Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:Hey, I'm just illustrating a certain sect of posters on this board with what you quoted.

You've done this "illustration" more than enough times.

Quote:You've done this "illustration" more than enough times.

 

Well, theres more than enough instances of "that" type of fan on here, too. 

I see what they're doing with Bortles as very similar to what GB did with Aaron Rodgers...and potential similar...potential. When Bortles takes the field he will know the playbook by heart, his mechanics will be completely reworked to the point where they're muscle memory and his accuracy and arm strength, which are both already more than good enough, will be notably improved, and he'll have instant chemistry with the receivers.

I said this in the thread I made a few days ago, but I expect 2015 Bortles to have the smoothness in the pocket and mechanical polish of Bridgewater, as he already has what you can't teach which is natural pocket presence, an arm similar in talent to Aaron Rodgers once the mechanical issues are flushed out (i.e. not a canon but a good mix of accuracy, touch, and strength),all wrapped into a Big Ben sized body that has great straight away speed for his size.

Honestly the more I think about it, the more I see Bortles as being a Big Ben sized version of Aaron Rodgers in our offensive system.

Quote:An fMRI study would be really interesting on athletic performances based in the wait and sit or start right away approach. Sadly, I don't think it'd be a practical study.

It's a mixed bag. There was an article on Grantland about it. It's impossible to settle this because we will never know if Rodgers would have been good right out of the gate. Just like we will never know if someone can be ruined by starting to early. Maybe they just sucked.


Also not sure why some make the case like the right answer is to sit them when there are examples working each way and failing each way. The biggest factor is the player and his environment. I like ours and think Blake will have success regardless of how he is developed.


Everyone knows I prefer to play the rookie. I'm not right and I'm not wrong. It's just a preference.


As an incoming freshman in high school I got thrown into a varsity game at a basketball camp. Played against some team who won state the previous year and I got destroyed (double digit turnovers). It didn't ruin anything for me. I realize it's not the best example as the jump to the nfl and playing seniors in high school is way different. Just saying people learn in different ways and I always preferred to learn by playing.

Quote:I see what they're doing with Bortles as very similar to what GB did with Aaron Rodgers...and potential similar...potential. When Bortles takes the field he will know the playbook by heart, his mechanics will be completely reworked to the point where they're muscle memory and his accuracy and arm strength, which are both already more than good enough, will be notably improved, and he'll have instant chemistry with the receivers.


I said this in the thread I made a few days ago, but I expect 2015 Bortles to have the smoothness in the pocket and mechanical polish of Bridgewater, as he already has what you can't teach which is natural pocket presence, an arm similar in talent to Aaron Rodgers once the mechanical issues are flushed out (i.e. not a canon but a good mix of accuracy, touch, and strength),all wrapped into a Big Ben sized body that has great straight away speed for his size.


Honestly the more I think about it, the more I see Bortles as being a Big Ben sized version of Aaron Rodgers in our offensive system.

 

If we can get anywhere close to that, this franchise hit a home run. 

Quote:It's a mixed bag. There was an article on Grantland about it. It's impossible to settle this because we will never know if Rodgers would have been good right out of the gate. Just like we will never know if someone can be ruined by starting to early. Maybe they just sucked.


Also not sure why some make the case like the right answer is to sit them when there are examples working each way and failing each way. The biggest factor is the player and his environment. I like ours and think Blake will have success regardless of how he is developed.


Everyone knows I prefer to play the rookie. I'm not right and I'm not wrong. It's just a preference.


As an incoming freshman in high school I got thrown into a varsity game at a basketball camp. Played against some team who won state the previous year and I got destroyed (double digit turnovers). It didn't ruin anything for me. I realize it's not the best example as the jump to the nfl and playing seniors in high school is way different. Just saying people learn in different ways and I always preferred to learn by playing.

your right and even more so I think it comes town to the players personality. Some players that are throw into the fire have there confidence destroyed. Others thrive. While I think Bortles would do ok I'd certainly rather sit him then throw him out there with the Inexperience that this team currently has.

