If you were hired by an NFL organization to instill discipline and establish a championship culture and you have proceeded to do the exact opposite, then what, exactly, are you bringing to this team, and why do you even still have that job? Those are the questions I’d be asking myself if I were Jacksonville Jaguars executive vice president Tom Coughlin and his handpicked head coach, Doug Marrone.
It’s pretty crazy when you think about it. Two guys who are as known for discipline as much as anyone else in the NFL are the leaders of arguably the most undisciplined team in the NFL.
To be clear, I’m not looking to play the blame game here. I’ve always had respect for both Coughlin and Marrone and believe in a lot of the things they hold near and dear to their hearts about the sport of football. Yet somehow, some way, here we are as they preside over a team that has had more discipline issues over the past 10 months than some teams have in a decade.
Maybe it’s emblematic of a new generation of players, the likes of which Coughlin and Marrone don’t know how to reach. Perhaps it’s general manager Dave Caldwell’s fault for giving Dante Fowler (whom they traded to the Rams in October), Jalen Ramsey and Leonard Fournette fully guaranteed contracts after drafting them in the top 10, thus making them virtually untouchable. Whatever it is, after last season’s 5-11 debacle it must change — and this past weekend was the latest indication that it hasn’t.
First, linebacker Telvin Smith posted on Instagram the fine letter that the Jaguars sent him for not going to the team’s mandatory minicamp recently. He’s certainly not the first player to ever publicly post a fine from the league or his team, but Smith’s current circumstances don’t speak well to the Jaguars’ culture. Smith previously posted that he is taking this year off from football to “get my world in order,” which could mean a lot of things. What makes Smith’s situation unique is that he has reportedly had no contact with the team to discuss what he needs to get in order or what issues he is dealing with. Hence, the fine.
Pass-rusher Yannick Ngakoue was also fined for skipping minicamp, but his situation is about money. That’s normal enough that it doesn’t even register on the Richter scale of recent Jags events.
What wasn’t as “normal” was Fournette and Ramsey, each of whom has made questionable decisions, posting a video over the weekend in which Ramsey makes it clear that he will not accept any “hometown” discount from the Jaguars next offseason after the team let him know it wasn’t going to extend him this offseason. Instead, he will ask the team for an “ungodly” amount.
First, I hope he and every player gets as much money as possible. Second, the entire concept of a hometown discount is comical to me, but that’s a story for another day. But do Ramsey and Fournette really need to post a video saying these things? How does that help the team or, frankly, even the two of them? Not to mention the fact that Ramsey is under contract for two more years and then the Jags could just franchise tag him after that in 2021, but that’s neither here nor there.
Right about now, I know what some of you are thinking. It’s June and Ross is grasping at straws or nitpicking or this column is a reach or whatever. My guess is that because they’re the Jags, you haven’t really followed everything that happened with them last season. To recap:
It started last training camp when Fowler and Ngakoue got in the rare “fight between players at the same position” and Ramsey went on a tirade toward the reporters filming the incident, [font=ACaslonPro-Bold]threatening one of them on social media before being suspended, along with Fowler, for a week.[/font]
That was right around the time Ramsey was [font=ACaslonPro-Bold]quoted in GQ as basically saying almost every quarterback in the NFL was “trash,” another move that, in my opinion, really helps nobody.[/font]
Shortly after that, four players were arrested in a London nightclub for failing to pay their tab two days before they lost to the Eagles.
After that, it was Fournette’s turn to get in the act as he ran across the field during a game in Buffalo in November to get involved in a [font=ACaslonPro-Bold]fight, which led to his ejection as well as a one-game suspension. In his first game back, he was caught on video telling a fan in Tennessee that he was going to “beat your [BLEEP].” He wasn’t done yet, as he and T.J. Yeldon caught the ire of Coughlin by sitting on the bench during the entire season finale in a move Coughlin said was “disrespectful,” “selfish” and “unbecoming of a professional football player”.[/font]
After this past weekend, it doesn’t seem like anything has changed.
Only time will tell, but if it really hasn’t and the team can’t turn things around, then the real change might start with Coughlin and Marrone.

https://twitter.com/theathleticnfl/statu...51680?s=21

He raises some interesting points. Is it time for a culture change at TIAA Bank Field?

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"Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes. That way, if he gets angry, he's a mile away and barefoot."

Eh. To some degree discipline is a problem.
Mostly just bluster and hyperbole in that article though. Makes it out to be much more than it is.

The Jags just have a high number of young players with maturity issues and not enough Calais Campbell types to show them the way.

