Going back to my post, I said he was an average back.  02 was using Fournette as some sort of validation of keeping Coughlin (which seems pretty irrelevant now).  No it's not Fournette's fault that he was drafted with the fourth pick, which was never the point that I was trying to make.  But he was not worth the fourth pick and that is squarely on the FO.

Knowing what we know now, based only on this year, I would say he would have been worth a late first round pick.  He's not special, for sure, but he's pretty good.  He's become an all-around running/receiving/blocking running back.  I don't think he needs to be replaced just because he's not Barry Sanders.  He's a good player.  His problem is he's a downhill runner who gets hit in the backfield way too often.  He needs holes to run through to be more effective than he already is.  

And if you want to point to this as a failure of the FO, there are much bigger failures to point to.  You don't even need this one to make the case.

The failure is a self proclaimed power running team that uses a scheme without a fullback. Stupid.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Going back to my post, I said he was an average back.  02 was using Fournette as some sort of validation of keeping Coughlin (which seems pretty irrelevant now).  No it's not Fournette's fault that he was drafted with the fourth pick, which was never the point that I was trying to make.  But he was not worth the fourth pick and that is squarely on the FO.

Knowing what we know now, based only on this year, I would say he would have been worth a late first round pick.  He's not special, for sure, but he's pretty good.  He's become an all-around running/receiving/blocking running back.  I don't think he needs to be replaced just because he's not Barry Sanders.  He's a good player.  His problem is he's a downhill runner who gets hit in the backfield way too often.  He needs holes to run through to be more effective than he already is.  

And if you want to point to this as a failure of the FO, there are much bigger failures to point to.  You don't even need this one to make the case.

Please go back and read the response to the post this was originally intended for.  Another poster was using Fournette as a case to keep Coughlin.  That is what I was responding to.  Not as a case to get rid of Coughlin.  It's pretty irrelevant at this point anyway.  Khan would be an idiot to keep Coughlin as he would torpedo any chance that the Jaguars have of signing any future free agents.

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Knowing what we know now, based only on this year, I would say he would have been worth a late first round pick.  He's not special, for sure, but he's pretty good.  He's become an all-around running/receiving/blocking running back.  I don't think he needs to be replaced just because he's not Barry Sanders.  He's a good player.  His problem is he's a downhill runner who gets hit in the backfield way too often.  He needs holes to run through to be more effective than he already is.  

And if you want to point to this as a failure of the FO, there are much bigger failures to point to.  You don't even need this one to make the case.

The failure is a self proclaimed power running team that uses a scheme without a fullback. Stupid.

They used the TE as a lead blocker just fine IMO.  Had they not had a constant churn of injured players at TE it may have been more effective, but they didn't really miss the FB much IMO.  Seth DeValve was lead blocking very well before he got injured for example (and he was a street free agent to replace Swaim.)

I think the greater fail was commiting to the power scheme in the first place. 
I hope we see an influx of more athletic linemen and add an elusive back to use in committee with LF and Armstead. 

I'd much rather make defenses defend multiple options than line up in a power set and dare them to stop the obvious ball carrier.  Flip's only real variation on this was very rarely sending two receivers in play action from a power set on first down and that's not near enough. Gotta make defenses work harder on first down by giving them more to account for. 

The only success the Jags have had with this in recent year was Hackett's brief use of a Grant/Fournette backfield running or passing out of a 3WR set.  I hope the next OC brings some version of that because it's the best way to get Fournette space and it gives the QB 5 options, three of which can be quick releases by design.

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The failure is a self proclaimed power running team that uses a scheme without a fullback. Stupid.

They used the TE as a lead blocker just fine IMO.  Had they not had a constant churn of injured players at TE it may have been more effective, but they didn't really miss the FB much IMO.  Seth DeValve was lead blocking very well before he got injured for example (and he was a street free agent to replace Swaim.)

I think the greater fail was commiting to the power scheme in the first place. 
I hope we see an influx of more athletic linemen and add an elusive back to use in committee with LF and Armstead. 

I'd much rather make defenses defend multiple options than line up in a power set and dare them to stop the obvious ball carrier.  Flip's only real variation on this was very rarely sending two receivers in play action from a power set on first down and that's not near enough. Gotta make defenses work harder on first down by giving them more to account for. 

