http://money.cnn.com/2014/09/10/pf/colle...ent-loans/
Approximately 40 million Americans have student loan debt. Student loan debt recently passed mortgages for the highest amount of debt in America, and Americans owe the Government and FAFSA approximately $1.2 trillion dollars.
I figured that it was time for somebody to talk about college and student loan debt; as it is a serious issue that will affect many of us, and our kids for years to come. Are there any tips or pieces of advice that people here would like to give for getting out of this? as I know that many users here have experience with this.
Tuition keeps rising while grants keep disappearing and gov't loan rates keep climbing.
I had it good the first time around with scholarship money, but I've been considering going back for another degree and the potential cost/debt is the main deterrent for me.
I have three tips:
First - Avoid for profit universities like the University of Phoenix and Ashford University. They spend more on marketing than they do on teachers. And sadly it's working out pretty well for them. Though their enrollment numbers are starting to drop. A degree from such a college is often worthless. And their recruitment strategies are often despicable.
Second - Find if you qualify for financial aid that you don't have to pay back. A friend of mine started college, and she was paying it on her own. However she later found out she qualified for $1000/semester because her father was killed in action. There's all kinds of these loans available, it's worth it to look and see if you qualify for any.
Third - Consider starting at community college, and taking classes that will transfer with a plan in mind. That's what my wife did. She took several classes at community college because we couldn't afford to take out big loans. Eventually she transferred to a four year college, and graduated (and is now on her way to getting her masters after working as a teacher for 7 years) . It helped by having a plan, and knowing what would transfer and what would not. You want to go in with a plan to attend a four year college.
Of course this advice will only really help those who don't already have debt. It's unfortunate that our college system is becoming so expensive, and college is becoming more and more mandatory for those who wish to enter the job market (for networking as well)
I can vouch for the community college path, saved me THOUSANDS over my younger sister that went to a University all four years.
I've found most of the time when kids take out student loans it's for cost of living expenses as much as cost of college. My advice for someone would be to learn to live with less before taking out a student loan. If you need student loans to cover the cost of tuition fine but make sure you NEVER take private student loans.
Something really needs to be done with education. The major problem is you cannot educate yourself. I mean you can but it is not recognized by most people. Secondary education has become big business for a while now. Probably should not be a capitalistic thing but here we are.
Quote:Tuition keeps rising while grants keep disappearing and gov't loan rates keep climbing.
I had it good the first time around with scholarship money, but I've been considering going back for another degree and the potential cost/debt is the main deterrent for me.
Quote:I have three tips:
First - Avoid for profit universities like the University of Phoenix and Ashford University. They spend more on marketing than they do on teachers. And sadly it's working out pretty well for them. Though their enrollment numbers are starting to drop. A degree from such a college is often worthless. And their recruitment strategies are often despicable.
Second - Find if you qualify for financial aid that you don't have to pay back. A friend of mine started college, and she was paying it on her own. However she later found out she qualified for $1000/semester because her father was killed in action. There's all kinds of these loans available, it's worth it to look and see if you qualify for any.
Third - Consider starting at community college, and taking classes that will transfer with a plan in mind. That's what my wife did. She took several classes at community college because we couldn't afford to take out big loans. Eventually she transferred to a four year college, and graduated (and is now on her way to getting her masters after working as a teacher for 7 years) . It helped by having a plan, and knowing what would transfer and what would not. You want to go in with a plan to attend a four year college.
Of course this advice will only really help those who don't already have debt. It's unfortunate that our college system is becoming so expensive, and college is becoming more and more mandatory for those who wish to enter the job market (for networking as well)
Quote:I can vouch for the community college path, saved me THOUSANDS over my younger sister that went to a University all four years.
I've found most of the time when kids take out student loans it's for cost of living expenses as much as cost of college. My advice for someone would be to learn to live with less before taking out a student loan. If you need student loans to cover the cost of tuition fine but make sure you NEVER take private student loans.
Quote:Something really needs to be done with education. The major problem is you cannot educate yourself. I mean you can but it is not recognized by most people. Secondary education has become big business for a while now. Probably should not be a capitalistic thing but here we are.
I've kind of always thought of student loan debt as being a tool of the Government's and other credit agencies. Sort of like a 21st century version of indentured servitude. It is ridiculous that most, if not all jobs nowadays require a degree or some kind of advanced education.
