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7 years of this rebuild and ths team is like Swiss Cheese! Why not fire everybody?

#1
(This post was last modified: 12-02-2019, 09:15 PM by jaguarmvp.)

Looking at this team there are still holes everywhere and it's going to be a big task to rebuild it

QB:  We don't know if we have one

RB:  Fournette is ok but not a Stud. 

WR:  Solid Group that lacks a real playmaker

Tight end: Total overhaul needed.  Oliver looked bad and there iis nobody else

Defensive line:  One area that is good but Campbell is slowing down and who knows what happens with Yannick.  Still need run stuffing DT's.

Offensive line:  I am not sold on Cam at LT, Jury is out on Taylor, and the interiror is mediocre at best.  Close to a total overhaul

Linebacker:  A total overhaul needed here

Secondary:  Close to a total overhaul.  

After all the cap room, all the draft pick, this is the garbage they put on the field.  Caldwell is responsible for the many 1st round duds and overpaying mediocre players. He misses many more than he hits, Coughlin just looks to be the old grouch doing nothing but begging fans to show up, and Marrone and his staff coach an undisciplined, unprepared football team.  I can't think of any real reason to keep any of this mess.  To top all of that off

1.  You just over payed Bortles and paying him $18 million this year to go sit on the Rams Bench then you double that up with...

2.  Giving Foles $88 million and if we flat out release him the Jags eat $33 million dollars in dead cap.  He is not the answer here and looks like no one would want to trade for him.  The only hope is packaging him with a pick for a team to take him.

Please give me a good solid answer to keep any of these clowns around?

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#2

You are correct. Let go off everything, just keep Josh Allen, Yan, Bouye, Minshew, Chark and Fournette and of course Calais if he wants to stay. Not sure if Myles Jack is worth it, possibly Harrison. I'm not sure if Bouye would want to stay here but we are in a [BLEEP] up situation
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#3

Fire everyone. So we get to enjoy another seven years of this crap.
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#4

(12-02-2019, 05:40 PM)DragonFury Wrote: Fire everyone. So we get to enjoy another seven years of this crap.

Sometimes you can't patch enough.  Time to build a whole new foundation.  We have one winning season in 7 years and the arrow is not pointing up.  We lose nothing by firing everyone.

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#5

(12-02-2019, 05:40 PM)DragonFury Wrote: Fire everyone. So we get to enjoy another seven years of this crap.

If they hire the wrong person and then stick with him for years after he has proven to be very bad at his job...possibly.
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#6
(This post was last modified: 12-02-2019, 08:44 PM by homebiscuit.)

Is anyone else feeling the difference in fan frustration with this current crash? In years past when we tanked, it was eye rolls and shrugs of resignation because we accepted losing as the status quo. "#becausejaguars. We'll see next year." 2017, and Gardner Minshew to some extent, changed all that. Now I'm detecting a palpable impatient dissatisfaction. We have some good players on our team and others with real potential. Added to that is four 1st round picks over the next two years. We're on the cusp of being a very competitive team in the near future but the old guard fans are sick and tired of the continual mismanagement. How many years do we have to endure this dreck before the lifetime STHs finally give up? More than a few because we've seen some express that view on this very board. 

Hopefully Shad Khan is detecting this deep seated discontent and acts accordingly. People who have been attending games since day one are about to give up entirely and he'll start feeling it in the bottom line, which is his primary concern. Hire some high-priced consultants and huddle with knowledgeable football insiders to build a front office and staff with some proven competence. Change needs to happen because folks are getting deeply disgruntled with these endless embarrassing messes.
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#7

We can complete a whole rebuild quickly with what we have. We have a few decent lineman, a good QB, and good WRs. We just need to supplement the line, draft some better talent on defense, sign a veteran MLB and we will be a competitive team again. We can be a good time literally by next season. However, with the current regime, I don’t think it’s possible.
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#8

Why are you always wanting to hit the nuclear button all the time?

A handful of positions could use an upgrade. A few of these positions could be upgraded simply by moving around some of your current talent ie: Myles Jack at WLB and Josh Allen as a bookend to Yannick.

