Quote:I think he is saying there is no need to applaud the moves so far. If they end up working, then he will heap praise. On both sides the praise and criticism are often too swift. It just sounds like he wants Caldwell to prove it, instead of assuming any move is the right move. Which was done in the past.
Thank you for saying better than I could
Quote:Let me get this straight?
According to you, I'm stupid, I'm dumb, Don't know football, and work at walmart or something.
Yet
If we go in the past my view of the team was always more right then you and most of your post seem really stupid and ignorant after the fact.
What does that make you?
According to me? No, you're taking care of that without a lick of help from me.
You seem to think that by preaching patience (which you're doing), and not immediately jumping to conclusions about something, that makes me wrong. Again, you really need to think about that, especially if we wind up having the same opinion about something. I know you're struggling here because I've used a few words that exceed your monosyllabic vocabulary, but I'm just not feeling like dumbing it down so you'll get the point.
Gene Smith: "Build through the draft"
*Trades away draft picks*
It's a problem that should have been seen much earlier. As early as when he traded up for Derek Cox. No matter how well Cox turned out...
Caldwell's biggest issue right now looks to be replacing the talent we've already got, rather than building around what we've got. If LJ is an upgrade to Monroe however, I think that will turn out to not be such a bad thing.
Not shopping Monroe around... that's hard to say if he should have or not.
How would the Jaguars feel if they offered the Ravens a 4th and 5th for a player they need, and then the Titans jumped up and offered a 3rd for that same player, and the Ravens decided to deal with the Titans instead?
I think fans overvalue Monroe a bit too. He's been a bright spot on an otherwise dim o-line. I think Caldwell was looking for ammunition to trade up. Turn a 3rd into a 2nd or maybe a 2nd into a late 1st. It's better to have ammunition to trade up, then to try and do like Gene Smith -- throw away Draft Picks while preaching their importance.
Quote:I think he is saying there is no need to applaud the moves so far. If they end up working, then he will heap praise. On both sides the praise and criticism are often too swift. It just sounds like he wants Caldwell to prove it, instead of assuming any move is the right move. Which was done in the past.
I haven't heaped praise or applauded any moves Caldwell has made to date. In fact, I've been very clear when deep thinkers like mvp jump on every move the team makes to say we need to wait to see how it pans out before we start blasting the moves. If anything, I've been pretty non-committal about the moves the team has made because I recognize these are the kind of moves that won't reap immediate benefits for the team. But, the genius you're talking about has certainly been premature with the criticism. He takes pride in being quick to the draw.
What's even more enjoyable about this is the fact that your point is correct, and he's one of the biggest violators of pouncing too quickly, yet he says this:
Quote:Thank you for saying better than I could
What's really funny here is you think he's backing you up, but he's basically calling you out since you've readily admitted you're quick to pounce and criticize. You're not even smart enough to recognize that fact.
Quote:Yes I do understand the roster had to be gutted and do understand Caldwell inherited a very bad team.
With that being said, it is alarming to be watching one of the worst teams in NFL history on the field every week. I don't even mind losing this year but it's the way we are losing. This team is not competing and getting his butt handed to it every week.
Right now the arrow is way down. Lets see what next offseason brings major improvement.
Yes there is a reason to be concerned as a jags fan
So, you're preaching patience.
Quote:According to me? No, you're taking care of that without a lick of help from me.
You seem to think that by preaching patience (which you're doing), and not immediately jumping to conclusions about something, that makes me wrong. Again, you really need to think about that, especially if we wind up having the same opinion about something. I know you're struggling here because I've used a few words that exceed your monosyllabic vocabulary, but I'm just not feeling like dumbing it down so you'll get the point.
Patience- <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);">the quality of being </span>
patient, <span>as the bearing of provocation, annoyance, misfortune, or pain, without complaint, loss of temper, irritation, or the like. </span>
I'm not expecting Caldwell to perform a miracle and some patience is required but your measure of patience is far greater then mine.
Quote:So, you're preaching patience.
No.
Giving him just 1 offseason would be unreasonable.
Patience in your definition is letting the whole plan play out and then see the results.
Again 2 different things
Show me once where I have jumped to a conclusion about Caldwell. I did it with Gene cause I could smell the stink and it turns out I was right.
