I think we offer Engram 3 yr  12 to 12.5 mil a year and if they can't agree on that he gets tagged

There's no way he will accept that, and he shouldn't.  Look at this table of TE contracts:  

https://overthecap.com/contracts

The contract you propose would make him the 10th highest paid TE.  That's an insulting offer.

I could see him getting 13 mil per year.  It would make him 8th highest.  If he's asking for 14 or 15 you tag him.  I don't see him being like Yawn, hopefully he has a better agent than that.  He will be 29 and just had his best season in Dougs TE friendly offense.  He's not going to get paid like Kelce or Kittle

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This is the era as a jaguars fan where we fall in love with players who have a good year, and are willing to pay them anything to come back next year so we can feel good again... because it's new for us.

Yup lol

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Agreed. I think you're going to have to look at $14.5-$15 APY at the minimum. This would put him in line where I think he belongs tier wise. He's obviously not Kelce, Kittle, etc. 

However, he should be in that area with Njoku and Knox. 100%. Especially if the expectations are that he gets even better and more involved offensively. Which, based on his first year here with Lawrence? It's possible.

God no, Engarm had a good year for us last year but he isn't close to Kelce, Kittle, or Andrew's.  He had his best year this year in Dougs TE friendly offense but you have to look at his past years as well.  If he is asking for that kind of money you just tag him which I doubt he is asking for that.  Maybe go 13 mil per

So you pay a guy who performs in your system less money because he didn't perform in someone else's system before? That seems...about on par for your takes.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Agreed. I think you're going to have to look at $14.5-$15 APY at the minimum. This would put him in line where I think he belongs tier wise. He's obviously not Kelce, Kittle, etc. 

However, he should be in that area with Njoku and Knox. 100%. Especially if the expectations are that he gets even better and more involved offensively. Which, based on his first year here with Lawrence? It's possible.

God no, Engarm had a good year for us last year but he isn't close to Kelce, Kittle, or Andrew's.  He had his best year this year in Dougs TE friendly offense but you have to look at his past years as well.  If he is asking for that kind of money you just tag him which I doubt he is asking for that.  Maybe go 13 mil per

I know for a FACT you will be the first one to say they should resign ETN when it comes time for his new contract.

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God no, Engarm had a good year for us last year but he isn't close to Kelce, Kittle, or Andrew's.  He had his best year this year in Dougs TE friendly offense but you have to look at his past years as well.  If he is asking for that kind of money you just tag him which I doubt he is asking for that.  Maybe go 13 mil per

So you pay a guy who performs in your system less money because he didn't perform in someone else's system before? That seems...about on par for your takes.

Less money?  Lol. 12.5 to 13 mil per year would be the most he has ever gotten by a good margin

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God no, Engarm had a good year for us last year but he isn't close to Kelce, Kittle, or Andrew's.  He had his best year this year in Dougs TE friendly offense but you have to look at his past years as well.  If he is asking for that kind of money you just tag him which I doubt he is asking for that.  Maybe go 13 mil per

I know for a FACT you will be the first one to say they should resign ETN when it comes time for his new contract.

That's 3 years away.  Still alot of football left to be played before we have to make that decision. I have no clue if I will want too or not, his first year played looks very promising though

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Hunter Henry signed a 3 year 12.5 mil per year deal. Kelce is making 14.5 and Andrew's is making 14 mil per. 12.5 to 13 mil per would be fair for both sides.

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So you pay a guy who performs in your system less money because he didn't perform in someone else's system before? That seems...about on par for your takes.

Less money?  Lol. 12.5 to 13 mil per year would be the most he has ever gotten by a good margin

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I know for a FACT you will be the first one to say they should resign ETN when it comes time for his new contract.

That's 3 years away.  Still alot of football left to be played before we have to make that decision

The guarantees are more important than the average annual salary number.  He’s probably looking at somewhere between $25M to $35M in guaranteed money.  This is based on performance as well as the cap increasing significantly.  Free agents will all want their share of that increase. 

Spotrac does provide an estimated market value for players, but Engram’s appears to not have been updated since last offseason.

EDIT: actually, the guarantees are probably more like $30M to $40M if we’re assuming that at least the first two years are fully guaranteed which I would assume will be the case and probably a portion of the 3rd year. That would put him in that Kittle/Andrews category or close to it, but keep in mind those deals were done in prior years with a smaller total league cap number.

