I don’t want my WR playing TE. I want a TE that can block and catch. If I have to ride with O’Shaugnessey then that’s what I’ll do.

The bottom line is our offense has never revolved around the TE. We’ve always been blessed with a great RB and mediocre WRs (except for Jimmy, Keenan, ARob).

I think Lewis and maybe Brady has been the only Pro Bowlers.

Of course Johnson is saying he is willing to try it because he’s not a starter and he’s looking for starter type money. And it makes him more valuable when it’s time to make cuts. When Wilford moves to TE he was plain ol Ernest Wilford. Still heavy footed but he did atleast catch the ball.

lol, hes going into his 2nd year.  I think he is just saying that and willing to do whatever it takes to help the team win

---

Id try it a few times in camp just to see how it turns out.  The main thing for this to work would be how good is his blocking.  Not many LB's would be able to cover him thats for sure

It’s never about a player helping a team win. It’s always about them logging into their bank account to see if that check hit.

I don’t mean this in any demeaning tone...but it took me until my late 30’s to understand what life and sports and jobs is really about. It’s about 1 thing when it comes to jobs and sports. Vic said it best, it’s always about the money.

As a backup WR Johnson don’t care about anything except financial security, just like every other player in the league. It’s like a job interview every single day. So when pro players get asked a question they give their best answer. I’m in the best shape of my life, I’m ready to get to work, whatever it takes to get this team a win, I’m here to win football games and make plays, etc.

Most questions are rehearsed. 

He knows if he doesn’t cut the mustard then he will be cut. 

But man, if it makes you feel good then yes he’s doing it for the Team. Go Jags.

---

I think it’s worth a shot. If we draft a wide receiver, let’s say Kadarius Toney (as a placeholder draftee). I think the 5 wide receivers who make the team are:

DJ Chark*
Laviska Shenault*
Marvin Jones*
Kadarius Toney*
Jamal Agnew*

I think he’ll be on the outside looking in. What’s the worst that can happen? It’s either get cut due to depth, make the team as the 6th receiver and not get on the field, or be tried at tight end. Might make it, might not. But his competition as it stands is Tyler Davis, Manhertz, and O’Shag. He’s the best pass catcher of that bunch, he’s the tallest of the bunch, and he’s the one with the frame to put on more weight. 

What’s Johnson’s weakness coming out? He lacked true receiver speed. And his strengths at Texas was he was a great blocking (albeit against DBs but I’m sure the technique and will was there) and he was a major red zone threat. He has the tight end “stuff.” Could be an experiment that could pay dividends. He painfully slow when it comes to DBs, but could take advantage of LBs. 

Basically I feel like he has immense value as a red zone target, but it’ll be tough to make the team as a WR. I don’t see the downside of trying it out. 

But before you attack me for my opinion, I really just want the best roster so if he makes as a WR, gets cut, or makes it as a TE—I’m assuming the decision will come down to the best roster

---

lol, hes going into his 2nd year.  I think he is just saying that and willing to do whatever it takes to help the team win

---

Id try it a few times in camp just to see how it turns out.  The main thing for this to work would be how good is his blocking.  Not many LB's would be able to cover him thats for sure

It’s never about a player helping a team win. It’s always about them logging into their bank account to see if that check hit.

I don’t mean this in any demeaning tone...but it took me until my late 30’s to understand what life and sports and jobs is really about. It’s about 1 thing when it comes to jobs and sports. Vic said it best, it’s always about the money.

As a backup WR Johnson don’t care about anything except financial security, just like every other player in the league. It’s like a job interview every single day. So when pro players get asked a question they give their best answer. I’m in the best shape of my life, I’m ready to get to work, whatever it takes to get this team a win, I’m here to win football games and make plays, etc.

Most questions are rehearsed. 

He knows if he doesn’t cut the mustard then he will be cut. 

But man, if it makes you feel good then yes he’s doing it for the Team. Go Jags.

It's not about naive idealism.

The fact is, Johnson can't keep those checks coming if he is of no use to the team.  He is of diminished use to the team if he is the 6th or 7th WR, especially if he may not match the coach's paradigm of what a WR should be in his system.  However, if there is a chance he bolsters a very weak position, he should explore that.

The more that a player on the bottom of the roster can do, the more value he has, and the longer he keeps those checks coming.  There are long snappers who have stayed in the league for over ten years because they offered a skill nobody else on the roster did that enhanced what their underlying position.


Remember Joe Zelenka?

What position did he play?

How much impact did Joe Zelenka make as a TE?  Was he ever listed anywhere above 3rd TE on any depth chart?

