Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:I agree with RJ...but we can't keep blowing 17 point leads.  That's not acceptable.

 

I still think that was by design. 

Its sad when you imagine how hyped we would all get if Marrone can win 7 games next year.


Exciting but sad.


Like streaking your mother in laws funeral.

I'm ok with the Marrone hiring, its not exciting but he seems like a good fit.  I'm a little worried about the coordinators not changing, it's basically saying that it was 90% Gus's fault and 10% Dave's fault with the Coughlin hiring.  Was really hoping for a little splash at least on the offensive side of the ball.

Not the "big splash" but probably the hire that will produce the best results.

And if it doesn't.....THEN Tom can tear it all up and start over.

Quote:But let's be honest, if he beats the Colts, does that really change anyones feelings towards the Marrone hire?

 

If he wins, do the people who don't like the hire suddenly love it?

 

If you do like the Marrone hire, do you like it even more?

 

Perhaps, had they gone in the tank and mailed it in I wouldn't be in favor of giving Marrone the job.

 

I doubt anything changes the mind of those who want to De-Gus the entire coaching staff (except Sullivan, the only coach universally valued).

 

It also reassures me Coughlin is comfortable enough with Marrone, and Caldwell for that matter, to accept responsibility for both. Trust, with Coughlin's insistence on accountability.

Quote:Not the "big splash" but probably the hire that will produce the best results.

And if it doesn't.....THEN Tom can tear it all up and start over.

 

 

Mike Smith was there to be picked up.  

 

Coughlin buying the groceries, and a HC that was a perennial playoff contender and turned around the Tampa defense from 23rd to 10th...

 

That was an option, you know...  That would have been a darn good combination...

I feel some type of way right now about the hire but it is what it is.  I just dont understand how Blake not learning a new system is the crutch for keeping Marrone If Blake is the problem.  It just seems that all of these excuses are started to cover for even bigger excuses by fans so whatever.  i'll just let be what it is and lol while eating my chips.  Jags till i die so regardless, i'll ride with my team.

Quote:I thought he left the saints before their Super Bowl run?


I have two concerns with Marrone:

•Just average overall records in NFL(17-18) and College (23-25)

•worried about Gus' previous culture still lurking in our locker rooms. Worried it's not a sweeping enough change to change players mindset.

Bill Bellichick was a .500 coach when he took the Pats job.

With TC and Marrone there will be accountability. Stupid penalties should be reduced. Instill pride. It's their job to perform. No cheerleader mentality. The fact that there's a head cheese guy who won two SBs as a coach. This should improve the team. TC won't be in the slow build mode, it's win...now! The talent he has. He will also convince FAs to come here that he wants.

The ones who really made out? The coach finding research company Khan hired. Thats like spending money on a dating site, and ending up with the ex.

Quote:Predictably, there is a sizeable portion of the fan base that disagrees with the decision to hire Marrone.  I saw a poll conducted by FCN that showed fans opposed Marrone being named head coach by a 70%-30% margin.  Given the disastrous 15 wins since 2013, I can understand fans wanting a clean sweep from the Bradley era, and hiring  Marrone flies directly in the face of that objective.  Furthermore, since his presence on the staff did not avoid that result, many feel Marrone not only wasn't part of the solution, but part of the problem.  Many feel Marrone is not the guy who will fix the QB position.  Ultimately, the view is that the hiring of Marrone was an endorsement of the status quo by a content and complacent ownership.

 

However, I submit that the hiring of Marrone is not mere capitulation to mediocrity and not the path of least resistance to further failure.  I maintain Marrone's inferior position on the coaching staff does not necessarily translate into him being an inferior caliber coach.  I contend Marrone's familiarity with the players here, including Bortles, is a positive factor for this team, and overall, he will prove to be a good hire.

 

One of the biggest, tacit arguments is that since Marrone was on the coaching staff of a team that failed miserably, he is ill equipped to be a head coach for this same team with the goal of making them winners.  There is historical evidence that oft unstated premise does not hold true.  There have been plenty of good coaches that have worked under head coaches with lesser ability and languished on bad teams, who wound up coaching teams with a level of success that far outpaced their former bosses.  The early 1980s saw Ray Perkins coach the New York Giants to a 23-34 record between 1979-1982.  With a team that performed so lethargically under his tenure, you would think it was poorly coached from top to bottom.  However, there were a couple of assistants under Perkins named Bill Parcells and Bill Belichick.  Ray Rhodes coached the Philadelphia Eagles in the years before Andy Reid got there, between 1995-1998.  His first two years, the Eagles finished a respectable 10-6.  However, those last two years, the Eagles finished 6-9-1 and 3-13.  His coaching staff included a guy named Jon Gruden, who wound up coaching the 2002 Bucs to a Super Bowl championship.  In 2006, Brad Childress coached the Minnesota Vikings to a 6-10 record.  His defensive coordinator was Mike Tomlin, who has coached the Steelers to a World championship and another Super Bowl appearance.  The point is a good coach can be in a bad situation and still remain a good coach.  I think that was the situation here with Marrone.  In his two game stint as interim coach, the team performed better under him-even splitting the last two games-than it did in any two game stretch under Bradley.  The players spoke openly about how different things were here under Marrone.  It's entirely possible he can coach better performance out of these guys.

