is a slight degree of uncertainty.  Given his contract and experience, the expected starter is free agent DJ Hayden.  Hayden has a ton of speed, but I question his ability to turn and change directions, and his ability to play a physical game.  But I think Myrick and Patmon might give him a run.  To me, Myrick is a younger, cheaper version of Hayden.  Patmon gave the team some good minutes last year.
  4. If I were to pick guys who were surprises to make the team, Quentin Meeks and Tony Adams would be my guys.
  5. Conversely, surprise cuts?  That would be tough, but depending on what Richardson shows, I could see Parnell or Cann being shown the door.
    Thoughts?
Fixed that for you.

I am with you on this.  So much better to have to search for holes and potential upgrades that what we have endured in the past.  

1.  I have no concerns about WR personally.  Robinson  Lee owns the crossing route, Westbrook and Cole have had a year with Keenan now and should improve on what I consider impressive rookie seasons.  Chark could be the missing piece to the puzzle and with addition of Moncrief even if he misses 4 to 6 games the unit should shine.

2.  As for Sam, Brown played fine when called upon (sans the special teams penalties) and should Jacobs beat him out so much the better for the team.  It means we have quality battles instead of needs filling holes.

3.  Secondary - Replacing Colvin with equal talent will not be easy.  The kid has the talent to be a 1 or 2 just not here (I hope he does well 14 times a year).  Hayden should be fine though and with our linebacking corp there is plenty of talent out there to pick up the slot.

Points 4 and 5 are where I get excited.  Since we are in that window where we are not having to worry about the cap, anyone that makes the team deserves it.  As I touched upon earlier any rookie that comes in here and beats out a projected starter is great news.
Original Season Ticket Holder - Retired  1995 - 2020


At some point you just have to let go of what you thought should happen and live in what is happening.
 

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#4

(07-25-2018, 10:19 AM)copycat Wrote:
(07-25-2018, 09:22 AM)Bullseye Wrote: For years, our Jaguars, as much as we loved them, were a joke.  We were regularly among the worst teams in the league.  The rosters had plenty of holes, and it reflected on the field.

But with the hiring of David Caldwell, that began to change.  Perpetual holes at marquee positions of QB, CB, DE and LT were eventually filled with guys like Bortles, Ramsey, Bouye, Ngakoue, Campbell, and Robinson.  Furthermore, the team was able to add guys like Dareus, Jackson, Fournette, Jack wasn't Down, and Telvin Smith at the non marquee positions.  As a result, the Jaguars are deemed to have one of the two most talented rosters in football, and it finally reflected on the field with the team's first playoff appearance since 2007, and almost beat the Patriots in the AFC championship.  The on field success Jaguars fans so richly deserved finally arrived.

However, a consequence of this evolution of the roster is that it makes posts like these a lot more difficult.  Make no mistake, I'd much rather deal with this than what we've seen in years before.  I am NOT COMPLAINING AT ALL!  But the fact is, there aren't many starting spots really up for grabs on this team.  However, there are some things I want to watch.

  1. The WR spot opposite Marqise Lee-I think because he is the most experienced WR on the roster and that he has become really good on drive extending crossing routes on 3rd down, I believe his status as a starter is pretty secure.  However, I think the battle for the spot opposite him will be an interesting one.  Donte Moncrief is big, fast and experienced, but has never put it all together for a stellar season. Keelan Cole was a pleasant surprise as a UDFA and in the preseason, and later the second half of the season, showed he can get deep and produce big plays.  But there were times he heard footsteps across the middle (SF game) and needs to be a more complete WR.  Dede Westbrook was the 2nd round talent that fell to the 4th round due to off field concerns.  Thus far, he has avoided any further off field issues.  Once he got healthy and got on the field, he had some impact, but like Cole, he needs more consistency.  Finally, DJ Chark is this year's second round pick who has deep speed and size for days, but needs experience and better route running.  UDFA rookie Allen Lazard is a longshot who is hoping to be a red zone target.
  2. SAM-You could argue that this is a position that isn't on the field much and therefore isn't that important.  Nevertheless, with Jack moving from that position to Mike, at first glance, there may be a drop in performance here.  Blair Brown, last year's 5th round pick, had some decent moments last year, but needs more experience. For me, I want to see how he holds up at the point of attack.   Leon Jacobs, the muscular 6th round pick this year from Wisconsin, is his primary competition for the spot.  Though I have heard some whispers he could be a pass rusher, I admit I know very little about him.
  3. Nickelback-Not sure there's much of a competition here, but since last year's nickel-Arron Colvin-is now in Houston, there is a slight degree of uncertainty.  Given his contract and experience, the expected starter is free agent DJ Hayden.  Hayden has a ton of speed, but I question his ability to turn and change directions, and his ability to play a physical game.  But I think Myrick and Patmon might give him a run.  To me, Myrick is a younger, cheaper version of Hayden.  Patmon gave the team some good minutes last year.
  4. If I were to pick guys who were surprises to make the team, Quentin Meeks and Tony Adams would be my guys.
  5. Conversely, surprise cuts?  That would be tough, but depending on what Richardson shows, I could see Parnell or Cann being shown the door.
    Thoughts?
Fixed that for you.

