Markeis McGlockton pulled into a convenience store parking lot a few days ago, parks in a spot designated for handicapped drivers. He enters the store with his son, leaving his girlfriend and mother of their children in the car with their two younger daughters. Michael Drejka parks nearby, inspect's McGlockton's car in front and back, apparently looking for a handicapped parking decal or tags. He begins talking to the woman, it appears to become heated and she opens the car door to emerge. McGlockton comes out of the store, approaches Drejka before roughly shoving him to the ground. Drejka can be seen reaching for and the bringing out a handgun, McGlockton backs away. Drejka fires one shot, McGlockton staggers, clutching his chest, back into the store where he collapsed and died.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAUrLpmOQVk

It appears to me there was over reaction by both men, but all facts are not yet known, including what was said.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

IMO, I think he should be prosecuted, let a jury decide his guilt or innocence. She shouldn't have parked there, he had no business saying anything to the woman, the big guy shouldn't have pushed him, and he shouldn't have shot him. Everybody [BLEEP] up and that family is going to pay a very hard price for it. This is a tough case that needs to be examined by a jury, we need some precedence on what happens when the shooter is both aggressor and victim. I feel terrible for the woman and her kids going through that.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

IMO, I think he should be prosecuted, let a jury decide his guilt or innocence. She shouldn't have parked there, he had no business saying anything to the woman, the big guy shouldn't have pushed him, and he shouldn't have shot him. Everybody [BLEEP] up and that family is going to pay a very hard price for it. This is a tough case that needs to be examined by a jury, we need some precedence on what happens when the shooter is both aggressor and victim. I feel terrible for the woman and her kids going through that.

I agree with you completely. I understand Drejka's fear, I understand McGlockton's instinct to protect his girlfriend. Heck, I totally understand Drejka's anger over the misuse of a handicapped parking space, but damn...a father died in front of his children over this. I don't agree with a law that gives an officer so much discretion over whether or not to make an arrest at the scene of a homicide, hopefully this case will go to trial.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

IMO, I think he should be prosecuted, let a jury decide his guilt or innocence. She shouldn't have parked there, he had no business saying anything to the woman, the big guy shouldn't have pushed him, and he shouldn't have shot him. Everybody [BLEEP] up and that family is going to pay a very hard price for it. This is a tough case that needs to be examined by a jury, we need some precedence on what happens when the shooter is both aggressor and victim. I feel terrible for the woman and her kids going through that.

I agree.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

One of those situations that escalated further than necessary. It is situations like this that cause folks to turn a blind eye when something is wrong. In any case, In my opinion, the escalation began once the Mrs. stepped out of the car. It went even further once shoving began. With all that said, I do not see clear Stand Your Ground justification. Further more, all parties will suffer because nobody wanted to be an adult and de escalate the situation. The DA should bring charges and let judge/jury clean this up.

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I don't have a problem with it, but that's only if this is an older handicapped man.

The old man stood a foot or two from the window. He didn't make an aggressive movement toward the car. If the girlfriend was in such fear then she wouldn't have exited the car. McGlokton pushes Drejka down (easily) and continues walking toward him. He pulls his shorts up like he wants to fight. He doesn't look like he's done with Drejka until Drejka pulls the gun. McGlokton turns his body but he still stands there. It's reasonable to believe Drejka thought he was going to get his [BLEEP] handed to him.

He didn't die over a parking spot, by the way. He died because he attacked someone unnecessarily. The lesson here is that you shouldn't attack someone without cause.

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I don't have a problem with it, but that's only if this is an older handicapped man.

The old man stood a foot or two from the window. He didn't make an aggressive movement toward the car. If the girlfriend was in such fear then she wouldn't have exited the car. McGlokton pushes Drejka down (easily) and continues walking toward him. He pulls his shorts up like he wants to fight. He doesn't look like he's done with Drejka until Drejka pulls the gun. McGlokton turns his body but he still stands there. It's reasonable to believe Drejka thought he was going to get his [BLEEP] handed to him.

He didn't die over a parking spot, by the way. He died because he attacked someone unnecessarily. The lesson here is that you shouldn't attack someone without cause.

Otoh, starting a fight shouldn't mean you get to kill the people you started it with just because they respond to your aggression.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Who started the fight? Looks to me like it was about to be 3 against one old man, but we can't know for sure.

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Who started the fight?  Looks to me like it was about to be 3 against one old man, but we can't know for sure.

47 isn't old.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

I don't have a problem with it, but that's only if this is an older handicapped man.

