https://www.bigcatcountry.com/2022/3/24/...rs-offense

I specifically liked the tables on the leading receivers on Pederson's Eagles teams.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

If he can stay healthy, he could be a sneaky steal in FA. Always had the talent when healthy and if there is a coach that will use him to his full potential it will be Doug.

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Kinda makes me want to add McBride to the mix

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I wish it gave some insights on how they are going to use him though. I still think he and Kirk (and Arnold) are oil and water.

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A lot of nice weapons. One or 2 more rookie wrs would be the icing on the cake. Remember last year there were a lot of injuries. There is no way of finding wrs once the season starts.

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Kinda makes me want to add McBride to the mix

Early in the off-season, I liked Isaiah Likely because I thought he was more of a downfield receiving threat than McBride.  Considering how the offseason transpired, my preference is with McBride at this point because he's more of a true Y as opposed to s move TE like  Engram.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

I wish it gave some insights on how they are going to use him though. I still think he and Kirk (and Arnold) are oil and water.

Why do you describe Engram and Kirk as oil and water?

Why do you think they are incompatible?  TE and WR routes (including slot) often complement each other, whether it's rub routes or routes that clear coverage on the other side of the field or attacking safeties.  I'm not disagreeing with you, but I'd like you to elaborate.  Are there player types at TE and slot that are incompatible?  What sorts of players at those positions would complement each other?

As for the first part of your quote, while the article doesn't post pictures of the Jaguars playbook, it provides a little insight.  Here are some quotes from the article:

“The tight end position is a focal point. It always is. It has been with Doug’soffense as you mentioned,”

The Jaguars have never placed a huge emphasis on the YE position.  I think they will get more use out of Engram in the passing game (assuming he's healthy) than any TE we've had here in the last decade at least.

“He’s a runner, he’s got great speed, he’s smart, he can separate, he does well against safeties, obviously against linebacker matchups, even third quarters and things that you see on tape that he can do and have success with,” Pederson said the first day of the new league year earlier this month.

To me, this indicates there are looks and coverages they will use Engram to attack, and they feel comfortable using him on intermediate and longer routes.

“We could be in 11 personnel, we could be in 12 personnel, two tight ends, we could have three tight ends on the field at once and teams are going to have to make a decision to play that way to defend that,” Engram said when asked what Pederson’s biggest selling point to him was.

“I think just his knowledge and views of tight ends and putting them in positions to be successful and to kind of be that security blanket for the quarterback but also be an explosive piece. That’s how I view myself and then that’s the vision he has for myself in this offense.”

To me, this shows they will use personnel groupings and formations to help create mismatches for hin.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

I like Engrams potential. Hopefully he can earn a long term contract.

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The TE position typically takes the longest to develop so maybe the Jags are catching Engram just as he is about to take that step.

It took Greg Olsen 6 seasons to finally break 600 receiving yards in a season.

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The TE position typically takes the longest to develop so maybe the Jags are catching Engram just as he is about to take that step.

It took Greg Olsen 6 seasons to finally break 600 receiving yards in a season.

Engram had 722 yards and 6 TDs as a rookie

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I wish it gave some insights on how they are going to use him though. I still think he and Kirk (and Arnold) are oil and water.

Why do you describe Engram and Kirk as oil and water?

Why do you think they are incompatible?  TE and WR routes (including slot) often complement each other, whether it's rub routes or routes that clear coverage on the other side of the field or attacking safeties. 

I agree that TE and WR often complement each other when they have complementing skill sets. Kirk could be a killer in 11 with a TE that can play inline. 12 could be killer with Engram in the slot if Kirk was effective outside. Unfortunately neither of those are true. They are both essentially slot receivers. To maximize one is to minimize the other almost by definition.

Obviously Engram is quoted as saying there are tons of way that Pederson can use him. That is true, except they also have a slot only WR that they just paid a giant amount of money to. How can they maximize both?

I think they are obligated to maximize Kirk since he is now the cornerstone of the offense. They can still use Engram as an X occasionally, they can use him in the backfield occasionally, they can run bunch sets and 4 wide occasionally. I don't think they can use him effectively in a traditional Pederson 2 TE offense unless they are willing to neuter Kirk.

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I wish it gave some insights on how they are going to use him though. I still think he and Kirk (and Arnold) are oil and water.

Why do you describe Engram and Kirk as oil and water?

Why do you think they are incompatible?  TE and WR routes (including slot) often complement each other, whether it's rub routes or routes that clear coverage on the other side of the field or attacking safeties.  I'm not disagreeing with you, but I'd like you to elaborate.  Are there player types at TE and slot that are incompatible?  What sorts of players at those positions would complement each other?

As for the first part of your quote, while the article doesn't post pictures of the Jaguars playbook, it provides a little insight.  Here are some quotes from the article:

“The tight end position is a focal point. It always is. It has been with Doug’soffense as you mentioned,”

The Jaguars have never placed a huge emphasis on the YE position.  I think they will get more use out of Engram in the passing game (assuming he's healthy) than any TE we've had here in the last decade at least.

“He’s a runner, he’s got great speed, he’s smart, he can separate, he does well against safeties, obviously against linebacker matchups, even third quarters and things that you see on tape that he can do and have success with,” Pederson said the first day of the new league year earlier this month.