I think everyone should go to community colleges more, get a degree from a trade school, or attend some kind of alternative college.
Quote:I've kind of always thought of student loan debt as being a tool of the Government's and other credit agencies. Sort of like a 21st century version of indentured servitude. It is ridiculous that most, if not all jobs nowadays require a degree or some kind of advanced education.
I think everyone should go to community colleges more, get a degree from a trade school, or attend some kind of alternative college.
It's possible the governments program to loan money has something to do with it. However I think it's more in regards to the universities ever increasing tuition on top of the outrageous costs of books. It is truly a big business.
In regards to requiring degrees look at it from this perspective. It's possible there are more people out of work with degrees than in the past due to jobs moving overseas or workplace efficiency increasing leading to workforce decreasing in addition to other factors like record number of people getting degrees. Hence there is more people with degrees looking for jobs so the employers can ask for them and likely get them.
I know very few would agree here but if community college was free or even cheaper than it is now it could force the more expensive universities to lower prices. That's just a theory though. Honestly though even if it did not one degree is better than another for most employers.
Quote:It's possible the governments program to loan money has something to do with it. However I think it's more in regards to the universities ever increasing tuition on top of the outrageous costs of books. It is truly a big business.
In regards to requiring degrees look at it from this perspective. It's possible there are more people out of work with degrees than in the past due to jobs moving overseas or workplace efficiency increasing leading to workforce decreasing in addition to other factors like record number of people getting degrees. Hence there is more people with degrees looking for jobs so the employers can ask for them and likely get them.
I know very few would agree here but if community college was free or even cheaper than it is now it could force the more expensive universities to lower prices. That's just a theory though. Honestly though even if it did not one degree is better than another for most employers.
The biggest thing that employers look for are actual skills. Not just degrees. That's why I like the idea of a liberal arts education a lot more than getting a degree from a big four year university. You learn critical thinking skills in things like math and science, and you're forced to read, write, and take an analytic approach to things. Of course, in some places it might be easier and more cost effective to go to a public university and get a degree if it really is that important. I know someone who has a law degree, but he has extensive knowledge of computers and cybersecurity. Less than 30% of people who major in any particular subject will actually get a job related to that field. I know that there are many more examples of this elsewhere.
Quote:It's possible the governments program to loan money has something to do with it. However I think it's more in regards to the universities ever increasing tuition on top of the outrageous costs of books. It is truly a big business.
In regards to requiring degrees look at it from this perspective. It's possible there are more people out of work with degrees than in the past due to jobs moving overseas or workplace efficiency increasing leading to workforce decreasing in addition to other factors like record number of people getting degrees. Hence there is more people with degrees looking for jobs so the employers can ask for them and likely get them.
I know very few would agree here but if community college was free or even cheaper than it is now it could force the more expensive universities to lower prices. That's just a theory though. Honestly though even if it did not one degree is better than another for most employers.
If apartments where free it would drive down the cost of owning a home.
Your on to something however that college is big business. I think if we look at what's happened to the education system you get a very fair picture of what crony capitalism looks like. The market creates a demand, government subsidies the demand eliminating the cost control of the market, prices rocket so government continues to subsidies more and prices increase, rinse lather and repeat.
Is anyone shocked 18-24 demographic has no problem signing onto 5000 a semester worth of loans, many times to simply fund their cost of living. Now you have generations that owe thousands to government, their dependent on government right out of the gate. Hmmmmmm
It's all by design, you want to fix education, get government as far away as possible from it.
In 20 years we'll be having this same discussion about healthcare.
Quote:In 20 years we'll be having this same discussion about healthcare.
That's assuming that this Country is still around in 20 years.
Quote:If apartments where free it would drive down the cost of owning a home.
Your on to something however that college is big business. I think if we look at what's happened to the education system you get a very fair picture of what crony capitalism looks like. The market creates a demand, government subsidies the demand eliminating the cost control of the market, prices rocket so government continues to subsidies more and prices increase, rinse lather and repeat.
Is anyone shocked 18-24 demographic has no problem signing onto 5000 a semester worth of loans, many times to simply fund their cost of living. Now you have generations that owe thousands to government, their dependent on government right out of the gate. Hmmmmmm
It's all by design, you want to fix education, get government as far away as possible from it.
In 20 years we'll be having this same discussion about healthcare.
