Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:I don't think any will be traded personally. 

 

So, then you are implying they are going to be stupid as well. 

 

I don't think they will be (stupid). I see one of those RB being dealt for a draft pick and most likely it will be Brown that gets traded. 

Quote:Oh, you mean outside of the games he's actually -started, right??

 

You're trying too hard to shoot down a good idea....probably with the only reasoning being that -I- was the one who brought it up. 

 

 

Marcedes never has had a single game where he's put up the kind of numbers that Bryce has put up in 2 of his starts in his brief time in this league. Terrible comparison. Plus, it took Marcedes 4-5 years to reach that one outlier season, Brown showed his potential in his ROOKIE season. 

 

You are ridiculous with that comparison. 

 

He also had a start where had 12 carries for 6 yards.

Quote:He also had a start where had 12 carries for 6 yards.

 

So, in your mind that supercedes two starts where he amassed 150 yards each?? For a ROOKIE RB??? Actually I think it was closer to 170 each, IIRC...

 

You're being ridiculous.

Quote:So, in your mind that supercedes two starts where he amassed 150 yards each?? For a ROOKIE RB??? Actually I think it was closer to 170 each, IIRC...

 

You're being ridiculous.

 

He had two good games. Nothing else even close so far in his career. He's now a third stringer. Sorry for not wanting to give away the 65th pick for that.

Quote:He had two good games. Nothing else even close so far in his career. He's now a third stringer. Sorry for not wanting to give away the 65th pick for that.

 

Not only are you being ridiculous in your overall take here, but you're also posting mis-information....

 

According to the Eagles official team website depth chart - Brown is 2nd string, not 3rd...

 

http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/team/depth-chart.html

Quote:Not only are you being ridiculous in your overall take here, but you're also posting mis-information....

 

According to the Eagles official team website depth chart - Brown is 2nd string, not 3rd...

 

http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/team/depth-chart.html

He is second string, I presume he is talking about Polk getting the nice TD when he got a rush while McCoy was Mile High winded. It was still 8 rushes for Brown compared to 3 for Polk.

Quote:He is second string, I presume he is talking about Polk getting the nice TD when he got a rush while McCoy was Mile High winded. It was still 8 rushes for Brown compared to 3 for Polk.

 

yeah, Polk got that carry because Brown got mile high winded too...

 

Saying Brown was "3rd string" was merely misinformation by J2DD....possibly intentional misinformation to help his side of  the argument which is badly failing

Not sure how it is failing. He has had two good games in his career. The rest has been mediocre. And you want to give up an early third rounder for him.

Quote:Not sure how it is failing. He has had two good games in his career. The rest has been mediocre. And you want to give up an early third rounder for him.

 

LOL......you say the above as if Bryce Brown is a 4 year veteran....

 

He was a 22 year old ROOKIE last year who started 3 or 4 games, and was the production level of ALL PRO in 2 of them...

 

So, he'll be 23 next year and you'd rather roll the dice and use a draft choice on a rookie RB which is even less of a sure thing, rather than use it on a player like Brown who has shown he can excel at this level of football. 

 

And....nice way to avoid being called out for your "3rd string" misinformation...

Quote:LOL......you say the above as if Bryce Brown is a 4 year veteran....

 

He was a 22 year old ROOKIE last year who started 3 or 4 games, and was the production level of ALL PRO in 2 of them...

 

So, he'll be 23 next year and you'd rather roll the dice and use a draft choice on a rookie RB which is even less of a sure thing, rather than use it on a player like Brown who has shown he can excel at this level of football. 

 

And....nice way to avoid being called out for your "3rd string" misinformation...

 

If the Jaguars acquire him and he does well, you'll be clamoring for them to trade him before his value slips.

I wouldnt give up more than a 5th for Brown. I believe we could find a solid interior lineman at the top of the 4th which I would value over a RB. Take a couple late round fliers on RBs and hope to hit.

Quote:You have much to learn sir. Spotrac.com is a wonderful resource. 

 

http://www.spotrac.com/rankings/nfl/aver...arterback/

http://www.spotrac.com/rankings/nfl/aver...-receiver/

http://www.spotrac.com/rankings/nfl/average/tackle/

http://www.spotrac.com/rankings/nfl/aver...nsive-end/

http://www.spotrac.com/rankings/nfl/average/linebacker/

http://www.spotrac.com/rankings/nfl/average/cornerback/

 

8 mil/yr doesn't get you in the top 10 in any of those positions. 10 mil/yr doesn't get you in the top 10 in many of those positions. Certainly not the 'elite FA of that year at that position.' Those guys get top value for the position. Even the new FA interior lineman (Nicks, Mankins, Evans, Levitre, Joseph) are getting 8 mil a year. You don't get bargains in FA.

 

Let's continue with the Greg Hardy. The franchise tag for DE last year was 11.175 mil. Charles Johnson signed for 12.6/yr three years ago, Mario Williams 16/yr, Chris Long 12.06/yr. You honestly think the best young stud FA DE of this class is going to sign somewhere for 8/yr. You are quite the silly person my friend.