The old man stood a foot or two from the window. He didn't make an aggressive movement toward the car. If the girlfriend was in such fear then she wouldn't have exited the car. McGlokton pushes Drejka down (easily) and continues walking toward him. He pulls his shorts up like he wants to fight. He doesn't look like he's done with Drejka until Drejka pulls the gun. McGlokton turns his body but he still stands there. It's reasonable to believe Drejka thought he was going to get his [BLEEP] handed to him.

He didn't die over a parking spot, by the way. He died because he attacked someone unnecessarily. The lesson here is that you shouldn't attack someone without cause.

Otoh, starting a fight shouldn't mean you get to kill the people you started it with just because they respond to your aggression.

He didn't start the fight. He was arguing with the woman. A verbal argument about a parking space doesn't justify getting pushed down. 

A verbal argument doesn't justify physical violence. Physical violence, however, does justify further physical violence if it's necessary to defend yourself.

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That is great. How does it make sense then to knee cap the number of H1B workers coming to America to satisfy tech jobs we are woefully ill equipped to fill with the domestic labor pool? What steps have been taken to better equip our labor force to gain these in-demand skills? How many of these people are working more than one job since their wage is not sufficient to live off of? How come wage growth is so much lower than expected? You cannot call check mate when you have barely proven you can play checkers. What part of your statement addresses any of my last statement? None, but it sure sounded good.

Who started the fight?  Looks to me like it was about to be 3 against one old man, but we can't know for sure.

47 isn't old.

The legal concept deals with disparity of force. It doesn't matter what his age was. He got attacked by someone younger, larger, stronger, and with 2 more possible attackers closing in. The man on the ground can't read everyone's mind. Was he about to get his face kicked in, or worse? The only thing he knows at this point is that the other parties are in the wrong. Parked illegally then assaulted him for speaking about it.

Yes, I know the "old" man is a prima donna toy cop wannabe. He is especially stupid to be confrontational while carrying. There are some people who should not be carrying, especially if it gives them any extra sense of bravado. So it's pretty much a thumbs down for everyone involved.

I think CCW classes should concentrate more on de-escalation techniques rather than teaching what constitutes a "good shoot" under the law.

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I am a believer in the "Stand Your Ground" law, but in this case, I don't think it applies. Yes, the man got pushed, but I see no reason to believe his life was in danger. This was one of those cases where everyone was at fault and the situation should have NEVER gotten to the point of a shooting. If I were the D.A., I would definitely take this before a jury and see if a conviction of manslaughter is warranted. It's a shame that neither man could restrain themselves from making the situation worse. The one man should have never parked in a handicap spot without the proper documentation. The other guy should have called the cops instead of taking the law into his own hands and starting a fight and he definitely shouldn't have shoved the other guy. The shooter should have never fired a gun over getting pushed. There were complete over-reactions by both men. Everyone is so quick to resort to violence these days.

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That is great. How does it make sense then to knee cap the number of H1B workers coming to America to satisfy tech jobs we are woefully ill equipped to fill with the domestic labor pool? What steps have been taken to better equip our labor force to gain these in-demand skills? How many of these people are working more than one job since their wage is not sufficient to live off of? How come wage growth is so much lower than expected? You cannot call check mate when you have barely proven you can play checkers. What part of your statement addresses any of my last statement? None, but it sure sounded good.

47 isn't old.

The legal concept deals with disparity of force.  It doesn't matter what his age was.  He got attacked by someone younger, larger, stronger, and with 2 more possible attackers closing in.  The man on the ground can't read everyone's mind.  Was he about to get his face kicked in, or worse?  The only thing he knows at this point is that the other parties are in the wrong.  Parked illegally then assaulted him for speaking about it.

Yes, I know the "old" man is a prima donna toy cop wannabe.  He is especially stupid to be confrontational while carrying.  There are some people who should not be carrying, especially if it gives them any extra sense of bravado.  So it's pretty much a thumbs down for everyone involved.  

I think CCW classes should concentrate more on de-escalation techniques rather than teaching what constitutes a "good shoot" under the law.

