Why did he give up playcalling?

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His answer was something to the effect of "focus on game management and other head coaching purview duties".

He was better than Taylor, but Taylor was still calling the Pederson playbook and in three years time that playbook proved inadequate. I think the biggest strike against Pederson and his playbook was the inability to get the most out of Lawrence consistently. Some of that is OL and other personnel, some of it is Lawrence's mistakes, but it was Pederson and his staff's job to develop Lawrence within a system that would foster his development.

They had a few spurts of growth but ultimately failed.

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Because it wasn't his job.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Because it wasn't his job.

My understanding was he brought on board to be hands on with the offense, aka call the plays

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Because it wasn't his job.

My understanding was he brought on board to be hands on with the offense, aka call the plays

He was hired to be the Head Coach, if the offensive coaching is doing what he wants why wouldn't he spend his time on other issues?

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Jaguars owner wanted Pederson to call plays if I’m not mistaken.

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I am over the play calling debate with him and Taylor, etc. It ultimately didn't work out in the grand scheme of things. Lawrence failed because this offensive line has been straight booty since he's been here, and, once the tape was out between the 2022 wild run and the 8 - 3 start in 2023 got put through the buzzsaw with tougher opponents?

The jig was up. This is why everybody should have been [BLEEP] canned last week as a collective. They all failed. The wrong personnel was put into place and the offensive line's continued struggles and regression proves this. It also applies to the defensive line's struggles and their inability to get after the QB.

This team has fundamentally [BLEEP] the bed at the two most critical aspects in today's game. Protecting the QB with pass protection and getting after the QB with pass rush. Not that much more to read into after that. You look at the best teams in football right now. It always starts upfront with trench warfare.

We're rolling squads out there with single shot rifles and bayonets attached to them while everybody else is rolling out fully automatic rifles and drone striking people.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Jaguars owner wanted Pederson to call plays if I’m not mistaken.

Wouldn't have mattered. The offense was predictable because the offensive line was predictable. If you can't run the football you can't sell anything downfield.

We could have tried more bubble screens or something but it would have been like cutting tough meat with a plastic butter knife at some point and teams would have schemed against it as well.

I think what they failed in was having adequate freedom and functionality for Lawrence and I think they may have been scared at times to get him moving around and outside of the pocket to fit most modern offenses to avoid injuries (him getting decapitated at home probably proves this point). 

They decided they wanted him to be more under center in 2024 and that's fine, until your running game is abysmal and proves it pointless. Which is exactly what happened.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Jaguars owner wanted Pederson to call plays if I’m not mistaken.

Wouldn't have mattered. The offense was predictable because the offensive line was predictable. If you can't run the football you can't sell anything downfield.

We could have tried more bubble screens or something but it would have been like cutting tough meat with a plastic butter knife at some point and teams would have schemed against it as well.

I think what they failed in was having adequate freedom and functionality for Lawrence and I think they may have been scared at times to get him moving around and outside of the pocket to fit most modern offenses to avoid injuries (him getting decapitated at home probably proves this point). 

They decided they wanted him to be more under center in 2024 and that's fine, until your running game is abysmal and proves it pointless. Which is exactly what happened.

I agree with all of this. 

Being more creative with the playcalling could have helped a bit, but that would have been exposed too at some point. And the run blocking killed so many opportunities and allowed defenses to focus elsewhere. 

Piggybacking on what you said about having freedom and function for Lawrence, I'd add that Pederson (after the 2022 season) announced he'd be taking input from TL and reworking the playbook to suit his strengths. 

I am firmly of the opinion that this is when began turning south. 

Not because of Lawrence's input, but because Pederson identified that Lawrence had a bad habit of staring down one guy sometimes, and maybe only making two reads at other times, or making multiple reads to only one side of the field. He didn't do this all the time, but he did it too often IMO. 

They collectively rearranged the playbook to try and give Lawrence more reads to one side, inserted more one read plays, and essentially took away a ton of options from the kid trying to suit his bad habit instead of DEVELOPING his ability to go through his progression in 2.3 seconds. 
It was a major mistake. 
This is where all of those "why are there two receivers in the same place" play came from. This is when we saw the emergence of the plethora of low percentage throws being forced. 

