Nothing.

Fearful suburbanites just make up reasons not to go there. 
Because Jax is so spread out - there are many communities that are 40 minutes or more from downtown, so those folks have a convenience factor to deal with as well. 

It could be a thriving downtown if it didn't have some preposterous stigma and folks had the cojones to venture out from the safety of their far-flung cul-de-sacs and stripmalls. 

Metro Jax is about as far flung as a city can be and it doesn't really have an "urban core."   The newer residential buildings along the waterfront downtown are half empty. People don't want to live there and the dozen or so bars and restaurants seem to have just enough clientele to survive. I make a point to eat and drink downtown at least once a month and I always enjoy it. It's really strange the way folks stay away though.  There's no degree of homelessness or crime that is disproportionate to a city of this size. And the way the river winds through downtown makes it seem even more inviting. I don't understand why folks are so anti-downtown. Makes no sense to me.

Make up reasons not to go there? Maybe "suburbanites" just don't consider Burrito Gallery "fine dining" or getting harassed by homeless people after hunting for a parking space for 20 minutes. 

LOL

Did you know that two newer, much nicer restaurants have opened downtown since Burrito Gallery was bought and became operated by the Mellow Mushroom company? 

One of them is a fine dining chophouse with a beautiful roof-deck which is amazing at sunset.  You should see if it's possible to muster enough courage to brush past a homeless person on your way from the car -- oh wait, you won't have to since they have free valet parking. 

There's really just no good reason that so many people have this inexplicable aversion to downtown.

---

Since I have never been in Jacksonville, can you guys tell me whats wrong with Jax doxntown or around the stadium ? Thanks

Nothing.

Fearful suburbanites just make up reasons not to go there. 
Because Jax is so spread out - there are many communities that are 40 minutes or more from downtown, so those folks have a convenience factor to deal with as well. 

It could be a thriving downtown if it didn't have some preposterous stigma and folks had the cojones to venture out from the safety of their far-flung cul-de-sacs and stripmalls. 

Metro Jax is about as far flung as a city can be and it doesn't really have an "urban core."   The newer residential buildings along the waterfront downtown are half empty. People don't want to live there and the dozen or so bars and restaurants seem to have just enough clientele to survive. I make a point to eat and drink downtown at least once a month and I always enjoy it. It's really strange the way folks stay away though.  There's no degree of homelessness or crime that is disproportionate to a city of this size. And the way the river winds through downtown makes it seem even more inviting. I don't understand why folks are so anti-downtown. Makes no sense to me.

This and most of the bad opinions (as can be seen in this thread) are based on perceptions and ideas from 20 years ago. There's still a lot of work to do and there are still issues but it's not the wasteland that some of the McMansion dwelling Ponte Vedre-ites would have everyone believe.

---

I'm condescending. That means I talk down to you.

It looks like a dump. Homeless people and litter everywhere. Dilapidated buildings. A jail house and a homeless center is close by.  Ugly coffee manufacture building and shipyard. People who come from out of state to watch the Gator Bowl have told me Jacksonville is ghetto.

Try Cowford Chophouse.  That's a really nice place.

I'll take my woman there and see if she likes it.  lol

---

It looks like a dump. Homeless people and litter everywhere. Dilapidated buildings. A jail house and a homeless center is close by.  Ugly coffee manufacture building and shipyard. People who come from out of state to watch the Gator Bowl have told me Jacksonville is ghetto.

Try Cowford Chophouse.  That's a really nice place.

How does it compare to Ruth's Chris?

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Make up reasons not to go there? Maybe "suburbanites" just don't consider Burrito Gallery "fine dining" or getting harassed by homeless people after hunting for a parking space for 20 minutes. 

LOL

Did you know that two newer, much nicer restaurants have opened downtown since Burrito Gallery was bought and became operated by the Mellow Mushroom company? 

One of them is a fine dining chophouse with a beautiful roof-deck which is amazing at sunset.  You should see if it's possible to muster enough courage to brush past a homeless person on your way from the car -- oh wait, you won't have to since they have free valet parking. 

There's really just no good reason that so many people have this inexplicable aversion to downtown.

Downtown is dirty, man. The roads suck. The planning is pathetic.

Two new restaurants (Cowford Chophouse and Blacksheep) are not exactly selling me on downtown.. for a city of 1.3 million people, downtown sucks. And it always will.

---

LOL

Did you know that two newer, much nicer restaurants have opened downtown since Burrito Gallery was bought and became operated by the Mellow Mushroom company? 

One of them is a fine dining chophouse with a beautiful roof-deck which is amazing at sunset.  You should see if it's possible to muster enough courage to brush past a homeless person on your way from the car -- oh wait, you won't have to since they have free valet parking. 

There's really just no good reason that so many people have this inexplicable aversion to downtown.

Downtown is dirty, man. The roads suck. The planning is pathetic.