I don't expect Caldwell to work a miracle but there needs to be signs of improvement
Quote:I haven't heaped praise or applauded any moves Caldwell has made to date. In fact, I've been very clear when deep thinkers like mvp jump on every move the team makes to say we need to wait to see how it pans out before we start blasting the moves. If anything, I've been pretty non-committal about the moves the team has made because I recognize these are the kind of moves that won't reap immediate benefits for the team. But, the genius you're talking about has certainly been premature with the criticism. He takes pride in being quick to the draw.
What's even more enjoyable about this is the fact that your point is correct, and he's one of the biggest violators of pouncing too quickly, yet he says this:
What's really funny here is you think he's backing you up, but he's basically calling you out since you've readily admitted you're quick to pounce and criticize. You're not even smart enough to recognize that fact.
Was I wrong in the past when I pounced in criticized. No I was not. My track record is good so thats going for me pretty well.
I'll take that over your same old speeches you give every regime.
Quote:I haven't heaped praise or applauded any moves Caldwell has made to date. In fact, I've been very clear when deep thinkers like mvp jump on every move the team makes to say we need to wait to see how it pans out before we start blasting the moves. If anything, I've been pretty non-committal about the moves the team has made because I recognize these are the kind of moves that won't reap immediate benefits for the team. But, the genius you're talking about has certainly been premature with the criticism. He takes pride in being quick to the draw.
What's even more enjoyable about this is the fact that your point is correct, and he's one of the biggest violators of pouncing too quickly, yet he says this:
What's really funny here is you think he's backing you up, but he's basically calling you out since you've readily admitted you're quick to pounce and criticize. You're not even smart enough to recognize that fact.
NOTE: IT'S EITHER ALL CAPS OR THE BELOW WHEN POSTING FROM MY PHONE. FWIW...SORRY
No I'm Stressing The Difference In Your Patience And His Patience. BTW, I Didn't Mean To Imply You Specifically As A Person Who Is Quick To Applaud Moves. To Me, It Seems You Are Stressing Patience With The Plan, Iie Build Through The Draft. He Seems To Want Us To Demonstrate Patience With Praise Of Said Plan. I Would Prefer To Build Through The Draft But I Don't Know If Caldwell Is The Man To Execute It. I Wanted To Believe In Gene, Because I Felt Like He Was "Homegrown". He Had Been With The Team Since It's Inception Believe. Alas, I Was Wrong. Move After Move Didn't Seem Right, And This Without Me Having A Professional Background In Football. The Execs, Including Polian Had Nice Things To Say About Gene In The Beginning Too. In Short, I'm Not Calling Anyone Out, Just Trying To Clarify Your Differing Viewpoints.
Quote:http://espn.go.com/blog/jacksonville-jag...or-the-job
Pretty good read.
Our defense is a tad bit too aggressive. They tend to run themselves out of plays by over pursuing. I do like the speed of the defense, though. I think they'll begin getting the hang of controlled aggressiveness.
Quote:Eh, not a fan of all this "GM Speak". It's just a bunch of cliche's.
Whether it's Jars on the shelf or everybody competing for a job
The only thing that matters is results. That, we aren't going to see this year. Next year here's hoping. I can't have full faith in Caldwell until he shows results. At the same time I'm not going to be a doubter until I see lack of results.
I'm with you on this. Another dose of the blah, blah, blah management rhetoric. Aren't speed and athleticism desirable at every position in every sport known? Has any GM ever been heard to say "We need more slow, clumsy, passive players?
The # 53 guy as likely to start as the # 1 guy?
.gif "Laughing")
That's never been the case on any team in the history of the NFL and never will. I like Caldwell so far, but if he really believes what he's saying, he's in fantasy land.
If all 53 are the same, there's no #1 and that means there's no leader. I want a #1 guy, a leader, preferably at QB. I want a couple more standouts too, a pass rusher, a guy like Von Miller or JJ Watt. I want every team we play to know "that's the guy we gotta worry about, that's the guy who's coming after our quarterback"
Quote:Our defense is a tad bit too aggressive. They tend to run themselves out of plays by over pursuing. I do like the speed of the defense, though. I think they'll begin getting the hang of controlled aggressiveness.