Given the state of for-profit colleges, i dread to think what colleges would be like if we 'got the government out of education' (or other schools for that matter)
I think Libertarians (and conservative) put way too much faith into the "Free Market"
Quote:Given the state of for-profit colleges, i dread to think what colleges would be like if we 'got the government out of education' (or other schools for that matter)
I think Libertarians (and conservative) put way too much faith into the "Free Market"
Show me a sector the Free Market doesn't control cost, I'll show you a sector government subsidizes.
Quote:Given the state of for-profit colleges, i dread to think what colleges would be like if we 'got the government out of education' (or other schools for that matter)
I think Libertarians (and conservative) put way too much faith into the "Free Market"
Its not so much the concept of the state school system, I think that's great and a true benefit to our society. Its the government financing of post-secondary education where it gets sticky. Frankly, if you give away community college like the President proposed then all you do is further deflate the value of a high school diploma. When everyone can get an Associates Degree for free then it simply becomes the new high school diploma. The same goes for the rest of the degrees, when too many people acquire the credential then the credential is naturally devalued, especially when so many who shouldn't be anywhere near college matriculate and graduate. Access to college is great, but everyone shouldn't got to college and cost is one of the ways to weed those folks out.
Quote:Its not so much the concept of the state school system, I think that's great and a true benefit to our society. Its the government financing of post-secondary education where it gets sticky. Frankly, if you give away community college like the President proposed then all you do is further deflate the value of a high school diploma. When everyone can get an Associates Degree for free then it simply becomes the new high school diploma. The same goes for the rest of the degrees, when too many people acquire the credential then the credential is naturally devalued, especially when so many who shouldn't be anywhere near college matriculate and graduate. Access to college is great, but everyone shouldn't got to college and cost is one of the ways to weed those folks out.
Are you meaning governement backed student loans or the government themselves loaning the money? I have about 12 years of student loans to repay yet, (and I'm 47 years old) and they are all backed by the government...If I don't pay them to the banks/financial companies who actually lent me the money for student loans, the IRS will take my tax refund every year and send it to the student loan lenders...There are other ways the government will recoup the money on defaulted student loans as well...
I think student loan debt is becoming one of the biggest financial messes in history...Some companies do not do public student loans anymore, but they will do private loans, due to the fact that private student loans are based on your credit worthiness and are not backed by the government, as most student loans are given to 98% (when I started getting mine) of people applying for them without even having a job or credit score...Straight out of High School and beginning college the following term, nearly everyone qualified for the pell grant (or a portion of it) and public student loans...
Not for profit schools make every effort to make it easier and more comfortable for students to gain higher education, yet their standards are the exact same as for profit schools...They are accredited by the same groups...
I'm not so sure that an Associates Degree is really worth much in todays market...A Bachelors helps, but where the real difference comes in, is in a Masters...Now trade schools that specialize in one thing such as ITT, MIT, HVAC (Heating ventilation air conditioning), welding, Wyoming Tech et.al carry a lot of weight, but it's the same student loan program for those, unless the school has their own financing program...
Quote:Its not so much the concept of the state school system, I think that's great and a true benefit to our society. Its the government financing of post-secondary education where it gets sticky. Frankly, if you give away community college like the President proposed then all you do is further deflate the value of a high school diploma. When everyone can get an Associates Degree for free then it simply becomes the new high school diploma. The same goes for the rest of the degrees, when too many people acquire the credential then the credential is naturally devalued, especially when so many who shouldn't be anywhere near college matriculate and graduate. Access to college is great, but everyone shouldn't got to college and cost is one of the ways to weed those folks out.
I agree with you about not everyone should go to college. I do not think it should be a requirement but I do think it should be available to anyone who wants to learn.
I do not agree that it would become the new high school diploma. High school is in no way advanced or specialized in education. It is a basic primer of knowledge. Now an argument can be made the the way we teach the young or impart knowledge could use a total paradigm shift but college even at the community level is a pick and chose the course you want leading to a specialized degree down the road. I do not think providing this education for free in any way devalues it. What it would do is lower the barrier for entry.
Lowering the barrier for entry in regards to businesses is a battle cry of the right wing and it's a good one. How could it be bad for education?
Quote:I agree with you about not everyone should go to college. I do not think it should be a requirement but I do think it should be available to anyone who wants to learn.
