Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:So...you maintain that he is a "once in a generation" player worthy of paying a coach under the table in order to secure the first pick and draft him first overall.


...and for the record, I think most of us would have more respect for you if you just said something like, "Yeah guys, I may have got a little carried away. I think he's going to be good, but my original stance was probably a bit much."


As it stands, you are currently distancing yourself from your original stance through your posts, but you are too damn arrogant to admit it.


Just a reminder: you banged the drum and preached to us all, for weeks, that Teddy was a surefire franchise changing QB on the level of Manning and Elway. And you chastised and LOL'd at those of us who disagreed. You even created a deep reaching conspiracy worthy of an a Oliver Stone screenplay, in which Texans owner paid his lameduck head coach some fall money to purposely lose games in order to acquire said franchise changing "once in a generation" QB.


And by your stubborn defiance, we are all to assume you still believe all of that of which you were so adamantly convinced about?


When I suggesting 6 months ago that you Houston would not select Teddy 1st overall and you condescendingly LOL'd at me until you dribbled pee down the front of your sweatpants- Is it possible that me declaration wasn't nearly as hilarious as you originally had thought?


C'mon TMD, answer the questions. It's called humility. It won't kill ya.

 

I honestly still think he's going top 10 - and he's still number one on my QB wish list. I think he'll be a franchise QB as long as he can stay healthy. I honestly believe that had he had the physique's of the Mannings/ Luck's/ Aikmans/ that he would more universally be seen in similar light as them. But the slight frame is probably more important of a factor than I first considered. 

 

As for the Texans....I maintain that they did not enter the season wishing to tank - unlike Indy....but by the time their season withered away to about 2-6, at that point it was tank for that first pick. I thought Bridgewater would be the end game for them, but now it appears they will go elsewhere. But getting the 1st pick was what they wanted from about midseason onward. That became obvious when they had a chance to re-insert Schaub as starter after he played well vs the Jags in relief duty, but instead they went back to Keenum, IMO, because they knew he'd get their desired result at that point of the season, - an "L". 

 

But, yes, I probably did go a little bit overboard during the Nov-Jan posting about Bridge. Prisoner of the moment. 

Quote:I honestly still think he's going top 10 - and he's still number one on my QB wish list. I think he'll be a franchise QB as long as he can stay healthy. I honestly believe that had he had the physique's of the Mannings/ Luck's/ Aikmans/ that he would more universally be seen in similar light as them. But the slight frame is probably more important of a factor than I first considered.


As for the Texans....I maintain that they did not enter the season wishing to tank - unlike Indy....but by the time their season withered away to about 2-6, at that point it was tank for that first pick. I thought Bridgewater would be the end game for them, but now it appears they will go elsewhere. But getting the 1st pick was what they wanted from about midseason onward. That became obvious when they had a chance to re-insert Schaub as starter after he played well vs the Jags in relief duty, but instead they went back to Keenum, IMO, because they knew he'd get their desired result at that point of the season, - an "L".


But, yes, I probably did go a little bit overboard during the Nov-Jan posting about Bridge. Prisoner of the moment.

A very respectable response.

Thanks for addressing.

Quote:A very respectable response.

Thanks for addressing.

I concur. If this TMD shows up more often it will be a lot better. I understand you get a lot of hate TMD and some of its not warranted but if you just show some humility and respect in your posts a lot of that will fade away. Your reputation has created a bit of a problem for you though.

IMO TMD I don't think the texans were tanking at 2-6 but rather trying to see if Keenum had a future in Houston. I think we may just happen to disagree there though.

I think the guy has a future in the NFL if two things happen:

 

A. He is given time to develop his game some more and transition to the NFL game.

 

B. He spends a season or two minimum growing physically. He needs to bulk up to handle NFL caliber play, IMO.

 

Such a player doesn't warrant a first round pick in my eyes. Second or third, sure, but not a first rounder. That's where you get your plug and play guys, and I just don't see him as that. Could he become that? Sure, but he's not right now.

If we can somehow walk away from this draft with Watkins and then either trade up for Teddy or he falls to us, this will be the best draft ever.


Watkins, Teddy, BA pass rusher and guard/center with our first 4 picks

Quote:Giving me an opportunity so you can throw either answer back up in my face. Thats how this board operates. There is no right answer. No matter what I say I'll be bashed.

This is good stuff. You love trying to pin others down so you can do the exact same thing. You taunted anyone who didn't agree with your propping up Bridgewater as a once in a generation player on par with Luck.


If you don't like having things thrown back in your face, perhaps you should evaluate your approach. Calling you the Gene Smith of the message board is accurate because you think you're the smartest guy on the board. That mindset served Gene well.


You're not always right.

Quote:So...you maintain that he is a "once in a generation" player worthy of paying a coach under the table in order to secure the first pick and draft him first overall.

...and for the record, I think most of us would have more respect for you if you just said something like, "Yeah guys, I may have got a little carried away. I think he's going to be good, but my original stance was probably a bit much."

As it stands, you are currently distancing yourself from your original stance through your posts, but you are too damn arrogant to admit it.

