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Do we have any good players on defense?

#41
(This post was last modified: 12-06-2022, 11:18 AM by Caldrac. Edited 2 times in total.)

(12-06-2022, 09:38 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: "The defense has gone downhill since Week 3 in Los Angeles and has blown fourth-quarter leads this season to the Washington Commanders, Indianapolis Colts and Denver Broncos. On Sunday, the Lions scored on every single possession until they ran out the clock with less than a minute to play. The Jaguars couldn't pressure Lions quarterback Jared Goff, couldn't cover wide receiver Amon-Ra St. Brown – who looked like Jerry Rice – and couldn't stop running backs Jamaal Williams and D'Andre Swift when the Lions did put the ball on the ground. In the last two years, the club has invested huge money in Roy Robertson-Harris, Foye Oluokun, Foley Fatukasi, Rayshawn Jenkins, Shaq Griffin and Darious Williams in free agency and spent high draft picks on Travon Walker, Devin Lloyd, Chad Muma, Tyson Campbell and Andre Cisco. Most alarming is that Walker, Lloyd and Muma aren't getting better; they shouldn't look so completely lost in December. These are guys who can all play. but they're not playing well. Since they're locked into these players with a tight salary cap in 2023. change must come from somewhere else."

Brian Sexton

What he is implying is pretty obvious.

Agreed. Sounds like Caldwell is struggling as a first time defensive coordinator and he doesn't know how to manage the talent around him. Pederson will probably part ways by the end of this month.

I keep saying it. However, it really makes sense to me with them bringing in Spielman as VP, potentially overseeing Baalke while he manages to keep his role as GM, and, that potentially opens the door wide open for Mike Zimmer to return to the NFL as our new DC to help bridge the gap for a year or two.

Pederson calling the offense and Zimmer calling the defense could really put this team on par with Dallas. That's the reality. That's a realistic expectation. Khan needs to make it happen.
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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."
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#42

(12-06-2022, 10:24 AM)carp8dm Wrote: Finally, let me leave you with this... 

Remember when Josh Allen pretty much destroyed the Buffalo Bills all by himself last year?  Josh Allen has the physical gifts and football skill to be a #1 Edge Rusher.  Josh Allen as the ability to be a hall of famer.  You know what Josh Allen doesn't have?  He doesn't have the motivation.  You know who that falls on?  The gosh dilly arn Coaches!!!!  The coaches should be lighting a fire under Josh Allen's over pampered, Rudy Poo, Candy [BLEEP]!!!   

I'm old, there used to be this thing called NFL films.  Back in the day you'd see coaches get on HOF players.  You'd see Bill Parcells pushing Lawrence Taylor.  You'd see Bill Cowher laying into Gred Lloyd.  You'd see Marty Schottenheimer getting after the late great Derrick Thomas.

Some players need to be ridden like mules.  Some players don't have a fire inside them, but they have a spark that a great coach can fuel and create an inferno.  Josh Allen is that type of player.  He's not going to work on his own.  He's not a guy with fire that will take over a team and be the catalyst.  He needs a coach that's gonna kick him in the rear and focus him on the task at hand. 

It's not the players that are letting down this team.  There's enough here for at least a mediocre squad at the worst.  But we have a coaching staff on defense that has no idea how to get the best out of our players.  That's the problem here.

Remember Tom Coughlin? That management style doesn't work anymore.
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#43

(12-06-2022, 11:22 AM)CanDoBetter Wrote:
(12-06-2022, 10:24 AM)carp8dm Wrote: Finally, let me leave you with this... 

Remember when Josh Allen pretty much destroyed the Buffalo Bills all by himself last year?  Josh Allen has the physical gifts and football skill to be a #1 Edge Rusher.  Josh Allen as the ability to be a hall of famer.  You know what Josh Allen doesn't have?  He doesn't have the motivation.  You know who that falls on?  The gosh dilly arn Coaches!!!!  The coaches should be lighting a fire under Josh Allen's over pampered, Rudy Poo, Candy [BLEEP]!!!   

I'm old, there used to be this thing called NFL films.  Back in the day you'd see coaches get on HOF players.  You'd see Bill Parcells pushing Lawrence Taylor.  You'd see Bill Cowher laying into Gred Lloyd.  You'd see Marty Schottenheimer getting after the late great Derrick Thomas.

Some players need to be ridden like mules.  Some players don't have a fire inside them, but they have a spark that a great coach can fuel and create an inferno.  Josh Allen is that type of player.  He's not going to work on his own.  He's not a guy with fire that will take over a team and be the catalyst.  He needs a coach that's gonna kick him in the rear and focus him on the task at hand. 

It's not the players that are letting down this team.  There's enough here for at least a mediocre squad at the worst.  But we have a coaching staff on defense that has no idea how to get the best out of our players.  That's the problem here.

Remember Tom Coughlin? That management style doesn't work anymore.

Coughlin's problem in 2018 was that he hated on the entire team.  

The great coaches lit a fire under the greats via a 1on1 relationship....  

The distinction is important.