...

I don't get any of that ^ when I go downtown.  
No issues with any of those things.

---

Downtown is dirty, man. The roads suck. The planning is pathetic.

...

I don't get any of that ^ when I go downtown.  
No issues with any of those things.

As much as I hate Indy I would kill for their downtown. Almost any major city, actually.

---

Downtown is dirty, man. The roads suck. The planning is pathetic.

...

I don't get any of that ^ when I go downtown.  
No issues with any of those things.

I remember a few years ago when the Browns came to town, a Clevelander remarked how clean Jacksonville was.

Granted I don't think Cleveland should be our baseline, and downtown isn't without its shortcomings.

But sometimes I wonder if some of the complaints are excessive.

However, no matter how much legitimacy the complaints may have, I don't think the solution is continued neglect of downtown.

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Some of you should be careful what you wish for. I live in MD so I can only speak about 2 stadiums.

You could end up like the Redskins and FedEx field which is in the middle of no where. Parking is atrocious and there are no forms of transportation that can take you there.

Ravens stadium is nice and it's near Camden Yards (Orioles park) but it's also near some of the worst parts of Baltimore. I have a great time when I go there but you just have to know which streets to take and which ones to steer clear of (just like any city really).

---

Try Cowford Chophouse.  That's a really nice place.

How does it compare to Ruth's Chris?

I haven't been to Ruth's Chris in ages, so I can't say.  I did have the best steak of my life there (Cowford Chophouse) the other night.  You know how a ribeye is laid out, with the eye in the middle and the "cap" around it.   That "cap" is the tenderest and juiciest part of the ribeye.   So the steak I had was just that cap part, cut in the shape of a steak, and it was the tenderest, tastiest, and juiciest steak I've ever had.   Only $85, haha.  Fortunately, someone else was buying.

---

Downtown is dirty, man. The roads suck. The planning is pathetic.

...

I don't get any of that ^ when I go downtown.  
No issues with any of those things.

Ehh. I would have to agree with trivialpursuit on this one. I have done a bit of work down town for a contract I have with JEA for my small business(I have a small pressure washing company I started in college about 10 years ago) and as much as I want to say down town is on the rise, I have yet to see any evidence of this. I get contracted to do work on the sidewalks and curbs around the city and honestly I leave with the same feeling every time: " I just polished a turd".

I will say that is not for a lack of effort. The city does do quite a bit to try and clean up the inner city but, so far, I feel like it is far too little, too late. Just an example, I cleaned up a block on forsyth and main that took 2 days(only took 2 days because the landscaping on the palms was running behind). The first day went without a problem but when I came out for the second day, I walked around what I had already cleaned to find 3 shattered bottles, both trash cans that boarder the streets had been emptied onto the sidewalk and curb, and a homeless person who was fairly aggravated that I was going to be running a machine in earshot of where he was trying to sleep. Didn't bother me very much I cleaned up and put the trash can back and got to work. By the end of that day, I walked back around the corner that was messed up that morning and found the trash can back out on the sidewalk and chicken wings everywhere with a shattered bottle. I had a walk through the next morning so I cleaned it up a second time and took pictures before and after just in case it happened again. The next morning when I was on my way to the walk through I got a call from JEA asking me if I had seen the trash on side walks or the shattered bottles when I was cleaning the day before. I explained what happened and showed them the pictures and they understood. 

This is not all the cities fault but this happens regularly when I work down town. There is only so much the city can do about the homeless people but honestly I almost feel bad when im pressure washing the sidewalks because they pay me good money for something I know will go almost unnoticed by the next day. 

I think it is a combination of that mixed with the run down areas that surround down town and the stadium area that make it an undesirable area. It is one thing to eat somewhere and have a cocktail at bar in the area, but it something else to live in an area. I don't think many of us on the board would give up our current homes to move somewhere downtown.

Recently me and my wife were looking at homes and one of the listings was close to down town. The train of thought that lead me away from the listing was: 'would I want my wife going to grocery store after dark in an area like this'. I think that is something that plays into a lot of peoples decision making when considering those areas.

---

How does it compare to Ruth's Chris?

I haven't been to Ruth's Chris in ages, so I can't say.  I did have the best steak of my life there (Cowford Chophouse) the other night.  You know how a ribeye is laid out, with the eye in the middle and the "cap" around it.   That "cap" is the tenderest and juiciest part of the ribeye.   So the steak I had was just that cap part, cut in the shape of a steak, and it was the tenderest, tastiest, and juiciest steak I've ever had.   Only $85, haha.  Fortunately, someone else was buying.

way off topic but have you tried a tomahawk ribeye? incredibly expensive but that was the best cut I have every had.