I am with you on this.  So much better to have to search for holes and potential upgrades that what we have endured in the past.  

1.  I have no concerns about WR personally.  Robinson Lee owns the crossing route, Westbrook and Cole have had a year with Keenan now and should improve on what I consider impressive rookie seasons.  Chark could be the missing piece to the puzzle and with addition of Moncrief even if he misses 4 to 6 games the unit should shine.

2.  As for Sam, Brown played fine when called upon (sans the special teams penalties) and should Jacobs beat him out so much the better for the team.  It means we have quality battles instead of needs filling holes.

3.  Secondary - Replacing Colvin with equal talent will not be easy.  The kid has the talent to be a 1 or 2 just not here (I hope he does well 14 times a year).  Hayden should be fine though and with our linebacking corp there is plenty of talent out there to pick up the slot.

Points 4 and 5 are where I get excited.  Since we are in that window where we are not having to worry about the cap, anyone that makes the team deserves it.  As I touched upon earlier any rookie that comes in here and beats out a projected starter is great news.

Sadly, Robinson is now in Chicago.  Lee owns that crossing route here.

I agree with your closing point.

Any undrafted rookie who comes in and makes the team has earned it.

BTW, I also expect Carey to be cut.
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





Reply

#5

(07-25-2018, 10:33 AM)Bullseye Wrote:
(07-25-2018, 10:19 AM)copycat Wrote: Fixed that for you.

I am with you on this.  So much better to have to search for holes and potential upgrades that what we have endured in the past.  

1.  I have no concerns about WR personally.  Robinson Lee owns the crossing route, Westbrook and Cole have had a year with Keenan now and should improve on what I consider impressive rookie seasons.  Chark could be the missing piece to the puzzle and with addition of Moncrief even if he misses 4 to 6 games the unit should shine.

2.  As for Sam, Brown played fine when called upon (sans the special teams penalties) and should Jacobs beat him out so much the better for the team.  It means we have quality battles instead of needs filling holes.

3.  Secondary - Replacing Colvin with equal talent will not be easy.  The kid has the talent to be a 1 or 2 just not here (I hope he does well 14 times a year).  Hayden should be fine though and with our linebacking corp there is plenty of talent out there to pick up the slot.

Points 4 and 5 are where I get excited.  Since we are in that window where we are not having to worry about the cap, anyone that makes the team deserves it.  As I touched upon earlier any rookie that comes in here and beats out a projected starter is great news.

Sadly, Robinson is now in Chicago.  Lee owns that crossing route here.

I agree with your closing point.

Any undrafted rookie who comes in and makes the team has earned it.

BTW, I also expect Carey to be cut.
  Oops my bad but at least you knew what I meant.  My wife tells me all the time I can't multi-task.
Original Season Ticket Holder - Retired  1995 - 2020


At some point you just have to let go of what you thought should happen and live in what is happening.
 

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#6
Tongue 

(07-25-2018, 11:34 AM)copycat Wrote:
(07-25-2018, 10:33 AM)Bullseye Wrote: Sadly, Robinson is now in Chicago.  Lee owns that crossing route here.

I agree with your closing point.