To me, this indicates there are looks and coverages they will use Engram to attack, and they feel comfortable using him on intermediate and longer routes.

“We could be in 11 personnel, we could be in 12 personnel, two tight ends, we could have three tight ends on the field at once and teams are going to have to make a decision to play that way to defend that,” Engram said when asked what Pederson’s biggest selling point to him was.

“I think just his knowledge and views of tight ends and putting them in positions to be successful and to kind of be that security blanket for the quarterback but also be an explosive piece. That’s how I view myself and then that’s the vision he has for myself in this offense.”

To me, this shows they will use personnel groupings and formations to help create mismatches for hin.

I agree Bullseye, There are 2 sides of the field, even if they "both ran routes in the slot area" they can be on the left and right side and attack different portions of the field. I really don't think they're oil & water. I also think that TE's in motion may be used as lead blockers on sweep type plays in lieu of a true fullback.

This is the most TE talent we've had since we had Marcedes Lewis & Julius Thomas. Thomas wasn't as bad as people remember he just wasn't worth the bloated contract we gave him. I also wonder what could have been if he hadn't broken his finger to start his career here ... or had a better QB than Bortles

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Championship Formula:

1) Draft Trevor Lawrence!
2) Play good physical Defense! 
3) Keep 91% of the roster healthy!
4) ???
5) Blank #2
6) CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

I think the pretty likely answer is that they're simply going to play Kirk outside a lot more than they should.

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Assuming our passing game is doomed in March because you don't like a receiver's lack of versatility seems logical

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Assuming our passing game is doomed in March because you don't like a receiver's lack of versatility seems logical

Who said our passing game was doomed?

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Assuming our passing game is doomed in March because you don't like a receiver's lack of versatility seems logical

Who said our passing game was doomed?

Bruh, you've harped over and over in thread after thread how dysfunctional it will be because of your fixation on Kirk

Don't even try to back off that [BLEEP] now

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Who said our passing game was doomed?

Bruh, you've harped over and over in thread after thread how dysfunctional it will be because of your fixation on Kirk

Don't even try to back off that [BLEEP] now

I have said many times that I don't know how we will effectively use Kirk and Engram at the same time. That =/= doomed passing game. It does likely mean that it won't be as good as it could be if our top WR could play outside effectively or if our top TE could play inline effectively. But it doesn't mean doomed, nor do i think an honest interpretation of what I have been saying could be interpreted as that.

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Bruh, you've harped over and over in thread after thread how dysfunctional it will be because of your fixation on Kirk

Don't even try to back off that [BLEEP] now

I have said many times that I don't know how we will effectively use Kirk and Engram at the same time. That =/= doomed passing game. It does likely mean that it won't be as good as it could be if our top WR could play outside effectively or if our top TE could play inline effectively. But it doesn't mean doomed, nor do i think an honest interpretation of what I have been saying could be interpreted as that.

If I have hyperbolized your lamenting over Kirk's supposed deficiencies, you have my apologies. 

I just don't see the point in making such assumptions about what will and won't work with our various personnel until we :
A - complete the roster, and
B - see how Pederson and Taylor actually scheme it up 

I don't share your assumption that our staff can't find a way to get the production they desire with Kirk and Engram on the field simultaneously. 
I'm also not assuming Kirk is "our top receiver" until the roster is settled and I'm not assuming (as you are) that Engram can't be effective playing in-line in Pederson's offense. 
I think you are connecting dots prematurely and unnecessarily. 

Maybe in October we'll have a sense of how these chess pieces are being utilized and whether or not Engram and Kirk are as limited as you think they are.

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Bruh, you've harped over and over in thread after thread how dysfunctional it will be because of your fixation on Kirk

Don't even try to back off that [BLEEP] now

I have said many times that I don't know how we will effectively use Kirk and Engram at the same time. That =/= doomed passing game. It does likely mean that it won't be as good as it could be if our top WR could play outside effectively or if our top TE could play inline effectively. But it doesn't mean doomed, nor do i think an honest interpretation of what I have been saying could be interpreted as that.

I'm curious as to how you got so intimate with Kirk's skill set? You seem to know it better than him lol. At least give him the grace of an offseason to prepare for playing outside.

Not to mention: He may not be asked to play outside. Coach may intend to use him as a Welker. The coach may value a slot receiver as his #1.

I know as casuals we think ourselves well informed on the gameplan and player abilities but christ....looking at your posts I'm wondering if Kirk and Engram have worked out for you in private. Just play your position, sit back, and at least see what training camp shows the actual coordinators and coaches. Or maybe they should skip practice and just ask you for your evaluation?

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Also, folks going crazy about Shenault drops be warned: Engram has gone through that phase too. He has had the dropsy's from time to time.

It's just something some players go thru. Anyone remember TO having that problem too?

Personally I know from experience, the first thing someone should check is their eyes. These guys are young and their eyes are growing/changing. I would think the medical staff would know this but I can tell you...them nor the player even suspect this many times. Think Fred Taylor. All those years we thought he couldn't catch and after years he finally got lasik.

Over one summer I went from a guy who caught everything to a guy who couldn't catch a cold. I didn't wear glasses in my daily life so never considered that I needed contact lenses.

Have Laviska get lasik or contacts.

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