Looking at the tape I think the shooter was in the wrong. And using a gun is the disparity of force, not getting pushed down for verbally assaulting a woman.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

I am a believer in the "Stand Your Ground" law, but in this case, I don't think it applies. Yes, the man got pushed, but I see no reason to believe his life was in danger. This was one of those cases where everyone was at fault and the situation should have NEVER gotten to the point of a shooting. If I were the D.A., I would definitely take this before a jury and see if a conviction of manslaughter is warranted. It's a shame that neither man could restrain themselves from making the situation worse. The one man should have never parked in a handicap spot without the proper documentation. The other guy should have called the cops instead of taking the law into his own hands and starting a fight and he definitely shouldn't have shoved the other guy. The shooter should have never fired a gun over getting pushed. There were complete over-reactions by both men. Everyone is so quick to resort to violence these days.

Your life doesn't need to be in danger. You only need to fear serious bodily harm (or death).

The legal concept deals with disparity of force.  It doesn't matter what his age was.  He got attacked by someone younger, larger, stronger, and with 2 more possible attackers closing in.  The man on the ground can't read everyone's mind.  Was he about to get his face kicked in, or worse?  The only thing he knows at this point is that the other parties are in the wrong.  Parked illegally then assaulted him for speaking about it.

Yes, I know the "old" man is a prima donna toy cop wannabe.  He is especially stupid to be confrontational while carrying.  There are some people who should not be carrying, especially if it gives them any extra sense of bravado.  So it's pretty much a thumbs down for everyone involved.  

I think CCW classes should concentrate more on de-escalation techniques rather than teaching what constitutes a "good shoot" under the law.

Looking at the tape I think the shooter was in the wrong. And using a gun is the disparity of force, not getting pushed down for verbally assaulting a woman.

How can arguing with someone be considered verbally assaulting them? That seems to sensationalize what he did.

How is pushing someone and preparing to attack them not a disparity of force when it was done in response to words? FORCE > NO FORCE

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I believe in the castle doctrine. If you're inside my house in the middle of the night and you so much as look up before running for the door after I catch you, I'd put one between your eyes in a heartbeat.

I don't believe in or agree with a law that allows a person to open fire because someone else knocked them on their [BLEEP] then backed away. The shooter should be charged with second degree murder. Partly because pulling a gun in that situation was an unreasonable escalation, but mostly because only a coward pulls out a gun when faced with a fistfight.

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I don't have a problem with it, but that's only if this is an older handicapped man.

The old man stood a foot or two from the window. He didn't make an aggressive movement toward the car. If the girlfriend was in such fear then she wouldn't have exited the car. McGlokton pushes Drejka down (easily) and continues walking toward him. He pulls his shorts up like he wants to fight. He doesn't look like he's done with Drejka until Drejka pulls the gun. McGlokton turns his body but he still stands there. It's reasonable to believe Drejka thought he was going to get his [BLEEP] handed to him.

He didn't die over a parking spot, by the way. He died because he attacked someone unnecessarily. The lesson here is that you shouldn't attack someone without cause.

The text in bold isn't true. As soon as Drejka starts reaching for his gun McGlokton steps back at least two steps, then turns slightly sideways. He was clearly backing away and ceased his aggressive behavior. At that point Drejka had the upper hand and was in control. There was no need to fire.

I'm not sure what the girlfriend's fear, if she was afraid, had to do with it, but if I had two kids in the car and some man was confronting me, pointing at me, I would get out of the car to talk to him.

We also don't hear anything on the video, so we can't say for certain why McGlokton shoved Drejka. 

There may be more to this. There were reports of Drejka harassing another person for the same reason. We'll see.

One thing I find ironic is Drejka isn't even parked in a lined, designated parking spot himself.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

I believe in the castle doctrine. If you're inside my house in the middle of the night and you so much as look up before running for the door after I catch you, I'd put one between your eyes in a heartbeat.

I don't believe in or agree with a law that allows a person to open fire because someone else knocked them on their [BLEEP] then backed away. The shooter should be charged with second degree murder. Partly because pulling a gun in that situation was an unreasonable escalation, but mostly because only a coward pulls out a gun when faced with a fistfight.

Amen!

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I don't have a problem with it, but that's only if this is an older handicapped man.

The old man stood a foot or two from the window. He didn't make an aggressive movement toward the car. If the girlfriend was in such fear then she wouldn't have exited the car. McGlokton pushes Drejka down (easily) and continues walking toward him. He pulls his shorts up like he wants to fight. He doesn't look like he's done with Drejka until Drejka pulls the gun. McGlokton turns his body but he still stands there. It's reasonable to believe Drejka thought he was going to get his [BLEEP] handed to him.

He didn't die over a parking spot, by the way. He died because he attacked someone unnecessarily. The lesson here is that you shouldn't attack someone without cause.