---

I'll say this as an out-of-towner who recently went to his first live Jaguars game in J-Ville.
It's like a stadium was built between the interstate and the hood..... apologies to anyone currently living in that area... but it was relatively uncomfortable walking from where we parked through what I guess was the Sheriffs office and jail and among a bunch of run down buildings and low income housing areas.
Closer to the stadium was not as bad, obviously... where all the fun tailgating and bars are.
I don't have much to compare it to but I know I remember thinking about night games and safety. Also, aesthetics in general.

Hopefully Shad and the city (and tax payers) can figure out something better. For Jacksonville and its fans.

---

I'll say this as an out-of-towner who recently went to his first live Jaguars game in J-Ville.
It's like a stadium was built between the interstate and the hood..... apologies to anyone currently living in that area... but it was relatively uncomfortable walking from where we parked through what I guess was the Sheriffs office and jail and among a bunch of run down buildings and low income housing areas.
Closer to the stadium was not as bad, obviously... where all the fun tailgating and bars are.
I don't have much to compare it to but I know I remember thinking about night games and safety. Also, aesthetics in general.

Hopefully Shad and the city (and tax payers) can figure out something better. For Jacksonville and its fans.

Yea the neighborhood right after the Acosta bridge was 4th worst in the nation.. 1 in 4 chance of being a victim of a violent crime.

---

I'll say this as an out-of-towner who recently went to his first live Jaguars game in J-Ville.
It's like a stadium was built between the interstate and the hood..... apologies to anyone currently living in that area... but it was relatively uncomfortable walking from where we parked through what I guess was the Sheriffs office and jail and among a bunch of run down buildings and low income housing areas.
Closer to the stadium was not as bad, obviously... where all the fun tailgating and bars are.
I don't have much to compare it to but I know I remember thinking about night games and safety. Also, aesthetics in general.

Hopefully Shad and the city (and tax payers) can figure out something better. For Jacksonville and its fans.

Yea the neighborhood right after the Acosta bridge was 4th worst in the nation.. 1 in 4 chance of being a victim of a violent crime.

That is my feeling when I am in some of the rough parts; "My odds of something bad happening here are a lot better than if I was off san Pablo or somewhere around where I live.". I do not generally do a whole lot of work in those areas but since I started on a contract for JEA I have been called out to areas I don't typically venture. one thing I will say is the residents in the area that I meet when I come to clean their driveways are generally super nice and always offer something to drink or eat when I show up.

---

Yea the neighborhood right after the Acosta bridge was 4th worst in the nation.. 1 in 4 chance of being a victim of a violent crime.

That is my feeling when I am in some of the rough parts; "My odds of something bad happening here are a lot better than if I was off san Pablo or somewhere around where I live.". I do not generally do a whole lot of work in those areas but since I started on a contract for JEA I have been called out to areas I don't typically venture. one thing I will say is the residents in the area that I meet when I come to clean their driveways are generally super nice and always offer something to drink or eat when I show up.

Well, like the rest of Jacksonville, downtown is not just one homogeneous whole. There are places in Jax Beach or the Southside or especially the northwest side that are no great shakes either. On the other hand, if you know where you're going there are areas that are pretty cool. For what it's worth...

The Elbow

It's more of a quantity issue than quality right now. I used to work downtown. I think most people who fear downtown have an attitude bred from unfamiliarity.

---

I'm condescending. That means I talk down to you.

My 2 cents, I flew from Montana for the patriots game. I been to plenty of sporting events in big cities. I heard Jacksonville wasn’t as good of an experience but man was is disappointing. Other cities, endless sports stores, restaurants, bars, businesses and things to do ALL DAY within walking distance. I brought my brother and girlfriend, thinking they would have fun spending the day doing things around the stadium, and there was NOTHING besides the one bar on the corner. Ended up just waiting at the gate for hours. I’ll just go to Denver and our other west coast games next year. With my limited expectations, the pregame aspect of the trip was embarrassing and I don’t understand how a Super Bowl was ever hosted there. So weird to me that a stadium that attracts large populations and potential business has nothing developed around it. Didn’t explore the downtown area much. Wouldn’t say excessively dirty but it was just dead/nonexistent

---

way off topic but have you tried a tomahawk ribeye? incredibly expensive but that was the best cut I have every had.

I've never had a tomahawk ribeye.   

This is what I had.  "American Wagyu Spinalis" from Snake River Farms, which supplies it to Cowford Chophouse.  

https://www.snakeriverfarms.com/american...ibeye.html

Snake River Farms also lists tomahawk ribeyes on its website.  

https://www.snakeriverfarms.com/american...ahawk.html

This is all like Kobe beef.

I just want to issue a disclaimer here- fellas, I am not trying to act like some kind of high flyer.  This was pretty unusual for me.  I was just trying to say, there are some nice places downtown.