 

Actually, 8 million puts you at the top 10 in tackle, guard, center, tight end, running back, fullback, defensive tackle, linebacker, cornerback, and safety.  And its even a little better next year when some of the pre collective bargaining contracts come off.

 

Stop looking at old contracts.  They are outdated.  Look at people signed last year for what contracts will be going for in the future.

 

Last year's most expensive free agent contracts:

 

1.) Mike Wallace: 5 yrs/60 million at 12 million per year

2.) Greg Jennings: 5 yrs/45 million at 9 million per year

3.) Jake Long:        4 yrs/34 million at 8.5 million per year

4.) Paul Kruger:     5 yrs/41 million at 8.2 million per year

5.) Andy Levitre:    6 yrs/46.8million at 7.8 million per year

6.) Jermon Bushrod: 5yrs/36 million at 7.2 million per year

7.) Jared Cook :        5 yrs/35.1 million at 7 million per year

8.) Dannel Ellerbe:    5 yrs/34.75 million at 7 million per year

9.) Gosder Cherilius: 5 yrs/34.5 million at 6.9 million per year

10.) Desmond Bryant: 5yrs/34 million at 6.8 million per year

11.) Sam Baker:           6yrs/40.85 million at 6.8 million per year

 

And the total years start going drastically down from here.  And some of these are some of the worst contracts of the year, like Paul Kruger. 

 

Let's look at some other notable players:

 

Danny Amendola:  5yrs/28.5 million

Cliff Avril:                2yrs/13 million

Nnamdi Asomugha:1yr/1.35 million 

Martellus Bennett:   4yrs/20.4 million

Reggie Bush:           4yrs/16 million

Steven Jackson:       3 yrs/12 million

Rey Maualuga:         2 yrs/6.5 million

Brandon Myers:        4 yrs/14.25 million

Ed Reed:                   3 yrs/15 million

Dominique Rodgers-C: 2 yrs/10 million

Sean Smith:                3 yrs/18 million

Daryl Smith:                1 yr/1.25 million

Andre Smith:                3 yrs/18 million

Aqib Talib:                    1 yr/4.86 million

Osi Umenyiora:             2 yrs/8.5 million

Sebastian Vollmer:       4 yrs/16.75 million

Wes Welker:                 2 yrs/12 million

Phillip Wheeler:            5 yrs/26 million

Eric Winston:                1 yr/2 million

Elvis Dumervil:              5 yrs/26 million

Ricky Jean Francois:    4 yrs/22 million

Quote:Actually, 8 million puts you at the top 10 in tackle, guard, center, tight end, running back, fullback, defensive tackle, linebacker, cornerback, and safety.  And its even a little better next year when some of the pre collective bargaining contracts come off.

 

Stop looking at old contracts.  They are outdated.  Look at people signed last year for what contracts will be going for in the future.

 

Last year's most expensive free agent contracts:

 

1.) Mike Wallace: 5 yrs/60 million at 12 million per year

2.) Greg Jennings: 5 yrs/45 million at 9 million per year

3.) Jake Long:        4 yrs/34 million at 8.5 million per year

4.) Paul Kruger:     5 yrs/41 million at 8.2 million per year

5.) Andy Levitre:    6 yrs/46.8million at 7.8 million per year

6.) Jermon Bushrod: 5yrs/36 million at 7.2 million per year

7.) Jared Cook :        5 yrs/35.1 million at 7 million per year

8.) Dannel Ellerbe:    5 yrs/34.75 million at 7 million per year

9.) Gosder Cherilius: 5 yrs/34.5 million at 6.9 million per year

10.) Desmond Bryant: 5yrs/34 million at 6.8 million per year

11.) Sam Baker:           6yrs/40.85 million at 6.8 million per year

 

And the total years start going drastically down from here.  And some of these are some of the worst contracts of the year, like Paul Kruger. 

 

 

Thanks, you just made my point for me. In a bad FA class you had a lot of guys break the amount that you predicted for FAs that put last years to shame. Jared Cook is a TE who has proved all but nothing in this league and he got 7.2 million. Levitre is a guard who got almost 8 million. You think a 25 year old monster DE coming off back to back double digit sack seasons while also holding up very well against the run isn't going to get double that? Hardy would get 15+ million without breaking a sweat and could easily break 100 million total. 

 

Oh yeah it's still all hypothetical too since not many of those guys will even get to FA. By all means keep dreaming though, hope is a good thing. Just don't be disappointed when your plans of grandeur are just that.

Oh, so now that free agent class was bad and that's why they were all cheaper?

 

Like I said, there were a few bad contracts in there and Jared Cook's was one of them.  The other TE's Bennett and Myers got 5 million and 3.5 million respectively. 

 

Andy Levitre is a top 10 guard in the league and he got less than 8 million and still was slightly overpaid.

 

What happened to Cliff Avril?  Coming off back to back double digit sack seasons, 26 years old...  2 years 13 million.