I realize there is some speculation in my opinion here, but there is also a lot of analysis, I assure you. 
 And that is what I believe happened.

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@This needs to be in NFL at Large@

If you get paid the same whether you call the plays or not, why not choose the easier route?

That, or Pressy got some incriminating photos.

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Pederson's gone. Who cares.

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Jags would have been better off letting Lawrence call his own plays.

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Jags would have been better off letting  Lawrence call his own plays.

"Trevor, what's the play call?"

"Let's go Clemson Tiger X Ray, Z delta, Y post, Double-Double, bootleg Alpha-Omega".

"Okay, we got 6 yards on that improvised run after the line couldn't hold up in pass protection, now what?".

"Let's go Urban Meyer, make X your Z, kick Y, dip [BLEEP], triple-option, lap dance".

"Okay, holy [BLEEP], great call, we got 16 yards there on another improvised run after the line couldn't hold up in pass protection, now what?".

"Let's go Snoop Dougy Doug, Press X, Taylor Z, Y Guess, double-echo, read option, half check Tank, full dive Etienne".

"Okay, unbelievable. We're now 1 yard away after yet another improvised run after the line couldn't hold up in pass protection, now what?"

"Trevor...Trev... Babe! Wake-up! It's your turn to feed the baby".

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

How the NFL has changed. I'm reminded of a story Vic Ketchman told of how after Chuck Noll had a couple of plays run into the huddle during a drive. Terry Bradshaw told him later that if he wanted to call the plays, he would sit on the bench so Noll could play quarterback.

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Because it wasn't his job.

Oh, those famous words from everyone who gets fired.

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Wouldn't have mattered. The offense was predictable because the offensive line was predictable. If you can't run the football you can't sell anything downfield.

We could have tried more bubble screens or something but it would have been like cutting tough meat with a plastic butter knife at some point and teams would have schemed against it as well.

I think what they failed in was having adequate freedom and functionality for Lawrence and I think they may have been scared at times to get him moving around and outside of the pocket to fit most modern offenses to avoid injuries (him getting decapitated at home probably proves this point). 

They decided they wanted him to be more under center in 2024 and that's fine, until your running game is abysmal and proves it pointless. Which is exactly what happened.

I agree with all of this. 

Being more creative with the playcalling could have helped a bit, but that would have been exposed too at some point. And the run blocking killed so many opportunities and allowed defenses to focus elsewhere. 

Piggybacking on what you said about having freedom and function for Lawrence, I'd add that Pederson (after the 2022 season) announced he'd be taking input from TL and reworking the playbook to suit his strengths. 

I am firmly of the opinion that this is when began turning south. 

Not because of Lawrence's input, but because Pederson identified that Lawrence had a bad habit of staring down one guy sometimes, and maybe only making two reads at other times, or making multiple reads to only one side of the field. He didn't do this all the time, but he did it too often IMO. 

They collectively rearranged the playbook to try and give Lawrence more reads to one side, inserted more one read plays, and essentially took away a ton of options from the kid trying to suit his bad habit instead of DEVELOPING his ability to go through his progression in 2.3 seconds. 
It was a major mistake. 
This is where all of those "why are there two receivers in the same place" play came from. This is when we saw the emergence of the plethora of low percentage throws being forced. 

I realize there is some speculation in my opinion here, but there is also a lot of analysis, I assure you. 
 And that is what I believe happened.

Why are you talking about something that only applies to maybe 10% of the pass plays Trevor misses on?     It's okay, I'm a man of patience, it only took you 3 years to get here.

I think we'll see with the next coach whether Pederson's simplifying the offense to partial reads was a failure to teach Trevor, or was an innate short-coming with the QB's skillset.

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NYC4jags Wrote:
Can we leave the personal insults behind for a while and get back to some semblance of topic, gents?
Please, and thank you.

Pederson/Taylor's biggest fail was the 3rd and shorts. Ultimate down of death.

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I agree with all of this. 

Being more creative with the playcalling could have helped a bit, but that would have been exposed too at some point. And the run blocking killed so many opportunities and allowed defenses to focus elsewhere. 

Piggybacking on what you said about having freedom and function for Lawrence, I'd add that Pederson (after the 2022 season) announced he'd be taking input from TL and reworking the playbook to suit his strengths. 