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Yeah, I could see him getting a 3 year 39 mil contract with 26 mil guaranteed. If his agent is asking for more we can just tag him but I think he would agree too a contract like that

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Yeah, I could see him getting a 3 year 39 mil contract with 26 mil guaranteed.  If his agent is asking for more we can just tag him but I think  he would agree too a contract like that

This is probably his last real bite at the apple though.  I think he’s really going to want a 5 year deal with a decent portion of that 3rd year guaranteed.(and could probably find that in the open market and if the signing bonus is large as it may have to be, spreading it over 5 years helps lessen the blow to the cap)

If he takes $26MM guaranteed on a 3 year deal (essentially a 2 year deal), Baalke must’ve had the violins playing while he oversold our cap situation to Engram and Engram must’ve really really wanted to stay here and bought it.  I just really think the guarantees need to go partially into year 3 for him to stay because I think he could find that out there.

EDIT: I guess the threat of the tag could play in though. Would hate for it to get contentious because I think Engram is the right type of personality for this locker room and that could change if he feels he’s being forced to shoulder all of the injury risk that comes with being tagged.

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Yeah, I could see him getting a 3 year 39 mil contract with 26 mil guaranteed.  If his agent is asking for more we can just tag him but I think  he would agree too a contract like that

This is probably his last real bite at the apple though.  I think he’s really going to want a 5 year deal (and could probably find that in the open market) with a decent portion of that 3rd year guaranteed.

If he takes $26MM guaranteed on a 3 year deal (essentially a 2 year deal), Baalke must’ve had the violins playing while he oversold our cap situation to Engram and Engram must’ve really really wanted to stay here and bought it.  I just really think the guarantees need to go partially into year 3 for him to stay because I think he could find that out there.

Eh, he was on the open market last year and the best he could get was a was 1 year 9 mil deal.  I don't see anyone signing him at 29 to a 5 year deal.  A team would of done it last year.  Engram is the top guy I want resigned  but he isn't getting Kelce money.  13 mil a year for 3 years would be a very great deal for him.  As the poster above said, it's new to us winning and when a player now has a good year they are willing to pay him anything so we can be good again.  I remember when some were saying give Yawn an open check book and whatever he wanted lol.  We offered him way more than he was worth or any other team would give him and he turned it down, he lost so many millions. The good think about Engram is we can just tag him if he's asking for crazy money but I don't think he will

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the market is dry this year
he will be coveted

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the market is dry this year
he will be coveted

Gesicki, Schultz, Hooper, Hurst, Howard, Moreau are all UFA this year.

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This is probably his last real bite at the apple though.  I think he’s really going to want a 5 year deal (and could probably find that in the open market) with a decent portion of that 3rd year guaranteed.

If he takes $26MM guaranteed on a 3 year deal (essentially a 2 year deal), Baalke must’ve had the violins playing while he oversold our cap situation to Engram and Engram must’ve really really wanted to stay here and bought it.  I just really think the guarantees need to go partially into year 3 for him to stay because I think he could find that out there.

Eh, he was on the open market last year and the best he could get was a was 1 year 9 mil deal.  I don't see anyone signing him at 29 to a 5 year deal.  A team would of done it last year.  Engram is the top guy I want resigned  but he isn't getting Kelce money.  13 mil a year for 3 years would be a very great deal for him.  As the poster above said, it's new to us winning and when a player now has a good year they are willing to pay him anything so we can be good again.  I remember when some were saying give Yawn an open check book and whatever he wanted lol.  We offered him way more than he was worth or any other team would give him and he turned it down, he lost so many millions.  The good think about Engram is we can just tag him if he's asking for crazy money but I don't think he will

Why does anybody keep pointing out or thinking that he's going to:

A. Ask for Kelce money
B. Worth Kelce money

My average per year is based on a few, realistic expectations. For starters, it puts him in the top five - eight range with guys that are in the same ballpark range production wise. This is factoring in last year plus the entirety of their careers. Also, you have to adjust for NFL inflation. 

The market always goes up. Guys are going to get slightly overpaid to an extent. It's just the nature of the salary cap. $14.5M - $15M APY is fair based on the current market and where guys are slotted in at. I would offer him 3 years, starting at $14M APY and working towards cash loading it up front with incentives towards that final year of the deal.

