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Draft O-Line Early In 2019? Finally?

#21

(11-20-2018, 07:37 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote:
(11-20-2018, 05:07 PM)JackCity Wrote: Biadasz from Wisconsin might be a first round pick if he comes out.

If he does, I believe he will be the first real interior lineman taken in the draft. The only problem with him is that he is a true Center and doesn't offer any versatility to play other positions, as far as we're concerned. He is by far, the best Center in the draft though and a lot of teams need one.

(11-20-2018, 07:03 PM)JackCity Wrote: Here's a name for you all.

Johnny Gibson Jr , Senior guard for Arkansas. 6'4 320

Arkansas' offense has been pretty bad this year. They rank #109 in total offense. I'd imagine he'd be a late round pick.

Thankfully players can be independently good on bad units. He's a really good run blocker and has done it Vs SEC dlines too.
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#22

(11-20-2018, 09:14 PM)JackCity Wrote:
(11-20-2018, 07:37 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: If he does, I believe he will be the first real interior lineman taken in the draft. The only problem with him is that he is a true Center and doesn't offer any versatility to play other positions, as far as we're concerned. He is by far, the best Center in the draft though and a lot of teams need one.


Arkansas' offense has been pretty bad this year. They rank #109 in total offense. I'd imagine he'd be a late round pick.

Thankfully players can be independently good on bad units. He's a really good run blocker and has done it Vs SEC dlines too.

I've gone through almost every draftboard on the internet that I can find, which has the top 100 players. Some even rank the top 300 prospects and I have yet to see his name in the first 4 rounds, if at all. We need to to take O-Linemen early in day 2 of the draft.
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#23
(This post was last modified: 11-21-2018, 02:00 AM by JackCity.)

(11-21-2018, 12:51 AM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote:
(11-20-2018, 09:14 PM)JackCity Wrote: Thankfully players can be independently good on bad units. He's a really good run blocker and has done it Vs SEC dlines too.

I've gone through almost every draftboard on the internet that I can find, which has the top 100 players. Some even rank the top 300 prospects and I have yet to see his name in the first 4 rounds, if at all. We need to to take O-Linemen early in day 2 of the draft.

I didn't say his name because I saw it high on some draft board. Just a guy I watched along my travels and was impressed by. Likely a riser.

Him being on a bad team and not high on media draft boards means literally nothing to me
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#24

(11-21-2018, 01:59 AM)JackCity Wrote:
(11-21-2018, 12:51 AM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: I've gone through almost every draftboard on the internet that I can find, which has the top 100 players. Some even rank the top 300 prospects and I have yet to see his name in the first 4 rounds, if at all. We need to to take O-Linemen early in day 2 of the draft.

I didn't say his name because I saw it high on some draft board. Just a guy I watched along my travels and was impressed by. Likely a riser.

Him being on a bad team and not high on media draft boards means literally nothing to me

That's fine, but I'm simply saying we're to the point where O-Line is a HUGE need and even if the guy is a late riser, it's unlikely he would rise all the way into the first 3 rounds and that is where we must start building our offense. I'd advocate using all of our 4 picks in the first 3 rounds on offense, (QB, OG/OT,TE and swing Tackle). We need high end players on the O-Line, especially if we are planning on starting a rookie QB either in the middle of 2019 or at the start of the 2020 season, depending on who we have as a bridge QB. We could always bring in guys for depth, that's great, but we need an instant starter at RG. Not only that, but depending on what we do with Parnell in the offseason and if Robinson can be ready by the start of the 2019 season and how much Richardson comes along, we may be needing a starting RT. Hopefully, Norwell can pull it together, because he has looked like crap so far. His big contract means his spot on the O-Line is locked in though.
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#25

I have no idea about specific players and don't plan to start looking until after the season, but yes yes yes to drafting o-line early. Not in the first though, that needs to be a QB.
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#26

Check out Nick Allegretti RG for Illinois. Came across him watching Reggie Corbin and I'd safely say he's a top 5 interior in this class. 6'4 320 but moves really well. His game against Nebraska is one of the best individual linemen performances I've seen this year.

Haven't seen anybody talking about him yet but according to his bio PFF have rated him very highly the last two seasons and stats wise he's given up very few pressures.
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#27

we do need seconed string offenssive lineman that can play first,and same with 3rd string offenssive lineman




snowwolf titans owner in madden.

note titans owner means im undeafted againest them. 