Any undrafted rookie who comes in and makes the team has earned it.

BTW, I also expect Carey to be cut.
  Oops my bad but at least you knew what I meant.  My wife tells me all the time I can't multi-task.

That's par, I bet she has to constantly remind you that you don't listen as well!

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#7

I think the nickel and Sam spots are our biggest concerns

Wr we lack a wr1 but i think we have enough talent and variety to change our personnel and create mismatches. Add to that I like asj and oshaughnessy so i feel ok at the spot especially when you add the threat of Yeldon and grant out the backfield

I think one of the big reasons Sam didn't really matter last year was because of how stout our corners were against the run. Colvin could hold his own but i dont if Hayden can and I certainly don't know if brown can

My biggest interest is our rotational pass rushers. Calais slowed down as the season went on so seeing if bryant and smoot can force consistent pressure so they can spell him and to some degree jackson is vital
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#8
(This post was last modified: 07-25-2018, 07:19 PM by Bullseye.)

(07-25-2018, 09:59 AM)Deacon Wrote:
(07-25-2018, 09:22 AM)Bullseye Wrote: ...

  1. The WR spot opposite Marqise Lee-I think because he is the most experienced WR on the roster and that he has become really good on drive extending crossing routes on 3rd down, I believe his status as a starter is pretty secure.  However, I think the battle for the spot opposite him will be an interesting one.  Donte Moncrief is big, fast and experienced, but has never put it all together for a stellar season. Keelan Cole was a pleasant surprise as a UDFA and in the preseason, and later the second half of the season, showed he can get deep and produce big plays.  But there were times he heard footsteps across the middle (SF game) and needs to be a more complete WR.  Dede Westbrook was the 2nd round talent that fell to the 4th round due to off field concerns.  Thus far, he has avoided any further off field issues.  Once he got healthy and got on the field, he had some impact, but like Cole, he needs more consistency.  Finally, DJ Chark is this year's second round pick who has deep speed and size for days, but needs experience and better route running.  UDFA rookie Allen Lazard is a longshot who is hoping to be a red zone target.
  2. SAM-You could argue that this is a position that isn't on the field much and therefore isn't that important.  Nevertheless, with Jack moving from that position to Mike, at first glance, there may be a drop in performance here.  Blair Brown, last year's 5th round pick, had some decent moments last year, but needs more experience. For me, I want to see how he holds up at the point of attack.   Leon Jacobs, the muscular 6th round pick this year from Wisconsin, is his primary competition for the spot.  Though I have heard some whispers he could be a pass rusher, I admit I know very little about him.
  3. Nickelback-Not sure there's much of a competition here, but since last year's nickel-Arron Colvin-is now in Houston, there is a slight degree of uncertainty.  Given his contract and experience, the expected starter is free agent DJ Hayden.  Hayden has a ton of speed, but I question his ability to turn and change directions, and his ability to play a physical game.  But I think Myrick and Patmon might give him a run.  To me, Myrick is a younger, cheaper version of Hayden.  Patmon gave the team some good minutes last year.
  4. If I were to pick guys who were surprises to make the team, Quentin Meeks and Tony Adams would be my guys.
  5. Conversely, surprise cuts?  That would be tough, but depending on what Richardson shows, I could see Parnell or Cann being shown the door.
    Thoughts?


1. In my opinion, it will be Cole but I think that it will be a bigger impact than just being "the guy across from Lee". It would not surprise me to see Cole overtake Lee in terms of production and being the favored target. 

2. I think that SAM is more important than some might guess. I'm still of the belief that most coaches prefer to run the ball and if they see success with it they will keep after it. From what I understand about the SAM in this defense is that he is there to slow things up enough so that the MIKE and WIL can come to the ball. If he doesn't hold up his spot, then the Defense is going to get a steady dose of RB making for a long day. My thought here is that Brown may start, but I see Jacobs taking over the spot by end of season.

3. Nickelback: bad band, important position. I am hoping that the versatility of Ramsey, Bouye and Hayden will make this spot be a true third CB and not just a player who has to cover the slot. My money is on Hayden holding this position down and Myrick and Patmon simply being bodies that can fill in and play 'Teams.