The Jags need some of their young starters to grow up a bit.
That's all. Is that a culture change?
Well, maybe not technically, but it certainly would bring about a change in culture.

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A valid concern? Absolutely. Now that is not to say that the description of "valid" puts the concern off the charts as it pertains to team chemistry and success or failure on the field. A concern? Yes. Not a big one though IMO.
Would you rather not have any? Sure. But these are young Alpha males with attitude and money they are dealing with.

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Looking to troll? Don't bother, we supply our own.

 

 

It's funny. We never heard these media guys bringing up discipline problems back when we had so little talent.

"Lack of discipline" is just kind of a catch-all excuse for when a squad with undeniable talent disappoints in the win-loss columns.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Flat out NO. Our team does not have discipline issues. Not even close. The only issue that I witnessed was LF27 getting suspended. I know of no other issues to create an thread about. The players sometimes get it rate on the field but that's football. Nothing to complain about.

NH3...

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"AZANE"

I think all these young players especially Ramsey needs to stay off the social media platforms. Nothing was gained from his comments last year. Other then young guys running their mouth I don't see much of a problem. Fowler was a case and he's gone. I don't know enough about the Telvin Smith situation to comment. It's just crazy that a supposed leader on this team decides to take a year off without any major emergency. Wasn't Telvin also involved in the London fiasco as well?

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Eh. To some degree discipline is a problem.
Mostly just bluster and hyperbole in that article though. Makes it out to be much more than it is.

The Jags just have a high number of young players with maturity issues and not enough Calais Campbell types to show them the way.

The Jags need some of their young starters to grow up a bit.  
That's all.  Is that a culture change?  
Well, maybe not technically, but it certainly would bring about a change in culture.

Yeah, it's funny they the article didn't mention the fact that the London incident was the result of the bar sending bottles to the players that they assumed were comped.  They probably could have handled it better, but it didn't appear that they were intentionally trying to skip out on their bill.

Fournette and Fowler really seem to be the ones that were most undisciplined in the way they handed themselves on and off the field.  One is already gone and the other seems to be on thin ice.  The defense plays with a ton of emotion, and it can get away from them on occasion, hopefully with more maturity they are able to keep themselves in check better.

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Generally speaking, every team needs to have adequate discipline to be successful. Too much and guys won't want to play here. There's a balance, and while the coach does set a certain tone, I think it's imperative the veteran players also step in an lead this team by example. I think more often than not, a guy like Calais can have more of an impact on a fellow player than the coach. If you've got enough guys in the locker room doing it the right way, that tends to spread.

Last year was an aberration in my opinion. I think they had so much unexpected success in 2017 that the younger players lost sight of the effort that was required to maintain that. When the injuries started piling up, you saw the team sort of run off the tracks, and the end result was a train wreck of a season. I think a lot of these guys, much like many fans, were just frustrated that the season went south so quickly.

We also lost guys like Poz, who served as more or less an anchor for some of the younger guys. The hope was that his influence would rub off on them. Unfortunately, that's not how it ultimately worked out, and as the team struggles increased, you had some young guys trying to do more than they should have to right the ship, only to add to the frustrations.

I think leadership and discipline will improve significantly this year. At least I'm hopeful that it will improve. If we have another year like 2018 this season, a whole lot of heads are gonna roll.

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Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

It really could go either way, if the team start winning then they will be described as a young team with attitude who play with an edge, just like they were in '17... On the other hand, a few bad results early and it's certainly possible that the atmosphere around this team goes south pretty quickly and things get ugly. Both scenarios seem about fairly equally likely from where I'm standing.

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That edge and attitude is needed to win in football (unless you're the Patriots....). If it starts causing losses and major issues, then yes. As of now, no.

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Let's Get Em!!!! Go Jags!

I think this author is a little off. Fournette's contract was not fully guaranteed, or we wouldn't have adjusted out all of the bonuses during the offseason. 1st rounder contracts are all but prefabricated under the current CBA, aren't they? How can you blame the GM for drawing up a deal that conforms to the standards set by the league and the PA?

I'm not concerned. Don't forget a lot of the young talent on our team is just that - young. As long as they produce results on the field, they will get paid, hopefully by our franchise. As long as they are at the team meetings, in the film rooms, and on the field, I give zero farts what they post on social media, how they blow their riches on fast cars or ginormous houses, or what they say about other QBs in the league.

Just win, baby.

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That edge and attitude is needed to win in football (unless you're the Patriots....). If it starts causing losses and major issues, then yes. As of now, no.