The text in bold isn't true. As soon as Drejka starts reaching for his gun McGlokton steps back at least two steps, then turns slightly sideways. He was clearly backing away and ceased his aggressive behavior. At that point Drejka had the upper hand and was in control. There was no need to fire.

I'm not sure what the girlfriend's fear, if she was afraid, had to do with it, but if I had two kids in the car and some man was confronting me, pointing at me, I would get out of the car to talk to him.

We also don't hear anything on the video, so we can't say for certain why McGlokton shoved Drejka. 

There may be more to this. There were reports of Drejka harassing another person for the same reason. We'll see.

One thing I find ironic is Drejka isn't even parked in a lined, designated parking spot himself.

He backed away and stood there. Canting your body doesn't take the threat away. He's already shown aggression. Why would you put the burden on the victim to flee, when in this case, the attacker could have done the same but didn't. You don't hold him to the same standard? How is Drejka supposed to flee when he's on the ground and McGlokton looks like he's about to whoop his [BLEEP]? When Drejka pulled the gun, everyone ran except McGlokton. The entire duration from push-to-shooting was less than 5 seconds. From the point where Drejka sat up in a position where he could defend himself and pulled the gun, it was about 1.5 seconds. Think about that. Think about what you would do with someone walking toward you, still posturing as if they wanted to attack you (after already pushing you), and then realize 1.5 seconds has already passed.

The girlfriend's fear is relevant because, if he was threatening, then a reasonable person wouldn't get out of the car unless they're preparing for further conflict.

You're right; we don't hear anything. The girlfriend has never claimed he was threatening, however. In fact, she said he only criticized her for parking there and asked her to move. She said she had the right to park in a handicapped parking space so she isn't very smart either. In my opinion, he's an idiot for making such a big deal about it. Him criticizing her isn't illegal though. You can correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm assuming that you said we don't know what was said implying that Drejka could have been threatening--justifying the push? In the same way, we don't know if McGlokton told Drejka he was going to kill him. 

Drejka is an idiot. He should've just parked and went about his business. He wasn't the one to escalate this, however.

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The text in bold isn't true. As soon as Drejka starts reaching for his gun McGlokton steps back at least two steps, then turns slightly sideways. He was clearly backing away and ceased his aggressive behavior. At that point Drejka had the upper hand and was in control. There was no need to fire.

I'm not sure what the girlfriend's fear, if she was afraid, had to do with it, but if I had two kids in the car and some man was confronting me, pointing at me, I would get out of the car to talk to him.

We also don't hear anything on the video, so we can't say for certain why McGlokton shoved Drejka. 

There may be more to this. There were reports of Drejka harassing another person for the same reason. We'll see.

One thing I find ironic is Drejka isn't even parked in a lined, designated parking spot himself.

He backed away and stood there. Canting your body doesn't take the threat away. He's already shown aggression. Why would you put the burden on the victim to flee, when in this case, the attacker could have done the same but didn't. You don't hold him to the same standard? How is Drejka supposed to flee when he's on the ground and McGlokton looks like he's about to whoop his [BLEEP]? When Drejka pulled the gun, everyone ran except McGlokton. The entire duration from push-to-shooting was less than 5 seconds. From the point where Drejka sat up in a position where he could defend himself and pulled the gun, it was about 1.5 seconds. Think about that. Think about what you would do with someone walking toward you, still posturing as if they wanted to attack you (after already pushing you), and then realize 1.5 seconds has already passed.

The girlfriend's fear is relevant because, if he was threatening, then a reasonable person wouldn't get out of the car unless they're preparing for further conflict.

You're right; we don't hear anything. The girlfriend has never claimed he was threatening, however. In fact, she said he only criticized her for parking there and asked her to move. She said she had the right to park in a handicapped parking space so she isn't very smart either. In my opinion, he's an idiot for making such a big deal about it. Him criticizing her isn't illegal though. You can correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm assuming that you said we don't know what was said implying that Drejka could have been threatening--justifying the push? In the same way, we don't know if McGlokton told Drejka he was going to kill him. 

Drejka is an idiot. He should've just parked and went about his business. He wasn't the one to escalate this, however.

But he did in fact start it.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

While I don't agree with parking in those spots if not entitled. Looks like the other guy was looking for an argument and maybe feeling a bit braver due to carrying a weapon. I mean did it matter? there was multiple free spots right next to the door and nobody affected.

The carrying of a gun just caused a completely pointless death from a nothing incident.

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