4. As for surprises, I always like LBs from Va Tech and Motuapuaka is one. Check out his career at VT sometime. The man can fill up a stat sheet.

5. I would be surprised if the team cut Starters from the O line, but then again I'm surprised at my bar tab most every night. Honestly, I don't have a feel for who may be susceptible.

1.  I agree that the X receiver will likely be of more import than just being the guy across from Lee...at least if the offense is to be as effective as we all hope.  I really like what Cole offered us last year.  I just hope he and the other WRs all step up their games, to give Bortles all of the available tools needed for him to step his up.

2.  I am inclined to believe you ont he SAM position-at least as it pertains to the first 4-5 games of the season.  I think considering the teams during this stretch are either retooling their OLs (NYG, NE, NYJ), are likely breaking in young or rookie QBs (NYJ, KC), or should be run first teams (TN), the running game will be a critical part of the defense.  It makes sense on many levels.  Arguably, they would stay away from the strength of the Jaguars defense (pass defense-sacks and coverage) and attacking the weakness by running the ball.  Conversely, taking a run heavy approach would minimize the negative impact of a retooled OL and protect young QBs.

3.  I can't say I've ever heard a single nickelback song.  I do know I've seen quite a bit of commentary over the years, and not once do I recall anyone saying they like them.  Regarding the position on our defense, if my assessment of Hayden is correct, I do not know if the Jaguars face any Welker/Amendola types that have great short area change of direction quickness early on (though I am unsure about who the Giants may offer in the slot) until KC.  I don't think New England will have anyone fitting that description early on.  Edelman is gone until week  due to suspension.

4.  Don't know too many great Va Tech LBs over the years off the top of my head, though I admit my memory isn't what it once was. The Edmunds kid Buffalo took this year looks like he could be a stud (though you could say the same for his father, Ferrell, and you saw how that turned out).  Are you a Hokie?  Why the partiality to Va Tech LBs?

5.  I would be surprised too.  I would be stunned if any starters were cut.  But since I picked the topic of surprise cuts, I had to pick someplace from which to cut.

(07-25-2018, 12:56 PM)ukjag34 Wrote: I think one of the big reasons Sam didn't really matter last year was because of how stout our corners were against the run. Colvin could hold his own but i dont if Hayden can and I certainly don't know if brown can

My biggest interest is our rotational pass rushers. Calais slowed down as the season went on so seeing if bryant and smoot can force consistent pressure so they can spell him and to some degree jackson is vital

I think your observation regarding the the tackling ability of our DBs is astute.  Our DBs overall do not shy away from run support and bring the lumber when they do tackle.  I'm not sure about Hayden in this area, either.

If Bryan and Smoot can provide a quality pass rush while spelling Campbell and keeping him fresh throughout the year, that would be gigantic for this team.
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





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#9

Don't be surprised if...

Westbrook has 800 yards and 6 TDs
Lee has 900 yards and 5 TDs
Fournette rushes for 1500 yards plus and 13 TDs
ASJ gives us 3 TDs


And Yannick puts up 17 sacks and gets the defensive player of the year honors.

This team's window is about 3 to 4 years starting now.

For all of you guys who stayed loyal through the decades of Terrible teams...thank you. My hat is tipped for you guys.

Football is in the air, I'm starting to get ready to see my Jags play on Sundays.
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#10
(This post was last modified: 07-27-2018, 02:17 AM by TheO-LineMatters.)

1. Personally, I am not worried at all about the WR position. As everyone knows, I am not a huge Marqise Lee fan, but I loved what I saw in Keelan Cole and I also believe DeDe Westbrook has a lot of potential that he began to show last year as well. I also believe Chark was the best WR in the draft and I am extremely excited to see what he can do in this offense. Moncrief offers us a lot of depth as well. IMO, Cole will end up being the X receiver before the season is over.

2. The SAM position is mildly concerning. Whether Blair Brown wins the position or not, we still lack depth at all 3 LB positions. I don't think we'd lose that much by replacing Poz with brown, but IMO, Poz was a weak spot on defense, just because he lacked the athleticism and speed of the younger guys. His leadership was extremely valuable though. The main problem I have is that if any of our starters go down, we're in trouble. I really like the selection of Leon Jacobs and believe he would be a great SLB option, but if he is moved to pass rusher, it wouldn't matter. I still believe we need to add depth at LB in general.

