Leave the politics out of it. 

This is a thread for discussing the science and related information as new data is constantly being evaluated and presented regarding variants and vaccines.

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Yeah, sure. Next we can have a non-political climate change thread.

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lolol

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I'm really interested in finding out the viral load and transmissibility with vaccinated people and the Delta variant.

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I'm really interested in finding out the viral load and transmissibility with vaccinated people and the Delta variant.

This study went to publishing last week and covers a 17 week period. I haven't fully digested it yet, but it shows the significant benefits of vaccination in those who acquire a "breakthrough" infection. I don't think it includes discussion of the variants, but it's still relatively good news.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NE...tured_home

Here's the big takeaways:

In a prospective cohort study involving 3975 health care personnel, first responders, and other essential and frontline workers followed over 17 weeks in six U.S. states, the effectiveness of the mRNA vaccines BNT162b2 and mRNA-1273 in preventing symptomatic and asymptomatic RT-PCR–confirmed SARS-CoV-2 infection was 91% (95% CI, 76 to 97) with full vaccination; vaccine effectiveness was 81% with partial vaccination. These estimates of vaccine effectiveness in real-world conditions are consistent with findings from efficacy trials[font=ff-quadraat-web-pro,]1,2 and from a similar prospective study involving health care personnel in which routine SARS-CoV-2 testing was also conducted.7[/font]

Among the small number of participants with breakthrough RT-PCR–confirmed SARS-CoV-2 infection despite vaccination, the mRNA vaccines appeared to attenuate infection and disease in multiple ways. Participants who were partially or fully vaccinated at the time of infection had a 40% lower viral RNA load and a 66% lower risk of viral RNA detection for more than 1 week than participants who were unvaccinated at infection. Partially or fully vaccinated participants also had a 58% lower risk of febrile symptoms and a shorter duration of illness, with approximately 6 fewer days of symptoms and 2 fewer days spent sick in bed, than unvaccinated participants. The observed presence of a reduced viral RNA load after the administration of mRNA vaccines is consistent with findings in a recent report,[font=ff-quadraat-web-pro,]8 and the observed combination of virologic and clinical effects is consistent with previous findings of a lower level and shorter duration of viral RNA detection with milder Covid-19.9[/font]

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

I'm really interested in finding out the viral load and transmissibility with vaccinated people and the Delta variant.

This study went to publishing last week and covers a 17 week period. I haven't fully digested it yet, but it shows the significant benefits of vaccination in those who acquire a "breakthrough" infection. I don't think it includes discussion of the variants, but it's still relatively good news.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NE...tured_home

Here's the big takeaways:

In a prospective cohort study involving 3975 health care personnel, first responders, and other essential and frontline workers followed over 17 weeks in six U.S. states, the effectiveness of the mRNA vaccines BNT162b2 and mRNA-1273 in preventing symptomatic and asymptomatic RT-PCR–confirmed SARS-CoV-2 infection was 91% (95% CI, 76 to 97) with full vaccination; vaccine effectiveness was 81% with partial vaccination. These estimates of vaccine effectiveness in real-world conditions are consistent with findings from efficacy trials[font=ff-quadraat-web-pro,]1,2 and from a similar prospective study involving health care personnel in which routine SARS-CoV-2 testing was also conducted.7[/font]

Among the small number of participants with breakthrough RT-PCR–confirmed SARS-CoV-2 infection despite vaccination, the mRNA vaccines appeared to attenuate infection and disease in multiple ways. Participants who were partially or fully vaccinated at the time of infection had a 40% lower viral RNA load and a 66% lower risk of viral RNA detection for more than 1 week than participants who were unvaccinated at infection. Partially or fully vaccinated participants also had a 58% lower risk of febrile symptoms and a shorter duration of illness, with approximately 6 fewer days of symptoms and 2 fewer days spent sick in bed, than unvaccinated participants. The observed presence of a reduced viral RNA load after the administration of mRNA vaccines is consistent with findings in a recent report,[font=ff-quadraat-web-pro,]8 and the observed combination of virologic and clinical effects is consistent with previous findings of a lower level and shorter duration of viral RNA detection with milder Covid-19.9[/font]

That's good news and good info that hasn't been widely broadcast effectively yet.