Yet how long was Zelenka on the roster?

Do you think Zelenka makes on most jobs what he made over the years as a long snapper?

---

I think it’s worth a shot. If we draft a wide receiver, let’s say Kadarius Toney (as a placeholder draftee). I think the 5 wide receivers who make the team are:

DJ Chark*
Laviska Shenault*
Marvin Jones*
Kadarius Toney*
Jamal Agnew*

I think he’ll be on the outside looking in. What’s the worst that can happen? It’s either get cut due to depth, make the team as the 6th receiver and not get on the field, or be tried at tight end. Might make it, might not. But his competition as it stands is Tyler Davis, Manhertz, and O’Shag. He’s the best pass catcher of that bunch, he’s the tallest of the bunch, and he’s the one with the frame to put on more weight. 

What’s Johnson’s weakness coming out? He lacked true receiver speed. And his strengths at Texas was he was a great blocking (albeit against DBs but I’m sure the technique and will was there) and he was a major red zone threat. He has the tight end “stuff.” Could be an experiment that could pay dividends. He painfully slow when it comes to DBs, but could take advantage of LBs. 

Basically I feel like he has immense value as a red zone target, but it’ll be tough to make the team as a WR. I don’t see the downside of trying it out. 

But before you attack me for my opinion, I really just want the best roster so if he makes as a WR, gets cut, or makes it as a TE—I’m assuming the decision will come down to the best roster

Exactly.

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Something important to remember in these TE conversion discussions is that:

A receiver getting snaps at the receiving tight end position doesn't mean he has to fully convert to being an every down TE.

When the team lost Josh Oliver to injury as a rookie they had Dede Westbrook taking some of the snaps that were originally intended for Oliver in the play book.

So, a small group of receivers can absolutely rotate taking snaps at the "move TE" spot if the team fails to acquire a clear starter for that role. They will merely be limited as to what they can do as blockers in that spot, and blocking is not the primary role for that particular TE anyway.

Obviously it's better if we have a clear-cut TE body type for the spot, but it's not the end of the world if it doesn't happen this offseason, and you don't have to make a receiver put on 30 pounds to take snaps there.

The "Y" TE is your primary in-line blocker, not the "F" - and it's the F we are talking about here.

---

Something important to remember in these TE conversion discussions is that:

A receiver getting snaps at the receiving tight end position doesn't mean he has to fully convert to being an every down TE.

When the team lost Josh Oliver to injury as a rookie they had Dede Westbrook taking some of the snaps that were originally intended for Oliver in the play book.

So, a small group of receivers can absolutely rotate taking snaps at the "move TE" spot if the team fails to acquire a clear starter for that role. They will merely be limited as to what they can do as blockers in that spot, and blocking is not the primary role for that particular TE anyway.

Obviously it's better if we have a clear-cut TE body type for the spot, but it's not the end of the world if it doesn't happen this offseason, and you don't have to make a receiver put on 30 pounds to take snaps there.

The "Y" TE is your primary in-line blocker, not the "F"  - and it's the F we are talking about here.

To me, a "receiving TE" is not the best kind of TE.   A "receiving TE" is basically a receiver, nothing more.  

In my opinion, the real value of the TE position is that on any play he can be a lineman or a receiver.  That puts enormous pressure on the defense to match up.

---

When I first read some thoughts on the board presenting the idea of moving Collin Johnson to TE, my initial thought was keep him at WR and let him continue to develop where he has shown ability and has a natural height advantage. After contemplating the conversion concept, I am starting to warm up to the idea. If Collin puts on about 20 pounds, he would be roughly the same size (height and weight) as Pitts. In 2019, Pitts had a PFF run blocking grade of 43 (not good), and improved it this past season with work to a 66 (respectable). We know based on his college work and last year's limited play that Collin can be a good receiving option in the pros. If he can just get to an "ok" level in run blocking, and can hold his speed, he think he could be a good move (F) TE, if he and the team so chooses. An effective move TE does not need to be a great run blocker for success.

---

Something important to remember in these TE conversion discussions is that:

A receiver getting snaps at the receiving tight end position doesn't mean he has to fully convert to being an every down TE.

When the team lost Josh Oliver to injury as a rookie they had Dede Westbrook taking some of the snaps that were originally intended for Oliver in the play book.

So, a small group of receivers can absolutely rotate taking snaps at the "move TE" spot if the team fails to acquire a clear starter for that role. They will merely be limited as to what they can do as blockers in that spot, and blocking is not the primary role for that particular TE anyway.