This should ensure you're getting the best out of your money spent on him up front while he's still a little bit younger and then towards the end when you know you're going to have to make moves to inevitably resign Lawrence to his monster deal you have given yourself an easy out and two years to draft and develop or sign his replacement that's going to cost you less per year.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

the market is dry this year
he will be coveted

Gesicki, Schultz, Hooper, Hurst, Howard, Moreau are all UFA this year.

Yeah, with that said I dont think we let him hit the market

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Gesicki, Schultz, Hooper, Hurst, Howard, Moreau are all UFA this year.

Yeah, with that said I dont think we let him hit the market

He gets tagged at the minimum. If that fails though. Moreau and Gesicki are worth the look.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Eh, he was on the open market last year and the best he could get was a was 1 year 9 mil deal.  I don't see anyone signing him at 29 to a 5 year deal.  A team would of done it last year.  Engram is the top guy I want resigned  but he isn't getting Kelce money.  13 mil a year for 3 years would be a very great deal for him.  As the poster above said, it's new to us winning and when a player now has a good year they are willing to pay him anything so we can be good again.  I remember when some were saying give Yawn an open check book and whatever he wanted lol.  We offered him way more than he was worth or any other team would give him and he turned it down, he lost so many millions.  The good think about Engram is we can just tag him if he's asking for crazy money but I don't think he will

Why does anybody keep pointing out or thinking that he's going to:

A. Ask for Kelce money
B. Worth Kelce money

My average per year is based on a few, realistic expectations. For starters, it puts him in the top five - eight range with guys that are in the same ballpark range production wise. This is factoring in last year plus the entirety of their careers. Also, you have to adjust for NFL inflation. 

The market always goes up. Guys are going to get slightly overpaid to an extent. It's just the nature of the salary cap. $14.5M - $15M APY is fair based on the current market and where guys are slotted in at. I would offer him 3 years, starting at $14M APY and working towards cash loading it up front with incentives towards that final year of the deal.

This should ensure you're getting the best out of your money spent on him up front while he's still a little bit younger and then towards the end when you know you're going to have to make moves to inevitably resign Lawrence to his monster deal you have given yourself an easy out and two years to draft and develop or sign his replacement that's going to cost you less per year.

I would tag him at 11.3 mil before I just offer him Mark Andrews money.  He had a really good year for us this year but he isn't as good as Mark Andrews

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Yeah, with that said I dont think we let him hit the market

He gets tagged at the minimum. If that fails though. Moreau and Gesicki are worth the look.

Gesicki would be a beast with Trevor and in Dougs offense

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Yeah, I could see him getting a 3 year 39 mil contract with 26 mil guaranteed.  If his agent is asking for more we can just tag him but I think  he would agree too a contract like that

So 3 for 42 is too much? Squabble over 3 million?

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Yeah, I could see him getting a 3 year 39 mil contract with 26 mil guaranteed.  If his agent is asking for more we can just tag him but I think  he would agree too a contract like that

So 3 for 42 is too much? Squabble over 3 million?

You always have to have a limit.  If you would go 42 why not 45?

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But yes I would tag him and see if he can have another big year with us and save almost 3 mil

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This is the era as a jaguars fan where we fall in love with players who have a good year, and are willing to pay them anything to come back next year so we can feel good again... because it's new for us.

Given the fact that we were the worst team in the NFL over the past decade (2011 through 2021), I really can't recall players that I fell in love with and wanted them back for another year.   However, if I recall correctly, didn't that exact thing happen to Gus Bradley, Bortles, and Dave Caldwell (GM), when we unnecessarily added a year to each of their contracts then got rid of them prior to each of their contracts expiring ...... SMH ... WHAT A DISASTER !!

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So 3 for 42 is too much? Squabble over 3 million?

You always have to have a limit.  If you would go 42 why not 45?

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But yes I would tag him and see if he can have another big year with us and save almost 3 mil

And then he walks because we didn’t sign him when we had the chance.

How many players sign a long term deal a year after getting the tag?

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I don’t like tagging engram. He came here in good faith for a one year prove it deal. You don’t tag a guy who comes for a one-year deal on my mind. both sides were aware of what this was. He outperformed our expectations, and clearly was a big part of us making it to the playoffs. I think you gave him top 10 money for 3 years and call it a day.

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