An upgrade at head coach and D coordinator/position coach would go a loooooong way to scheme around everything else.

And if Minshew pans out look out. A franchise QB can fix what’s remaining. The Ravens being the perfect example.
"Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes. That way, if he gets angry, he's a mile away and barefoot."
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#9

(12-02-2019, 07:10 PM)jaguarmvp Wrote:
(12-02-2019, 05:40 PM)DragonFury Wrote: Fire everyone. So we get to enjoy another seven years of this crap.

Sometimes you can't patch enough.  Time to build a whole new foundation.  We have one winning season in 7 years and the arrow is not pointing up.  We lose nothing by firing everyone.

One winning season in 12 years actually.
I'm condescending.  That means I talk down to you.
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#10

Is Gene Smith available ?
My sig goes here!
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#11

I think we have a better foundation than people give us credit for: Stud book end DEs, decent interior pash rush, pro bowl corner in Bouye, number 1 received developing in Chark, serviceable number 2 in Deedee, and potential rookie of the year QB if he had played all year. We need o-line and more o-line. Get that fixed and this team will look a hell of a lot better next year.
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#12

I think the decision makers need to go, but I'm 100% against another purge or hitting the nuclear option. That NEVER works, let the new GM come in and evaluate the roster. He takes the talent we have and drafts and fills voids as he can and then hires a coach that CAN build a scheme around what we do have.

This whole crazy cart before horse, build a scheme then draft to fit that scheme is the whole reason we are in this mess. Caldwell wanted to mirror what Seattle did, so he went and got Gus and then started drafting for zone blocking schemes, this hybrid defense crap, and so on. It's why we targeted under sized lineman and linebackers they fit the scheme they drew up. you have to build with what we have here, you have to build a scheme around the talent you have. to me that's the #1 priority hire someone who gets that and let them work.
[Image: 5_RdfH.gif]
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#13

Also a new coaching staff with more innovation
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#14

(12-02-2019, 10:03 PM)hb1148 Wrote:
(12-02-2019, 07:10 PM)jaguarmvp Wrote: Sometimes you can't patch enough.  Time to build a whole new foundation.  We have one winning season in 7 years and the arrow is not pointing up.  We lose nothing by firing everyone.

One winning season in 12 years actually.

We didn't realize how good we had it in the Shack Harris era.
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#15

(12-02-2019, 09:42 PM)knarnn Wrote: Why are you always wanting to hit the nuclear button all the time?

A handful of positions could use an upgrade. A few of these positions could be upgraded simply by moving around some of your current talent ie: Myles Jack at WLB and Josh Allen as a bookend to Yannick.

An upgrade at head coach and D coordinator/position coach would go a loooooong way to scheme around everything else.

And if Minshew pans out look out. A franchise QB can fix what’s remaining. The Ravens being the perfect example.


I understand this line of thought, and I'm not disagreeing that a new HC and DC would greatly help, but this team has been a handful of positions away from a complete team for several years now.  How many years should fans expect this 7 year rebuild to take before it's finished?  Also, we're looking at being in cap purgatory if not all out cap hell in the very near future.  How are we going to pay for all these first round picks we have coming up?

That's why performance and record means more to me than anything else, as it is the absolute indicator of success.  In six seasons under Caldwell:

-  we have a combined regular season record of 30-66
-  we have 5 losing seasons and 1 winning season
-  we made it to the playoffs 1 year, and that now looks like a fluke

Since Coughlin was brought in to babysit Dave we've gone 19-25, but only 9-19 over the last two seasons which shows the arrow is pointing down.

I'd hate to get a quality HC and DC in here only to have their efforts torpedoed by the FO is all I'm saying.  A fresh start seems more beneficial in the long run.


"We believe in victory!"   -  Gus Bradley
"I don't want to believe.  I want to know."   -  Carl Sagan
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#16
(This post was last modified: 12-03-2019, 01:32 AM by TheO-LineMatters.)

(12-02-2019, 05:07 PM)jaguarmvp Wrote: Looking at this team there are still holes everywhere and it's going to be a big task to rebuild it

QB:  We don't know if we have one

RB:  Fournette is ok but not a Stud. 