Quote:your right and even more so I think it comes town to the players personality. Some players that are throw into the fire have there confidence destroyed. Others thrive. While I think Bortles would do ok I'd certainly rather sit him then throw him out there with the Inexperience that this team currently has.

 

I think Bortles would be fine starting right away.  I think he'll be better in the long run by sitting for as long as possible. 

Let's not overlook the experience he will get as the #2 in the preaeason. Even if defenses are running base schemes, he will still be facing NFL talent.

Quote:I see what they're doing with Bortles as very similar to what GB did with Aaron Rodgers...and potential similar...potential. When Bortles takes the field he will know the playbook by heart, his mechanics will be completely reworked to the point where they're muscle memory and his accuracy and arm strength, which are both already more than good enough, will be notably improved, and he'll have instant chemistry with the receivers.


I said this in the thread I made a few days ago, but I expect 2015 Bortles to have the smoothness in the pocket and mechanical polish of Bridgewater, as he already has what you can't teach which is natural pocket presence, an arm similar in talent to Aaron Rodgers once the mechanical issues are flushed out (i.e. not a canon but a good mix of accuracy, touch, and strength),all wrapped into a Big Ben sized body that has great straight away speed for his size.


Honestly the more I think about it, the more I see Bortles as being a Big Ben sized version of Aaron Rodgers in our offensive system.

 

Question.  Why does everyone keep bringing up Rodgers?  Is anyone suggesting Bortles sit for 3 years??  And how long does Aaron Rodgers sit if Chad Henne is the starter?  Aaron Rodgers isn't remotely close to the Jaguars situation right now.  The Aaron Rodgers situation is having a hall of fame QB and drafting another in the first round.  The Patriots are attempting to do what GB did, not us, but they had to settle for a 2nd rounder. 

Quote:Question.  Why does everyone keep bringing up Rodgers?  Is anyone suggesting Bortles sit for 3 years??  And how long does Aaron Rodgers sit if Chad Henne is the starter?  Aaron Rodgers isn't remotely close to the Jaguars situation right now.  The Aaron Rodgers situation is having a hall of fame QB and drafting another in the first round.  The Patriots are attempting to do what GB did, not us, but they had to settle for a 2nd rounder. 

 

People keep fixating on Henne.  In all honesty, Bortles progression, and when he starts has nothing to do with Henne.  The similarity with Rodgers is the fact that he sat.  Nobody is suggesting Bortles sit for 3 years.  Nor are they trying to portray Henne as Favre.

Quote:I think Bortles would be fine starting right away. I think he'll be better in the long run by sitting for as long as possible.

I think he'd be ok but why put him in that situation? So much youth.

Quote:Question.  Why does everyone keep bringing up Rodgers? 

 

Because people keep asking how a QB can possibly progress if he isn't thrown to the field in games right away.

 

There's a clear answer to the question staring us in the face.  

Quote:  There was an article on Grantland about it. It's impossible to settle this because we will never know if Rodgers would have been good right out of the gate 

 

If you watched Rodgers play in the preseasons in his first couple of years, there wasn't much question that he was in no way ready to play that early.  

Quote:Are you suggesting the reason Newton hasn't got any better is because he has started from day 1?

 

 

Yes, I'm saying if he had better mechanics he would complete a higher percentage of passes and wouldn't be so wildly inconsistent.   It's really not a difficult concept to grasp, even though it seems to have to be hammered into some people's skulls with a sledge hammer.   You can't work on your mechanics when you're putting in 60-70 hours a week in game preperation for every upcoming opponent as a starter.    Your obligation ans priorities as a starter are to lead your teammates who are laying it out on the line to a win every week, not how high you're holding your elbow or how you're setting your feet properly on a 5 step play action drop.    