I've noticed that.
But Id rather that than them being too timid.
Quote:If you're not privy to what their plan is for the long term, there's no way to know for certain why they didn't get into the free agent market for the high profile RTs. Vollmer signed a contract that was nearly $30 million. Andre Smith signed a $20 million contract, and never intended to leave Cincy. Again, hardly chump change.
What we do know is that after they drafted Joeckel, they made it clear he was the starting RT the day after the draft. At that point, the need to grab a costly free agent evaporated. They weren't planning to trade Monroe at that point, or ever for that matter.
This notion that Gene Smith negotiated the contracts is pretty funny. Especially when the reality is we had one of the highest payrolls in the league last year, so I wouldn't call them cheap. They didn't spend that money wisely, but they weren't being cheap.
The fact that they decided not to move on with Smith probably had more to do with what they had in their plans long-term. He isn't a young player, and regardless of the price, bringing him back would have indicated he was part of the long term plan. I don't think that was the case, and based on the decision they made, that seems to be correct. Whether we like it or not, he's in a better place, and we will see how things unfold here without him over the long haul.
Well, we are some what privy. They want to build through the draft. I'm not sure what they want to do in free agency. I don't think this year told us a whole lot about what to expect in free agency.
In regards to Monroe, it wasn't their plan to move him, but they jumped all over a 4th and 5th round pick? It isn't like that is something you would jump all over if your plan was to keep a guy. It just doesn't add up. I'm still not sure exactly what went down, how and why.
I really don't have a problem with the Monroe trade. He would not be worth the money he would demand in FA to resign. I do think they may have gotten a better offer if they waited closer to the trade deadline but maybe they took Monroes wife in baltimore into consideration.
Quote:I am not agreeing with you. I'm just saying you and your buddies had the same old speeches before and we saw where that got us. You guys were having circle jerks about how great the team was and how well Gene was building the team. Enough of the crap.
Right now it's looking ugly, real ugly. There should be some concern with how pathetic this team is looking right now
I understand your point, but the reality is, we have to sit through another rebuild. The guy before who was supposed to rebuild failed and left us worse off than where we were before. It sucks, i know its bad, but thats the truth. I do believe Caldwell and Bradleys plan is far better than Genes. Coming from a huge critic of Gene. This is a true rebuild, unlike Genes.
Theres nothing much else to say, you gotta back the team. I can give you reasons to back Caldwell, but it wont do to much good for you and understandably. We have suffered through a rebuild already and the team is asking to suffer through another.
When we get that franchise QB, who actually pans out, we will be a whole lot better.
I'm sure some of you guys will dismiss anything Oehser says because he's employed by the team but the following comment from him is one of the reasons I keep saying "we don't know the whole story on the Monroe trade."
Quote:
I think there are two sides of the story, and I think you can’t always believe reports. The Jaguars talked to many teams about Eugene Monroe, the Browns included. Caldwell took the best offer.
Why is it that if you don't agree with everything the organization does, you're a nay sayer and should just be a fan of another team already?
Whereas conversely if you do agree with everything you're a homer and have no personal opinions?
Can't we be fans of the team and disagree with moves that are made? None of us are so neurotic that we believe the franchise makes any decision based on our posts, so stop wheeling that out there.
The team sucks, and the fans have a right to be upset about it. Tell us to wait a few years to see results, the fans have a right to be unsettled. We've been a struggling team that is "rebuilding, or retooling" through the better part of a decade, now in our 3rd regime and we're supposed to just blindly trust they're making the right calls, no questions asked?
How dare you question my or anyone's fanhood because their opinion differs from yours. We all have little things we wish were or weren't done, but let's not resort to blasting posters for their being wary that this team seems to have gotten worse from last year, if that's even possible.
Or should we all be drinking the koolaide?
Quote:This is a true rebuild, unlike gene's
Ah yes, and I can remember the 2009 season, after Gene's first draft, the onset of "in gene I trust", where everyone was sure that he was building this team properly, unlike Harris.
See how all this can seem a bit familiar?
For now....all of that is useless. Prove your worth with this team. Produce wins. He hasn't. So as of now, we are paying him to do nothing