WR:  Solid Group that lacks a real playmaker

Tight end: Total overhaul needed.  Oliver looked bad and there iis nobody else

Defensive line:  One area that is good but Campbell is slowing down and who knows what happens with Yannick.  Still need run stuffing DT's.

Offensive line:  I am not sold on Cam at LT, Jury is out on Taylor, and the interiror is mediocre at best.  Close to a total overhaul

Linebacker:  A total overhaul needed here

Secondary:  Close to a total overhaul.  

After all the cap room, all the draft pick, this is the garbage they put on the field.  Caldwell is responsible for the many 1st round duds and overpaying mediocre players. He misses many more than he hits, Coughlin just looks to be the old grouch doing nothing but begging fans to show up, and Marrone and his staff coach an undisciplined, unprepared football team.  I can't think of any real reason to keep any of this mess.  To top all of that off

1.  You just over payed Bortles and paying him $18 million this year to go sit on the Rams Bench  then you double that up with...

2.  Giving Foles $88 million and if we flat out release him the Jags eat $33 million dollars in dead cap.  He is not the answer here and looks like no one would want to trade for him.  The only hope is packaging him with a pick for a team to take him.

Please give me a good solid answer to keep any of these clowns around?

I agree about QB. We might have a franchise QB in Minshew or maybe we don't. I have no idea, but he needs to improve a lot.

I agree about RB. Fournette is fine, but I'd like to add a speedy 3rd down back to use on screen passes. 

I'm fine with our receiving group. 

We definitely need a major upgrade at TE. O'shaughnessy was looking decent until he got injured, but we have absolutely no other decent TE's. 

I'm fine with the DE's, but good God, can we please get a NT who can stop the run?

O-Line is a mess! Blow it up! They all stink!

Same goes for the Linebackers. Giving Jack a big extension as a MLB was a HUGE mistake. He's much better on the weakside. He lacks the instincts to play the middle. He misses way too many tackles. We need a thumper in the middle who can help stop the run. 

I'm actually fine with the secondary. The corners have been playing well enough and the Safeties haven't been giving up too many big plays despite getting no help from the linebackers. 

We got ourselves into a mess with the Foles contract. I didn't want him. I believe in finding a QB via the draft, but we owe Foles so much money, we've painted ourselves into a corner. Like it or not, he's probably gonna start next year, unless he's so bad again that Minshew has to come in for him once more.
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#17

This team is not as bad off as a lot of people make it sound. Yes, certainly need to upgrade in several positions and move some players around but IMO this team can have a starting rotation to be able to play with anyone in the NFL next season. Unfortunately, most of the needs we have, we had last year too. We need 6-7 new starters. They would be 2 or 3 new OL starters depending on your feeling on LT Robinson. 1 TE, they may actually have something with Josh Oliver to have 2 good TE's. 1 REAL MLB and move Jack back outside where he played well. Dareus needs to be restructured and bring in another wide body. As far as DB's I see the biggest need at FS. So basically just like the end of last year, fix the Oline the Jags are better.
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#18

Fire everyone.....and take Gumbo ( Fournette ) with them.
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#19

We needed another thread for this?
When inventing a foolproof system inventors often underestimate the ingenuity of fools.

A flute with no holes is not a flute.  A donut with no hole is a danish.
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#20

(12-02-2019, 10:15 PM)Newton Wrote: I think we have a better foundation than people give us credit for: Stud book end DEs, decent interior pash rush, pro bowl corner in Bouye, number 1 received developing in Chark, serviceable number 2 in Deedee, and potential rookie of the year QB if he had played all year. We need o-line and more o-line. Get that fixed and this team will look a hell of a lot better next year.

Out of the 22 starting positions, how many do you think are starting caliber on a super bowl aspiring level team? I think maybe like 5 or 6 with the potential to have a handful more if they develop properly. We still need like half of a starting lineup to start seriously competing for anything of value. That's a long way to go considering the embarrassingly huge amount of high picks and FA $$$ Dave has spent over the past 7 seasons.
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