3. Nickleback is my biggest concern. We have great starters at both CB spots and I liked Aaron Colvin a lot and I was disappointed that we let him walk. Our backups at CB are HUGE dropoffs from our starters though. I really wanted us to replace Colvin with consistent player, but IMO, D.J. is the epitome of inconsistent. Yes, he has speed, but so far in his NFL career, I see a lack of instincts and ability to shift and change directions in an instant. That is a major concern. I like bigger corners (over 5'10"), who can play press and off coverage and when you look behind our starters, it just isn't there. We filled some major holes in the off season, but I fear we created at hole at Nickle when we lost Colvin and I don't see a player on our current roster who I believe can fill that role consistently. I pray I am wrong.

4. I believe Richardson, Adams, Jacobs and Meeks all have a really good chance to make the roster and I like Lazard as will. I believe he could be really effective as a TE/WR hybrid, if the team opts to use him this way. If they strictly use him as a straight up WR, he's likely headed to the PS. I thought Richardson was probably our best pick in the draft. I'd like to see him get a chance to start at our weakest position, RG, but he could also unseat Parnell at RT. I really like that we signed Tony Adams. I was disappointed that he failed the physical after the draft and giving him this second chance could really improve our interior. It wouldn't surprise me to see Adams and Richardson as starters on our O-Line, in the next year or two. Both are really talented.

5. I'm gonna save opinion on cuts until we get a little into the preseason.
Reply

#11

(07-25-2018, 09:30 PM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: Don't be surprised if...

Westbrook has 800 yards and 6 TDs
Lee has 900 yards and 5 TDs
Fournette rushes for 1500 yards plus and 13 TDs
ASJ gives us 3 TDs


And Yannick puts up 17 sacks and gets the defensive player of the year honors.

This team's window is about 3 to 4 years starting now.

For all of you guys who stayed loyal through the decades of Terrible teams...thank you. My hat is tipped for you guys.

Football is in the air, I'm starting to get ready to see my Jags play on Sundays.
I would not be shocked at any of your offensive predictions.

I tend to differ a bit from your Yannick prediction for a few reasons.


First 17 sacks is a heckuva number, better than one agame.  While Ngakoue is capable of putting up high numbers, reaching that would simply be insane.

Secondly he would have to remain completely healthy all season.  He has been blessed/fortunate enough to avoid the injury bug thus far and I hope that continues.  But injuries are common in the NFL and the slightest ding could knock him off that pace.

Furthermore, assuming no training camp surprises, the team will have, at full strength, at least five (5) guys who can give quality reps at DE: Ngakoue, Campbell, Fowler, Smoot, and Bryan.  Given the pass rush seemed to wear down by season's end, it would not be a total shock to see more of a rotation at DE, which might lower his season total but make him fresher as the season progresses.

Finally, my last rationale derives from the previous one.  The Jaguars have so many quality pass rushers, they would end up taking sacks from each other.
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





Reply

#12

(07-26-2018, 07:11 AM)Bullseye Wrote:
(07-25-2018, 09:30 PM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: Don't be surprised if...

Westbrook has 800 yards and 6 TDs
Lee has 900 yards and 5 TDs
Fournette rushes for 1500 yards plus and 13 TDs
ASJ gives us 3 TDs


And Yannick puts up 17 sacks and gets the defensive player of the year honors.

This team's window is about 3 to 4 years starting now.

For all of you guys who stayed loyal through the decades of Terrible teams...thank you. My hat is tipped for you guys.

Football is in the air, I'm starting to get ready to see my Jags play on Sundays.
I would not be shocked at any of your offensive predictions.

I tend to differ a bit from your Yannick prediction for a few reasons.


First 17 sacks is a heckuva number, better than one agame.  While Ngakoue is capable of putting up high numbers, reaching that would simply be insane.

Secondly he would have to remain completely healthy all season.  He has been blessed/fortunate enough to avoid the injury bug thus far and I hope that continues.  But injuries are common in the NFL and the slightest ding could knock him off that pace.