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#28

Kaleb McGary is a guy I think we could look at in the 2nd or 3rd if still available for Parnells replacement. Has started a 4 years at RT, made first team All Pac 12 the last 2 years, Won the 2018 Morris Trophy (award to the best olineman in the Pac 12 voted by opposing players). 320 lbs. and a great run blocker. I love the fact that he has started 4 years a RT. I dont think he will be there with our 3rd pick but if we go QB and TE or G in the first 2 I think a trade up from our first 3rd round pick to get a guy that could start day one at RT is possible.
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#29

(12-18-2018, 08:06 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: Kaleb McGary is a guy I think we could look at in the 2nd or 3rd if still available for Parnells replacement.   Has started a 4 years at RT, made first team All Pac 12 the last 2 years, Won the 2018 Morris Trophy (award to the best olineman in the Pac 12 voted by opposing players).  320 lbs. and a great run blocker.  I love the fact that he has started 4 years a RT. I dont think he will be there with our 3rd pick but if we go QB and TE or G in the first 2 I think a trade up from our first 3rd round pick to get a guy that could start day one at RT is possible.

The problem with him is that he is a RT only. We already have that kind of player in Will Richardson. Meantime, we don't know it Cam will be ready to start the 2019 season. I'd rather draft a Tackle with experience at both RT and LT. While McGary is a very good RT prospect, I don't know if he has the footwork to play LT.
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#30

(12-18-2018, 08:34 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote:
(12-18-2018, 08:06 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: Kaleb McGary is a guy I think we could look at in the 2nd or 3rd if still available for Parnells replacement.   Has started a 4 years at RT, made first team All Pac 12 the last 2 years, Won the 2018 Morris Trophy (award to the best olineman in the Pac 12 voted by opposing players).  320 lbs. and a great run blocker.  I love the fact that he has started 4 years a RT. I dont think he will be there with our 3rd pick but if we go QB and TE or G in the first 2 I think a trade up from our first 3rd round pick to get a guy that could start day one at RT is possible.

The problem with him is that he is a RT only. We already have that kind of player in Will Richardson. Meantime, we don't know it Cam will be ready to start the 2019 season. I'd rather draft a Tackle with experience at both RT and LT. While McGary is a very good RT prospect, I don't know if he has the footwork to play LT.
So you would rather draft a swing tackle that's not as good?  If we can get a fixture at RT I'm all for it.
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#31

(12-18-2018, 08:54 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote:
(12-18-2018, 08:34 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: The problem with him is that he is a RT only. We already have that kind of player in Will Richardson. Meantime, we don't know it Cam will be ready to start the 2019 season. I'd rather draft a Tackle with experience at both RT and LT. While McGary is a very good RT prospect, I don't know if he has the footwork to play LT.
So you would rather draft a swing tackle that's not as good?  If we can get a fixture at RT I'm all for it.

Who says they wouldn't be as good? Wouldn't it be redundant to draft a player two years in a row that can only play RT? We still have no decent backup LT and our starting LT might not be ready when the season starts. If we march out there in 2019 with Ereck Flowers at LT to start the season, I'm gonna jump off the tallest building I can find.
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#32

(12-18-2018, 09:57 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote:
(12-18-2018, 08:54 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: So you would rather draft a swing tackle that's not as good?  If we can get a fixture at RT I'm all for it.

Who says they wouldn't be as good? Wouldn't it be redundant to draft a player two years in a row that can only play RT? We still have no decent backup LT and our starting LT might not be ready when the season starts. If we march out there in 2019 with Ereck Flowers at LT to start the season, I'm gonna jump off the tallest building I can find.

Cam will be ready.
Richardson can play RT and RG
Linder and Norwell spots are locked.

We really only need one OL starter (probably need to get 2 more reserve guys either FA or draft)

I think McGary is a 3rd or 4th round guy.
If we're looking at the 2nd or early 3rd round I like Dalton Risner (RT, also can play RG and C)

But I've been hearing a lot about Jonah Williams sliding because although he played well at LT NFL teams see him more as a RT so he's getting more of a late round grade.
There may only be 1 or 2 OTs worthy of top 15 selection in this draft from what I'm reading.