 

Or Elvis Dumervil?  Coming off 3 straight double digit sack seasons, including a 17 sack season, and 28 years old...  5 years 26 million

 

Would you care to place a bet that Hardy doesn't see 12 million per year or 80 million total?  Hardy could have 25 sacks this season and he still wouldn't see 100 million.

Quote:Oh, so now that free agent class was bad and that's why they were all cheaper?

 

Like I said, there were a few bad contracts in there and Jared Cook's was one of them.  The other TE's Bennett and Myers got 5 million and 3.5 million respectively. 

 

Andy Levitre is a top 10 guard in the league and he got less than 8 million and still was slightly overpaid.

 

What happened to Cliff Avril?  Coming off back to back double digit sack seasons, 26 years old...  2 years 13 million.

 

Or Elvis Dumervil?  Coming off 3 straight double digit sack seasons, including a 17 sack season, and 28 years old...  5 years 26 million

 

Would you care to place a bet that Hardy doesn't see 12 million per year or 80 million total?  Hardy could have 25 sacks this season and he still wouldn't see 100 million.

 

Avril was actually terrible last year. -11.6 PFF grade, -9.9 in run support. Utter one trick pony and even got lucky with an inflated pressureack ratio. 

Dumervil was even worse at -12.2, 5th worst in the entire league. Also, the Bronco fax fiasco happened very late in the FA process so who knows what could have happened otherwise.

Hardy was 6th best at +20.2. Extremely impressive in all facets of the game and only improving.

As the famous quote says, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics. Sacks is one of those statistics that can lie the most. 

 

Lastly, it was an inordinately low spending FA year period. So bad in fact that many people suspected collusion amongst the owners. Don't use last year as a prognostication tool for what has happened in the past or in the future as it was clearly an outlier year for some reason.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Free...place.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/foot...nfl-teams/

 

 

All that said, I'm done wasting so much time on a wholly impossible OP suggestion in the first place. Have fun in your dreamland.

Quote:Avril was actually terrible last year. -11.6 PFF grade, -9.9 in run support. Utter one trick pony and even got lucky with an inflated pressureack ratio. 

Dumervil was even worse at -12.2, 5th worst in the entire league. Also, the Bronco fax fiasco happened very late in the FA process so who knows what could have happened otherwise.

Hardy was 6th best at +20.2. Extremely impressive in all facets of the game and only improving.

As the famous quote says, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics. Sacks is one of those statistics that can lie the most. 

 

Lastly, it was an inordinately low spending FA year period. So bad in fact that many people suspected collusion amongst the owners. Don't use last year as a prognostication tool for what has happened in the past or in the future as it was clearly an outlier year for some reason.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Free...place.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/foot...nfl-teams/

 

Yes, it was an outlier (man that word has been used a lot on this thread) year because of the new collective bargaining agreement and all the teams that are cap strapped as a result.  You have 5+ teams that will be purging their rosters next year as well because of it.

 

There are more free agents than there is money to go around.  Supply meet demand.  Even some of the teams with money to spend, don't really have it.  Take for instance the Chicago Bears and Minnesota Vikings.  They have a ton of high end free agents to resign.  The Oakland Raiders are losing 11.5 starters next season as well.  The only teams in the league with a real abundant amount of money to spend are the Jaguars, Colts, Browns, Jets, and maybe the Raiders since their free agents aren't going to be very pricey.  Then you have maybe 5 teams that can spend for 2 mid lvl contracts or 1 large one like the Dolphins, Packers, Redskins, Giants, and Bengals.  And then you have like 17ish teams that can't afford to sign anyone other than fluff and draft picks.

 

Again, I'm willing to bet Hardy doesn't see over 80 million or 12 million per year.  I'll bet you a signature if I win and I'll buy you your season tickets if you win.

After the Lowery cut and Monroe trade, we could theoretically be sitting at 64 or 65 million dollars in cap space next season if the veterans I originally mentioned are jettisoned this offseason.  We are talking about 50 million dollars of spending in one year with very little dead money to chew any additional cap space.  I honestly think we could see historical level spending this coming offseason should we ditch those veterans.

Quote:After the Lowery cut and Monroe trade, we could theoretically be sitting at 64 or 65 million dollars in cap space next season if the veterans I originally mentioned are jettisoned this offseason.  We are talking about 50 million dollars of spending in one year with very little dead money to chew any additional cap space.  I honestly think we could see historical level spending this coming offseason should we ditch those veterans.

Dont know why you want to cut Allen.

Quote:LOL......you say the above as if Bryce Brown is a 4 year veteran....

 

He was a 22 year old ROOKIE last year who started 3 or 4 games, and was the production level of ALL PRO in 2 of them...

 

So, he'll be 23 next year and you'd rather roll the dice and use a draft choice on a rookie RB which is even less of a sure thing, rather than use it on a player like Brown who has shown he can excel at this level of football. 

 

And....nice way to avoid being called out for your "3rd string" misinformation...

Won't Ben Tate be a free agent? Won't have to trade for him and has shown a lot of consistency.

Quote:Dont know why you want to cut Allen.

It saves 2 million dollars for a marginal starter who should be a backup, despite PFF annointing him the best 4-3 OLB in the world.