Furthermore, assuming no training camp surprises, the team will have, at full strength, at least five (5) guys who can give quality reps at DE: Ngakoue, Campbell, Fowler, Smoot, and Bryan.  Given the pass rush seemed to wear down by season's end, it would not be a total shock to see more of a rotation at DE, which might lower his season total but make him fresher as the season progresses.

Finally, my last rationale derives from the previous one.  The Jaguars have so many quality pass rushers, they would end up taking sacks from each other.

Yannick is my favorite defensive player. With that said, I have to agree that 17 sacks is high. He had a fantastic season last year and I believe he can improve on his numbers, but going up by 5 sacks is asking a lot. I see Calais' numbers dropping a bit, but he still should be a force as well. I'm gonna predict 12 sacks for Campbell and 14 for Ngakoue. I see Fowler's numbers dipping as well. I'm gonna give him 7 sacks on the season, which is still very good for a rotational player. I'm not as high on Smoot and Bryan though. I'll give them 2 a piece. I believe as a team, we could end up with 54 sacks on the season which would only be 1 shy from last season and would keep us in contention for tops in the league.
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#13

Enjoyed hearing Marrone comment on his open-mindedness concerning the RG position and the "best combination" of the 5 up front in today's presser.
He mentioned AJ being the first one out there, but that they feel they have good competition and he won't look past the possibility of another back-up from the left side, or along the line, competing there as well.

Perhaps AJ steps it up in a contract year, and that would be great, but I'm glad that competition at RG seems to be wide open. Around the 7 minute mark:https://www.jaguars.com/video/marrone-win-the-day
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#14

(07-26-2018, 07:11 AM)Bullseye Wrote:
(07-25-2018, 09:30 PM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: Don't be surprised if...

Westbrook has 800 yards and 6 TDs
Lee has 900 yards and 5 TDs
Fournette rushes for 1500 yards plus and 13 TDs
ASJ gives us 3 TDs


And Yannick puts up 17 sacks and gets the defensive player of the year honors.

This team's window is about 3 to 4 years starting now.

For all of you guys who stayed loyal through the decades of Terrible teams...thank you. My hat is tipped for you guys.

Football is in the air, I'm starting to get ready to see my Jags play on Sundays.
I would not be shocked at any of your offensive predictions.

I tend to differ a bit from your Yannick prediction for a few reasons.


First 17 sacks is a heckuva number, better than one agame.  While Ngakoue is capable of putting up high numbers, reaching that would simply be insane.

Secondly he would have to remain completely healthy all season.  He has been blessed/fortunate enough to avoid the injury bug thus far and I hope that continues.  But injuries are common in the NFL and the slightest ding could knock him off that pace.

Furthermore, assuming no training camp surprises, the team will have, at full strength, at least five (5) guys who can give quality reps at DE: Ngakoue, Campbell, Fowler, Smoot, and Bryan.  Given the pass rush seemed to wear down by season's end, it would not be a total shock to see more of a rotation at DE, which might lower his season total but make him fresher as the season progresses.

Finally, my last rationale derives from the previous one.  The Jaguars have so many quality pass rushers, they would end up taking sacks from each other.

RE:Yannick
If he's beasting, he's beasting... Don't think he'll lose snaps. Especially if he's improved vs the run.
Also... We're heavy at "big end" but essentially rush end is still Fowler and Yannick, right? I was under the impression Smoot is more big end than rush end...
Fowler will already be missing 1 game due to suspension. And if his weight doesn't bounce back (or strength or whatever) he could miss more than just the one.

I totally could see Campbell's sack number drop and Yannick's get higher. 
I also think Fowler's sack number will decrease this year (which could be good if we are trying to keep him next season: $)
With Campbell on the way out (I'm guessing) our ends could end up being Bryan, Smoot, Fowler, and Yannick, perhaps adding a cheap vet or rookie next year.


But your points are very valid as to how or why he could miss that mark.
And it makes me wonder... with more and more rotation going on with a lot of teams... will the sack record ever be broken?
Reply

#15

(07-26-2018, 10:39 AM)Kane Wrote:
(07-26-2018, 07:11 AM)Bullseye Wrote: I would not be shocked at any of your offensive predictions.