 

Newton's completion% is a whopping 1% higher than his rookie year three years ago and his QB passer rating has improved a stagger 3.5 points from where it was as a rookie.  .  (of course his YPA is drastically lower, which shows almost any improvement in completion% can be explained with throwing more dinks and dunks).  Luckily for him, that Panthers defense has grown by leaps and bounds in those 3 years and doesn't ask him to carry many games.    

 

Would you be happy if Bortles was still throwing 61 comp% after 3rd years as a starter with no discernible year to year progress?   I certainly wouldn't. 

Quote:Sure, he's progressed.  His completion% is a whopping 1% higher than his rookie year three years ago and his QB passer rating has improved a stagger 3.5 points from where it was as a rookie.  .  (of course his YPA is drastically lower, but we won't talk about that).  Luckily for him, that Panthers defense has grown by leaps and bounds in those 3 years and doesn't ask him to carry many games.  

 

 Would you be happy if Bortles was still throwing 61 comp% after  3rd years as a starter?   I certainly wouldn't. 

 

Cam's test will come this year with the troubles they're facing at WR. 

Quote:He completely reworked his footwork and throwing mechanics so that he became a much stronger and more accurate thrower.  He significantly improved his lower body strength to allow him to better drive the ball (he was not a hard thrower coming out of college).   He learned the weekly work preparation and nuances of  film study, game planning and game plan installment needed in game week preparation.   He learned the strengths, weaknesses and tendencies of players/coaches around the league, particularly becoming familiar with division opponents he would face 6 times a year.    He completely learned the terminology and progressions of McCarthy's offense backwards and forwards so it was second nature by the time he took the field.  And he spent time daily throwing ot his WRs to develop timing and chemistry in practice.  

 

As opposed to being a starting QB, where you put in 60-70 hours a week just trying to implement the gameplan and preperation for the current week's opponent.  

 

 

what? 

 

......"<b>POSITIVES:</b> Athletic passer with the physical skills and mental intangibles needed to lead a franchise at the next level. Quickly sets up in the pocket, sells ball fakes and technically very sound. Poised under the rush, steps up to avoid defenders and works to keep the play alive. Patient, buys time in the pocket and waits for receivers to come free. Does an excellent job with his reads and natural looking off the safety. Does not make mental errors and throws the ball away rather than toss the errant pass. Times the short and intermediate throws well, as receivers rarely wait for the ball out of their breaks. Outstanding vision and immediately spots the open receiver. Possesses a quick release, live arm and zips the outs or gets the ball downfield. Throws with touch. Sits in the pocket and takes a big hit in order to get the pass off. Fleet-footed and picks up yardage with his legs when necessary.

Quote:....at least 1 year would have been smart. 
 

 

If McCown didn't



And Garrard didn't have a broken back and hefty contract, maybe he would have sat a year.

 

(but would he have been any good?)

 

And who plays if Henne goes down in the preseason?

Quote:If you watched Rodgers play in the preseasons in his first couple of years, there wasn't much question that he was in no way ready to play that early.  

 

Rodgers is garbage every preseason. its the preseason. it doesnt matter. do you know who aaron rodgers is?

Quote:If McCown didn't



And Garrard didn't have a broken back and hefty contract, maybe he would have sat a year.

 

(but would he have been any good?)

 

And who plays if Henne goes down in the preseason?

 

Maybe Gabbert would have panned out had he been able to sit as originally planned.  Del Rio caved to pressure almost instantly because he was concerned about keeping his job.  In the end, it was a series of stupid decisions that cost him his job, this being one of them. 

 

If Henne goes down in the preseason, and the team doesn't look to sign another veteran QB, then it's between Stanzi and Bortles.  As unfortunate at it would be for his development, Bortles should win that battle. 

Quote:Rodgers is garbage every preseason. its the preseason. it doesnt matter. do you know who aaron rodgers is?

it matters in the sense if mechanics and footwork. Not so much in the stats department but there is a lot to learn from those games.