 

Another concern is that Marrone won't be able or willing to fix the QB position because he was on the coaching staff last year.  I submit Marrone and Hackett represent the best chance to fix Bortles and maximize his ability.  Though fans cringe at the idea of continuity from 15-49, some continuity is what Bortles needs.  Bortles has had three (3) different offensive coordinators (Fisch, Olsen, Hackett) in his three seasons as a Jaguar.  Had we brought in a guy entirely unfamiliar with him, he would have to learn a 4th system completely cold.  With Marrone and Hackett having worked with Bortles, they can make the transition to the new offense easier for him.  They already have an idea of his strengths and weaknesses, and they know the terminology of the offense Bortles has run these last two years.  In the two games Marrone coached, the offense averaged 25 ppg.  Bortles looked sharp and with potential.  Allen Robinson returned to the offense, and it was productive minus Allen Hurns, Julius Thomas, and Ivory.  When Marrone and Hackett introduce their playbooks to Bortles, they can easier explain and translate the differences to Bortles, and call plays tailored to his strengths.  If you think they will be too loyal to Bortles, there is nothing about the hiring of Marrone that precludes bringing in a QB to compete with him now or in the future if Bortles should falter.  It's not likely the Jaguars would draft a QB high this year anyway, whether a new coach came in or not, and the free agent class is underwhelming.  A new coach other than Marrone may well have played with Bortles at QB this year anyway. 

 

Will Marrone need a strong defensive coordinator?  Sure.  But his past shows a willingness to bring an established an successful guy to fill that role.  In Buffalo, he brought along Jim Schwartz as defensive coordinator.  There is nothing to indicate he would be averse to bringing in another solid guy to run the other side of the ball.  Besides, any coach that comes in with a specialty on one side or another will need a solid coordinator on the other side.  Had Smith been the guy, we all know he'd need a strong OC.  Had Shanahan or McDaniels been the choice, they would all need good defensive coordinators.

 

At the end of the day, the Jaguars hired a guy who has experience on a Super Bowl winning coaching staff with the Saints, has produced a winning season for a franchise not used to them in recent years without anything resembling a franchise QB, and has gotten the best out of Bortles this year.  There are signs he will implement the discipline this young team needs, and can draw upon TC's expertise in assembling a staff.

 

I think he deserves the patience from this fan base, though admittedly it is in short supply after the past nine years.

Great take Bullseye.  As always you are a voice of reason.  

A few thoughts to ponder and contributing factors....

1. We have several top players who I believe will perform really well next year. Regardless of who coaches.

2. Marone appeared to have a much higher football IQ than Gus.

Marone gets it, isn't afraid to instill discipline ( locked a guy out of a meeting, no ear phones in meetings, no food) and this should make everyone who under performed step up.

3. It appears we have kept both coordinators and it remains to be seen what the defense will look like scheme wise, But we were top 10 last year.

So even if the defense looks apples to apples. We're good there.

Offense looked light years better in two games under marone next year should be more Improvement as he and Hackett will have an entire offseason to work on it.

We're drafting what 4th every round?

Caldwell will get at least one starter who will contribute next year.

Another toy for Marone.

I get it that a lot of this is unproven.

But it's solid rational stuff.

Imho there's no way we're not substantially better next year.

Add to that we have TC holding basically a big hammer over Marone and DC's heads if they get stupid.

If we aren't better next year, substantially better...

I'm sure I'll hear it from 80,000 people just like I did this year.

Gus apparently was a problem.

Marone was definitely a part of that team and contributed to our failures to some degree.

The thing is...

Noone knows what next year will bring.

My opinion is that we SHOULD see a substantial marked improvement on offense and about the same performance on Defense with quite possibly more take aways.

That being said...

All of us jaguars fans hopes hinge on basically one man's success.

Blake Bortles.

He lays an egg first few games next year?

I believe Doug will pull him.

He did it in Buffalo and still won I believe more games in that year than Gus Bradley won as our coach in 4 years.

There's your reason for hope.

Marone as our HC makes a ton of sense imho

Here are some quotes from Marrone from the press conference.

 

Quote: 

“I didn’t want to come in here and make major adjustments in the last two weeks, so we just made some subtle adjustments to start laying the foundation down for the team,” Marrone said. “Not that I knew that I would be here, but just some things that would probably help when they come back – whoever the next coach was going to be.”

Marrone during an appearance on Jaguars.com Live shortly after the press conference said several players had told him after the season they hoped he got the job. He joked that he told them, “be careful what you wish for,” and during the press conference he made it a point to send a message to Jaguars players that the future culture would be about “high expectation … a high standard for our players and our coaches and what they should be doing.”