I tend to differ a bit from your Yannick prediction for a few reasons.


First 17 sacks is a heckuva number, better than one agame.  While Ngakoue is capable of putting up high numbers, reaching that would simply be insane.

Secondly he would have to remain completely healthy all season.  He has been blessed/fortunate enough to avoid the injury bug thus far and I hope that continues.  But injuries are common in the NFL and the slightest ding could knock him off that pace.

Furthermore, assuming no training camp surprises, the team will have, at full strength, at least five (5) guys who can give quality reps at DE: Ngakoue, Campbell, Fowler, Smoot, and Bryan.  Given the pass rush seemed to wear down by season's end, it would not be a total shock to see more of a rotation at DE, which might lower his season total but make him fresher as the season progresses.

Finally, my last rationale derives from the previous one.  The Jaguars have so many quality pass rushers, they would end up taking sacks from each other.

RE:Yannick
If he's beasting, he's beasting... Don't think he'll lose snaps. Especially if he's improved vs the run.
Also... We're heavy at "big end" but essentially rush end is still Fowler and Yannick, right? I was under the impression Smoot is more big end than rush end...
Fowler will already be missing 1 game due to suspension. And if his weight doesn't bounce back (or strength or whatever) he could miss more than just the one.

I totally could see Campbell's sack number drop and Yannick's get higher. 
I also think Fowler's sack number will decrease this year (which could be good if we are trying to keep him next season: $)
With Campbell on the way out (I'm guessing) our ends could end up being Bryan, Smoot, Fowler, and Yannick, perhaps adding a cheap vet or rookie next year.


But your points are very valid as to how or why he could miss that mark.
And it makes me wonder... with more and more rotation going on with a lot of teams... will the sack record ever be broken?
I could easily see things progressing as you describe here.

Regarding Smoot, he was first drafted as a backup big end to Campbell.  but as the season wore on, he saw snaps at RDE opposite Campbell.  I see him as a swing guy.  Like Bryan is a guy who could go from LDE to DT in certain situations, I could see Smoot play either the big DE or a pass rushing RDE (and actually an interior pass rusher) in certain situations.

Generally speaking we are eye to eye on this.
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





Reply

#16

One battle I did not mention, but quite possibly the most important one, is at WR.

If the Jaguars keep five, it would seem the 5 are

Lee
Chark
Westbrook
Cole
Moncrief

However, if the Jaguars keep 6, the question is who do they keep?

To me it seems the top three candidates are

Jaydon Mickens
Rashad Greene
Allen Lazard

in that order.

To me, Mickens has recently demonstrated explosive return ability as well as the ability to contribute some in the passing game.

Greene exhibited those same traits as a rookie, but has since had a down year ending in an achilles injury, spending last year on IR. While he has more size than Mickens, I have my doubts about his ability post achilles injury. I'd be far more confident in his ability to return to form if he had an ACL tear.

Lazard seems to be the longshot as a rookie UDFA. He is the biggest of these three receivers, and based upon his build, he would seem to offer a red zone threat. However, he does not appear to offer any return ability, so if he were going to make this team, he'd either have to prove to be an exceptional WR, or he'd have to contribute on special teams some other way, barring something way bad or unusual happening.

Now if the Jaguars go with five WRs, Westbrook, Lee and Chark also have demonstrated return ability, though I wouldn't want to see Chark returning punts.
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





Reply

#17

(07-26-2018, 11:01 AM)Bullseye Wrote:
(07-26-2018, 10:39 AM)Kane Wrote: RE:Yannick
If he's beasting, he's beasting... Don't think he'll lose snaps. Especially if he's improved vs the run.
Also... We're heavy at "big end" but essentially rush end is still Fowler and Yannick, right? I was under the impression Smoot is more big end than rush end...
Fowler will already be missing 1 game due to suspension. And if his weight doesn't bounce back (or strength or whatever) he could miss more than just the one.

I totally could see Campbell's sack number drop and Yannick's get higher. 
I also think Fowler's sack number will decrease this year (which could be good if we are trying to keep him next season: $)
With Campbell on the way out (I'm guessing) our ends could end up being Bryan, Smoot, Fowler, and Yannick, perhaps adding a cheap vet or rookie next year.