There's a pretty good argument out there that it caused a loss in buffalo last season. 

Nonetheless, I expect this team to make enough adjustment that we don't see that particular sort of debacle again in 2019.

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For years and years we kept hearing how lackluster the talent was on this roster. Because Gene Smith kept drafting choir boys for the most part. So, what do you guys want? What do you expect from the millennial generation and soon to be generation Z of athletes coming into the NFL? They've all grown up with social media, instant access, etc.

A lot of them lack a ton of home training. And of course, not all of them are the same. But you have to learn how to take in the bad with the good. And because of how the player's union is these days a lot of these athletes now are getting treated with kid's gloves instead of fists of rage. Each generation seems to get softer and watered down since I have been alive.

I get frustrated with some of the things I read and see as well. But a lot of that starts within your home. Winning is the remedy though. And I think people forget the "bad boys" of the NFL back in the day. Riggins and the shed with beers after practice. The Raiders and their rowdiness behavior leading up to big games, etc. We just didn't hear about it as much because social media wasn't a thing back then.

The NFL and most professional sports in general have always been driven by diva's and ego's. It is what it is. As long as their actions don't result in actual laws being broken I could really give two solid [BLEEP].

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

It is a concern. Maybe our team more than some others.

It is also a concern due to that fact the refs look for stuff and enforce some things they wouldn't for other teams. Telvin's pick six pointing foul was ridiculous.

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This debate reminds me of good ol' gene smith. We need some GS character guys and most will be happy. I can see the entire O'line and D'line sitting front row at church and feeding the homeless each week.

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Season Tix, Section 409

2023 and still counting.....SB will finally be ours soon enough.
TLaw aka 'the prince that was promised' supporter.

It's a bit odd for us considering Coughlin's reputation, but it's probably no worse than any other team. Definitely not worse than the Raiders or Bengals have been lately. It might stick out a little more cause it was coming from some our highest profile, and highest drafted, players I guess.

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It's a bit odd for us considering Coughlin's reputation, but it's probably no worse than any other team. Definitely not worse than the Raiders or Bengals have been lately. It might stick out a little more cause it was coming from some our highest profile, and highest drafted, players I guess.

It's not odd at all. Coughlin has been spurned once or twice already with the NFLPA since being here for a little over two or three years now. This is what happens when each generation gets softer and lax on raising their children. Baby Boomers and Generation X parents did the best they could. But this is what happens when you let the television and cell phones raise your "me first" little athlete at home everyday. 

Each team does tend to go through these things. Even New England has had it's fair share. So it's not like we should be highlighted under a microscope. It's just the nature of how people interact these days. I could go on Facebook or Twitter right now and say the wrong thing no matter how politically correct I try to make it sound and could lose my job within 24 hours. Good ol' double standards alive and kicking in America today.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Flat out NO. Our team does not have discipline issues. Not even close. The only issue that I witnessed was LF27 getting suspended. I know of no other issues to create an thread about. The players sometimes get it rate on the field but that's football. Nothing to complain about.

NH3...

Serious post, or am I getting "whooshed" again?

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"We believe in victory!"   - Gus Bradley
"I don't want to believe.  I want to know."   - Carl Sagan

This debate reminds me of good ol' gene smith.  We need some GS character guys and most will be happy.  I can see the entire O'line and D'line sitting front row at church and feeding the homeless each week.

The whole "choir boys" take is old and stupid.  Relating talent to off the field issues is stupid as well.

Having a competitive, nasty, on-field disposition combined with a strong work ethic doesn't mean the player has to have a criminal record.

Gene Smith's problem was not that he drafted "good guys", it's that he drafted un-talented "good guys".

Right before he got the boot, he drafted Blackmon, who had talent along with serious issues.  That didn't work out too well, huh?

Coughlin drafted Soward back in the day, and that was a similar result.

This team needs to get another Fred Taylor/Tony Boselli caliber player again so we can stop hearing the "choir boy" arguments altogether.

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"We believe in victory!"   - Gus Bradley
"I don't want to believe.  I want to know."   - Carl Sagan

I think all these young players especially Ramsey needs to stay off the social media platforms.   Nothing was gained from his comments last year.  Other then young guys running their mouth I don't see much of a problem.  Fowler was a case and he's gone. I don't know enough about the Telvin Smith situation to comment.   It's just crazy that a supposed leader on this team decides to take a year off without any major emergency.  Wasn't Telvin also involved in the London fiasco as well?

Why should the league be able to dictate what players say or don't say on their social media accounts?

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'02