I do not agree that it would become the new high school diploma. High school is in no way advanced or specialized in education. It is a basic primer of knowledge. Now an argument can be made the the way we teach the young or impart knowledge could use a total paradigm shift but college even at the community level is a pick and chose the course you want leading to a specialized degree down the road. I do not think providing this education for free in any way devalues it. What it would do is lower the barrier for entry.
Lowering the barrier for entry in regards to businesses is a battle cry of the right wing and it's a good one. How could it be bad for education?
It doesn't devalue education, it's the economic side I have issue with. We can't just magically make it free, what we would be doing is paying for it through taxation just like public education.
Now step back and look at how pathetic our public education system is and ask do we really want government to take over college the way it did public education?
Quote:It doesn't devalue education, it's the economic side I have issue with. We can't just magically make it free, what we would be doing is paying for it through taxation just like public education.
Now step back and look at how pathetic our public education system is and ask do we really want government to take over college the way it did public education?
I don't want the government to provide the education. I want the tuition to be covered in some manner. Weather that is taxation or or buy moving current budget funds into this or w/e. It can be done without impacting the curriculum currently being taught. Again all I am saying to do is lower the barrier for entry to advanced education. The huge college businesses can still make their money from the more wealthy or those willing to take on loans or w/e because they are to big to kill off completely right away similar to insurance companies.
In addition the fact that it's an economic issue at all is a failure of our country in general IMO. Educating the people is the best way to build the future of your country both domesticity and world wide. We have turned something that is in the best interest of the US into a business.
Quote:In addition the fact that it's an economic issue at all is a failure of our country in general IMO. Educating the people is the best way to build the future of your country both domesticity and world wide. We have turned something that is in the best interest of the US into a business.
Without education, how can we hope to uphold the tenants of democracy? An uneducated populous are much easier to control than an educated one.
I remember seeing a picture (can't post it here due to language) that basically says:
Student: hey government can i have some money to go to university?
UK Government: Sure here you go. You'll have to pay it back, but only when you're earning 21,000/year ($31,000 USD) and if you don't pay it off after 30 years we'll just write it off, don't worry about it man
scottish government: nah man just go to uni. we ain't gonna charge you
US government: no you gotta pay it yourself. up front. your parents have to save up from the moment you're born. good luck. you have six months after graduating to start paying loans so you better pray to god and jesus that you have a well paying job by then or prepared to be screwed for life.
Quote:I don't want the government to provide the education. I want the tuition to be covered in some manner. Weather that is taxation or or buy moving current budget funds into this or w/e. It can be done without impacting the curriculum currently being taught. Again all I am saying to do is lower the barrier for entry to advanced education. The huge college businesses can still make their money from the more wealthy or those willing to take on loans or w/e because they are to big to kill off completely right away similar to insurance companies.
In addition the fact that it's an economic issue at all is a failure of our country in general IMO. Educating the people is the best way to build the future of your country both domesticity and world wide. We have turned something that is in the best interest of the US into a business.
I understand what you're saying but I think a better avenue then would be to end high school at 16. Then at 16 let those that wish to attend these publicly funded community colleges get their AA degree before 18 or those that wish go to a trade school and learn a trade by the age 18. But make no mistake there is no public funding without effecting the curriculum, what the state pays for the state controls that's just the reality of how the world works.
Quote:Without education, how can we hope to uphold the tenants of democracy? An uneducated populous are much easier to control than an educated one.
I remember seeing a picture (can't post it here due to language) that basically says:
Student: hey government can i have some money to go to university?
UK Government: Sure here you go. You'll have to pay it back, but only when you're earning 21,000/year ($31,000 USD) and if you don't pay it off after 30 years we'll just write it off, don't worry about it man
scottish government: nah man just go to uni. we ain't gonna charge you
US government: no you gotta pay it yourself. up front. your parents have to save up from the moment you're born. good luck. you have six months after graduating to start paying loans so you better pray to god and jesus that you have a well paying job by then or prepared to be screwed for life.
No one likes the current system, no one. However student loans are not forced on individuals, the repayment terms are more forgiving than any other loan anyone can ever take in their lifetime,
Quote:No one likes the current system, no one. However student loans are not forced on individuals, the repayment terms are more forgiving than any other loan anyone can ever take in their lifetime,
Student loans are the most collectible type of debt there is.