Obviously it's better if we have a clear-cut TE body type for the spot, but it's not the end of the world if it doesn't happen this offseason, and you don't have to make a receiver put on 30 pounds to take snaps there.

The "Y" TE is your primary in-line blocker, not the "F"  - and it's the F we are talking about here.

To me, a "receiving TE" is not the best kind of TE.   A "receiving TE" is basically a receiver, nothing more.  

In my opinion, the real value of the TE position is that on any play he can be a lineman or a receiver.  That puts enormous pressure on the defense to match up.

It's all about scheme.

It may be obvious to opponents which TE on an offense is the hands guy and which is the blocker, but as long as you aren't throwing to the F every time he's on the field, then the F-TE (receiving TE) can be a VERY useful piece in an offense that still creates very lopsided mismatches against DBs and LBs. And defenses are forced to adjust when he proves successful. 

Nothing wrong with having different tight ends for different roles as long as they have a modicum of versatility to both block and catch.

---

If Johnson can block a DE and hold the point and set the edge then I’m all in. Until then he’s a WR hoping to make it as a pro.

To be honest, a good offensive minded OC will scheme him in the offense regardless of where he lines up presnap. I think he can be a mismatch down there in the red zone. No LB in the league should be able to cover a WR.

Johnson reminds me of another Johnson...Keshawn but a broke down Keshawn. Tall, Heavy footed, long strider, catches the ball clean, and could play TE on Madden.

Give it up guys. I remember this same affinity of having Ramsey play Safety.

He said he would be open to moving to TE, but it ain’t up to him. It’s up to Urban. We will get a TE in the draft or FA and all this Johnson talk will go away. He will be back to a role player WR who logs into his bank account each week to see that $7500 or whatever he’s making.

He better learn to be a WR before he goes playing other professional positions.

---

https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...45477?s=19

---

Am I the only one that doesn’t put anything into PFF grades?

Robinson was in the rookie of the year discussions but he’s ranked below a backup WR.

---

Am I the only one that doesn’t put anything into PFF grades?

Robinson was in the rookie of the year discussions but he’s ranked below a backup WR.

Nope.

They had Derek Cox as a better CB than Darelle Revis. 

That stopped me right there.

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Am I the only one that doesn’t put anything into PFF grades?

Robinson was in the rookie of the year discussions but he’s ranked below a backup WR.

Well we all know why you don't lol. In general their grades are a fine piece of the puzzle. Their charting and raw stats are what I think they do best.

---

Some mocks have the Jags picking this guy at 33. Pat Freiermuth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTV_yMxb-8A

---

"If you always do what you've always done, You'll always get what you always got"

Some mocks have the Jags picking this guy at 33. Pat Freiermuth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTV_yMxb-8A

@never heard of him.@

---

Some mocks have the Jags picking this guy at 33. Pat Freiermuth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTV_yMxb-8A

@never heard of him.@

He's widely considered the number 2 TE in the draft.

---

@never heard of him.@

He's widely considered the number 2 TE in the draft.

...so you're not familiar with sarcasm tags. We have been talking about Freiermuth for close to half a year around here

---

Some mocks have the Jags picking this guy at 33. Pat Freiermuth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTV_yMxb-8A

What do people think of the fact that we hired his tight end's coach to be the Jaguars tight ends coach?  Did they hire him with the plan to draft Freiermuth or was it unrelated and just purely coincidence?

---

Some mocks have the Jags picking this guy at 33. Pat Freiermuth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTV_yMxb-8A

What do people think of the fact that we hired his tight end's coach to be the Jaguars tight ends coach?  Did they hire him with the plan to draft Freiermuth or was it unrelated and just purely coincidence?

They hired Tyler Bowen as the tight ends coach because he is a very good, respected, and experienced positional offense coach, with most recent success as a tight end coach.  The Jaguars have had inferior tight end play and development.  At Penn State, he was also the co-offensive coordinator.  As the NFL uses a draft system, not a recruiting system, Bowen was hired to coach and develop any existing or drafted tight end that makes the roster.  I do not believe a plan to specifically draft Freiermuth had anything to do with his hire.

---

I am on board with Freirmuth at 33. I like his toughness and he seems to have a little of that bruiser tight end nastiness and grit. He has really good hands and does seem to know how to get open. I like him better as a prospect than Lewis when we drafted him at what like 27 or 28.

---

He's widely considered the number 2 TE in the draft.

...so you're not familiar with sarcasm tags. We have been talking about Freiermuth for close to half a year around here

Ah. I will keep that in mind next time, lol.

---