Just a reminder: you banged the drum and preached to us all, for weeks, that Teddy was a surefire franchise changing QB on the level of Manning and Elway. And you chastised and LOL'd at those of us who disagreed. You even created a deep reaching conspiracy worthy of an a Oliver Stone screenplay, in which Texans owner paid his lameduck head coach some fall money to purposely lose games in order to acquire said franchise changing "once in a generation" QB.

And by your stubborn defiance, we are all to assume you still believe all of that of which you were so adamantly convinced about?

When I suggesting 6 months ago that you Houston would not select Teddy 1st overall and you condescendingly LOL'd at me until you dribbled pee down the front of your sweatpants- Is it possible that me declaration wasn't nearly as hilarious as you originally had thought?

C'mon TMD, answer the questions. It's called humility. It won't kill ya.

Humility? Good luck. Don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen.

Quote:If we can somehow walk away from this draft with Watkins and then either trade up for Teddy or he falls to us, this will be the best draft ever.

Watkins, Teddy, BA pass rusher and guard/center with our first 4 picks

On paper. On the field, we'll see.

Quote:I think the guy has a future in the NFL if two things happen:

 

A. He is given time to develop his game some more and transition to the NFL game.

 

B. He spends a season or two minimum growing physically. He needs to bulk up to handle NFL caliber play, IMO.

 

Such a player doesn't warrant a first round pick in my eyes. Second or third, sure, but not a first rounder. That's where you get your plug and play guys, and I just don't see him as that. Could he become that? Sure, but he's not right now.

Agreed on all counts. Unfortunately, this is the same NFL that regularly overdrafts guys hoping to hit big.


That being said, a 2nd rounder for him would be acceptable if he lands in the right situation where both A and B above are a possibility. Jacksonville might actually be a good fit for him.

Can someone answer me this? What QB has been crushed or been unsuccessful in the NFL due to being " small " ?

Quote:A very respectable response.

Thanks for addressing.

 

...except for the whole "prisoner of the moment" cop-out and refusal to own the statements.

 

Just like the "I was drunk" sidesteps of years past.  There's always an excuse.

Quote:Can someone answer me this? What QB has been crushed or been unsuccessful in the NFL due to being " small " ?

 

There was discussion about this on the radio the other day.

 

There's a saying among QBs that the hits that don't knock you out of the game are the worst.

 

Why?

 

You wear down.  Not just over the course of a game, but also the season.

 

If the kid is handicapped out of the starting gate (such as being required to wear a throwing glove to grip a football properly,) you're not talking a very high ceiling.  If he can't hold weight during the college season (all the way down to 188 for a guy 6'2",) it certainly isn't getting easier for him with a longer grueling season in the NFL.

Quote: 

Such a player doesn't warrant a first round pick in my eyes. Second or third, sure, but not a first rounder. That's where you get your plug and play guys, and I just don't see him as that. Could he become that? Sure, but he's not right now.

 

Ideally, I would completely agree.  But I see pretty much all the QBs in a similar light.  Bortles could be very good but isn't ready right now either, and you could say the same about Manziel. 

 

The QBs nowadays get overdrafted.  Their true value is probably in the 2nd round, as they may not be "plug and play" kind of players from day 1, but they'll get drafted in round 1 anyway.

Quote:There was discussion about this on the radio the other day.

 

There's a saying among QBs that the hits that don't knock you out of the game are the worst.

 

Why?

 

You wear down.  Not just over the course of a game, but also the season.

 

If the kid is handicapped out of the starting gate (such as being required to wear a throwing glove to grip a football properly,) you're not talking a very high ceiling.  If he can't hold weight during the college season (all the way down to 188 for a guy 6'2",) it certainly isn't getting easier for him with a longer grueling season in the NFL.

 

Completely agree here.  Bridgewater does have physical limitations that are not worthy of being picked in the top 5.  

 

I think he can and probably will develop into a very solid starter, but giving him a year to get physically acclimated to the game would be good.

 

I would love to have him a Jaguar...but not at #3.  

Quote:There was discussion about this on the radio the other day.

 

There's a saying among QBs that the hits that don't knock you out of the game are the worst.

 

Why?

 

You wear down.  Not just over the course of a game, but also the season.

 

If the kid is handicapped out of the starting gate (such as being required to wear a throwing glove to grip a football properly,) you're not talking a very high ceiling.  If he can't hold weight during the college season (all the way down to 188 for a guy 6'2",) it certainly isn't getting easier for him with a longer grueling season in the NFL.

 

I can't say I disagree with the premise (or what I take to be the premise) behind this.  However he took some good hits in college and never missed any time.  The most memorable one was in the game against Florida.  The kid got his bell rung.  He played on and won the game. 

 

His weight isn't as big of a detractor to me as it is others.  I wonder how much NFL teams truly weigh (no pun intended) that factor with a QB prospect?  I could also argue that it could also be easier for him to hold weight with an NFL trainer/nutritionist/strength coach.  I would be ecstatic for this team to be able to trade down considerably and still draft Teddy/Johnny.  