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We're supposed to be going back into the office in October. I have a feeling that is going to be out the door if we don't get this latest surge under control. I was actually looking forward to it. I haven't been in the office since I moved out here so it severely limits my ability to meet people and find golf partners. At least when we go in, it will only be three days at work, two days at home. Perfect mix as far as I'm concerned.

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We're supposed to be going back into the office in October.  I have a feeling that is going to be out the door if we don't get this latest surge under control.  I was actually looking forward to it.  I haven't been in the office since I moved out here so it severely limits my ability to meet people and find golf partners.  At least when we go in, it will only be three days at work, two days at home.  Perfect mix as far as I'm concerned.

I’m doing a two day in, three day at home mix and I love it. Given how much money the company is saving monthly on energy costs, there is strong speculation it may become permanent. 

The company is also now offering financial incentive for employees to get vaccinated. Especially after an idiot showed up to work knowingly suffering from COVID symptoms and caused six coworkers to be quarantined. These are shop workers who do not have the benefit of WFH. The CEO sent out a long email threatening disciplinary action, including termination, if it happens again.

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We've already decided to make our work from home permanent. This could have huge ramifications for the commercial real estate market if lots of companies do the same thing.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

We've already decided to make our work from home permanent. This could have huge ramifications for the commercial real estate market if lots of companies do the same thing.

Both of my daughters have been given the option to work permanently at home.  

I don't mind being at home working, but for me personally, 24x7 can get to be a bit much.

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I thought about putting out a list of Covid symptoms that those of us here who have already had it can share with everyone else as something to look for if you start feeling shady. After doing some reading not all symptoms are obvious. 

That was certainly the case for me. I never had the most talked about flu like symptoms, I had the symptoms I never heard of as being Covid related until I started doing some research. That's literally how my life is though. I will have the most random side effects or symptoms of any medication, medical issue, illness, etc. and doctors are scratching their heads. Lol.

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I thought about putting out a list of Covid symptoms that those of us here who have already had it can share with everyone else as something to look for if you start feeling shady. After doing some reading not all symptoms are obvious. 

That was certainly the case for me. I never had the most talked about flu like symptoms, I had the symptoms I never heard of as being Covid related until I started doing some research. That's literally how my life is though. I will have the most random side effects or symptoms of any medication, medical issue, illness, etc. and doctors are scratching their heads. Lol.

How are you feeling?  Better I hope.  Did you get vaccinated before, even if just a first dose?  How many days in are you?  Praying for the best for you and that your hubby doesn’t catch it as well.

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For those working from home, I’m jealous. Until I buy a [BLEEP] ton of goats or about 150+ of them Roomba lawn mowers I actually have to work. I’ll catch up to you guys. Looking forward to hanging out with “you guys”. Whether at the poker tables or at a round of beer on a golf course. Until these lawns become Emo and cut themselves, I have to go in.

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I work for a small civil works construction company that does work all over the US, but is headquartered in San Rafael, California. When the World Health Organization officially declared COVID a pandemic in March last year, my company was always a week ahead of everyone. They mandated masks in the office, social distancing, and remote working when possible almost immediately. They were ahead with Zoom meetings, and beat our clients to the punch with every single COVID-related request. Until recently, I had thought that the fact they were located in California had something to do with it.

It did, but not for the reasons I thought. The owner of the company, who had stepped back a bit from day-to-day operations, got involved. It turns out he had lost a couple uncles when the 1918 pandemic hit Sacramento; people he never met, but his father and grandfather had talked about in his youth. He kept it under his hat until the last company meeting. For him it is personal, not political, and I'd never have guessed. The company is still at the point. Yesterday, we got the email mandating masks in the office and cash bonuses for getting vaccinated. He's still taking it very seriously.

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I work for a small civil works construction company that does work all over the US, but is headquartered in San Rafael, California.  When the World Health Organization officially declared COVID a pandemic in March last year, my company was always a week ahead of everyone.  They mandated masks in the office, social distancing, and remote working when possible almost immediately.  They were ahead with Zoom meetings, and beat our clients to the punch with every single COVID-related request.  Until recently, I had thought that the fact they were located in California had something to do with it.