Josh Allen has never been pushed.  He's been coddled.  And look at his carreer.  Dude is a waste of space.  But he is a bust because the Jaguar organization never pushed him out of his comfort zone.
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#44

(12-06-2022, 11:37 AM)carp8dm Wrote:
(12-06-2022, 11:22 AM)CanDoBetter Wrote: Remember Tom Coughlin? That management style doesn't work anymore.

Coughlin's problem in 2018 was that he hated on the entire team.  

The great coaches lit a fire under the greats via a 1on1 relationship....  

The distinction is important.

Josh Allen has never been pushed.  He's been coddled.  And look at his carreer.  Dude is a waste of space.  But he is a bust because the Jaguar organization never pushed him out of his comfort zone.
Coughlin's problem in 2018 was he wanted to be the coach and he wasn't the coach.

Coaches can be harder on players because they have that relationship.

When the director of football operations come into the locker room trying to do the coaches job you've got problems
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#45
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2022, 03:33 PM by I am Yoda.)

(12-05-2022, 06:46 PM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: We messed up passing on Sauce Gardner. The only bright side to that, is so did the Texans. Stingley might be good but Gardner is elite.


Perhaps for immediate impact. 3 years from now, I don’t think so. Freak athletes who are also good football players don’t grow on trees. I think Travon is that. Get him some good coaching and he will be great.


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(12-06-2022, 09:19 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: We need better players.  But we have enough talent to do a lot better than we have.  Players being out of position and not knowing whom to cover is not a talent issue.

Pederson made the comment the other day in a press conference that he is not involved in the game planning for the defense.  Usually, Pederson is very careful not to say anything of much substance.  But that was a very telling comment.  I think Caldwell is in over his head.


Some much this. Caldwell is a not ready for prime time DC.


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Fix the O-Line!
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#46

Caldwell isn't adapting well to the coordinator job, but he had his guys motivated yesterday.

I don't expect to see turnovers like that often, but they forced three yesterday and recovered another.

Changes made were primarily more stunts from the OLB/DE looping inside , more 4-3 looks (Walker in 3 point stance), and he moved the safeties around more. Fewer single high looks with Cisco out.

Campbell allowed zero yards, Wingard had some impactful plays, Lloyd still looks lost, Oluokkun is a tackling machine, Arden Key re-emerged from nowhere, Walker had a number of nice plays, Allen pressured a few times as did Smoot -and Fatukasi got onto the sack stat column. It was a good bounce back for the defense. Next week will be tougher vs Prescott and a better OL.
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#47

Campbell is playing at a pro bowl level. Got his head around for the pass breakups perfectly yesterday.
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#48
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2022, 04:21 PM by StrayaJag.)

https://jaguarswire.usatoday.com/2022/12...n-jaguars/

Who knows maybe the titans game is a turning point and we start to see some more consistent defence
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#49
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2022, 04:37 PM by Newton.)

Hopefully mri on Walker’s ankle does not find anything serious
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#50

We have good players, they just haven't played well. Josh Allen can't go 8 games ithout a sack. We wanted travon to be 8 sack guy not 4 sack guy. Campbell had trouble tracking the ball arly in the season. Devo Lloyd is struggling with scheme. The same line that turtled the colts in the Shut out were getting pushed around the last month. Every phase of this defense has shown flashes of quality, the issues been consistency.
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#52
(This post was last modified: 12-13-2022, 09:19 AM by carp8dm.)

(12-12-2022, 07:17 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: https://twitter.com/BaldyNFL/status/1602...nExrXXGmdQ


This is why good coaching matters.  Trayvon's first 3 games were pretty doggone impressive.  Then teams adjusted to him.  

It takes a good headcoach to provide feedback and get players in the best position to do what they are good/great at.  Moving Trayvon around is what he's good at.  It's what he did at Georgia.  Having him put his hands in the dirt helps his explosivity.

Oh, and Tray's ability to drop into a zone shell and chase the ball?  Man, the dude is a problem.  But he's only a problem if a coach can recognize how to get the best out of this stud.

My only concern is that I still don't think Caldwell is the HC that can get the best out of our talent.  Based on Sunday's win, I'm willing to give Caldwell the rest of the season and let him show us if he can be a great D.C.  I hope he can get it done.  I'm rooting for him!  I'd rather keep guys than get rid of them.  But if he's not successfull, he's got to go.

(12-12-2022, 04:44 PM)jj82284 Wrote: We have good players, they just haven't played well.  Josh Allen can't go 8 games ithout a sack.  We wanted travon to be 8 sack guy not 4 sack guy.  Campbell had trouble tracking the ball arly in the season.  Devo Lloyd is struggling with scheme.  The same line that turtled the colts in the Shut out were getting pushed around the last month.  Every phase of this defense has shown flashes of quality, the issues been consistency.

Because of our cap situation, Josh Allen will still be here next season.  But I gotta say, the dude has shown he's not worthy of keeping past 2023.  I don't know what happened to him.  But damn, he is so average, he makes me think Miracle Whip is spicy
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