Foles has disappointed greatly in two games. I'm not rushing to conclusions on him yet, but it's not looking good.
I'm just infinitely more concerned about fixing the defense and O-Line right now.

With a (hopefully) competent staff next year and Foles/Minshew under contract I'm not tripping about the QB spot.

And, as mentioned, all this stuff about Foles numbers and tendencies was thoroughly hashed out in the offseason here.
We knew the numbers, and we saw he was still able to win games with them. There's more going on with Foles right now than just short passes and "failed completions."

Thank you sir. Good to see some level headedness up in here.


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We talked about this article back in the offseason. I think it's an interesting statistic but it needs to be married to more data. For starters it looks like it weights the downs equally but throwing short on 3rd down is far more significant of a "failed completion" than checking down on first down to get you to a 2nd and a 6 which also counts as a "failed completion". Second, just looking a the rankings for 2018 and 2017, any statistic that continually has Blake Bortles ahead of Drew Brees and consistently has Jameis WInston at the very top needs to be understood for what it is. It's a stat that identifies which players are more likely to throw down the field when successful while discounting any negative plays. If you threw a hail mary on every play, you'd be at the top of this ranking. Looking at Foles, in 2018 he had the 2nd highest comp% at 72%. How much of that comp% was due to him checking the ball down instead of forcing a throw down the field? And would you rather be at 2nd and 10 (or possibly an INT) or 2nd and 6? For every 7 completions last year, if he had instead thrown one of those balls as an incompletion(presumably down the field but for this stat it doesnt matter), his comp% would have matched Aaron Rodgers and he would have skyrocketed up this ranking. But I'm not sure that would be considered a success.

Now the fact that he seems to check down more than anyone else is a cause for concern. And we all talked about how he doesnt have the playmakers here at Jacksonville that he did in Philly who can bail him out on jump balls. But I wouldn't write anyone off because of this stat alone. Besides, as stated above, he wasn't brought here to be the next Drew Brees. He was brought here because the team thought they were close enough to be playoff contenders if they replaced Bortles with a guy who had played well enough to win a Super Bowl MVP. If they knew the defense would collapse, I wonder if they would have made the same moves.

Great Great points man! I don’t expect any of these pro’s in here will agree but it sure made me throw up a high fiver.


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Not sure you can completely dismiss a metric that generally the better qbs do well with and not so good qbs not.

For me it just confirms what my eyes tell me. Foles completion percentage is more about throwing short than superb accuracy or qb play.

Don’t let the philly run blind you.

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Not sure you can completely dismiss a metric that generally the better qbs do well with and not so good qbs not.

For me it just confirms what my eyes tell me. Foles completion percentage is more about throwing short than superb accuracy or qb play.

Don’t let the philly run blind you.

It's easy to figure out when people actually watch the games and not just the highlights.  Foles was never a light it up type of QB and won a SB because of his teammates and coaching staff.  Playing a average D in the big game also helped.  There are fans who look at stats and only watch games that their team plays; then there are fans that watch alot of teams play and see the difference in those teams.  There are a ton of mediocre QBs in this league but we only complain about ours, as we should.  A fan can hate their roster but outside of a few stacked Offenses and Defenses around the league, there are plenty of Meh situations.  Fans gonna fan, just in different ways.

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Season Tix, Section 409

2023 and still counting.....SB will finally be ours soon enough.
TLaw aka 'the prince that was promised' supporter.

Starting to think that Shad Khan isn’t cut out to own a football team..

Why? This team is turning a great profit! Owning a team isn't about winning any more than NFL referees are about calling a fair game.

preach

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Not sure you can completely dismiss a metric that generally the better qbs do well with and not so good qbs not.

For me it just confirms what my eyes tell me. Foles completion percentage is more about throwing short than superb accuracy or qb play.

Don’t let the philly run blind you.

It’s a scheme-centric metric as much as it is a QB-centric metric. It’s not being dismissed by me - it’s being kept in perspective. A perspective I’ve maintained since Foles was signed.

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@rfc17 and @NYC4jags are examples of how to fan. There's too much outright hate being spewed on the board during this 3 game debacle...and usually by the same 6 or 8 posters who are wrong on just about everything else.

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Fix the O-Line!

Not sure you can completely dismiss a metric that generally the better qbs do well with and not so good qbs not.

For me it just confirms what my eyes tell me. Foles completion percentage is more about throwing short than superb accuracy or qb play.

Don’t let the philly run blind you.

It’s a scheme-centric metric as much as it is a QB-centric metric. It’s not being dismissed by me - it’s being kept in perspective. A perspective I’ve maintained since Foles was signed.