It did, but not for the reasons I thought.  The owner of the company, who had stepped back a bit from day-to-day operations, got involved.  It turns out he had lost a couple uncles when the 1918 pandemic hit Sacramento; people he never met, but his father and grandfather had talked about in his youth.  He kept it under his hat until the last company meeting.  For him it is personal, not political, and I'd never have guessed. The company is still at the point.  Yesterday, we got the email mandating masks in the office and cash bonuses for getting vaccinated.  He's still taking it very seriously.

Someone with direct connection to a century-old historic event is using that experience as guidance for a contemporary crisis. That’s fascinating.

It’s an interesting and poignant story. I’m sure those uncles were young when they died.

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I'm really interested in finding out the viral load and transmissibility with vaccinated people and the Delta variant.

In general; vaccinated people can be infected with the delta variant and can infect others, but will do so much less than unvaccinated people. Bottom line; getting the vaccine will not only protect you, but the people around you as well.

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Interesting article. I thought this section to be particularly interesting.

"COVID diagnosis and COVID deaths are coving up deadly infections of other types. Since COVID tests are not really testing specifically for COVID-19 or its variants, we are running blindly, not knowing how harmful or prevalent fungus and bacterial infections are during the pandemic.

According to the FDA and CDC, positive results indicate active infection with SARS-CoV-2 but do not rule out bacterial infection or co-infection with other viruses. The agent detected may not be the definite cause of the disease. Even Dr. Fauci admits to false positives from the COVID tests. The test currently being deployed to detect COVID-19 infection is the Polymerase Chain Reaction (PCR) test. This test, however, was not developed for and is not a reliable indicator of the presence of infectious disease. The Nobel-Prize-winning inventor of the test, Kary B. Mullis, is quoted as stating: “PCR tests cannot detect free infectious viruses at all.” They can detect genetic sequences of viruses but not viruses themselves.

Members of the public could be putting themselves more at risk from contracting coronavirus by wearing face masks, one of England’s most senior doctors has warned. Jenny Harries, deputy chief medical officer, said the masks could “actually trap the virus” and cause the person wearing it to breathe it in. Not only the virus, we are learning, but a host of bacteria, fungus, yeast, and molds, which are potentially more deadly than COVID-19 and any of its variants.

In Germany, the association of “Kinder f.Weltfrieden eV” commissioned a laboratory analysis to investigate the level of microbial contamination that results after a child wears a fresh mask for 6-8 hours in school. What they found was alarming to all those recommending we mask our children for several hours every day. The masks were found to be contaminated with 82 bacterial colonies and 4 mold colonies. Where do you think the bacteria, molds, and viruses progressively colonizing and growing on the warm moist mask-mouth interface end up? So it should be no surprise that the GOP is proposing a federal law abolishing mask mandates for children.

In more than 50% of cases, a fungal infection will end in death.
It’s challenging to diagnose, and fungus infections are often
detected either too late, not at all, or treated inappropriately."


It also says scientists (who studied it) generally believe a good portion of deaths from the Spanish Flu were from infections other than the flu. I think a lot of that has happened with Covid as well. I watched a local news broadcast a few nights ago and they talked about how many people were in the hospital with Covid. They never said hospitalized due to Covid or because of Covid, only that people are there and have it. 

I don't know when or if we will ever know the truth about any of what it brought up in this article.

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Off to get Moderna shot #1 here in a minute. I got past my 90 day wait after being positive about a week or so ago.
Got a lot of work to do so I hope I don't get that little 16 hour cold many report after the shot.

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Off to get Moderna shot #1 here in a minute. I got past my 90 day wait after being positive about a week or so ago.
Got a lot of work to do so I hope I don't get that little 16 hour cold many report after the shot.

Good luck!

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Off to get Moderna shot #1 here in a minute. I got past my 90 day wait after being positive about a week or so ago.
Got a lot of work to do so I hope I don't get that little 16 hour cold many report after the shot.

Actually, I think having that reaction is a good thing.  It means your immune system is ramping up.  But it usually happens after the 2nd dose.

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Off to get Moderna shot #1 here in a minute. I got past my 90 day wait after being positive about a week or so ago.
Got a lot of work to do so I hope I don't get that little 16 hour cold many report after the shot.

I felt like crap for about 20 hours after my first Moderna shot, and it was more like the flu than a cold.  Best of luck with that one.

The second one - no problem, except my shoulder swelling up at the injection site.  Neither shot hurt or anything, and as a bonus the pharmacist jabbing my shoulder was pretty.

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