The only success the Jags have had with this in recent year was Hackett's brief use of a Grant/Fournette backfield running or passing out of a 3WR set.  I hope the next OC brings some version of that because it's the best way to get Fournette space and it gives the QB 5 options, three of which can be quick releases by design.

You can't help but wonder that if we weren't using TE as FB if they wouldn't be less susceptible to wear and tear.

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They used the TE as a lead blocker just fine IMO.  Had they not had a constant churn of injured players at TE it may have been more effective, but they didn't really miss the FB much IMO.  Seth DeValve was lead blocking very well before he got injured for example (and he was a street free agent to replace Swaim.)

I think the greater fail was commiting to the power scheme in the first place. 
I hope we see an influx of more athletic linemen and add an elusive back to use in committee with LF and Armstead. 

I'd much rather make defenses defend multiple options than line up in a power set and dare them to stop the obvious ball carrier.  Flip's only real variation on this was very rarely sending two receivers in play action from a power set on first down and that's not near enough. Gotta make defenses work harder on first down by giving them more to account for. 

The only success the Jags have had with this in recent year was Hackett's brief use of a Grant/Fournette backfield running or passing out of a 3WR set.  I hope the next OC brings some version of that because it's the best way to get Fournette space and it gives the QB 5 options, three of which can be quick releases by design.

You can't help but wonder that if we weren't using TE as FB if they wouldn't be less susceptible to wear and tear.

Eh, if a Y-type TE can't run 10-12 lead block plays a game for you without getting hurt then he has a durability issue unrelated to his position vs a FB.  We're talking about guys who are 240+ and 6'4" or better who are already expected to block more often than run routes. 

DeFilippo left the FB off the roster so he could emphasize versatility with his TEs and on the surface it wasn't a bad plan until they all got hurt and he was plugging in street free agents to fill three distinct TE roles. (Y, F, and H-Back) 


I'm sure the next OC will utilize a lead blocker in some form.  I just hope he's a bit more creative about it and doesn't suffer injuries like we did this year.

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He's got the 6th most carries overall behind guys like Derick Henry and Nick Chubb and McCaffery etc. Of the 5 guys with more yardage overall, only Henry has more carries against 8+ men fronts. Listen, he doesn't have much wiggle and he isn't the best at staying on his feet after contact but you guys should start acknowledging his production for what it is and stop trying to make up excuses for it.

Lol, I have made no excuses for him. I just don't think he is special, just like Linder, Shorts, and the myriad other players that get blown up on this board and go on to be average.

You're making excuses for why he's been successful this year. If you mean he's not a grear runner in the long term, I'd agree with that but he *is* performing very well this year. He'd probably be top 3 in overall production if Flip hadn't practically forgot about him in a couple of games.

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I'm condescending. That means I talk down to you.

Yeah, it's not like the Chiefs traded up for Mahomes because they saw something.

You really think Texans, Panthers or Chiefs would have taken Fournette instead of their guys?

But you are right, afterall it's not like the FO guys are getting paid millions to find talent, right? we should go easy on them.

No, we should hold them to account for results. What I'm saying is you pretending that you knew how these picks were going to work out at the time is ridiculous. It's easy to second guess when you see how things work out after the fact.

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Cam, Norwell and Linder were run blocking v wellover the first half for sure.

Also Linder doesn't really get physically outmatched. He's mostly been the same guy he always has , just been targeted for by tons of whistles this season

Cam is ok in run blocking. Linder is ok sometimes but he's been getting beat a lot this year. He's been getting hit with a lot of penalties. Norwell has been a disappointment since he got here.

Ok...

Where exactly was I pretending that? I honestly had no idea about Mahomes but I did like the other 2 better than Fournette. Still had some doubts about McCffrey's durability but still did seem like a playmaker.

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Lol, I have made no excuses for him. I just don't think he is special, just like Linder, Shorts, and the myriad other players that get blown up on this board and go on to be average.

You're making excuses for why he's been successful this year. If you mean he's not a grear runner in the long term, I'd agree with that but he *is* performing very well this year. He'd probably be top 3 in overall production if Flip hadn't practically forgot about him in a couple of games.

Hes alright this year. He has had some very good games with a bunch of completely forgetable ones in between. What does he have, like 3 100 yard rushing games this year? Overall I don't think he is performing very well. I will give him credit for improving this year, but I don't see him as anything better than slightly above average due to physical talent and his non running plays. As a runner, he is merely average, and still below expectations based on physical gifts.

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