Scheme-centric? I could see that accounting for a portion of the differences, but it's not like the eagles didn't also have Wentz play extended time, too, and he was in the upper half of the league in that stat while Foles was dead last.

Foles also performed similarly in different seasons for different coaching staffs, so scheme is starting to sound like a red herring.

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It’s a scheme-centric metric as much as it is a QB-centric metric. It’s not being dismissed by me - it’s being kept in perspective. A perspective I’ve maintained since Foles was signed.

Scheme-centric? I could see that accounting for a portion of the differences, but it's not like the eagles didn't also have Wentz play extended time, too, and he was in the upper half of the league in that stat while Foles was dead last.

Foles also performed similarly in different seasons for different coaching staffs, so scheme is starting to sound like a red herring.

Foles got lucky. Just like Flacco. Period.

God I remember that Flacco superbowl run clearly... his WRs would bail him out on 50/50 balls EVERY SINGLE TIME.. it was amazing effort by Anquan Bolden... Bolden was the hero of that Superbowl run.

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@rfc17 and @NYC4jags are examples of how to fan.  There's too much outright hate being spewed on the board during this 3 game debacle...and usually by the same 6 or 8 posters who are wrong on just about everything else.

That's fine and all. But reality is reality. I have been more than fair with my views over the last four weeks regarding this team's overall situation, especially showing fairness with Foles & Minshew. I ultimately pinned the blame on the front office and coaching staff for a wide variety of reasons but the most damning of them all is for the simple fact that they rushed Foles out into the line up during a pivotal stretch of games. 

Rust or no rust. He's been off with his throws and timing. Again, that's not his fault. That's on the coaches for not properly managing and assessing the situation. I personally feel that if they lose to Tampa this Sunday that they'll more than likely shut Foles down for the remaining four games and cite that he wasn't ready after that injury from week one. Which we all clearly saw in the last two losses. 

This offensive line struggled last year and they've struggled this year. Failing to add adequate depth with actual talent that excelled in the pass protection department has ultimately resulted in this year's shortcoming's. Failure to actually work these guys during training camp and preseason has reared it's ugly head as well. 

While I'll agree that some posters have flat out blasted Foles for making non-veteran like decisions with the football in his hands with time management in his favor, forcing passes into windows that weren't there or checking it down out of what appears to be fear instead of allowing the play to develop seem to be pretty reasonable to me. It's not like they're making it personal. At least not too personal. 

Plenty of criticism to go around. "how to fan" is a funny way of putting things though. Some of you on here have blinders on or love living along the teal coated river of denial. That's also fine. Maybe some of us are just tired of being a [BLEEP] embarrassment.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

It’s a scheme-centric metric as much as it is a QB-centric metric. It’s not being dismissed by me - it’s being kept in perspective. A perspective I’ve maintained since Foles was signed.

Scheme-centric? I could see that accounting for a portion of the differences, but it's not like the eagles didn't also have Wentz play extended time, too, and he was in the upper half of the league in that stat while Foles was dead last.

Foles also performed similarly in different seasons for different coaching staffs, so scheme is starting to sound like a red herring.

Yes. 

Scheme-centric. 

The offense he played in (and flips playbook to a degree) have lots of designed quick hit short passes. 
It’s attributable to his skill set and to the scheme/play calling. 
Not sure how this isn’t obvious.

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Scheme-centric? I could see that accounting for a portion of the differences, but it's not like the eagles didn't also have Wentz play extended time, too, and he was in the upper half of the league in that stat while Foles was dead last.

Foles also performed similarly in different seasons for different coaching staffs, so scheme is starting to sound like a red herring.

Yes. 

Scheme-centric. 

The offense he played in (and flips playbook to a degree) have lots of designed quick hit short passes. 
It’s attributable to his skill set and to the scheme/play calling. 
Not sure how this isn’t obvious.

It's so obvious defenders are slowing up in their pursuit and batting passes away. I can't remember if Minshew had a handful of those or not this year. But it seems like over the last two weeks defenders know Foles isn't running anywhere and they switch from pass rusher to volleyball player here and there. 

Frustrating. Again, this is NOT a knock on Foles or an argument to be made for putting Minshew back out there. This is frustrating because DeFilippo should be doing things play calling wise to help Foles out with that. Haven't seen enough rolling out or play action over the last two - three games. 

Both QB's can make those work IMHO.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Scheme-centric? I could see that accounting for a portion of the differences, but it's not like the eagles didn't also have Wentz play extended time, too, and he was in the upper half of the league in that stat while Foles was dead last.

Foles also performed similarly in different seasons for different coaching staffs, so scheme is starting to sound like a red herring.