If we move back in the first, I'd love grabbing Williams to bookend with Robinson, but that would leave us converting Richardson to RG (an idea floated but never really tried) or filling Cann's spot with another draft pick or free agent, leaving Richardson to be the swing OT.
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#33

(12-21-2018, 01:29 PM)Kane Wrote:
(12-18-2018, 09:57 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: Who says they wouldn't be as good? Wouldn't it be redundant to draft a player two years in a row that can only play RT? We still have no decent backup LT and our starting LT might not be ready when the season starts. If we march out there in 2019 with Ereck Flowers at LT to start the season, I'm gonna jump off the tallest building I can find.

Cam will be ready.
Richardson can play RT and RG
Linder and Norwell spots are locked.

We really only need one OL starter (probably need to get 2 more reserve guys either FA or draft)

I think McGary is a 3rd or 4th round guy.
If we're looking at the 2nd or early 3rd round I like Dalton Risner (RT, also can play RG and C)

But I've been hearing a lot about Jonah Williams sliding because although he played well at LT NFL teams see him more as a RT so he's getting more of a late round grade.
There may only be 1 or 2 OTs worthy of top 15 selection in this draft from what I'm reading.

If we move back in the first, I'd love grabbing Williams to bookend with Robinson, but that would leave us converting Richardson to RG (an idea floated but never really tried) or filling Cann's spot with another draft pick or free agent, leaving Richardson to be the swing OT.

How do you know Cam will be ready? Richardson has proven nothing up until now. He barely played, in the preseason. I'm not comfortable installing him at RT without some kind of competition. As I said before, I believe a competent swing Tackle is the #3 need on this team, behind QB and RG. That means someone with LT experience. I don't wanna use that position on some UDFA either. We keep doing that and our OT depth sucks. I don't see Williams sliding out of the top 10. If nothing else, Buffalo will definitely snag him. Besides, assuming Haskins enters the draft, we'd have no need to trade back. QB is definitely our #1 need. 

I would never use Richardson as a swing Tackle, because even in college, he was a RT only. A lot of guys can't make that adjustment to LT, because it requires better footwork. I want a player with experience at LT, have some type of evidence, he can handle the adjustment. That leaves us with converting Richardson to RG, which I would be o.k. with or having him compete for the RT position with someone new, (assuming Parnell is gone.)
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#34

Cam tore his ACL in week 2, which means he has a full year to rehab and be ready. Players generally come back from ACL tears in the 9 month range, so in all likelihood he will be ready. Obviously something could happen that prevents him being cleared to play, but past history with this injury heavily suggests he'll be fine by the start of the season.
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#35

(12-21-2018, 02:26 PM)empty Wrote: Cam tore his ACL in week 2, which means he has a full year to rehab and be ready.  Players generally come back from ACL tears in the 9 month range, so in all likelihood he will be ready.  Obviously something could happen that prevents him being cleared to play, but past history with this injury heavily suggests he'll be fine by the start of the season.

Even if he does come back and is 100%, that doesn't change my draft plans. 

Needs:

#1 QB
#2 RG
#3 Swing Tackle
#4 TE
#5 WR
#6 NT
#7 DE

and if we happen to add any more picks, I use them on OG depth, another QB and LB depth.
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#36

(12-21-2018, 02:52 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote:
(12-21-2018, 02:26 PM)empty Wrote: Cam tore his ACL in week 2, which means he has a full year to rehab and be ready.  Players generally come back from ACL tears in the 9 month range, so in all likelihood he will be ready.  Obviously something could happen that prevents him being cleared to play, but past history with this injury heavily suggests he'll be fine by the start of the season.

Even if he does come back and is 100%, that doesn't change my draft plans. 

Needs:

#1 QB
#2 RG
#3 Swing Tackle
#4 TE
#5 WR
#6 NT
#7 DE

and if we happen to add any more picks, I use them on OG depth, another QB and LB depth.

This is about right IMHO. I am also wondering if they'll actually sit tight on both of those 3rd RD picks and make some selections or if they'll try to move up to get hopefully a big name that slipped out of RD1.
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#37

(12-21-2018, 05:00 PM)Caldrac Wrote:
(12-21-2018, 02:52 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: Even if he does come back and is 100%, that doesn't change my draft plans. 