 

I can't wait until May 8th win all this will be figured out.

Quote:I seriously can't wait for teddy to ball out in this league and then all of these analyst who shot him down because of a pro day hop on his bandwagon again

This.

Yeah this is to hilarious lol? This is the time of year we are in. There is some team who wants the guy bad enough to destroy his draft stock and get him in the later rounds. I hope it's us doing it cause is love to get Teddy in the 7th round lol.


Seriously if you've watched enough drafts and been around football long enough you could tell what's going on. This happens every year. Good players get tore down (Bridgewater) and bad to mediocre players get built up (Garoppolo and Bortle). Full blown NFL darft season

Pirk's absolute refusal to acknowledge jaw surgery requiring a liquid diet as a very strong reason for dropping to 188 is bewildering to me. It's almost like he's only been cherry picking stats and quotes this whole offseason...oh wait. 

 

He played at 222 lbs during his Sophomore year. and he had already gained a lot of it back by the combine. He will be in the 220-230 range in short order and the size concerns will be an afterthought. 

 

His frame is no more of a worry than it should be for Carr, Fales, Manziel, McCarron, Morris, Murray...or Aaron Rodgers, Eli, Kaepernick, Geno, Glennon, etc.  

 

None of these QBs are top 10 talents. Some of them do have 1st round talent and ability but in all honestly any QB taken in the first round will probably be overdrafted depending on what team they are taken by.....

 

For those complaining about "PRO DAY" (which I never cared about) and trust the tape....No offense the in accuracy and duck passes show up on take as well. One game definitely comes to mind to me immediately:

 

Houston - http://draftbreakdown.com/video/teddy-br...ston-2013/

 

:02 - Curl route, not the type of zip you want to see on that ball with that type of tight coverage and it is high. Better catch than throw

 

:15 - Curl route, great placement against tight coverage. However, needs to have that tight spiral in NFL, too wobbly of a ball

 

:32 - good read and and pass, pretty much perfectly executed by QB

 

:43 - routes taken away, good scramble

 

:58 - looks deep first then takes curl route to sideline. I love the read, but hate the wobbly ball on the throw

 

1:12 - receiver slips...another curl route

 

1:23 - dump off curl route, great read as man was wide open, and got rid of ball just before taking contact

 

1:42 - QB roll out to curl route, love the pass as it shows velocity and excellent ball placement.

 

1:52 - great placement on slant route with the velocity you want to see

 

2:05 - sack...never had a chance

 

2:15 - drop on screen pass. Pass didn't have good zip and looks a little wobbly as well,  but that was on receiver

 

2:30 - curl route, but ball again lacks velocity and that ball is very wobbly, definitely feel it is a mechanical issue that can be fixed

 

2:46 sack...again never had a chance

 

2:57 great step up inside pocket....took dump off as I a guessing nothing was available deeper. Given they are up a TD, where they are on the field, and it was 3rd and 23 good play to pick up a lot of lost yardage before punting.

 

3:10 - great playaction set up to deep curl route, but I don't like the footwork when he releases the ball. It is a be reason I feel the pass wasn't complete as it lacked velocity and accuracy. Almost picked

 

3:26 - ball batted at LOS

 

3:38 - great escape, keeps eyes down field, great pass with zip on slant route to sideline

 

3:54- dangerous pass into coverage, probably should have been incomplete or picked

 

4:04 - dropped pass on curl route

 

4:13 - scramble then ball thrown away

 

4:28 - scramble then ball thrown away

 

4:45 - screen pass

 

4:52 - wobbly deep pass, but it gets there. Would have liked to see a better pass which would have probably led to a TD, the replay shows the receiver had to slow down a bit....ball only traveled about 36-38 yards in the air.

 

5:24 - horrible screen pass

 

5:32 - great read and pass with velocity, accuracy,  and timing...everything you want to see 

 

6:05 -  horrible pass and mechanics, what was he thinking???, should have been a pick

 

6:25 - good pass on curl route which allowed receiver to pick up some YAC

 

6:31 - not a good throw to flat.

 

6.41 - reverts back to bad mechanics and the wobbly ball returns.

 

6:54 - good read under pressure to get a completion

 

7:07 - bad footwork again, very wobbly inaccurate pass

 

7:21 - QB roll out, not a great throw but it is complete

 

7:32 - coverage sack?

Quote:Pirk's absolute refusal to acknowledge jaw surgery requiring a liquid diet as a very strong reason for dropping to 188 is bewildering to me. It's almost like he's only been cherry picking stats and quotes this whole offseason...oh wait. 

 

He played at 222 lbs during his Sophomore year. and he had already gained a lot of it back by the combine. He will be in the 220-230 range in short order and the size concerns will be an afterthought. 

 

His frame is no more of a worry than it should be for Carr, Fales, Manziel, McCarron, Morris, Murray...or Aaron Rodgers, Eli, Kaepernick, Geno, Glennon, etc.  

 

 

If that is true that he played at 220 for his sophomore year, then I would agree his frame is less of a concern.