Yes. 

Scheme-centric. 

The offense he played in (and flips playbook to a degree) have lots of designed quick hit short passes. 
It’s attributable to his skill set and to the scheme/play calling. 
Not sure how this isn’t obvious.

Are you saying the scheme is designed for his shortcomings?

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Yes. 

Scheme-centric. 

The offense he played in (and flips playbook to a degree) have lots of designed quick hit short passes. 
It’s attributable to his skill set and to the scheme/play calling. 
Not sure how this isn’t obvious.

Are you saying the scheme is designed for his shortcomings?

Schemes are always designed for shortcomings. 

Offense to hide them and Defense to exploit them.

The Jags just have that backwards most of the time.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Are you saying the scheme is designed for his shortcomings?

Schemes are always designed for shortcomings. 

Offense to hide them and Defense to exploit them.

The Jags just have that backwards most of the time.

My point is if the scheme is determined by the QB then what's the point of arguing it's the scheme that's causing the dreadful statistical performance?

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Yes. 

Scheme-centric. 

The offense he played in (and flips playbook to a degree) have lots of designed quick hit short passes. 
It’s attributable to his skill set and to the scheme/play calling. 
Not sure how this isn’t obvious.

Are you saying the scheme is designed for his shortcomings?

LOL
are you serious???

Yes. Of course it is. It’s also designed to his strengths. 
You know, the way every coordinator worth his salt at least attempts to do for his players. 
Holy hell, is this a new concept for you? 

Remember when every coordinator after Fisch refused to call an out route with Bortles behind center because he literally threw a pick on that route every other time he tried it? Similar concept here. 
Yeah, news flash, it’s a coordinator’s job to try to mitigate weakness and exploit strengths. 
Pederson’s staff found they could have success with lots of quick hit stuff with Foles behind a rotating cast O-Line. So they called lots of it. Some of that speaks of the QBs skill, some of it speaks of scheme.

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Are you saying the scheme is designed for his shortcomings?

LOL
are you serious???

Yes. Of course it is. It’s also designed to his strengths. 
You know, the way every coordinator worth his salt at least attempts to do for his players. 
Holy hell, is this a new concept for you? 

Remember when every coordinator after Fisch refused to call an out route with Bortles behind center because he literally threw a pick on that route every other time he tried it? Similar concept here. 
Yeah, news flash, it’s a coordinator’s job to try to mitigate weakness and exploit strengths. 
Pederson’s staff found they could have success with lots of quick hit stuff with Foles behind a rotating cast O-Line. So they called lots of it. Some of that speaks of the QBs skill, some of it speaks of scheme.

Just a side note- I really enjoy the jaguars failing season version of NYC4jags. The snark is so fun to read.

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LOL
are you serious???

Yes. Of course it is. It’s also designed to his strengths. 
You know, the way every coordinator worth his salt at least attempts to do for his players. 
Holy hell, is this a new concept for you? 

Remember when every coordinator after Fisch refused to call an out route with Bortles behind center because he literally threw a pick on that route every other time he tried it? Similar concept here. 
Yeah, news flash, it’s a coordinator’s job to try to mitigate weakness and exploit strengths. 
Pederson’s staff found they could have success with lots of quick hit stuff with Foles behind a rotating cast O-Line. So they called lots of it. Some of that speaks of the QBs skill, some of it speaks of scheme.

Just a side note- I really enjoy the jaguars failing season version of NYC4jags. The snark is so fun to read.

Apologies to anyone I've been harsh with. Just a case of the "jaded-by-jaguars-jerkiness." 

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Just a side note- I really enjoy the jaguars failing season version of NYC4jags. The snark is so fun to read.

Apologies to anyone I've been harsh with. Just a case of the "jaded-by-jaguars-jerkiness." 

It’s tough when you watch the jags lose year after year... There is plenty of snark to go around here, but I give you credit for at least being funny with it. 

We have a good group of folks here that have weathered many storms including this one. Other teams don’t have this much activity when they are losing like this. 

I’m sadly kinda hoping we get another blow out against the Bucs so MAYBE Minshew can get the start the rest of the season. At this point, I’ve seen enough Foles to last me until next season? I wanna see the kid now.

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Just a side note- I really enjoy the jaguars failing season version of NYC4jags. The snark is so fun to read.

Apologies to anyone I've been harsh with. Just a case of the "jaded-by-jaguars-jerkiness." 

Continuing to support and follow/watch a Franchise that has 1 winning season per decade can most definitely bring out the grumpiness in all of us.

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The Foles signing was the Jaguars' Osweiler move.

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