Needs:

#1 QB
#2 RG
#3 Swing Tackle
#4 TE
#5 WR
#6 NT
#7 DE

and if we happen to add any more picks, I use them on OG depth, another QB and LB depth.

This is about right IMHO. I am also wondering if they'll actually sit tight on both of those 3rd RD picks and make some selections or if they'll try to move up to get hopefully a big name that slipped out of RD1.

Yes.  It would be pretty cool to package something to get one of the more "premier" o-linemen in a move-up after they've got their QB. 

Man, this draft is going to be crucial for this offense and the team's cap future.
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#38
(This post was last modified: 12-21-2018, 06:17 PM by TheO-LineMatters.)

(12-21-2018, 05:05 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(12-21-2018, 05:00 PM)Caldrac Wrote: This is about right IMHO. I am also wondering if they'll actually sit tight on both of those 3rd RD picks and make some selections or if they'll try to move up to get hopefully a big name that slipped out of RD1.

Yes.  It would be pretty cool to package something to get one of the more "premier" o-linemen in a move-up after they've got their QB. 

Man, this draft is going to be crucial for this offense and the team's cap future.

We pick high enough in round 2 to get a premier OG/OT. As far as a swing tackle, after Jonah Williams, I really don't see any premier Tackles in this draft. That's definitely not to say there isn't talent, there is, but guys like Yodny Cajuste, Mitch Hyatt, Jon Runyan Jr., Andre Dillard, Max Scharping and Jackson Barton are guys I would look at in that 3rd or 4th round area to fill the swing Tackle position. I'm hoping one of the premier TE's might fall to our first pick of round 3.
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#39

(12-21-2018, 06:14 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote:
(12-21-2018, 05:05 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: Yes.  It would be pretty cool to package something to get one of the more "premier" o-linemen in a move-up after they've got their QB. 

Man, this draft is going to be crucial for this offense and the team's cap future.

We pick high enough in round 2 to get a premier OG/OT.
...
Yeah, maybe. 
It's a little early to think we know which guys are going to be sitting there at our second pick. The top tackles could be gone.
I know you've got your own strategy with a guard and a swing tackle, but I'm trying to keep a more open mind about it. I find it difficult to feel any certainty about the front office's approach to filling out this o-line when we have no clue what their evaluation of Richardson is. 
It's possible they go after two tackles that have enough versatility to play guard and/or either tackle spot. It's possible they don't target right tackle at all other than depth behind Richardson/Parnell.  
It's hard to guess right now with the amount of unknowns floating around that right side. There's a lot of ways to try skinning this particular cat. 


All I know is they definitely need a guard before the 4th and they need depth everywhere. I just hope to see two quality linemen selected before the 4th round, and I hope one of them has some versatility. 
I imagine we'll see some depth signings in mid March from the pool of journeymen out there. That may be the first chance to really begin speculating their approach.
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#40

(12-21-2018, 06:35 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(12-21-2018, 06:14 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: We pick high enough in round 2 to get a premier OG/OT.
...
Yeah, maybe. 
It's a little early to think we know which guys are going to be sitting there at our second pick. The top tackles could be gone.
I know you've got your own strategy with a guard and a swing tackle, but I'm trying to keep a more open mind about it. I find it difficult to feel any certainty about the front office's approach to filling out this o-line when we have no clue what their evaluation of Richardson is. 
It's possible they go after two tackles that have enough versatility to play guard and/or either tackle spot. It's possible they don't target right tackle at all other than depth behind Richardson/Parnell.  
It's hard to guess right now with the amount of unknowns floating around that right side. There's a lot of ways to try skinning this particular cat. 


All I know is they definitely need a guard before the 4th and they need depth everywhere. I just hope to see two quality linemen selected before the 4th round, and I hope one of them has some versatility. 
I imagine we'll see some depth signings in mid March from the pool of journeymen out there. That may be the first chance to really begin speculating their approach.

I agree totally. We have no clue what the team will do regarding the O-Line, but they have to see it's a major problem. I don't know what their evaluation of Richardson is, but last season the coaching staff was adamant he was a RT only. I doubt they stray from that, unless we get a whole new coaching staff (fingers crossed.) I really do not want to go through a bunch of low level journeymen FA's to fill holes. That does nothing. I believe in building via the draft. Hopefully we've learned our lesson this season and we build a stronger O-Line around our new QB.
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