I am firmly of the opinion that this is when began turning south. 

Not because of Lawrence's input, but because Pederson identified that Lawrence had a bad habit of staring down one guy sometimes, and maybe only making two reads at other times, or making multiple reads to only one side of the field. He didn't do this all the time, but he did it too often IMO. 

They collectively rearranged the playbook to try and give Lawrence more reads to one side, inserted more one read plays, and essentially took away a ton of options from the kid trying to suit his bad habit instead of DEVELOPING his ability to go through his progression in 2.3 seconds. 
It was a major mistake. 
This is where all of those "why are there two receivers in the same place" play came from. This is when we saw the emergence of the plethora of low percentage throws being forced. 

I realize there is some speculation in my opinion here, but there is also a lot of analysis, I assure you. 
 And that is what I believe happened.

Why are you talking about something that only applies to maybe 10% of the pass plays Trevor misses on?     It's okay, I'm a man of patience, it only took you 3 years to get here.

I think we'll see with the next coach whether Pederson's simplifying the offense to partial reads was a failure to teach Trevor, or was an innate short-coming with the QB's skillset.

A few things here:

1. I thought of you when I posted that and expected a response because I recall that convo

2. Trevor's tape has plenty of great examples of him scanning the entire field, looking off safeties and alerting receivers to hot routes etc. - Even if he was also showing the bad habits I described at other times.

  -- My point  (that you are mostly missing whilst focused on trying to take a false victory lap) is that this stuff changed for the worse after the 2022 season when the Jags offensive braintrust decided to alter course with how they tasked him to read the field. Instead of trying to develop the good stuff he was putting on tape, they focused on mitigating the mistakes. 
 
I think that's where Pederson screwed up. 

Mitigating mistakes is how you handle a QB like Blake Bortles, Case Keenum or David Mills.
Developing talent is how you handle a QB like CJ Stroud or Trevor Lawrence. 

And yes, I have watched more tape since that post - and I do think Trevor shows these bad habits more frequently than I thought he did a year ago. 
But having watched the all22 route running from 2023 and 2024 - it's pretty clear to me that the staff handcuffed him instead of growing him.

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Why are you talking about something that only applies to maybe 10% of the pass plays Trevor misses on?     It's okay, I'm a man of patience, it only took you 3 years to get here.

I think we'll see with the next coach whether Pederson's simplifying the offense to partial reads was a failure to teach Trevor, or was an innate short-coming with the QB's skillset.

A few things here:

1. I thought of you when I posted that and expected a response because I recall that convo

2. Trevor's tape has plenty of great examples of him scanning the entire field, looking off safeties and alerting receivers to hot routes etc. - Even if he was also showing the bad habits I described at other times.

  -- My point  (that you are mostly missing whilst focused on trying to take a false victory lap) is that this stuff changed for the worse after the 2022 season when the Jags offensive braintrust decided to alter course with how they tasked him to read the field. Instead of trying to develop the good stuff he was putting on tape, they focused on mitigating the mistakes. 
 
I think that's where Pederson screwed up. 

Mitigating mistakes is how you handle a QB like Blake Bortles, Case Keenum or David Mills.
Developing talent is how you handle a QB like CJ Stroud or Trevor Lawrence. 

And yes, I have watched more tape since that post - and I do think Trevor shows these bad habits more frequently than I thought he did a year ago. 
But having watched the all22 route running from 2023 and 2024 - it's pretty clear to me that the staff handcuffed him instead of growing him.

"1. I thought of you when I posted that and expected a response because I recall that convo because you gave me this idea" FIFY  

Another possibility is that Doug made that simplification during the 2022 bye week.  Turning a 3-7 team into a team that went 6-1.  This fits in my original theory that "If Pederson has to continually simplify the offense to fit Trevor Lawrence's skill set (or lack there of) he may get some increases in production, but for a short time."

Like I said, we won't know until we see Trevor under another offensive coaching staff.

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NYC4jags Wrote:
Can we leave the personal insults behind for a while and get back to some semblance of topic, gents?
Please, and thank you.

We should probably ask an Eagle fan.

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The Other Jag Forum: Duval Football Fans.

Brandon Scherff is no longer that dude.   Next season I want him gone.