---

Pdiddy
[quote pid='1186912' dateline='1547227878']
My 2 cents, I flew from Montana for the patriots game. I been to plenty of sporting events in big cities. I heard Jacksonville wasn’t as good of an experience but man was is disappointing. Other cities, endless sports stores, restaurants, bars, businesses and things to do ALL DAY within walking distance. I brought my brother and girlfriend, thinking they would have fun spending the day doing things around the stadium, and there was NOTHING besides the one bar on the corner. Ended up just waiting at the gate for hours. I’ll just go to Denver and our other west coast games next year. With my limited expectations, the pregame aspect of the trip was embarrassing and I don’t understand how a Super Bowl was ever hosted there. So weird to me that a stadium that attracts large populations and potential business has nothing developed around it. Didn’t explore the downtown area much. Wouldn’t say excessively dirty but it was just dead/nonexistent

[/quote]


That's what Im saying. I get some are speaking positively about downtown and there are 2 new restaurants and hidden areas. But I think what the majority is saying is that for a "big city" downtown area, it should be and have way more to it.  Compared to other cities, even small ones, we don't have much of a downtown. And the stigma that has been mentioned has to do more with the news putting out more negative than the positive.

IMO, our downtown area is on life support. Its dead. The Landing aint lit no more. There is so much potential downtown. It just reeks of small city trying to find its way. I want more for my city and the downtown area.

Also, Im fully aware who is holding the expansion back. I feel like that he should at least attempt to help improve our downtown in a positive way. I feel so bad when I see the homeless people downtown and I cant do much myself. But to strengthen the economy and help bring jobs, so compromises need to be made.

---

If you think I offended you, don't worry, I meant to. #facts 
  
#iamlegend

My 2 cents, I flew from Montana for the patriots game. I been to plenty of sporting events in big cities. I heard Jacksonville wasn’t as good of an experience but man was is disappointing. Other cities, endless sports stores, restaurants, bars, businesses and things to do ALL DAY within walking distance. I brought my brother and girlfriend, thinking they would have fun spending the day doing things around the stadium, and there was NOTHING besides the one bar on the corner. Ended up just waiting at the gate for hours. I’ll just go to Denver and our other west coast games next year. With my limited expectations, the pregame aspect of the trip was embarrassing and I don’t understand how a Super Bowl was ever hosted there. So weird to me that a stadium that attracts large populations and potential business has nothing developed around it. Didn’t explore the downtown area much. Wouldn’t say excessively dirty but it was just dead/nonexistent

You can't expect that kind of sports bar and retail store scene to sustain itself only doing business 10 days a year.  You'll find that the scene in Tampa is not much better for this reason. And you especially can't sustain that when it's surrounded by abandoned buildings with open doors and windows.   
That said, when the Jacksonville fair is going on it's pretty nice.
Atlanta's stadium scene is doing a little better now.  The soccer team helps.  
It's a really delicate balance of urban planning, because of the parking demands too.  It helps if most of your fans are OK with taking the bus or train like in NY.
The Pats own their stadium and built a nice seven day a week retail area there. The Dolphins own theirs and are contemplating something similar.  The new LA stadium will be in a high dollar retail area. The Redskins own their stadium, but have not pursued this.
I'd hope Shad considers something like this ready to be open sometime around 2030, but I also hope he doesn't expect the City of Jacksonville to take out more bonds for it.

---

My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Since I have never been in Jacksonville, can you guys tell me whats wrong with Jax doxntown or around the stadium ? Thanks

Nothing.

Fearful suburbanites just make up reasons not to go there. 
Because Jax is so spread out - there are many communities that are 40 minutes or more from downtown, so those folks have a convenience factor to deal with as well. 

It could be a thriving downtown if it didn't have some preposterous stigma and folks had the cojones to venture out from the safety of their far-flung cul-de-sacs and stripmalls. 

Metro Jax is about as far flung as a city can be and it doesn't really have an "urban core."   The newer residential buildings along the waterfront downtown are half empty. People don't want to live there and the dozen or so bars and restaurants seem to have just enough clientele to survive. I make a point to eat and drink downtown at least once a month and I always enjoy it. It's really strange the way folks stay away though.  There's no degree of homelessness or crime that is disproportionate to a city of this size. And the way the river winds through downtown makes it seem even more inviting. I don't understand why folks are so anti-downtown. Makes no sense to me.

Speaking only for myself, it's not fear that keeps me away, I just hate downtown anywhere. Here in Tampa, I'd pass scores of equal or better dining and entertainment establishments to get downtown. My reward for that is hunting for a parking spot and perhaps paying for it depending on the time of the day.

And I always thought it to be absurd to place sporting venues in any downtown area. Downtown areas are typically congested with limited parking. Cramming more vehicles into that area in a small time frame always seems like a bad idea. I'd probably catch some Tampa Bay Lightning games if the arena wasn't downtown. I even avoid concerts that are there. Conversely, I've always liked the location of Raymond James Stadium. I can get in and out of that place with ease.

---