But your points are very valid as to how or why he could miss that mark.
And it makes me wonder... with more and more rotation going on with a lot of teams... will the sack record ever be broken?
I could easily see things progressing as you describe here.

Regarding Smoot, he was first drafted as a backup big end to Campbell.  but as the season wore on, he saw snaps at RDE opposite Campbell.  I see him as a swing guy.  Like Bryan is a guy who could go from LDE to DT in certain situations, I could see Smoot play either the big DE or a pass rushing RDE (and actually an interior pass rusher) in certain situations.

Generally speaking we are eye to eye on this.

Indeed. One final point on the DL... not sure if it's our scheme or the general direction of the NFL but being able to effectively play multiple positions on the DL is a big plus. Almost every guy drafted or added in FA has a primary role and a secondary role where they are equally effective.
Bryan and Smoot are big ends that can transfer to interior or the other end.
In obvious run situations I could see Bryan, Dareus, Campbell, and Smoot on the line together. (Although as I mentioned... I'm hoping Yannick improves enough vs the run that it makes it hard to pull him off the line outside of him needing the breather)
LBers and DBs that can play multiple positions in the back 7 seem to be valued a lot more too as opposed to "in the box" or "zone" only guys.

(07-26-2018, 11:19 AM)Bullseye Wrote: One battle I did not mention, but quite possibly the most important one, is at WR.

If the Jaguars keep five, it would seem the 5 are

Lee
Chark
Westbrook
Cole
Moncrief

However, if the Jaguars keep 6, the question is who do they keep?

To me it seems the top three candidates are

Jaydon Mickens
Rashad Greene
Allen Lazard

in that order.

To me, Mickens has recently demonstrated explosive return ability as well as the ability to contribute some in the passing game.

Greene exhibited those same traits as a rookie, but has since had a down year ending in an achilles injury, spending last year on IR. While he has more size than Mickens, I have my doubts about his ability post achilles injury. I'd be far more confident in his ability to return to form if he had an ACL tear.

Lazard seems to be the longshot as a rookie UDFA. He is the biggest of these three receivers, and based upon his build, he would seem to offer a red zone threat. However, he does not appear to offer any return ability, so if he were going to make this team, he'd either have to prove to be an exceptional WR, or he'd have to contribute on special teams some other way, barring something way bad or unusual happening.

Now if the Jaguars go with five WRs, Westbrook, Lee and Chark also have demonstrated return ability, though I wouldn't want to see Chark returning punts.

I think there's too much talent AND not enough of a clear pecking order that we will almost certainly keep 6 WRs.
As for who has the edge... one would think Greene has it based on draft position, potential, and reading the tea leaves from Johnny O. However, Mickens came in last season when needed and did a fine job. Both as a returner and wide out.
Lazard has all the makings for a big possession type receiver and RZ threat. And with a lot of keyboard pundits trying to give him double duties as a possible TE target.
To me... it screams developmental PS guy.
IMO, it comes down to Greene and Mickens and honestly I hope it's Greene. Draft equity tied up in him. Mickens still has PS eligibility, iirc (though he might get stolen, as might Lazard).

All in all... when your biggest issues going into camp are who's our #6 receiver and who is our SAM backer (who plays, 35-40% snaps) we as fans gotta feel pretty good.
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#18

Shane Wynn is my guy still, i believe he can make that last spot
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#19
(This post was last modified: 07-26-2018, 02:18 PM by Kane.)

(07-26-2018, 02:00 PM)ColoJag Wrote: Shane Wynn is my guy still, i believe he can make that last spot

Ahh the forgotten man.
He shined a bit in preseason last year. I just think he's quite undersized. And while some guys have over come it, it is rare to become a regular contributor when that undersized.
In 3 seasons with 6 teams in the NFL he has yet to crack a starting lineup.
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#20

(07-26-2018, 01:15 PM)Kane Wrote: All in all... when your biggest issues going into camp are who's our #6 receiver and who is our SAM backer (who plays, 35-40% snaps) we as fans gotta feel pretty good.

There it is, folks!

We aren't under Gene Smith anymore!
 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!





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