Marrone said though he was unable to implement his entire approach in two weeks as interim head coach, he did make some changes that he believed beneficial at the time. The Jaguars turned in two of their better performance of the season in his two games as coach.

“I think that our players, when we made those changes, were outstanding with it,” Marrone said. “I do believe they know what our expectations are.”

(Emphasis added)

 

These quotes illustrate what I was trying to point out with my original post.

 

Marrone could have had differences with Caldwell Bradley in the way things were done, but due to the comparative positions, he could not implement them.

 

I can imagine once TC and Marrone put their stamp completely on the franchise, just how good this group could be.

Quote:Predictably, there is a sizeable portion of the fan base that disagrees with the decision to hire Marrone.  I saw a poll conducted by FCN that showed fans opposed Marrone being named head coach by a 70%-30% margin.  Given the disastrous 15 wins since 2013, I can understand fans wanting a clean sweep from the Bradley era, and hiring  Marrone flies directly in the face of that objective.  Furthermore, since his presence on the staff did not avoid that result, many feel Marrone not only wasn't part of the solution, but part of the problem.  Many feel Marrone is not the guy who will fix the QB position.  Ultimately, the view is that the hiring of Marrone was an endorsement of the status quo by a content and complacent ownership.

 

<--many point snipped-->

 

You make a lot of good points.  I think that the upset comes from the fact that a majority of the fan base is dumb.  That's not a knock against the Jags fan base, football fans in general are pretty dumb.  They can't see past the surface of things to understand that there are different parts that make up the whole.  Smart fans like you and I (and three or four other on the forum) know better which is why we know not to write off Marrone out of hand.  And of course Coughlin will have something to say with what goes on at field level too.  Keep the faith bro!

With Coughlin in charge , he'll do good or be gone. I'm with him until he proves different

great post bullseye.

Quote:Here are some quotes from Marrone from the press conference.

 

(Emphasis added)

 

These quotes illustrate what I was trying to point out with my original post.

 

Marrone could have had differences with Caldwell in the way things were done, but due to the comparative positions, he could not implement them.

 

I can imagine once TC and Marrone put their stamp completely on the franchise, just how good this group could be.

And will ultimately make Caldwells job in the nfl,  better as well.  

Quote:And will ultimately make Caldwells job in the nfl,  better as well.  

I meant Bradley in the post to which you replied.  Not Caldwell.

 

I fixed the post.

Quote:I meant Bradley in the post to which you replied.  Not Caldwell.

 

I fixed the post.

okay

Quote:A few thoughts to ponder and contributing factors....

1. We have several top players who I believe will perform really well next year. Regardless of who coaches.

2. Marone appeared to have a much higher football IQ than Gus.

Marone gets it, isn't afraid to instill discipline ( locked a guy out of a meeting, no ear phones in meetings, no food) and this should make everyone who under performed step up.

3. It appears we have kept both coordinators and it remains to be seen what the defense will look like scheme wise, But we were top 10 last year.

So even if the defense looks apples to apples. We're good there.

Offense looked light years better in two games under marone next year should be more Improvement as he and Hackett will have an entire offseason to work on it.

We're drafting what 4th every round?

Caldwell will get at least one starter who will contribute next year.

Another toy for Marone.

I get it that a lot of this is unproven.

But it's solid rational stuff.

Imho there's no way we're not substantially better next year.

Add to that we have TC holding basically a big hammer over Marone and DC's heads if they get stupid.

If we aren't better next year, substantially better...

I'm sure I'll hear it from 80,000 people just like I did this year.

Gus apparently was a problem.

Marone was definitely a part of that team and contributed to our failures to some degree.

The thing is...

Noone knows what next year will bring.

My opinion is that we SHOULD see a substantial marked improvement on offense and about the same performance on Defense with quite possibly more take aways.

That being said...

All of us jaguars fans hopes hinge on basically one man's success.

Blake Bortles.

He lays an egg first few games next year?

I believe Doug will pull him.

He did it in Buffalo and still won I believe more games in that year than Gus Bradley won as our coach in 4 years.

There's your reason for hope.

Marone as our HC makes a ton of sense imho

Agreed.

 

As for the potential benching of Bortles, I don't think it'll happen, because I think Bortles should thrive under Marrone.

 

But if he doesn't, a benching might be more likely than it was in 2016 because I think he'll have a better backup than Henne.

<a class="" href='https://twitter.com/APMarkLong'>Mark Long ‏@APMarkLong </a> <a class="" href='https://twitter.com/APMarkLong/status/819565172507308032' title="10:22 AM - 12 Jan 2017">Jan 12</a>

<p class="" style="font-size:16px;">Jaguars coach Doug Marrone says he's still working to put staff together. I heard Tom Coughlin has final say in each decision


 


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